#1245 Resilience in Four Parts - 3

July 5, 2024Scott Benner

Episode 1245: Psychological Impacts of Diabetes with Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT

Marriage and family therapist Erika Forsyth explores the psychological impacts of diabetes on patients and caregivers. This episode delves into the anxiety and stress associated with constant diabetes management and offers strategies for coping with these challenges. Erika discusses how technology can both help and hinder emotional well-being, providing a comprehensive look at the mental health aspects of living with diabetes. Listen to gain valuable insights into managing the psychological impacts of diabetes.

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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends and welcome to episode 1245 of the Juicebox Podcast

Erica Forsythe is back with me for part three of the resilience series. And don't forget to learn more about Erika, you only have to go to Erica forsythe.com. Nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan. If you have type one diabetes, or are the caregiver of someone with type one and a US resident, you have a unique opportunity to make a significant impact on type one diabetes research right from your home in fewer than 10 minutes. Just go to T one D exchange.org/juice box and complete the survey. That's all you have to do. When you place your first order for ag one with my link, you'll get five free travel packs and a free year supply of vitamin D. Drink ag one.com/juice box. Hey, you like being comfortable? Do you like looking good. If you do go to cozy earth.com Fill up your cards with towels and sheets and clothing and all the things that will make you happy. And then use the offer code juice box at checkout and you will save 30% off of everything in that cart. Cozy earth.com use the offer code juice box at checkout this episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by us med U S med.com/juice box or call 888721151 for us med is where my daughter gets her diabetes supplies from and you could to use the link or number to get your free benefit check and get started today with us met. This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by the Dexcom G seven made for all types of diabetes Dexcom G seven can be used to manage type one, type two, and gestational diabetes, you're going to see the speed, direction and number of your blood sugar right on your receiver or smartphone device. dexcom.com/juicebox This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by the only implantable sensor rated for long term were up to six months. The ever since CGM ever since cgm.com/juicebox. Erica, we are back to do the third installment of our resilience conversation. How are you?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 2:43
That's right. I'm well thank you. So yes, I have to keep reminding myself that the yes, the overarching theme is resilience because I know we're focusing a lot on trauma, but we're, it's all connected.

Scott Benner 2:55
If people listen to the podcast long enough, they'll recognize that my titles are not that meaningful sometimes. But I also think that resilience just leads into the conversation. You know what I mean? Like, I reached out to you and I said, Can we talk about resilience? That's all I said, and you came back with all this great content and these things to pick through, you know, what you found and what you knew, you know, which I didn't know, because I think this was just the thing I thought of while I was in the shower, if I'm remembering correctly, is that you know, this part about trauma that we discussed in the last episode? And I guess we'll kind of continue on with today as well as that, right?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 3:32
Yes, I was thinking today, we could do a little bit of review and reflection, and then start talking a little bit more about the connection of privilege and resilience. That also connects to our talk a little bit more about the ACES today if we have time.

Scott Benner 3:46
So I want to hear all about that. But let me ask you this. I think that it's possible that we use the word privilege, you scare people, and they're looking for the stop button already. They're like, I don't need to be told I have privilege. So like I'm interested in, in how that unfolds. And I hope people like take a minute and listen to the that they can see the bigger picture. You don't just mean I don't want to tell you what you mean. So do your review. And then and then you ask then yes, I

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 4:13
know that that word can be has a lot of connotation and association. And what we'll get into is kind of thinking maybe the better question to think about is did you feel safe and secure growing up? Which is can be thought of as a certain form of privilege? Or do you currently feel safe and secure? And so we'll talk about how that is connected to your stress response system and whether or not you had opportunities to develop to develop resilience as a young person.

Scott Benner 4:47
Yeah. Because in context privilege is opportunity to be safe to be protected to be loved that kind of stuff.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 4:57
And predictability. Hmm Have you an opportunity, minimal threat, and you experience stress and chaos? You still experience it, but it's in an unpredictable, controllable, manageable way.

Scott Benner 5:12
Okay, cool. You said you want to look back a little bit before me? Yeah,

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 5:17
I just thought we could review a little bit of what we talked about in the last couple episodes of the kind of capital T trauma, which is understanding what is trauma, we'd look at the event itself, and how did you experience the event? And then did you have any long lasting effects of that event. And if you are experiencing traumatic system symptoms, which I don't even know if we actually talked about last time, but if you are wondering if you are living from a traumatic experiencing a traumatic event, or having the past or continuing to the symptoms might feel and look very similar to depression, or anxiety, some of them you know, having flashbacks, intrusive memories, exhaustion, fatigue, anxiety, depression, changes in appetite, changes in sleeping, or irritable mood swings, you might be numbing by alcohol, or other drugs, you know, or other even ways to numb that emotional overwhelm that you're feeling. You might have difficulty concentrating, you might be kind of always on edge and irritable and like, you know, hyper arousal and hyper vigilance is one of the keys of PTSD, key symptoms. As we talk about trauma, those are symptoms as a result of trauma. But it can get confusing and maybe unclear is it? Are you experiencing depression? Are you experiencing the results, you experiencing symptoms and behaviors as a result of one traumatic event which we talked about the capital T trauma? Or is it that over a period of time, you might be exposed to the heavy days, many, like many, many, many moments of feeling invisible or not good enough or shamed, or feeling like you, you're gonna be feeling stupid, or that you don't quite get it or feeling othered over time, all of those moments of kind of small t trauma still trigger your stress response system so that you are actually responding as if you were exposed to a terrible hurricane or earthquake abuse. Right? So you're still your body's responding as if you had a big T trauma. So we talked about those two differences. Am i Does that make sense? Not only

Scott Benner 7:39
does that make sense, but you just I feel like somebody just threw open the curtains for me. I used to hate ordering my daughter's diabetes supplies, and never had a good experience. And it was frustrating. But it hasn't been that way for a while actually for about three years now. Because that's how long we've been using us med us med.com/juice box or call 888721151 for us med is the number one distributor for FreeStyle Libre systems nationwide. They are the number one specialty distributor for Omni pod dash. The number one fastest growing tandem distributor nationwide, the number one rated distributor index com customer satisfaction surveys. They have served over 1 million people with diabetes since 1996. And they always provide 90 days worth of supplies and fast and free shipping. US med carries everything from insulin pumps and diabetes testing supplies to the latest CGM like the libre three and Dexcom G seven. They accept Medicare nationwide and over 800 private insurers. Find out why us med has an A plus rating with the Better Business Bureau at us med.com/juice box or just call them at 888-721-1514 Dexcom G seven offers an easier way to manage diabetes without finger sticks. It is a simple CGM system that delivers real time glucose numbers to your smartphone, your smartwatch. And it effortlessly allows you to see your glucose levels and where they're headed. My daughter is wearing a Dexcom g7 Right now, and I can't recommend it enough. Whether you have commercial insurance, Medicare coverage, or no CGM coverage at all Dexcom can help you go to my link dexcom.com/juice box and look for that button that says Get a free benefits check. That'll get you going with Dexcom when you're there, check out the Dexcom clarity app where the follow Did you know that people can follow your Dexcom up to 10 people can follow you. Right now I'm following my daughter but my wife is also following her. Her roommates at school are following her. So I guess Arden is being followed right now by five people who are concerned for her health and welfare, and you can do the same thing. School Nurses, your neighbor, people in your family, everyone can have access to that information if you want them to have it. Or if you're an adult, and you don't want anyone to know, you don't have to share with anybody, it's completely up to you, Dex comm.com, slashed use Box links in the show notes links at juicebox podcast.com. And when you use my link to learn about Dexcom, you're supporting the podcast. I'm being being really genuine here, I was just having a conversation with a person whose details I'll keep very vague. But they experienced a significant amount of anxiety, they're medicated for it, they had a situation where the medication went away for a little bit. And they they told me they didn't realize how much the medication was helping them because as soon as the medication went away, it was overwhelming. And this person doesn't think of themselves as depressed. But told me that in their medical folder, it says, I forget the exact phrasing, but it's something basically says always sad. But they're not a sad person. But that's how the doctor sees them. They have this anxiety that they've been told they have without the medication and it's unmanageable. But when I think about what I know about their upbringing, Mother using pills, a lot of craziness. And you're talking and I think God is Is she not anxious? Is she not depressed? Is she just in a constant state of experiencing her younger life, and waiting for it to happen again, and again? And again? Like that's a really

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 11:40
interesting, actually. Yes. And because of her exposure to that, in her childhood, she is sensitized to that and kind of more aware, more, or like to maybe trying to anticipate, and trying to protect her body and mind from experiencing those feelings. Like we said last time, I think the research and information out there from trauma is still it's still new, in terms of how we define it, understand it and treat it, which is it's really fascinating. And then when we when we look at it through the lens of diabetes, that we talked about whether or not let's say you grew up in a very predictable, safe environment, as a child, then you are diagnosed, then are you having these micro moments that feel like trauma, because of how you're treated in the classroom, or how you're treated by others, or the shame that you experience constantly, if you do around your diagnosis and living with diabetes, or is it what we talked about the FFTs, you know, from Brene, Brown a first time experience, which is what we we do experience that as people living with diabetes, or caregiving where you're trying something new every time. And then you're having this expectation that you're supposed to kind of nail it because you did it. You nailed it yesterday. So I think that's where it's really kind of confusing and blurry. Are you experiencing some of those anxiety? Depression is that diabetes distress is that diabetes burnout? Is that as yet your body responding as if it were a trauma? Right, because of your past or not? Right? So it's, it's really blurry. And I think also really fascinating. And if someone wants to go do research on all of that, that would be I don't

Scott Benner 13:31
know how blurry it seems. I mean, it feels like it makes a lot of sense. You know, and I can even see how it could look like resilience. Because if you're, I'm going to use myself as an example, like I was around a lot of yelling, right? And it could be physical, sometimes not all that frequently. I'm trying to balance what the 70s was like, compared to what I would want to do now for my kids. So like, he got smacked more in the 70s. But it wasn't a full on assault DNA. I mean, that makes sense. But I grew up like that, like people were if he did something wrong, you got yelled at, there was a little bit of fear mongering to like manage you like right, there was always that like, It's good if they're a little scared feeling. I think of myself as very resilient, but maybe I'm just always on alert because of that, but it's manageable for me. So I look resilient. If it wasn't manageable for me, I'd look anxious. Is that right?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 14:28
Yes. Because because of having a little bit of stress is is helpful. And somewhere within as we talked about last time, is it your genetics? Is it your family generational resilience that is ingrained? And I guess that's also part of genetics. But somewhere in there you as you were exposed to to stressful situations. You learned how to adapt and respond and overcome,

Scott Benner 14:57
but that could be as easy as it just got lucky and conquered a couple of them. So I build up some confidence. And then I have this expectation it's going to go well, etc. Can that look at? Can I ask a weird question? I don't want to get too far off the path because I'm really interested in this conversation today. But could that look like narcissism? Can confidence look like narcissism when it's not narcissism? What's the difference between knowing you're good at something, being confident that it's going to go well, and actually being a narcissist? Is there a difference? Oh, gosh,

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 15:30
they asked if, by the way, if you're interested in in narcissism, there's a really good book I just was talking about recently called The Wizard of Oz and other narcissists, just as theirs. So the question is, are you what's the difference between feeling confident and competent? Versus narcissism? Yeah, if

Scott Benner 15:51
I was speed dating with Superman, he was like, less than I'm very handsome, super strong, I look great in a bikini fly, you know, and you keep going online. He's just telling you the facts about his life. And like, so you don't mean by that? Like, so? Yes. Good. Well,

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 16:06
I think well, Nurse narcissism is a true is a personality disorder diagnosed by the fact that they're excessively you're self centered, you're preoccupied with your own needs at the expense of others. And so I would say, when you're confident, competent in something, you're still maybe you're holding compassion and empathy. Whereas oftentimes with people with narcissism, they need the attention, they want people to admire them. But they really lack the empathy piece, or I say, compassion. Okay, so that would that I think that would be the marker of the difference.

Scott Benner 16:45
Perfect definition. I just wanted that out there for moving forward. That's Yes. Great. Thank you. Okay, I'm sorry, do you know where you? Did I cut you off to the point, you don't know where you

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 16:53
are? No, we're good. So okay, so we're talking about these three, kind of three different layers, how I'm envisioning is like these three different buckets. But they can also be layers of like this big T trauma, this kind of one event incident, these multiple moments of really feeling invisible, you experienced that fear that feeling of of not accepted, or not good enough, that can also lead to the trauma experience, and the third bucket of doing something for the first time, which can, you can have these moments of feeling doubtful of anxious of sadness, of loneliness, but over time, that doesn't necessarily lead to a stress, it's not triggering your stress response system so that you're having traumatic symptoms. Okay. So with that, I think if we're looking at going back to diabetes, and understanding trauma, as the way Brene Brown defines it a situation or environment over which you have no control, thinking about this from the context of mean, we feel like that all the time, you can feel like you have like you do all the right things, and then you still skyrocket or you still plumb it with your blood sugars, or you still experience the emotional toll. That can be feeling like you're in this constant traumatic state. And I was just envisioning, you know, I know, we talked, we've talked about your history. But imagine, like if you grew up in chaos, where stress was unpredictable, was uncontrollable. And then you learned you had these kinds of adaptive behaviors as a child to say, Okay, I'm going to, I'm going to try and feel safe in this environment by trying to predict, right predict outcomes, I'm going to try and figure out how can I be safe, I'm a trade control as much as I can, or at least tell myself I'm going to control as much as I can, I'm going to be a people pleaser, and avoid conflict. Those were all adaptive behaviors as a as a child to feel safe, then you get diagnosed with diabetes. And I think I feel like I see this and I hear this a lot on the on your podcast, as well as like, how could you not I just thinking about this question of how could you not go into a shame spiral or experiencing severe anxiety, depression, if you feel like you can control things, right. And then you get diagnosed, you're like, oh, my gosh, not only am I out of control with this diagnosis, but then feeling that sense of out of control, particularly in the new so you know, first year or when life changes, you experienced this kind of, like you're feeling out of control, you thought you could control everything, and then consequently, you're experiencing these kind of traumatic moments. I thought that was important to kind of note and reflect on. And so if you're listening and you're hearing that, I think it's really important to understand, like, what is what's the story, what's fueling this response in this behavior? Is it Just the diabetes, usually it's not, is it your childhood trauma is that all the other things going on in life that are feeling unpredictable and scary and overwhelming. And then you're you felt like you could live a life trying to be in control, and then you realize you aren't a

Scott Benner 20:17
you could live your whole life having impacts from this and not have any idea what it's them from. And just thinking, I'm an anxious person, or because I hear people say it all the time. Like, I'm just an anxious person. Yeah, right. Or, I don't know, I just am always expecting the worst thing to happen and blah, blah. But I've tried this a number of times, when I'm making the podcasts, I'll say to somebody who says somebody that I'm like, Are your parents alcoholics? And a lot of people will say yes, because alcoholism is pretty common. And so like, they'll say, Yes. And then they don't, they don't understand the connection between it all. And then you say a little bit of like, you know, the, some of the things you've just mentioned, like, you know, always being on alert or things being so like, you know, haphazard one, one minute, everything's fine. The next minutes not, is that exact explanation of what anxiety is, you're trying to be ready for something that you have no idea if or when it will ever come? That's anxiety, right? And yes, yeah. And so, if it's always looming, whether it's really there or not, you're still going to feel that way. And then I think the part you don't get is like, even if it's not, like, let's say, it just doesn't exist in your life anymore. But you still have the response, you come off strangely to your spouse or to your family, who then wants to know, why are you acting so strangely, and then you don't know you're acting strangely. And then these weird interpersonal, like, underlying issues come and they build on top of each other and build on top of each other, until you're in these problems, and you don't understand how you got there. And now I'm trying to imagine on top of that, you have that feeling already. And then you or your kid gets a chronic illness. Holy Hell, I knew it was coming. Eric, I knew it. I knew it. Here it is. And then your body rewards you by giving you more anxiety. Because see, this was really valuable for us. I told you something bad was coming. But is that kind of the point? Is that the path it takes? It

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 22:17
can I mean, and that's part of, you know, anxiety connects to a lot of the distortions you were just talking about, right? Like the magical thinking, or the catastrophic thinking, that's worst case scenario, thinking. And the trick we talked about, in my practice, you know, that anxiety lies to you, and says, Will you be prepared, be prepared? Because you never know what's gonna happen? And you think that that's going to reduce the pain? If and when something bad happens. But no one has ever said, Gosh, I'm so glad I worried about this thing happening. Because when it happened, I was I was so much more prepared. It felt it didn't feel as bad. Yes. That

Scott Benner 23:00
never happens. Fear is a waste of imagination, is what it ends up being. But anxiety is different than fear. Right? Yeah. Yeah. I

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 23:07
mean, they can be connected. But yes, yeah. But

Scott Benner 23:10
what yeah, not to dig too deep into it. But you can find reasonable things to be like, That's a scary thing. I should know how to I should know how to unlock my car in case I have an accident. You know, I have a seatbelt cutter. And a thing that breaks the window like, oh, that sounds like anxiety. But if you had a car accident as a young person, or someone was able to market to your anxiety properly, I could make anything sound necessary. I mean, a good salesman could could sell you anything. I don't know, this is all just very, I don't know if I'm being articulate enough. But I think that many people listening to this can say, Oh, wow, I did have either large T small t first time, trauma in my life as a child, I can see now that I that is still something I'm worried about. And then we have to make the leap to believe that that underlying anxiety is coming from that. I bet you there's a fair amount of people who think what you're talking about is Hocus Pocus, like, you know what I mean? Like, like therapy and talking about your past, there's plenty of people are like, just get over it. I don't know that that's a thing. You'd even know what's happening to you to get over. If that makes sense.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 24:22
Yes, I think it's, it's important, I believe, obviously my profession to understand why you're doing or thinking a certain way. And sometimes it's because of what happened to you yesterday. But most of the time, it's about what happened in the past and how your core your neuro pathways, your stress system, everything was formed. And you don't have to spend years looking back at all that right. But I think it's important to just spend a little time to look back and say, Oh, this this all these things happen. That's why I, when I hear this sound or smell that thing, or someone says this thing to me, or I have to prick my finger, I experienced these things,

Scott Benner 25:09
right? I get worried as we're talking about it that some people see themselves as so autonomous and conscious that they don't think about anything that happened before. It's this, you know, the wind blew I squinted, I made that decision. Like you don't mean like I am only who I am right now. I'm not a collection of the things that have happened to me in the past. But today's podcast is sponsored by the ever since CGM, boasting a six month sensor. The ever sent CGM offers you these key advantages distinct on body vibe alerts when higher low, a consistent and exceptional accuracy over a six month period. And you only need two sensors per year. No longer will you have to carry your CGM supplies with you. You won't have to be concerned about your adhesive not lasting, accidentally knocking off a sensor or wasting a sensor when you have to replace your transmitter. That's right. There's no more weekly or bi weekly hassles of sensor changes. Not with the ever sent CGM. It's implantable and it's accurate ever since cgm.com/juicebox. The Eversense CGM is the first and only long term CGM ever since sits comfortably right under the skin and your upper arm and it lasts way longer than any other CGM sensor. Never again will you have to worry about your sensor falling off before the end of its life. So if you want an incredibly accurate CGM, that can't get knocked off, and won't fall off. You're looking for the ever since CGM ever since cgm.com/juicebox. And I do think that's, I think a lot of people believe that I think a lot of people think therapy's meaningless because of those beliefs. And if you feel that way, that's great. But listen to what she's saying here about, you can all trace your life back a little bit and see moments where you're like, Oh, my God, that did happen to me, or that was scary. And so if you're one of those people who says like, I don't like being told what to do. That's a great one, right? You ever hear people say that very proudly? I don't like being told what to do. You know? And you're like, Well, yeah, it's because somebody controlled you, you know, at some point along the ways, and this is you trying to keep that from happening again. But there's also somebody out there who likes to be told what to do. And we're probably being controlled the exact same way. But for reasons I don't know, they it was comfortable to them instead of off putting and I don't know, I think what you just said about knowing yourself, and knowing why you feel the way you feel. I think that's at the core of anyone's ability to live a healthy and comfortable life. But, you know, get a podcast, talk about yourself constantly. You'll figure it out pretty quick.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 27:55
Oh, my gosh, okay. Well, yes. Okay. So we'll end it just on that last thought on that point. It can feel scary. And you might not even know, if you do have a sense of what is causing or driving some of your thoughts, behaviors, that it can feel scary to do that. And so you know, there's no point in opening that box. But you also might not even know what's there. Sure. And that can also be overwhelming. Yeah. are scary. How

Scott Benner 28:26
can I tell you the reefer story, and then you can just move on, I'll let you go. I just put an episode up last week. It's called after dark prison, a female in our 30s mother of a few kids. And we spent an hour and a half laying out her life like she came on because she had been to prison with type one diabetes. And I wanted to hear about that. But the interview just went. I mean, it went so well. I'm proud of it. It went so well. And we basically dug through her early life of a lot of verbal abuse from her parents, from her dad, and no defense from her mom. And eventually she ends up in foster care. And then there she meets other people who were not treated well. And now they have the Justice League of foster care kids. So now they can break more rules and do more things. And they're all stunted at some point in their life, right? They're all kind of frozen wherever their trauma happened. She gets out of foster care. As babies the state takes a baby from her big trauma, right? Then she has more kids with a person who she shouldn't have been with. And then he's a criminal. And then she becomes a criminal. And then she defraud the government somehow gets caught, gets thrown in jail for two years during jail times treated terribly with her diabetes on and On and on and on. And I hope when people listen to that story, I mean, you can hear it any way you want to. And I'm not saying she didn't make decisions along the way that she could have made better she absolutely could have. But if you look at her as a whole story, and not just a caricature of a person who's been in jail, somebody abused her when she was little, and it sent her on a path. And then she met more abusive people. And to the point where she said at one point, she thought, because she knew how to vacuum and clean, she was better than the other people that she knew. That was her Mendoza line for success. She's like, I know what a vacuum and clean and I'm like, Oh, my God, like no one taught her anything once ever. And now you look at her in her 30s. And you want to be able to, and people want to judge her, they want to go look at her and go like, geez, yeah, there's no resilience here. She gave up everywhere along the way, broke every rule she could she didn't, you know, she didn't work hard. She didn't do anything like that. Yes, but what if someone would have been kinder when she was four, like, you know what I mean, like, and that's a bigger and more kind of ham fisted example. But some version of some of that happens to a lot of people. And maybe it doesn't end up with you in jail, maybe it just ends up with you in a personal, you know, relationship where it's always just a little contentious. And you don't really know why, or something like that. Like, I just think that that's important to know that, that what happened to her, on some level or another probably happens to almost everybody, and all the things that we've talked about in the past so far, your genetic makeup, the situation you're in the privilege you have of being loved by somebody, you know, because what a difference it would be to have a car accident as a seven year old and be surrounded by supportive people, or have that same car accident, and not have support, and then let that trauma tumble away and suck you down some sort of like, you know, siphon, anyway. Yes. Yeah. I feel like I don't have any clear thoughts on this. But I feel like I have a ton of them. I don't know how to put them together, if that makes sense.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 32:12
Yeah, I get that. Okay. Because it is it's it's so rich, and intense and important. But it's hard to lay it out in a very clear, clean outline. So I think we're trying to figure our way through here. I

Scott Benner 32:27
just hope that people listening can do it for themselves. Because what this really is, in my mind is a star map. Like you're the planet in the middle, and all these other points of light around you have pushed you pulled you influenced you helped you hurt you loved you not loved you along the way. And that those are all the reasons why you are who you are. And then we meet people as adults, and we say stuff like, she's a bitch. It's not that simple. Right? Right now, it's not my job to fix you. But it should be, oh, God, I'm going to sound like a hippie. It should be. It should be our jobs, to at least look at people and say, you know, there might be a really good reason that this is happening. And why don't I try not to be one more reason for this to go wrong for them. You know, you can say it any way you want, like Be the bigger person or whatever, or, but you know, when it all comes down to it. I follow David Foster Wallace his advice, and when somebody cuts me off, I assume they gotta go to the bathroom. They're not just being a jerk. They're probably just being a jerk, Erica, but it doesn't help me to feel that way. So I just give everyone the benefit of the doubt.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 33:44
I love No, I love that. Because that's that's your you just answered the question. You know, there. There's a story. What's the story fueling the behavior is what I think either Brene Brown or Dr. Perry usually asked. Yeah, there's there's always something underneath. And

Scott Benner 33:58
that's your it's very important to you, as you're figuring out your thing, but to the outside world looking in my perspective is it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if they have a good reason for being like this or not. It doesn't benefit you to walk around thinking that everybody's a piece of shit all the time. Like it's just it's hard on you. You don't I mean, like and why do we want to assume that people are bad on purpose? That's a weird thing, because some people don't feel that way. Right. So even that's an impulse from a variable from your past, right? Yes. Yeah. Okay. I'm sorry. Okay. I could No, no, that's good forever. So go

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 34:41
ahead. Yes, me too. Yeah. Okay. I was just looking up. I think we could maybe transition into talking about the aces, which I just was looking at the time it was developed aces or adverse childhood experiences developed in 1995 by researchers Vincent the Ready, Robert, and their colleagues at the Center for Disease and Control Centers for Disease Control. So thank you. And this is a tool that they started implementing and using it didn't really it hasn't really good didn't gain traction until a few years ago. I think we talked about that. And it's a it's a questionnaire, you could you could look it up right now, and take it, but it's for questions for adults, so 18 and over, but they're asking you if you experienced any of these 10 bad things before the age of 18. And these are things like, you know, consistent conflict in the in the household divorce, abuse, addiction, and neglect. And from the recent data, they have discovered that 60% of the population of the adult population has experienced at least one of these things before the age of 18. Jesus, really? Yes, 30% of the population has at least three or more. And what they discovered from these results is that the higher the score, the more risk there is for health disease, mental health problems, relationship issues, etc. Can I read them real quick? Yeah, please. Yeah, wait, I just kind of summarize Go ahead. Physical

Scott Benner 36:20
abuse, emotional abuse, sexual abuse, emotional neglect, physical neglect, parental separation, or divorce, mother treated violently, substance abuse, mental illness, incarceration. How many people have three or more

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 36:37
over 60% 30% of three or more 60% of have at least one. So this is so when we talk about I think it maybe it's important to yet to talk about the aces in conjunction with this idea of growing up feeling safe and secure. So if you grew up in a household, that the the stress, the pattern of stress was predictable, it was controllable is more moderate. That is a privilege in general, not like we're not talking about capital P privilege, that's that is a privilege. And that pattern of stress that was moderate controllable leads to more resilience, because like we talked about in the previous episodes in the in the parenting series, as well, you experience a little bit of stress, and then you come back to a safe and, and loving parental figure. And that's how you develop the resilience. And because of that, then your stress response system is more regulated. And that leads to as Dr. Perry says, a cascade of secondary and tertiary benefits because you're more capable of managing stress. So now, if we think about that household, and then juxtapose it with, if you grew up in a household where you had one, or three or more of these adverse childhood experiences, you are at greater risk to develop these other issues, health issues, mental health issues, relationship issues, problems with your profession. And what the studies one study from the Department of Health and Human Services found that while all children are at risk of aces, numerous studies showed inequities in these experiences. And these inequities are linked to the historical social and economic environments in which some families live. So that's where it this this conversation around environment, your family, is that that privilege, but then also is connected to how you were able to develop resilience. But also, it's important to note that even children who were exposed to a lot of these aces, they also showed, I don't have the numbers here but had a height. A lot of people demonstrated resilience despite these aces. Yeah.

Scott Benner 38:58
So it doesn't befall everybody and ruin them. But yeah, it certainly could. And also, you have to start thinking about the numbers inside of the numbers, like I listed 10 things. And but then go ask yourself, like how many people have mental illness? And how many people experience you know, spousal abuse or how many people and you start looking at? I mean, if there's 10 options, and each option has a fairly big percentage of likelihood, then the likelihood that you're covered by a number of these, this is significant, or at least I mean, I looked at it, I've got a couple of these from growing up to you. Would you mind we never talked about you, but do you have any of them? I mean, look at the list again, probably physical emotional, sexual, emotional neglect, physical neglect, separation, divorce mother treated violently substance abuse, mental illness, incarceration,

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 39:50
not clinic No, not clinically, I would have to say I grew I definitely had a you know, a very predictable all controllable household Yeah, then there's the diabetes factor, right, which happened younger. But that anyway, I'm gonna pause there. Also,

Scott Benner 40:09
there are significant impacts from having a chronic illness too. So you could just find problems in a different spot like so even if you grew up, luckily, do what you call privilege. I call it luck, like in this in this context, right? If you luckily did not experience any of these things, and you still got type one diabetes, there you go. Like there's your big T right there, followed by a whole lot of baby T's come in forever and ever and ever with low blood sugars. And, you know, here's your juice box, you know, Do this, don't forget your meter, like all these other little things that we think of is not just important, because they are not just safety things because they are but they're little, I think of them as like, little dings on your soul. You know what I mean? Like, over and over again, like you're trying to leave the house, you're running out the door, you're feeling like a real person, and then somebody looks and goes, Don't forget your kit. Oh, yeah, I have diabetes, I got this bag. You didn't even like, hey, you know, you're gonna go play at the park. That's great. Hold on, what's your blood sugar before you go? Like that, like thing thing? You know, let me just get you over and over and over again, little bits, little bits, which is to say like, I wouldn't stop doing that if I was a parent. I mean, I try not to be overbearing about it. You can't just forget that you have diabetes. But there's that. I don't know what the feeling here is, though, is, you know, you come out of the womb, and hopefully you're, you're at 100%. You know what I mean? And then something happens. And sometimes you dip down and you get to come back up again, right, you get a cold, you fight the cold, you come back up again. But some things you get. And you never can re ascend all the way. And if you start having a number of those things happen to you know, that's the pressure and the weight of life, right? Like I can't get out from under these things that have happened to me. And then you get these little, these little bits here and here. Like my friend of mine struggling just to get there CGM is right now having these long arguments and conversations on the phone arguing with insurance companies and going back and forth. And you think, Oh, no big deal, you have insurance, you're lucky you'll get them. But after hours on the phone having to say to somebody, give me this thing, that you know what? I don't really want, I just need it. Like you don't even mean like, like, so I need this thing. You're telling me I can't have it. I've explained to you 1000 times I have diabetes, I've had diabetes for years, you know, I have diabetes, why don't have to reprove it to get like, Why do I have to sit down and go over it again? Like, why do I have to relive the fact that I have diabetes with you to get this thing that I don't really want, I just need and that I'm telling you takes a little piece away. And if you're lucky, you can rebound in any mean? Yes.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 42:46
But even let's say you don't have any of the aces or major T traumas. But that scenario that you just described, over and over and over again, whether you're the person living with it, or a caregiver, that is stressful and triggering your stress response system. And that's over time, that does become the big T trauma. And so I just wanted it. I know, we've said that, but I think it's important to really highlight that that is as if you had this one event, but it's also

Scott Benner 43:15
a good example for why like all the sudden you lose your shirt on a neighbor who's like, can you eat that? And you're like, you know what, here we go. Like, I'm gonna let it all out right here, because you don't know that's gonna happen. Like you don't I mean, like, what, just one day, it's just too much. And it just tips the other way. What's that? Slowly I turned? What's that old movie? And like, so like, I don't know, I'm not referencing things I haven't even seen. It's like that kind of push you over the edge moment. And I don't think that like people don't just go off half cocked, they have these little things that happen that build up. And then like you said, all the sudden, it all gets pressed together and do it into a ball. You can't tell one little trauma from the other one. It's just this horrible feeling I have now that exists because I have diabetes or because something else happened to me that I can't like and then I look over here and this person's got all these same problems, too. And they seem completely resilient. And they're just smiling and tripping through life gone. Oh, yeah. What are some of the lessons you've learned from diabetes? You like, like, I always hear that conversation. And I'm like, I believe in it. I don't want to go down the wrong rabbit hole. Like I believe in it. I believe that I am better off because my daughter has type one. I also believe that I would be happy to give away all the things that I'm better off about. If she didn't have it. I think she's better off to I think I do think she's more resilient and blah, blah, blah. But if I was a piece of she didn't, that resiliency wouldn't have come to her it would have been something else and then she'd be running around going No, there's nothing good that's come from diabetes. Then two people online, argue with each other all day long about it. Oh though, there's plenty to learn from type one. I don't care. I have all these problems like, again, it's Those little like points of light that surround you, that changed your perspective and their perspective, your planets pointing one way and there's pointing another way. And that's where all these little arguments come from all the time when I see people arguing about, you know what, you know, if you want people with type one diabetes to argue Erica, go on Facebook and say, Hey, how do I get a disability? Pass it Disney live,

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 45:23
but yeah, I've been seeing those conversations. Yeah. We're

Scott Benner 45:28
not disabled. Yes, we are. No, we're not. Yes, we are.

Lija Greenseid 45:31
I can't stand up that low. My blood sugar gets low. Yes, you can. I ran a marathon back and forth, and back and forth. And I just want to get in the middle of it and go, stop. Why does it matter?

Scott Benner 45:42
She needs the past. You don't move on. Alright. Right. But it's not that easy. Because of all of this, that you were telling me about? It's freaking me out. This conversation is freaking me out. Just so you know. I'm so sorry. Aces were? Yeah. So

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 46:00
aces. I think the we're talking about you know, the, when you experience it, how you experience it. Also, I think it's important to not only talk about what happened to you, but also what didn't happen, like what, what was not there that you may be needed, which was that safe and secure. environment. And what you're talking about is Dr. Perry says your your ability to enjoy the world and enjoy others is related to how regulated you are, which is directly related to what happened to you? Because if are you operating from a place where you feel safe and secure? are you operating from a place that you're constantly aware and wanting to respond in fight or flight or protect yourself. And when we're talking about if you feel safe and secure, then you're also able to be more curious and go out and explore the world. And I was thinking about this in terms of your how you manage the diabetes, right because some people leave the hospital with their pomp and their CGM on or at least mostly their CGM, some people aren't able to do that. There's all different reasons why. And then some people are more comfortable saying, Okay, we're going to switch from injection to pump or we're gonna go eat this thing on day five, or we're going to, or we're not. And I also from this kind of framework of trauma, I was thinking about, is that related, if you're under threat, you're feeling under threat, you aren't very curious, or you aren't feeling very confident in trying new things. But if you are from either historically, from your family of origin, or even present day feeling safe, secure, are you then able to make those jumps or try new things in terms of your management? I don't know. I just thought it was an interesting point to think about,

Scott Benner 47:59
my son's looking for a job right now. And I said, Hey, listen, I just want to tell you, I think this is all gonna work out for you, you know, if you're feeling worried, or like pressure or anything like that, I don't think he shouldn't. He goes, I don't feel that way. And I was like, and so I go, not law. And he goes, No, I know, you guys got me. I was like, Oh, okay. That was it. That's the same thing you're talking about in slightly different contexts. Like, he's like, No, it'll be alright. I know. It'll be alright. But he doesn't know. It'll be alright. He believes it. Because we set up a safe, secure, loving place for him to live and to and to grow up. And his experience is that things work out. Not always quickly. But in the end. Yeah. So he can take risks, which and because he turned, he turned a job down because he was like, this isn't what I want to do. And it wasn't like a malt. Like, you know, like when I don't know what generation of these kids now I have no idea. I don't keep track of that stuff. Like I don't know if I'm an extra Milena. I don't know what I am. Well,

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 48:59
what? What year was he born? 2000. Say that is? Well, Gen Z. He's Gen Z. Technically,

Scott Benner 49:09
it seems to me like that's a statement where people be like, Yeah, well, his generation, like, they don't care about this, like blah, blah, blah. Like, it's not like that. He just, he has a plan. He is going to execute the plan. There's certain experiences he asked to get from jobs he offered, he was offered a job. And it wasn't, it would have just been a job. He would not have been able to get the experience and he has the luxury. Oh my god America, he has the privilege to say no to that job, because he knows the next one will come along. Whereas when I was his age, it would not have mattered what job you offered me. I would have said yes. And I would have taken it like literally I worked in a you know, I've worked in sheet metal shops, I've collected credit card debts, I've cut lawns, anybody who stood in front of me and said if you show up here at this time, I'll pay you. I was like okay, and I was there and I did not have any problem. Obviously, Okay, interesting. All right. I

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 50:03
think you know, when one thing I will share, you know, you asked me about my aces. When I think about my my family history in relation to trauma, I was just thinking about I was diagnosed at age 12. Two years later, my brother was diagnosed with type one when he was 10. And then a year later, our house burned down in the Laguna Beach Firestorm was there a lot of lots of houses. So I, when I think about my parents, and like, that was a lot for them to endure. And we got through it, there was a sense of like, resilience, like this is hard, but it was maybe leaning more. So in the like, we can do this and not as much space for like grief, which is probably why I do what I do now. But the I think about my dad and all that he endured, was had a lot of trauma growing up and built a lot of resilience in in response to that. Yeah, and leaned into the like, we can do this mindset. And so I think there's so going back to like, why is it important to look back as to how you operate today? Your history is rich with evidence, right?

Scott Benner 51:08
So if you if you're hit with something that requires resilience, and you have it, then you get a story like your dad's. But if you're hit with something, you don't have it? Are you doomed? Or can you recognize it? And go back and find these things? I mean, I know you believe that that's possible, you probably wouldn't do what you do for a living, but like, but what's the step there? Like, if you're listening to this right now, and you go, I am anxious all the time, and there is no reason for it. And I heard a couple of those things. That aces list, I did live through that. And then my kid got diabetes, and oh, my God, I feel like this. What do you do? Like you only mean like, what do you do that? Like, because listening to a podcast isn't gonna fix it? Like it might make you aware of it. But it's not. There are some people who say if you give something voice, it does clear it which I have seen work for some people, but for a lot of people, you're going to need help, right? Yes.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 52:00
And that what you just said, that's part of what therapy is, is speaking something out separating yourself from that. But if that's part of your narrative, you don't even understand why Yeah, and how its how that is impacting you, just by speaking it out in the presence of someone else to hear it and validate it, and then help you differentiate your story from your past your current story,

Scott Benner 52:26
can you tell me what's the significance of saying it in front of another person?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 52:30
Oh, it's for it to to know that it to recognize that it actually happened, that there is pain in that story to be heard and validated in an objective way. So I'm not going to be saying well, you should have done that. Or, like, why wouldn't did that happen? That way? There's, it's clear, it's just being giving space to something that happened to you by speaking it out in the presence of an objective listener is therapeutic, because you are able to simply be validated that that happened is the is the biggest first therapeutic tool, right to say, Wow, that sounds like it was really intense.

Scott Benner 53:15
Oh my god, Catholic confession. That's the That's, I guess, the basis of that idea. So okay, so here I am in 2024, realizing something that I guess people have known for hundreds of years, but nevertheless, sort of longer, but so just saying it out loud to somebody who won't, who will just hear it, because you can't just say it to yourself, you can't go into a room and be like, I murdered a hobo. Like that doesn't make it go I don't know why I said that. Because I think it sounds funny, and I know that that's not like, you know, like I just I gotta like Friday night, I went out I got crazy. I did some coke and I killed on faker. Like you can't say that in a room and make it go away. And not that you could ever make obviously murdering your person going away is a big example I shouldn't have made but but like, if you go into go in and sit with a priest and say, Look, I did this thing. It alleviates some of it. Saying it to yourself doesn't make it go away saying to somebody else does make it go away. Also, I believe if you say something like that to a priest, they do encourage you to turn yourself into the police. If I was

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 54:19
that from personal experience.

Scott Benner 54:22
I think it's an episode of mash I saw but okay. But if I go to you, and I say, Eric, I, what happens there? What's your legal? I know this is a weird turn. But if I go to you and I say Hey, I think I killed somebody with my car the other night. I'm not sure. We're just the legal legality, why

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 54:45
there's tariffs off rule, which is I am mandated to report you if you come in and tell me that you are thinking about harming somebody and then you you can. You've identified who that person is As I would have to then report that, if it's in the past, I think it really? Yeah. If it was conditional, yeah, it kind of depends.

Scott Benner 55:09
Interesting. Oh, all right. Okay, this all seems important, for reasons that I can't exactly put together right now. But like, what I'm trying to, I guess what I'm trying to like peel apart here is for people who don't see the value in going and talking to somebody, like, what does that accomplish for them? You put it into words, I still think it's a little nebulous for people listening, like, but I know for sure that saying it out loud, is very valuable. Like I'm 100% certain about that. Yes,

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 55:40
it decreases the your isolation from that experience, any kind of shame, or you're, you've lived in a space where you've kind of minimized it, where people might come in and tell me stories, and I'll say, that is significant. Trauma, like not overuse trauma, but real, real trauma. And they're

Scott Benner 56:00
like, Oh, my, there's like, just like a whole hot pan on my arm. Right, right. Right. Like that kind of thing. Gotcha. Okay, yes. And

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 56:08
so it's bringing to life, my pain that you've been carrying, and then learning how to grieve, heal and heal from it eventually, right? But just by speaking it out loud in the presence of someone who can be an objective listener and validate it is so powerful for the human spirit. Because you might not know how to validate it for yourself or even know that it needs attention, right? Until you speak it out. Do

Scott Benner 56:35
you need the forgiveness piece to somebody? Because you don't offer forgiveness to people, right?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 56:40
Most people know I mean, that's that's their journey, right? If someone is living in a space of of shame, and guilt, for whatever reason, that's their journey. And sometimes it looks like forgiveness. Sometimes it looks more like acceptance. It really is. Forgiveness is a complicated concept also to be worked on, and addressed in therapy, because you

Scott Benner 57:01
can I guess you would contextualize what they did, which might lead them to be able to accept it, which could look like forgiveness. And maybe just make them feel a little better. But then you got to go. Wow, all this stuff. I never really thought about how like 12 steps or you know, all these other like, they all have little pieces of unburdening yourself in there. Interesting. Wow, that's very complicated being a person. slightly complicated. I'm sorry. Is there something else you want to talk about that? I

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 57:36
think? Maybe, do we pause there we can go into the you know, classic PTSD, but maybe we I don't know what our timing is, like. Save that for next time. Okay.

Scott Benner 57:48
Yeah, I'm happy to I'm happy to. Oh, I see your your part here. Yeah. This was a big part. Part Three. Yes. And then I and then I got chatty in the middle and screw that up for you? Well, I mean, yeah, well, we'll just do it next time, we'll just do PTSD and chronic illness. In our next conversation. That's all.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 58:07
Yeah, I think in general, but you know, we're from today understanding, I think a that how, how are you experiencing? Or are you experiencing trauma? In what capacity? Did you were you exposed to one of these adverse childhood experiences? And if so, and I think your question going back to like, what do you do about it? With, you know, you're realizing, gosh, I did have an ace, or I am or I didn't, but I'm experiencing these traumatic trauma symptoms. Yeah. And I think understanding what people are like, Well, where do you start? Oftentimes, people come into therapy that again, or know where to start? I think it can be important to look at, okay, what are your current stressors? And then moving out? What are your social support systems? What is your family of origin story? Yeah. And when, when you're, when you're experiencing anxiety, it also can feel anxious, you can feel anxiety around what, you know, how do I under understand the root cause of everything. But also that's part of what you know, your therapist or, or anyone else that you're, you know, I'm thinking about? You said mentioned, confession, or even, you know, a church person, the counselor there should be trained to help you navigate and then start making connections. But even now, if you're experiencing anxiety, and you're like, What do I do, I can't go to therapy. I can't I don't have time for all these other things. Understanding, going back to some of our coping skill tools, right like that. You can Google anything around grounding exercises, deep breathing, going back to the basics of learning how to regulate your body physically is a great place to start. Yeah.

Scott Benner 59:51
It occurs to me that as we talk in in modern times about oh, there's so many more anxious people now I always think like there's Probably no more anxious people now than there was before. I just think maybe we talk about it more. Also, we've made a couple of things in life verboten that people were clearly using to like smoking, for example, right? Like, we have significantly quelled cigarette smoking. But how many people were managing their anxiety with cigarette smoking? Probably a lot. And now all of a sudden, a person who before wouldn't have seen themselves as anxious is probably like, No, I'm very anxious, or you mean, like, there's things like that, that, that as society changes, shines lights on other ideas. Now, maybe there are more people with anxiety that then there, there were in the past, I have no idea. I'm not looking at him. But this is as deep as I'm gonna look into it is to wonder out loud, it just does occur to me that we are in a sense, we are in a societal moment now, where people are also not as embarrassed to say something's not going well. When it's spoken about colloquially, you'll hear people say, I've said it before, like everybody wants a diagnosis. Like everybody wants to say they have a thing now all the sudden, like, I've never seen adults walking around and going, like, I think I'm this I think I'm that I'm like, oh my god, like, okay, like, like you so many feet, it feels like they want to identify their problem, somehow, like, right, like, I want to give a name to my problem. But I think it probably would be more valuable to give a voice to the what got you to the problem. And then just to say, Oh, I have this, see. And then that'd be the

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 1:01:26
right. You don't there's there's such their interest, interesting conversation around, you know, the DSM, the diagnosis manual. And even the ACE study, there's, there are critics of these things, because then it's saying, Okay, well, great. You have, you have five aces, and now you have now we can identify you as having PTSD. That's great. But let's we want to understand how can we help heal people and understand, not

Scott Benner 1:01:53
just paint them and then go, Okay, we'll go away. You have this now? Like, right, like, yeah, I want to get past this idea. Are there people walking around who have been through those aces? who legitimately don't have life struggles? Where is it impossible to have those things happen to you and not be impacted by them?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 1:02:11
I don't know if I could, like, I wish I could give you like a study. But I mean, I think that, in general, the research has shown that yes, you certainly can be exposed to these aces and, and succeed, and you've demonstrated resilience, you've overcame that adversity. But then there's also the data that says, well, that also can really impact your your mental health, your physical health, your overall functioning. But again, going back to the question of like, Are there more people with anxiety? Or are we just having that conversation and diagnosing more is, is a complicated line that we've kind of talked about this a little bit in past episodes. I think that the beauty of it, though, is, is normalizing the experience that people are, I think there probably is more anxiety based on a lot of things like the internet and social media, and even just thinking about with diabetes, you know, when you were diagnosed, like I was 30 years ago, you could hide it. And you would not, you didn't have any beeps, or things on your body. And consequently, I didn't have any teachers telling me like, who's ringing who's beeping or kids, everyone, you know, you beep and all the kids look at you in the classroom, and you have that micro moment of like, Oh, I'm different, right? I didn't have any of that even

Scott Benner 1:03:23
your health, you can kick the can down the road, because it's not hurting you in the moment. So you don't even say it. Yeah,

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 1:03:29
that's interesting. And so now with, even with the, you know, the the, all this technology, their psychological implications of, of caregivers, looking at the numbers all day, my mom had no idea what my number was until she would download my CGM or look at my, you know, fake life.

Scott Benner 1:03:50
42

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 1:03:55
there are opportunities for anxiety to be triggered more so. And we're talking about it more. And we're understanding what it looks like more. Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:04:04
yeah, gotcha. Okay. Well, I appreciate this. As always, I'm fascinated by all this and like, and looking at the different pathways that you could end up where you are and, and I also am very cognizant of the idea that like, there are some people who are like, I don't end up somewhere I make choices to get places. And then there are people who are like, I don't have any of these problems. And maybe they don't like maybe some of them don't, but maybe some of them do, and just think they don't land in the end. If you're happy. Is that enough? Like, you know, at what point do you want to just live your life and not be working on your life? There's just a lot of interesting questions for people to ask themselves in here. And I think just by talking back and forth like this, you allow them to wonder what those questions are, you know, anyway, appreciate it very much.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 1:04:51
Yes. Thank you.

Scott Benner 1:05:01
A huge thanks to Dexcom for supporting the podcast and for sponsoring this episode dexcom.com/juicebox Go get yourself a Dexcom g7 right now using my link. A huge thanks to us met for sponsoring this episode of The Juicebox Podcast. Don't forget us med.com/juice box this is where we get our diabetes supplies from you can as well use the link or call 888-721-1514 Use the link or call the number get your free benefits check so that you can start getting your diabetes supplies the way we do from us med. I want to thank the ever since CGM for sponsoring this episode of The Juicebox Podcast. Learn more about its implantable sensor, smart transmitter and terrific mobile application at ever sent cgm.com/juicebox Get the only implantable sensor for longterm where get ever since if you are a loved one was just diagnosed with type one diabetes, and you're looking for some fresh perspective. The bold beginning series from the Juicebox Podcast is a terrific place to start. That series is with myself and Jenny Smith. Jenny is a CDC es a registered dietician and a type one for over 35 years. And in the bowl beginning series Jenny and I are going to answer the questions that most people have after a type one diabetes diagnosis. This series begins at episode 698 In your podcast player, or you can go to juicebox podcast.com. And click on bold beginnings in the menu. I know that Facebook has a bad reputation. But please give the private Facebook group for the Juicebox Podcast. A healthy once over Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes. The group now has 47,000 members in it, it gets 150 new members a day. It is completely free. And at the very least you can watch other people talk about diabetes, and everybody is welcome type one type two gestational loved ones, everyone is welcome. Go up into the feature tab of the private Facebook group. And there you'll see lists upon lists of all of the management series that are available to you for free in the Juicebox Podcast, becoming a member of that group. I really think it will help you it will at least give you community you'll be able to kind of lurk around see what people are talking about. Pick up some tips and tricks. Maybe you can ask a question or offer some help Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes on Facebook. If you're not already subscribed or following in your favorite audio app, please take the time now to do that. It really helps the show and get those automatic downloads set up so you never miss an episode. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back very soon with another episode of The Juicebox Podcast. The episode you just heard was professionally edited by wrong way recording. Wrong way recording.com