#1061 Celiac Shock

Kathryn’s son has type 1 diabetes and celiac. 

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Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends, and welcome to episode 1061 of the Juicebox Podcast

Welcome back everybody today on the podcast Catherine is 36 years while I just use more English than that, I start over Katherine is 36 years old, a school teacher she's married the mother of three, and her four year old son has type one diabetes and celiac disease. She actually just had a baby a few weeks before we made this. Her son was diagnosed pretty early on, and the story of how they found out about the celiac is crazy. What do you hear it? While you're listening? Please remember that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan. Were becoming bold with insulin. Want to save 40% off of comfortable things like this beautiful sweatshirt I'm wearing right now go to cozy earth.com and use the offer code juicebox at checkout to save 40% off of this sweatshirt, actually off of your entire order. And you get a free year supply of vitamin D and five free travel packs when you get your first order of ag one at drink ag one.com/juice box

this episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by Omni pod makers of the Omni pod dash n the Omni pod five, learn more, get a test drive and get started today at Omni pod.com/juicebox. podcast is also sponsored today by us med us med.com/juice box or call 888-721-1514 Why would you go to that link or call that number? Well to get your free benefits check and to get started today, receiving your diabetes supplies the same way we do from us met.

Kathryn 2:13
I am Katherine and I am a mom to three. my eight year old daughter, my four year old son who is our tea Wendy and celiac. And then we have a seven week old son.

Scott Benner 2:27
You just had a baby. Yes. So I that's why

Kathryn 2:31
I'm not working right now. I'm a teacher, but I am home for the rest of the school year with the baby.

Scott Benner 2:34
Get back to work. Katherine, that's enough. Three weeks.

Kathryn 2:39
It's finals week next week at our school. So as like Why Why go back at this point for finals?

Scott Benner 2:44
Yeah, yeah, no, I understand. Okay, so eight for three weeks. Wow. Eight for three weeks. Which one's the type one?

Kathryn 2:52
The four year old? Boy right for your little boy? Yep. Okay.

Scott Benner 2:58
All right. And you're married?

Kathryn 2:59
Yes. Yeah, I should say that. I've been married for 10 years. Next month.

Scott Benner 3:04
You should say that. You want to leave him out?

Kathryn 3:08
No, he he's very important. And like I said a big part of this story, too. So married 10 years next month.

Scott Benner 3:13
Okay, great. So, just for context, how old are you? 36

Wow, look at you. Think about that. You did all the things now. I mean, threes. Three, you're done. Right? Three kids?

Kathryn 3:23
Yes. Yeah. 99.9%. Sure. Right. Probably done having sex not just having kids and has well husband's gonna go take care of business.

Scott Benner 3:32
Well, look at him doing the doing the best big boy thing to do. Hmm,

Kathryn 3:35
yeah. Hey, if I have to have three kids then, which I should say I'm very happy that we had three kids. But you know, it's a lot of work and pain so he can have a couple yet. couple moments of pain.

Scott Benner 3:48
I just heard your brain say I don't want my kids to hear this one day when I say if I have to have three. Your brain was like be nicer about that. But I take your point. So Geez, how long ago was your type one diagnosed?

Kathryn 4:03
He was diagnosed March 23 of 2020. So literally the onset of COVID School got shut down like a week before and it was what was supposed to be our spring break. Nobody obviously went anywhere. And he was 17 months old when he was diagnosed.

Scott Benner 4:24
Oh wow. That happened while you guys were like while we were all still thinking we should wipe our groceries off.

Kathryn 4:29
Oh yeah. We when we noticed something was up with him. He was like leaking through his diapers up to his armpits. It was it was beyond the point where we're like, oh, maybe he just needs a bigger diaper at night. It was like he took a bath and I we have no diabetes in our family like this was a complete shock and I have no idea why I knew warning signs of diabetes. I used to read like ridiculous medical novels when I was a teenager and that's probably something you know, stuck in me but we call this pediatric Shouldn't we're like, do we even come in? We don't know what the situation is anymore. And yeah, she had us come in and his blood sugar was and I heard this through the, through the wall. I heard her on the phone with the Children's Hospital. And I don't even didn't even know what a good blood sugar versus a bad blood sugar was. But I heard like 483 I was like, Okay, that sounds bad. If she's on the phone with the hospital before she even comes back in to talk to me.

Scott Benner 5:24
That's a horrible way to find out where your your head wasn't up against the door or something. Right?

Kathryn 5:29
Like, apparently it was just a really thin door in the pediatricians office.

Scott Benner 5:33
I just had this feeling like you up against the door just listening and listening. She's calling the hospital. She packed the bag up. We're leaving in a minute. This is right.

Kathryn 5:41
Yeah. And then she came back in and she's like, normally in this situation, we would send somebody in an ambulance and put you on put him my son on, you know, an IV, but she's like, I don't know what's in the ambulance. I don't know what's in the emergency room. We don't want to expose you to any more unnecessary germs. So she's like he's stable. How you caught it this early. No idea. He was not in DKA or anything. He just really high blood sugar and p and a whole lot. So I drove we're in the far northwest suburbs of Chicago. So I drove into the into the city and Oh,

Scott Benner 6:14
wow. And then yeah, Geez, how long were you in the hospital? Which they got you out of there quicker? To

Kathryn 6:20
two nights. So three days, two nights. Yeah, pre pre masks and everything. But they gave us two options for hospitals, one out of the city, and then the children's hospital in the city. And she said maybe not the one out of the city because they started accepting COVID patients and the, at the time, the children's hospital didn't have any known COVID patients. So

Scott Benner 6:41
that is right, right at the beginning. Oh, yeah,

Kathryn 6:44
right at the beginning. So we were lucky my husband was still allowed to come down. And at that point, we're like, okay, we hadn't seen the grandparents were like, We don't know if you're diseased or what's going on. But we're like, We need someone to watch the Our older daughter so grandparents were like, Okay, you're in our bubble now.

Scott Benner 7:01
Disease. I love that part of it. When you look back on that that moment, right where I took one of the best flights of my life because of COVID Because everyone panicked. Before people were really sick, which was, by the way, good. I guess they were going home. But I flew a Me and four other people flew from Georgia to New Jersey, in a jumbo jet was amazing. Like, like, laid across the all three seats and like, you know, the stewardess is willing to give you extra pretzels they'd like kind of flip them to you.

Kathryn 7:37
Probably 12 bags because it's an empty airplane. And we don't need

Scott Benner 7:42
them. We're not even have to clean the bathroom after this. They were just like, like, it was insane. Like a big like, I don't know, what is it yet? Hold? Three, three of the standard ones are like three on each side, just like 30 rows. We can do this six times, like 180 people, right? Something like that. Yeah. So there were five of us on there. And then it was really terrific. It was also frightening in like, first 30 minutes of a zombie movie kind of way to

Kathryn 8:08
show like it's the world coming to an end like this very,

Scott Benner 8:11
it was it was somehow oddly relaxing and off putting at the same time. I

Kathryn 8:16
definitely know co workers that just jumped a plane to Florida and taught the rest of the school year on a beach. So

Scott Benner 8:22
I know what to do. I'm getting out of here. Oh, and what my one of my daughter's teachers did that. They left and just every day she said she turned the camera on. He was he was this close to going outside and enjoying the weather just had to get through whatever thing they were pretending to teach them that. Yeah. Okay, so, three days, two nights did it feel right. And I was gonna ask you if it felt rushed, but how would you know? I

Kathryn 8:45
felt like I took a crash course like in medical school on diabetes and you know, what would have been a semester a year I don't know a lifetime at college. I just even my my head like I said, my husband came down. I spent the first night there alone with my son and my husband came downtown the next day. And we just felt like, overwhelmed. Like, can you say in a good way like overwhelmed, sad for you know what our son's going to live with for the rest of his life. But the staff at the hospital was so amazing, like, trying to educate us as much as possible, and trying to like meet us where we were in understanding things and whatnot like overwhelmed with support I guess so good support. So I guess felt rushed? Yes. In the sense that we're trying to learn hey, here's here's everything you need to know to keep your son alive and healthy and happy. Now go home and keep them alive. So yeah, overwhelmed there. But like I said, they we still work with the the Endo, his endocrinologist who's out of the hospital to and they've been nothing but amazing anytime we need anything or have questions, so overwhelmed in a good way.

Scott Benner 9:48
Now, what about technology and like, where did you start? Did you start with a meter and a syringe or?

Kathryn 9:57
Yes, so I'm here He was actually MDI until about two weeks before our son was born. This, like the one that we just had, oh, so we were doing injections until about, I mean, less than two months ago. And he went home with just a meter, but we got the Dexcom like two or three weeks after diagnosis, they just pushed it all through insurance. So we were Dexcom and MDI until under two months ago, and now he's on Omnipod. Five,

Scott Benner 10:28
who brings up the Dexcom to you, the hospital

Kathryn 10:31
did the nurse educator at the hospital did. That's good. That's excellent. Yeah, yeah. It that was definitely amazing. Because it felt like having a newborn again, going into his crib. I mean, he was still in a crib when he was diagnosed, and like poking him at two o'clock in the morning and be like, Can I squeeze enough blood out of your little finger. So having the Dexcom was fantastic.

Scott Benner 10:55
My daughter, Arden has been wearing an omni pod since she was four years old. And she is now 19. That is every day wearing an omni pod for the last 15 years. I think what we love most about the pod is that it doesn't have any tubing. But I don't know is that the thing you love most about it? You don't have to take it off to swim or bave you can leave it on for activity and exercise. It's small. I don't eat I mean, it's so easy to put on right to fill it and to put it on. It's just it takes us no time at all. Yeah, I guess it's hard to figure out what my favorite thing about Omni pod is. I guess I'll just say that my daughter loves it. It's easy, and it's worked for her. For so many years. It's just such a friend at all this Omni pod.com forward slash juice box. You can check your coverage there for your insurance. Or take a test drive right? Would you like a free trial of the Omni pod? You can do that there as well. And you can just get started on the pod.com forward slash juice box. Now you have a decision to make. Do you want the Omni pod dash, which is an insulin pump? Where you make all the decisions? Or do you want the Omni pod five now the Omni pod five is the first and only tubeless automated insulin delivery system to integrate with a Dexcom G six. And it's available for people with type one diabetes ages two years and older. It features smarter just technology, and it's going to help you to protect against highs and lows both day and night. That's an algorithm based system making decisions about insulin given it and taking it away. It's pretty damn cool. Omni pod.com forward slash juicebox links in the show notes links at juicebox podcast.com. When you use those links, you're supporting the production of the podcast and helping to keep it free and plentiful. Everybody who has diabetes has diabetes supplies, but not everybody gets them from us med the way we do us med.com forward slash juice box or call 888721151 for us med is the number one distributor for FreeStyle Libre systems nationwide. They are the number one specialty distributor for Omni pod dash, the number one fastest growing tandem distributor nationwide, and they always provide 90 days worth of supplies, and fast and free shipping. That's right us med carries everything from insulin pumps to diabetes testing supplies, right up to your latest CGM like the FreeStyle Libre two, n three and the Dexcom G six and seven. They even have Omni pod dash and Omni pod five, they have an A plus rating with the Better Business Bureau and you can reach them at 888-721-1514 or by going to my link us med.com forward slash juicebox. When you contact them, you get your free benefits check. And then if they take your insurance, you're often going and US med takes over 800 private insurers and Medicare nationwide. better service and better care is what US med wants to provide for you. Us med.com forward slash juicebox get your diabetes supplies the same way Arden does from us med links in the show notes links at juicebox podcast.com. To us Med and all the sponsors. When you use my links, you're supporting the show. I don't meet a ton of people whose kids were diagnosed earlier in life than Arden was. But yeah, you've got me by by a little you've got her by a little bit when he's 17 months old. Is that right? 17

Kathryn 14:32
months? Yes. His pediatrician said he won a a not so great award for her. She he's the youngest patient. She has referred to the hospital for diabetes diagnosis.

Scott Benner 14:45
Does she get something like a plaque?

Kathryn 14:48
I know right like terrible, terrible award to win. But yes, he was the youngest and I his pediatrician was great too. She called us in the hospital is like is everything you know are you getting what you feel like you need to How's he doing? So it's been it's been a great team. But yeah, he wasn't anybody and a big surprise.

Scott Benner 15:05
What did he way before diagnosis one of the way at diagnosis?

Kathryn 15:08
You know what I don't even know. stepdad I don't know how much he was. Looking back at pictures, though. You can see in his facial expression, things changed from the week leading up. I mean, he looked to me still like a chubby toddler. He, I mean, he was walking back way before 17 months and running around, but he was just lethargic. His face, looking back at the pictures was all flushed. He looked pudgy. He wasn't like, you know, super skinny. Like you hear a lot of a lot of kids.

Scott Benner 15:36
You figured it out quickly. Yes, yeah,

Kathryn 15:39
they were Everyone was surprised. Even at the hospital, we figured it out as quickly as we did. And maybe that was because of COVID. I was, I would have figured it out eventually. But I wasn't running to work. I was staring at my kids, you know, all day, every day. That's such

Scott Benner 15:52
a good point. I feel like that's why a lot of people are diagnosed around holidays, and vacations and things like that. Because they their life slows down and they don't have as much to do and then they somebody looks up and gets in bed one night and goes this the kid looks skinny to you. You know, like, it just sort of gives you a moment to reflect I think, oh, yeah, I actually believe that after hearing enough stories. You know, a lot of people would figure it out sooner if they weren't running around living, you know, doing all the things.

Kathryn 16:22
Exactly, exactly. So I guess we're fortunate that COVID happened and the fact that it made us slow down and take a look at what was happening. Yeah,

Scott Benner 16:30
well, he didn't go into decay. And that's a big deal because I can tell you Arden our didn't look like our didn't look like a runway model on a heroin bender. By the time we figured out she had type one because she had lost so much weight. And she was so speed spacey in her face and everything and can see your ribs like it was the terrible like scary, like, look back and you think, how did I like we knew she didn't feel well. But you never like we never, like you said like, I don't know anybody weird to say like, I don't know anybody in my family with type one, which is what people say. But we didn't know what that means. Like, my best friend had type one on when he was 18 or 19. But I mean, I didn't watch him get diagnosed, not like I was there when it happened or anything. So

Kathryn 17:13
no one tells you as a parent like, and by the way, look out for X, Y, and Z because that might indicate your kid has problems. You know, no one tells you what to look out for. Because why would you look for it? You know,

Scott Benner 17:25
I always think to look, can you imagine you had a baby, it's your first one. And you're still in that, like, it's gonna be great. Like, oh, and for those of you who are younger, it's gonna be great. Don't worry. But for everybody else, who knows what we're talking about. You imagine if you had a baby, and you were still in that it's gonna be great. Everything's exciting. And I just got married. We just bought a house like that vibe. And a doctor sat you down and said, Okay, we just need about six days. We're gonna go over it in two hour chunks. I'm going to explain everything that might possibly happen to that kid that will make them really sick and you have to bring him to the hospital. You just, you know, that's not first of all reasonable and second of all, I wouldn't be I wouldn't be healthy. You didn't nobody

Kathryn 18:07
would have kids anymore. You'd have one and be like, Okay, this is too scary. I'm done. Well,

Scott Benner 18:11
I mean, I don't know. Katherine, if the coming out of the vagina thing doesn't stop people. I don't know what else is gonna get them. Honestly. Seriously, think back to when you like my daughter's 19 right now or 19. Anytime you ask her about a baby, the only thing she says is, Hmm, seems like a bad idea the way it happens. Fair enough.

Kathryn 18:32
Yeah. The two of the first two came out the the normal way. The third this last one though. They got cut open. So I'm like, Okay, done. I don't need to be cut open anymore.

Scott Benner 18:41
We're just going to do just to make it just open up your abdomen. Don't worry. We do it all the time. We hardly lose any other moms. Like just what is happening. All this? And you're gonna be I don't understand. Like, I mean, as a person. I don't have one. You understand what I mean? But I've seen I've seen one close up, and it doesn't see them like, I just didn't seem like a good idea. You would think very surreal experience. Nature would like install, like a zip lock or something like that. The nice zipper with a look like some kind of lock on it. It seems poorly thought out to me as all I'm saying. ticular we're watching cow have a bit of calf. Yes, yes. Those long legs.

Kathryn 19:23
Uh huh. Who's there is a there's a farm in Indiana. We went on vacation last year in my now eight year old daughter was fascinated. You can watch cows have birth, like give birth live and she was like, eyes wide open staring just like we wait a second to come out. Now. It's like, I don't know if you should be seeing this at seven years old at the time. But hey, that's nature. Let

Scott Benner 19:46
her say she's going to adopt. So that'll be she's like I don't know. I just strongly feel I feel strongly about adoption for some reason. I just you know why if I put an engineer in charge of getting a baby calf out of a mother calf, and that's what They came up with, I'd be like, who hired this guy? That's what you came up with ridiculous. Get out of here. Anyway. Okay, so I guess I'd like to commiserate with you a little bit. Now you had to CGM. So fair enough. But what's it like taking care of a 17 month old with insulin? The

Kathryn 20:20
beginning is such a blur. Like I said, it felt like having a newborn baby. And in the fact that we were always awake and always tired, because we felt like we couldn't sleep and especially me, I took a lot of the I took a lot of the care upon myself. And I'll, I'll keep talking about like, I keep saying My husband's a big part of the story. I don't think at the time he was capable of taking care of our son he is now it was overwhelming. His blood sugar was mountains and valleys like high, low, high, low, high, low all the time, finding your podcast, which I didn't even find until last summer, when somebody on our town square saw my son's Dexcom and was like, Hey, I have type one, two, and then we got to talking. But it was up, down up down. I'm like, I felt like I was doing nothing right at the time. The CGM was a blessing. But eventually it got better. I mean, obviously it did. Because otherwise, why would we be doing multiple daily injections for? I guess he's had, what three years he's been diagnosed. So yeah, for almost three years, we did daily injections, but we figured it out. You

Scott Benner 21:21
figured it out, you were using syringes that were like had half units on it. Yes. And not even not even using the whole half

Kathryn 21:28
unit. Exactly. The endocrinologist would be like as close to a quarter of a unit as you can get it. But of course, nothing, no syringe goes that low. Just probably in the last couple of months, before we switched over to the Omni pad, we finally could use the pen and twist it up to one unit because his insulin needs were growing as he was. So it's like, oh, this is amazing. We don't have to stick a syringe into the pen needle and pull out this teeny tiny bit. His his long acting was still in a syringe, though, until we switched to the pump. Yeah,

Scott Benner 21:58
I taught myself how to inject drops of insulin. So So I took, I took some insulin, and I squirted it into a dish. And then I put food coloring in it so I could see it. And then I drew it back up in the syringe. And then I would sit and practice pushing on the plunger slightly to see a drop come out. I wasn't doing this obviously in art. And I was like visually looking at it. And I colored it so I could see it better. So once I taught taught myself how to press on it enough to get a drop out. Then I started doing that to Bolus her because she knew she didn't need anything you don't I mean, so that would

Kathryn 22:39
have been super helpful. If had I thought about it, that I can't even imagine how long that took to fit, you know, to be able to do that consistently enough to I just

Scott Benner 22:47
sat at a table over and over again, just practicing and practicing until I got it right. And then of course, once the needle goes in, you know the non insulin, the non fruit colored insulin goes in. Then as soon as that happens and you do it you think well I did it the way I did it before that's probably right. And then you realize I don't know. I don't know if it went in I don't know if enough. When does everyone have that panic? Where you you're so bad at injections in the beginning that you put it in you push it and then you go Did I push it while it was in the skin? Or did I not? And then there's that horror that falls over you're like well, I guess we just have to wait now and see if what happens because I don't know what I did. And there's like a little moisture on the skin. It's just the whole thing is a panic.

Kathryn 23:32
good handful of times our son especially at the beginning would you know jump or try and run away and it's like did he get enough in or did he run away before it all came out of the syringe? Yep. Oh, totally. Totally remember that feeling? They're

Scott Benner 23:45
running away and the syringes in them and you're like

Kathryn 23:50
the nice part now is he it's so normal to him. Even if he goes to the doctor you know for for a shot. It's like it's a needle whatever. He's he doesn't even flinch anymore. Yeah. Which is amazing and sad all at the same time.

Scott Benner 24:05
I think there was a moment in that time where my wife looked at me and she's like she was kidding but she goes Do you want to get married? Well have us in kids she's like thanks a lot Yeah, no problem sorry. Apologize for that. Oh my fault. Anyway, so what are your goals? Like I You said you were like bouncing up and down up in hindsight, why was that happening? Um,

Kathryn 24:35
overwhelmed overwhelmed with his care overwhelmed he is celiac also so after when he got admitted they you know, ran all the tests and then we get this phone call that oh my gosh, he needs to have an endoscopy and you know, get them diagnosed for that. And for whatever reason I feel like that diagnosis hit me harder. I remember I don't cry a whole lot but crying in the basement, to my husband and the kids were down airs after we got the official call that he was diagnosed celiac, but the the blood sugar, the peaks and valleys are overwhelmed. And then my husband ended up in the hospital, like five times starting in September of 2020. I found out he and I did not know this, my husband, I guess, is an alcoholic or a recovering alcoholic at this point. And that probably would not have been figured out had our son not been diagnosed. Diabetic and celiac. Well, my husband would probably be dead if, which is we're very sad to say out loud, he'd probably not be with us anymore if our son hadn't been diagnosed. Okay,

Scott Benner 25:38
so let me finish up the one thing before we move on. Yeah, no problem. Way to drop like a like just the bomb in the middle of the conversation. Yeah, thank you. By the way, Kevin, thank you. Someone said something on a recording recently, that was so shocking. And told the told that part of their story. And afterwards I just said, I really appreciate you sharing that I was like, I'm like, it's horrible. But boy, people are gonna love listening to that, just like this is not on that same level. And I don't want to ruin it for people because it'll come out before yours. But anyway, they found out can I just tell you, they found out that her father was bipolar? By figuring out that he was going to dungeons to be dominated by a dominatrix. And well, he's a pastor. It was the like, as she was saying it I just all I could think was Thank you. Thank you so much. I really do appreciate you sharing.

Kathryn 26:36
I'm very much anticipating that episode. As the my I haven't

Scott Benner 26:39
even edited it yet. I want to wrap my brain around the fresh eyes. So but overwhelmed. That's why the blood sugar's go up and down. But like management wise, what were you not doing or doing that was making it happen? I'm

Kathryn 26:53
probably overcompensating on both ends, like giving insulin and then giving carbs to, you know, when he was low, bring it back up. I feel like everybody's told 15 carbs at the at the beginning. Like if he's low, give him 15 carbs. And looking back on it. Now, that was way more than he needed to bring him back up at certain, you know, when he was hitting low at certain, certain levels, like if he's only sitting at 70, he didn't need 15 carbs to put him back into, you know, around 90. So I'm sure that contributed to it and then not being good at pulling insulin into that little syringe. Had I've been able to give him one or two drops, it's probably all he needed versus the half a unit or eyeball, what a quarter unit would be, was probably too much insulin that he was being given to drop him back down. You're

Scott Benner 27:41
just always chasing the blood sugar. You're flying up. You're hitting it with insulin, it crashes down, you hit it with too much. You're just rollercoaster and all over the place. Exactly. Okay. Exactly. Did his size when he grew? Did that make it easier?

Kathryn 27:56
Yeah, it did. And I think experience, you know, every day I learned a little bit more. But yeah, as he got bigger, he needed more insulin. So it helped with the peaks and you know, the peaks and valleys and helped not eliminate them. They still happen. He's fighting a fever right now. So we're back to it. It made them better. It made less of them. We got a little bit more of the the nice rolling hills. Yeah, I his Basal insulin at the beginning, his long acting was so minut that it was he probably only needed one or two drop. So as he got bigger and needed more it. Yeah, it helped.

Scott Benner 28:37
I tell people all the time, and they're like, we're struggling with this, we're struggling that I'm like, the great thing here is they're gonna grow, like keep eating, keep growing. It's the best thing to make this feel easier. At some point. It's just the ability to put in a measured amount of insulin that you can count on doing a thing and not being too much or too little. And it's a big part of it. Okay, so you've, you've got me interested now, how does your son's diabetes diagnosis help you to learn that your husband is an alcoholic? So

Kathryn 29:09
call me naive, like, I mean, we should drink drink. I don't even know the proper word anymore. Socially.

Scott Benner 29:17
I see your red hair. I know what's happening. Don't worry. Yeah.

Kathryn 29:19
My Type One is a fiery redhead, too. Yeah, I grew up in a household that we didn't like my parents didn't drink a glass of wine, maybe for a special occasion. I didn't grow up around drinking at all, as I you know, went to college, studied abroad, you know, grew up had my own my own place, you know, drink a little bit more, but I've never been a big super heavy drinker. Definitely drink socially, way back at the beginning of our relationship when we were dating, like I remember my husband drinking straight out of a bottle and I was like, Ooh, that rubs me the wrong way. And he stopped doing it. He still was you know, acting like a young 20 something year old. So I didn't know any I didn't know anybody. You that I knew of anyway, that was an alcoholic. I didn't know what, what to look for. I didn't know what signs there were of alcoholism. And looking back. I'm like, oh, yeah, X, Y and Z. Hindsight is always 2020. Right? But anyway, my husband hates doctors hates doctors never takes himself to the doctor. He is also wish in a chef. He's in the culinary industry. And so insurance like, yeah, right. So he never went to a doctor because he didn't have insurance. I mean, it was as far as when he went to go ask my parents, if he could marry me nice and old fashion. I said, What did you do today when I came home from work, and he's like, I went to the doctor, and I freaked out because I was like, something has to be wrong. If you went to the doctor, no, he was trying to lie that he went to my parents. But anyway, when our son got diagnosed diabetic and then the celiac diagnosis, the his gastro, highly recommended that our daughter older than him get screened for celiac, and that my husband and I got screened just to see if, you know, our daughter had it, not that she was showing any signs, if we possibly had it. And so I called the doctor and we did not have a primary care doctor for my husband and I at the time. So we were switching to a highly rec, or we were going to we were going to start with a highly recommended doctor in the area. And because we hadn't been to the doctor, not only she wasn't going to just run the celiac, I guess the the blood panel right away. She wanted to do a physical for my husband and I wanted

Scott Benner 31:36
to get paid Catherine, I understand exactly

Kathryn 31:38
exactly. Which I was like, okay, not a bad idea when the last time I went to the doctor was when our son was born, and my husband never goes to the doctor. So I remember going in for the physical and of course, I made all the appointments, and we walked into the doctor's office and my husband realized we weren't at the lab to just pick out we were just going to draw blood. And he liked the look of panic on his face was like, he's like, You didn't tell me we were actually going to a doctor's appointment. He just thought we were gonna go get a blood draw. And I said, Well, we're gonna go do the blood draw. But we're gonna go see this doctor first. It's our first time seeing her she wants to do a physical and he visual look of panic on his face. Really. Which I again thought it was just, he doesn't like doctors. He hates going to doctors rarely does it. But looking back it was she's gonna figure out something that isn't, isn't right. The alcoholism.

Scott Benner 32:31
Wow. By the way, you're so nice. If I walked into a doctor's office and looked panicked. I know my wife would think and say out loud, I made a mistake marrying you. You really have to toughen up. Like, please, please pull yourself together. We're at the doctor's office. But that's what so he thought something in I don't go to doctors. I don't even know what they're gonna do. But he's betting in his mind that something's gonna happen. It's gonna sniff him out on this. Yeah,

Kathryn 32:59
exactly. I mean, of course, I'm not in his mind. But I'm sure that's what he was thinking in my head. Looking at him at the time, I was just oh, he's panicking. Because he doesn't ever go to the doctor. He hates doctors, they freak him out. Just Medicine freaks people out some, you know, but just, she had us to do. I mean, when we were in, in the doctor's office, he elevated blood pressure, which can be a sign of so many things. But she, when she ordered the blood test to screen for celiac, she did like, you know, whole general gamut of blood tests just again, first time at a primary care, she wanted to have a baseline. And she's also the primary care for my parents. So she knows that she knew what my parents are, you know, as in their older age. So for me, you know, screening to see, you know, whatever if I take after my parents, but when those tests came back, No, we weren't showing any signs of celiac, but she looked at my husband was like, there is something else going on here. And

Scott Benner 33:59
liver enzymes, where did they where did she figure it out?

Kathryn 34:02
You know what, I don't remember exactly that test. But she was recommending I remember she was recommending that he go. I don't remember he sees so many doctors now and has seen so many doctors since I don't remember exactly what came out of seeing the primary care. But shortly after seeing her, we ended up in the emergency room. Really.

Scott Benner 34:25
Were you together on that follow up visit the two of you were together. Yeah, yes. Okay.

Kathryn 34:32
And, again, I don't remember exactly what happened and she didn't send us to the emergency room but wanted to do follow ups with him or send him other places. He ended up in the emergency room mainly because of me and his parents and our parents. He was at the time curled up on our couch and couldn't stand up and we're like something is not right. This has been lasted a couple of days knowing that the doctor did saw something where like, we gotta we gotta go.

Scott Benner 35:02
He tried to quit cold turkey. Is that what happened to him? No, not at the

Kathryn 35:06
time his. What turns out after we found out once he did get admitted to the hospital, his liver and his kidneys were shutting down and how old was turns out? Let's see, he's I would have been just about three years ago. He was 38.

Scott Benner 35:20
Wow. Yeah, that's impressive. In a bad way. Yeah, okay. Definitely.

Kathryn 35:27
And, again, we would never, I don't think we ever would have ended up in the emergency room, when we did. Had the whole ball gotten rolling with our son's diagnosis, the celiac that, you know, don't get screened as adults. My husband would probably be dead because we wouldn't have gotten there that quick. Where are

Scott Benner 35:47
you? When a physician is in the room explaining this, and you start doing the math and you say, Oh, my God, he drinks like, does he drink way more than you thought he did? Was he drinking Private 100%? Okay, privately

Kathryn 36:01
100% If we had you know, friends over it was the summer at the time and you know, have a glass of wine or a seltzer outside. Most of the time, I didn't even see him drinking. He's like, I'll just have water. I'll have a you know, a Lacroix or something. I'm like, Okay, I, you know, I'm having one Seltzer and I drink more than I drink more than my husband, who, previously, you know, when we started dating, was drinking all the time. So, yes, it was mostly in private, he would be adding things to his drinks, not in front of me. And I didn't know. And once he got admitted to the hospital and was in for a stay, and we, I found out I mean, they called me in the morning, and we're like, hey, we had to move him to the you know, to a different floor because he's in withdrawal. And I'm like, What the heck does that even mean? I grew up so naive, it took me a while, but then going through cabinets. I was like, oh, empty liquor bottle, empty liquor bottle empty liquor bottle, as like, I didn't I didn't even know that it was happening. That's fascinating.

Scott Benner 36:59
Shocking, I imagine. So But where does your brain jump to? Do you jump to? I've been lied to? Or do you jump to he needs help.

Kathryn 37:10
Both like, there was so much hurt, anger, and please save my husband, because they told him 8% chance of getting out the hospital alive. Original, like there was talk when the first time I went in to see him. When he was going through withdrawal, talking to a doctor, he was in a procedure and talking to a doctor, she was talking like maybe transplant list if we're lucky enough to get one. And my head's going. I can't be a widow at what was I 33. At the time, like we have two kids, we have a diabetic that I'm overwhelmed. Like I'm teaching remotely, which is a different kind of overwhelmed. Thank you. COVID. But then also the anger, the hate, like how could you do this to me? How could you do this to yourself? How could you do this to your kids running through my head of how many times did you put me or the kids in danger? Like how many times were you drinking behind the wheel? I don't know. It was the biggest mix of emotions.

Scott Benner 38:06
Yeah, I can't I can't I can't imagine that. I can't imagine. So if this this part where he's in the hospital, and they're like, he might die. That's insane. But how did he tell you? I bet you telling your parents wasn't easy. No.

Kathryn 38:19
My mom, we're very fortunate that our parents, both sets are nearby and very, very supportive. And when I took my, my my husband to the hospital, he got admitted I came home to spend the night I was like, I have a I have a newly diagnosed diabetic. My parents at the time, hadn't learned how to fully take care of him. So I couldn't spend the night at the hospital. And so my mom was there in the morning, because she was going to watch the kids so I could go back to the hospital for my husband. And so she was there with me, actually, when I got the phone call that they moved him to a different floor because he was going through withdrawal. Yeah. And so she heard it right there with me. Wow. And I'm sure there there were disappointed in my husband, but they're super supportive. My parents are very religious too. So my mom saying prayers, all of her friends saying prayers. Did

Scott Benner 39:12
you go tell Moscow? Don't worry, my mom's praying, you're gonna be fine.

Kathryn 39:16
I don't think he would have even known he was so out of it. I mean, at him going through withdrawal like I was when I was there helping him pee in a cup because he couldn't get out of the bed like going through the convulsions, the shakes. The whole thing he went to he probably didn't even know what happened until after it happened. Wow, that, you know,

Scott Benner 39:34
how long did that go on for the withdrawal in the hospital. The first

Kathryn 39:38
hospital stay was almost a week, I think almost a week. And that was the beginning of September. And he had ended up four or five hospital stays between September and November because of retention, water retention. He had a lot of abdomen taps to release the fluid buildup

Scott Benner 39:59
because his kidneys weren't functioning well,

Kathryn 40:02
exactly. And they found when they were releasing the fluid out of his abdomen, paracentesis, I think is what it's called, they ended up finding a blood clot to his portal vein in his to his liver. So he wasn't also getting blood flow to his to his liver. While all this is happening,

Scott Benner 40:18
his body was like, we can't filter out any more alcohol, we gotta block it from coming in. That's

Kathryn 40:22
exactly and so well, finding the clot was great. Yeah, I mean, eventually getting rid of the clot and getting the blood flow going. He has cirrhosis of the liver, but he is if for anybody listening, he is alive and functioning. He's a medical miracle. Really?

Scott Benner 40:43
Is he on a transplant list now? Or no? No, no, no,

Kathryn 40:46
he has. He has a small amount of cirrhosis. But what is the liver and the kidneys? I think both can regenerate to a certain extent, in his functioning. I mean, because doctors he's on a what every six months. Now he sees them. He's a medical miracle. He's like everything that they do. He got his body responded the most idealistic way that could possibly happen. I mean, they told me his bilirubin level because of the liver and the kidneys was at a 20. And at a time they tell you it's a 50% chance of life. Yes. Did you ever was at a 20? Yeah.

Scott Benner 41:21
Did you ever consider leaving him?

Kathryn 41:24
II? I don't think really seriously. I mean, like I said, in, in all of the emotions going through me it was like, Well, I hope he doesn't die, because that would be terrible for everybody. Him, me, the kids, our families, but I definitely ran through my head, if he comes home, and lives through all of this, which he did, if he can't give up alcohol, if he relapses, maybe leaving him as an option. Thankfully, we haven't. We haven't had to deal with that. There were about three nights that I made him go sleep at his parents, because I was I was in the very angry stage. And I was like, I can't take care of you take care of me my mental and emotional state and take care of our kids. Like, I'm still learning this diabetes stuff. Like, I can't trust you to take care of our diabetic because I there was a lot of trust lost at the time. So there was never, we never hit the point where I was like, seriously, like, move out and you know, stay out. Like, like I said, he slept at his parents like two or three nights. But that's about it

Scott Benner 42:28
for me. I know, I would have a lot of trouble with the line, that that would really hit me hard. I'm almost impressed that he was able to get into this poor shape and hide it like that, like a ninja level move. How was he doing it? And did he ever tell you when he started drinking or why?

Kathryn 42:46
I think it in the story also changed over the course of those six months, like His truths got truthy or came out slowly. Slowly over time, the truth came out. And therapy has been a wonderful, wonderful thing. Like I saw therapist a couple times we went together, he still goes not that mean, he was going twice a week after he got out of outpatient. You know, outpatient therapy, like the therapist has helped a whole time with the truth coming out. But I don't know how much he was drinking in a day. But the number of minis that I found like, we always had an extensive alcohol collection, I guess you could say at our house. And a lot of it came from him working in restaurants. So we're a restaurant closing and it's like, Okay, I'm gonna just go take it home and throw it on the shelf. There was so much that I thought sat there, and we just never touched. We just had this abundance of stuff, cleaning out the house later on, that one's watered down, or that one's completely empty. And there's like the storage area in our basement where a lot was I just never go into that's my husband's area. You know, there's his sheet pans for cooking. And like, why would I go in there and it turned out tons of empties in there. But again, I didn't go in there. So why would I? Why would I know?

Scott Benner 43:59
Well, so far, the least shocking thing you've told me is that he's a chef. Because everybody I've ever spoken to who works in a restaurant just describes the battery. So Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Kathryn 44:13
Lots of lots of stories from in there. And I think lack of work when COVID hit, gave him more time. He wasn't in a restaurant at the time. He was teaching, culinary and working. He's got friends with food trucks and catering business, you know, he be working with this person and that person. And I think the lack of work he if he felt and later on voice, he felt a lack of purpose. And he tried to cover up or find a purpose, I guess, and increasing his drinking exponentially from what it was before then, I mean, I don't I don't blame COVID It was still his choices. But I think COVID and the lack of work definitely did not help anything I think had COVID not hit we probably still would have dealt with the alcoholism at some point in time. Like just or

Scott Benner 45:00
autoimmune on one of your sides of the family are both? Nobody else. Nobody else has celiac or a thyroid thing? Nothing.

Kathryn 45:08
No. So yeah, everything. Everything was a big shock. And now of course, the nervous part of me is eagerly anticipating, you know, we'll our brand new baby that we have now. Well, will he show any signs of anything? But now that's always going to be stuck in the back of my head. But yeah, there's nothing on either side. Alcoholism does run in the family. So I guess that shouldn't have been too much of a, I shouldn't say it shouldn't be too much of a shock. It still was a giant shock but ya know, autoimmune in the

Scott Benner 45:37
family, the alcoholism on his side, or both sides. His side. I wasn't sure if your parents found Jesus after they shook drinking or something like that could happen.

Kathryn 45:47
No, no, that's just Catholic military parents is what happened. So everything was very strict, regimented, and we follow the rules again, your

Scott Benner 45:55
red hair tells me almost everything I need to know about your background.

Kathryn 45:59
I'm not Irish, if that's what you're thinking.

Scott Benner 46:01
Trust me here. It's okay. I knew you were Catholic. I'm not a redheaded

Kathryn 46:05
Irish Catholic.

Scott Benner 46:07
Wow. She's that's a lot. So this is the overlapping with the diagnosis. Yes, he might die. He lied to me. He's an alcoholic. Is he gonna be okay, is this gonna get better? Are we gonna stay together? Is this I mean, when do you start thinking? I mean, you just said, I wonder if my little one might get type one. Do you think I wonder if my kids are gonna be lean towards alcoholism, too? Like it all hits you at once? Yeah. Yeah,

Kathryn 46:36
we have my husband. I have both said Now, in some ways, not that you can't drink alcohol when you're type one and celiac, but the celiac reduces your choices of what you can drink safely. So I have said to my husband, I said, I'm kind of glad that for the celiac and the fact that it reduces his choices when he's older, and our kids are still so young, that we'll have to talk as we get older about how we you know how we're going to talk about alcohol with them. How much do we tell them of their dad and what he went through as far as they understand right now? Because let's see, our daughter was only five

Scott Benner 47:16
because you don't want us all went down. Don't want them? Cursed? Right? Like it's gonna happen. Right? Right. Yeah, I see that and

Kathryn 47:22
trying to explain to them when it was all happening like daddy's in the hospital like he was in the hospital. Like I said four or five times for a week at a time between September November. He was in the hospital a lot. And if he wasn't in the hospital, he was at a doctor's office. They knew daddy had a tummy ache. His tummy wasn't working right and drinking daddy juice or mommy juice as they called it wasn't helping his tummy ache because we don't want I don't want to scare you know, scare them Daddy might not come home. Daddy has a big problem. Yeah,

Scott Benner 47:51
Mommy didn't choose well, and we're all on a storm. Now. How did that boy trick you? By the way? One of the when you got back? I know how I tricked my wife into marrying me. She should have not done that. But she really should have been smarter about it. But what did what did what? Well, who did you think? Like? I mean, you said like you just felt naive about drinking in general. Right? But like, did you just never think, oh, this could be more than I think it could get worse it could like I'm trying to think of I guess my question is Who did you think you were married to? That's my question.

Kathryn 48:28
A social I mean, a social drinker. As far as the drinking is concerned, like, I love my husband, he's, he's very much a people person and super charismatic people. People love him, he can engage you in conversation for hours on end. And I'm sure that's a trick of you know, he's been a bartender and all of his different aspects of the culinary world. And being a bartender, you're like, somebody's therapist at a bar. So he cracks everybody up. Everyone loves talking to him. It's really easy to be drawn to just his charismatic personality. And that's that's who I thought I was marrying, you know, at the time. Well, you had the alcoholism never didn't see it. Yeah, let's know. And at the, at the time, we got together. His dad, like I said, it runs in his family, his dad was sober. And that didn't even strike me at the time. Like I knew his dad was sober. And I was like, Oh, my husband could end up with it because it it you know, it does run in families. That my naivete naivety, I don't even know the right word to say it. I'm a math teacher, not an English teacher. I it didn't even faze me like that could be something I might deal with later on down the road. Has he

Scott Benner 49:39
figured out why like why he drinks is it just the the gene like the alcoholic gene, is it is he anxious and he's masking something like do you know what he was trying to save himself from with it?

Kathryn 49:49
I think the anxiety was a slow build over time. The the inconsistency in His work which He loved work, but the inconsistency of just that industry didn't help anything. I think there was always a part of him that worried that he would end up like his family. And I mean, his. Everybody in his family is alive and doing very, very, very well. But I think he knew that it could be it could be a hereditary thing, or it could, you know, run in his bloodline. But I think, yeah, the anxiety builds with the inconsistency of work, but also the work industry that he was in didn't help. Yeah, no, I understand. didn't help at all. If he was working in an office, he wouldn't have alcohol in front of him. Like, like, all day, but when you're working in a restaurant, or you're working as a bartender, Hey, you want a shot? I'll take a shot to you know,

Scott Benner 50:44
did you guys have a movie moment where you dumped all the bottles down the sink? We did.

Kathryn 50:48
I did that with his parents and his best friend on on his parents anniversary while he was in the hospital. Oh,

Scott Benner 50:55
wow. What a what a lovely remembrance of the of their union. Exactly.

Kathryn 50:58
Exactly. And yeah, there was there was a lot of uncovering of, you know, watered down bottles, empty stuff. But yeah, I didn't do it with him. I was like, I had that angry part of me. And I remember talking to him in the hospital. He's like, we don't have to get rid of everything. Like you can still drink. And I was like, No, it's all going like, no. Sigh It's all going. So I did it while he was not

Scott Benner 51:21
home. Yeah, this wasn't fun. We're not doing this twice. Wow. And oh, gosh. And then on top of this, this, this diagnosis did does he does your husband have clarity? Does he ever mentioned the the pressure he felt from the diagnosis of the type one? No.

Kathryn 51:38
I and looking back, I he obviously knew what was happening with our son like he now like he was in a fog from March till, you know, November when he finally came out of the hospital for the last time, but I think he was so about him at the time, you know? Yeah, this alcoholism is building and how can I hide it? That he wasn't he very easily let me take the reins on everything with our son. And for me at the time, it was well, he hates doctors anyway. So I take our son to the doctor's appointments, I make the phone calls. He was trying to help at the time as much as I think he was capable of at the time me not knowing what he was going through. But I took the reins of everything with our with our son. I don't think he he was he was too busy thinking about himself looking back on it then really worried and that sounds so bad to say out loud because he loves our kids and the kids love him. But I think he was too wrapped up.

Scott Benner 52:41
Listen, I've gotten the flu before I've gotten the flu before and for three days. I tell everybody just stay alive because I can't help you. And he's probably just in that situation. Hey, my last my last kind of question about this. Did you have any experience with any friends come to you privately and apologize to you for not telling you? No, that didn't happen.

Kathryn 53:03
i He like was a master at hiding. It's not like he was out drinking with his best friend. You know, if he went out with his friend, it was a beer. It was like nothing. It was all secretly in the privacy of our home. There was one time that my mom has said she saw like an empty mini in the recycling bin. And not my parents because they like the fact that they even have any alcohol in their fridge is usually because one of us five kids is you know, one of their kids is coming into town or something. So I remember her telling me she saw a mini in the fridge when he was coming to our in the recycling bin when my husband was coming to pick up our son because the grandparents are thankfully our babysitters when we're working. And that's the only like, the only person who said anything, but she told me when she saw it and that didn't really

Scott Benner 53:56
know I meant or anything. There was an apology tour at my house of God about my dad's cheating. Like so guys that were single and involved in the what was going like what these guys were doing. Like, you know, who knew my dad was cheating on my mom and they came to it was very, actually I found that unpleasant. They were unburdening themselves like they were. It wasn't helping my mom. They just they felt bad. And they were trying to get trying to get rid of that burden. I didn't know if that happened. If you had any by people like I'm so sorry, but it sounds like he was very private about it. Is he? Oh, yeah. Was he embarrassed at the time? Has he told you like when he was drinking? Was he? Like he's he hide? Why? Like, Why do you hide it? Like, that's my question. You're hiding it because you don't. Because you're why you don't. I mean,

Kathryn 54:50
I think he was embarrassed that he was drinking so much and he didn't want it to seem like he had a problem. He didn't want anyone to know we had a problem and yeah, I mean, I guess I I get that to a certain extent, why would you want people to know if you have a problem? And that kind of problem is not one where most people say, Hey, I have a problem, please go get me help, you know, thankfully, the help he's gotten has definitely helped him a whole heck of a time.

Scott Benner 55:13
Cool. That's amazing. I'm trying to put myself in his position, like, how do I approach you? And say, this is what's happening to me. I don't know, though. It seems difficult to me. Like it's one of those things like a therapist would tell you, like, reach out to friends and Bob. Oh, my God always sounds good. When people say it, I'm like, how do you? How am I supposed to do that? Like, how am I supposed to walk up to the person who I, you know, is trying to trust me for my whole life? And I'm just like, hey, I need to tell you something. I'm having like a significant issue here. Yeah. So I

Kathryn 55:42
think it was really on his literally on his deathbed. He had to have that, like, come to Jesus moment. Like I need to do what I can to stay alive and then go get some help to, you know, combat this, this issue.

Scott Benner 55:56
That's good. It's good for him. It's amazing. Honestly. Yeah. Yeah. Good. It's got to be hard work.

Kathryn 56:01
It's yeah, it's always still hard work. And it took a long time to trust Him and trust Him to take care of our son and not like, give him way too much insulin or let him go too low for too. Like. Yeah, that was all

Scott Benner 56:14
you see. Even the chef Catherine. I mean, he was so good at hiding the other thing, maybe it's an international spy, you have no idea who it

Kathryn 56:19
could be. Maybe there'll be a movie made out of his life. You know, he was just really, you know, like a what is it Mr. And Mrs. Smith kind of moment. Just

Scott Benner 56:27
just comes in the house with a gun with a silencer on and he's like, listen, I did get the kids together. We're gonna have to find our way out. Exactly fell me. Oh, my gosh. Well, that's really something. Oh, you are? Hey, are you okay? Yeah, yeah. Are you sure?

Kathryn 56:44
I am. I'm, I'm as good as I can be as good as I have been in the last three years. Good

Scott Benner 56:51
for you. That's excellent. Is there a whole rebuilding? Like if I asked you to describe your personal relationship now versus I'm not asking you to, but if I was asking you to describe it now versus then is it a completely different relationship now? Yeah,

Kathryn 57:04
yeah. 100% win trust gets destroyed as bad as it did. It took a lot of rebuilding a lot of therapy, discussions, fights. Everything. I mean, and yeah, it's complete. It's completely different. Like, I feel like I'm married to the person that I thought I was married. And didn't get at the beginning. Yeah.

Scott Benner 57:27
Well, I also would assume that this probably feels exactly like being cheated on. Right. Yeah,

Kathryn 57:32
it's I mean, it is I guess, a type of cheating not with somebody else. But he was you know, not with a person. But with a bottle. You're

Scott Benner 57:39
doing a thing. It's unknown to the to your spouse, it would hurt them if they knew. You're hiding it. It seems very similar to me. Yeah. Wow. That's like, hey, this. I'm sorry. I know you have little kids. But Did Did he just drink or were there any drugs?

Kathryn 57:56
No, just drinking. Okay. No drugs unless there's more hidden secrets but I trust there's there's not more hidden secrets. So no, just drinking. Well, you

Scott Benner 58:04
have to trust if you don't trust you make yourself crazy. But yeah, is he what they call California sober? Or is he sober sober? Like, is there weed? is my question. No, yeah, is

Kathryn 58:14
sober, sober. He has found a lot of he genuinely likes the taste of alcohol, a lot of alcohols. And he has found some brands of anaise that he really likes that are that are hard liquor alternatives that are like, you know, zero proof. Yeah.

Scott Benner 58:31
That was my question. Like, how do you like because he still got the anxiety, right? It

Kathryn 58:36
is way better. Like he would have shakes that I thought was just his crippling anxiety probably alcohol induced. But he would have shakes when he would get really anxious before like if he like I said, we are in the burbs of Chicago if we drove closer to the city and he grew up way closer to the city like closer burbs than where we live now. So he's used to the traffic like he would, you would see him on the wheel shaking, and I just thought it was anxiety, but that has virtually all disappeared. Now that is now that he is sober. So he

Scott Benner 59:11
couldn't he was like, having withdrawals just on a drive somewhere. Because he isn't true. He was checking constantly. It sounds like, Wow, geez, that's something I don't know. I'm glad not to understand it. But it's terrible. You know, every time somebody tells me about it, hindsight,

Kathryn 59:30
like the number of times that this was part of my anger, like the number of times he put myself in our two kids at the time in danger is like, How could you even do that? But yeah, we've come up. Yeah, yeah.

Scott Benner 59:45
Well, that sounds good. Oh, wow. Hey, thanks for telling me about that. It's not it's not a pastor in a dungeon, but it's pretty good.

Kathryn 59:54
It's I mean, I never thought I would say I'm thankful that my kid has diabetes, but But had that diabetes diagnosis never happened, the ball would never have started rolling to what

Scott Benner 1:00:06
it would have been. It would have been COVID. And he would have probably, like, doubled down on what he was doing in that COVID time. Oh, yeah, I would have been bad and

Kathryn 1:00:15
he would not have I had he not gotten into the hospital in September when he did like that blood clot that he had, like, yeah, he would be dead, because

Scott Benner 1:00:26
they wouldn't have taped because if he came in just saying, like, look, I'm, I'm an alcoholic, like that probably would have got pushed real down on the list once they weren't admitting people in hospitals anymore, ya know that the timing really worked out for him. He's gonna get crazy. Because one day, one day when your four year old is a is a man. He's gonna tell him. Did he mean? Like, he's gonna He's gonna pull him aside and tell him like, I'm here because of you. And, you know, like, that whole thing? That's gonna be crazy. Yeah.

Kathryn 1:00:56
Wow, the whole everything happens for a reason, like whether you're religious or not, or however you want to believe it. Like, I guess the reason that my son had to get diagnosed was so my husband could live.

Scott Benner 1:01:07
It would have been nice if your kid just got like a nice, like, I don't know, simple virus that would have cleared up in a couple of weeks. So yeah,

Kathryn 1:01:12
like a broken bone or something would have

Scott Benner 1:01:14
been would have been terrific.

Kathryn 1:01:17
Exactly. I mean, he is super, super proud. He's the cutest four year old. He's super proud of all of his machines on his body. And he shows everyone he's like, look, I'm like the bionic man. But which is cute to see. Like, I'm glad he's not fazed by anything happening to him. But yeah, would have been nice if it was just a virus or a broken boat. Yeah, that

Scott Benner 1:01:34
would have been better. I take your point. I do. Take your greater point, though. Are we have we covered everything, I want to make sure we don't miss anything. And then I want to ask you a little more about how the diabetes is progressed for him. And no,

Kathryn 1:01:45
yeah, that I mean, we got that. That's in a nutshell how my how my, my son saved my husband's life.

Scott Benner 1:01:52
To go back to when you were 19 and find you and be like, Hey, tell me the story of the next 20 years of your life. Just

Kathryn 1:02:02
just how I thought it would all pan out. But well,

Scott Benner 1:02:06
I guess you're all here. That's good. You know, exactly.

Kathryn 1:02:09
Okay, we brought another kid into the world since then, too. So I guess we have to be doing pretty decent.

Scott Benner 1:02:14
Listen, I just assume your husband is very handsome after you told me you had a third kid. After all, that just must be such a handsome guy must make you dizzy. You're like, Alright, one more. Oh my god, I just I don't think my wife would drive in the car with me again. So I like pretty impressed. Actually.

Kathryn 1:02:36
A lot of things of, you know, getting in the car of like letting you in the house taking care of our diabetic son putting a needle in his body took a long time before I let him do say have you know? And you're not like I had another kid for a while with my husband? Like you can or can't do this. You know, I imagine

Scott Benner 1:02:53
and you you're not um, I don't know the way but you're not sure about it. Like, how come you don't seem like the kind of person who like walks out the door in the morning goes, Hey, don't get drunk drunky and leave like you're not pet you don't seem passive aggressive or, or, like giving me

Kathryn 1:03:08
I feel like when all of this happened, I I'm very much a people pleaser. And I feel like I became more frank with my husband and more direct in how I was feeling and what I needed and what I came to a point now where I'm like, I don't care if how I'm feeling or what I think or what I need you to do is what you want to hear or if it's going to make you feel good, or if it's going to make you feel bad. Like I gave up the people pleasing to a certain extent, you know, with especially my husband after all of this went down. I was like, I need to make sure that I'm okay. In order to make sure my kids are okay in order to make sure my my husband's okay, like, I don't care anymore. I mean, it sounds really bad. Like, I do care what I say to my husband, but I don't care if me sharing my feelings makes you feel good or feel bad. Like there were a lot of discussions, especially early on where what I said is not what my husband wanted to hurt, you know, here, but I'm definitely more frank with my husband now than I was three years ago. His

Scott Benner 1:04:09
emotional maturity is doubled, tripled, like exponential, exponentially.

Kathryn 1:04:13
It's it's continuing to grow. Definitely. And our conversations or discussions or disagreements are far more productive now and in attempting to resolve them than they were three years ago. Like, like I said, it's a he's a he's the person I thought I was going to. I thought I was married. He's that person now versus you know, three years ago?

Scott Benner 1:04:39
Yeah. And I'm sure he always was that person just with the alcoholic just, he didn't have any time or space to be that person. So okay, you mentioned a while ago, I'm sorry, this one this this a lot. I get the feeling sometimes like you're you're you and I are looking each other which I don't usually do but I'm like warm. I'm like oh my god. I was terrible. Turn up the air conditioning? Well, it's just it's a, I mean, it's a triumphant story really, when you when you see it through to the end, but when you're living, like through the, the retelling of it, it's like, wow, like, there's so many moments where, like, no one would have blamed you, if you would have just been like that said, Well, I'm not doing this with you.

Kathryn 1:05:21
There were definitely times in in all of that, to that. I felt like, Okay, this is the low point of my life. Like I honestly I did. I taught school and did work meetings from a my husband's hospital room, like the point where my principal goes, Hey, that's not like, we didn't have to be in our classrooms. I did go into my classroom a couple of times, just because I'm very thankful my parents were watching the kids. But when my principal finally goes, you're not in your house, or you're not in the school, like, where are you? And I'm like, I'm in a hospital room right now. Like I am. I missed one day of work and all of that, because I had to take our son to an appointment to see the nutritionist at the hospital downtown, and my husband was in the hospital, so he couldn't take him. But yeah, teaching teaching from a hospital room might kind of felt like it was my low point. I mean, I wasn't the one in the hospital bed, but will not

Scott Benner 1:06:13
be in the hospital room. But when you use the empties to show them how to add that was probably upset. You're like, if you have five vodka bottles, and you put four whiskey bottles together. That's nine. Let's count them together. Kids. It's sorry. This is all I have on my hand. By the way. Does anybody do glassblowing? Because we have a ton of this? Yeah. Wow, that must have been humbling for your husband to I mean, honestly, like to see you having to do this thing. Like to do your job from a hospital room? You don't even Yeah, he must have felt like a soul. Yeah, so yeah, yeah.

Kathryn 1:06:45
I mean, he's finally come to term to terms with everything enough, you know, looking back to where he can admit, oh, my gosh, I was an asshole. Yeah, that's

Scott Benner 1:06:53
terrible. I'm sorry for him. I addiction of any kind is it's terrible. I mean, there's part of me that's like, well, thank God, it wasn't gambling, and you didn't like, learn you were losing your home or something like that, you know, or something, but there's no good. There's just no good outcome here. It's it's a scourge, like for people and you know, of any kind of food and alcohol and drugs and gambling and sex and all the other things people get addicted to and ruins their lives.

Kathryn 1:07:23
And it's a lifelong battle. Like he might be sober right now, I guess we're going on going on three years come September, but it's still a lifelong battle. It's not like you can make alcohol disappear from your life, you know, visually, you know, unless you become a hermit. So how long

Scott Benner 1:07:39
after all this? Does he look at you and say, or do you look at him and say, I need you to understand the diabetes now? Like, did he say I want to learn or do you say it's time you learn? When

Kathryn 1:07:50
I the therapist, helped me realize I need to give up a little bit of control because I was I was going insane. I remember sitting and you know, crying on the therapy at the therapist. And as like, I just feel so overwhelmed between my son my daughter who's in Kindred, starting kindergarten on a computer, work my like everything going on, I just felt so overwhelmed. And she was, you know, trying to help me find what can I give up? Or what can I slowly allow my husband to pick up and even small things like our son's long acting, he took a small dose in the morning and a small at night and we would pull the morning syringe at night. And we had a certain location you know that we put it like, we started small with me finally allowing my husband to pull the syringe naughty that way I could double check it before I gave it to him. Yeah. But it took the therapist, you know, what control can I give up? To make me slightly you know, slightly less insane. So we started vaping I'm still insane. No, but

Scott Benner 1:08:55
my wife's like, it's making me sad. My wife because this is making me crazy. I'm like crazier. Stop it. But yeah, no, by the way, I wish I was your age and I would have met you a marriage because you are so forgiving. And I don't even know I like like, not the Kelly's sorry, that hold your feet to the fire thing that you do. Now. I've been dealing with that since I met my wife. And as I just like, it sounds, there was a moment I'll share something with you. Where you describe being a people pleaser. And I for a moment just didn't think of you as a person I thought of you as like, like a spouse. Right? And I thought, wow, he screwed that up. Like I had that real thought in my head like, like, like, like you mean she was like making excuses for you and telling you what you wanted to hear and being overtly kind when it didn't need to be and you like you. My only thought was like why would you ruin that? Like seriously like I know that's not I don't know if politically correct is not the right thing to say. But I just I've never I kill for a couple of years where people just nodded at me and went yes got that makes sense. Yeah, I would like one year where nobody argues with me. whether I'm right or wrong, do you see what I'm saying? Katherine like,

Kathryn 1:10:05
no. 100% 100% I mean, our relationship is a million times more healthy now that I'm not as much of a people pleaser. Yeah, no,

Scott Benner 1:10:15
I That's my point. It's not that that would have been good for you. Like I literally like I have to like dehumanize you for a second to have that thought. But I was like, wow, you screwed that up. Like, like, almost like you. I don't know. And, but then bring it back together again. That's so unfair to you. And you really have gained, you've gained something from this because you would have spent your whole life half head down being like, alright, I don't think that's right. But okay. And that's no way to live either. You know, no,

Kathryn 1:10:41
no, yeah, we're we're sounds crazy. We're we're all in our family better off. Now that my husband's, you know, gone through what he's gone through. And our son's going through what he gets to live with, you know, we're all better off.

Scott Benner 1:10:56
I have to agree. Yeah, I have to agree with that. Although I'm thinking just my birthday or one month, like you don't I mean, like, what if there was just a month where Scott was right. And then there could be a month where Kelly was right. Yeah, I mean, like, I would

Kathryn 1:11:06
start with a day of it's every yesterday, one yesterday, by the

Scott Benner 1:11:11
way, I don't think that's a bad idea. I'm writing down yesterday. I'm bringing this up at the next meeting. And then the meeting, where's the Father's Day? You can say you want to yesterday, the meeting, by the way is when we go over everything I do wrong. What's that bill burr joke? He says I've been married for a long time now. And all I'm really sure of is we're still working on me.

Kathryn 1:11:33
Always. It's always. It's always work. We're always

Scott Benner 1:11:37
working on me. She seems to be fine. And he says, anyway, Bill Burr stand up is great. Okay, so diabetes, every once in a while I should write down in front of myself. This is a diabetes podcast, just so I remember. You get a CGM. You've had it for a long time you do MDI for a very long time. But you said you just went to Omni pod five, is that right? Yes. Okay. And

Kathryn 1:11:59
he's actually still in, we see his Endo, next in like two weeks, next month, beginning of June. He's still in auto mode, they wanted him or not in auto mode, manual mode. They wanted us to get used to using one, like the dash, we initially looked at the dashboard, we're like, Well, might as well go to the five and so we're actually still in manual mode, which is still nice. He can be running past me to go you know, go play something it'd be like, Okay, I'm gonna give you insulin now. Like it's still so much easier than the daily injections. But yeah, we are, we are on a great time, like okay about to give birth, let's switch to let's switch to an insulin pump. Let's learn that, you know, and his he's in preschool now and his nurse at at his preschool is amazing. We email multiple times where she's not hesitant and at all to call me call my husband called grandma. We're like, okay, just double checking. This is right, like, and she was so open to learning the learning the pumps, she hadn't had a diabetic in two years. So she had to kind of like, relearn some things. But yeah, oh, everybody's been great with taking care of our son.

Scott Benner 1:13:02
Well, did you listen to the episodes about setting up on the pod five? Yeah,

Kathryn 1:13:06
and I'm really listening to him now that that we have them too. And I'm like, Okay, I finally feel like we have our basil dialed in. So when we switch to, when we switch to auto mode, I'm like, fingers crossed. It's

Scott Benner 1:13:19
beautiful life restraint. I would just be like, it's work. And I'll turn it on now.

Kathryn 1:13:23
Why not? You know, what are they when we first initially went through the training and set up our son settings based on what the endo recommended, the first time that I thought something needs to be tweaked. I emailed the team and they're like, yeah, do XYZ. I've totally tweaked things since then. So I'm gonna go back to the Endo. And you know, ask for forgiveness, not permission. But the yes, I've restrained myself from turning it into auto mode, but I stopped asking for permission to change other settings for you.

Scott Benner 1:13:52
Yeah, just get it get it super stable. Where that where that basil is doing its job, you're not seeing a lot of lows, you're not seeing weird rises for no reason. And make sure your insulin to carb ratio is really rock solid. I just I've had people say to make it a little more aggressive when you put it into like, just so the auto mode like is a little more aggressive. But I mean, young kid no hormones, probably not eating a ton of like, fatty greasy like that kind of stuff. Right? So you should I don't know. You should love it. And it should work really well for you. So the

Kathryn 1:14:26
first couple of nights that we saw that like pretty straight line overnight. I was like, Oh, they lujah like we finally hit that hit that correct? You know that

Scott Benner 1:14:34
crazy that? That's just from getting your Basal right in the pump. It's so

Kathryn 1:14:38
awesome. I'm like, I'm not fighting a low I'm not fighting a high like finally I feel like the basil is right. And then now he got sick. So I'm like, oh, hit the fan. And I don't know if I can swear on here, but

Scott Benner 1:14:50
we already have a couple times. It's fine. Don't worry about it. You said so once I said this whole. Like, don't worry, it'll be okay. I mean, you're not cursing that I don't understand people who, like you should be walking around just like sons of bitches every month. Chris trying to kill me.

Kathryn 1:15:09
So I would not that bad, but it is bad when our our four year old is our little Spitfire and the redhead, and he'll be like, welcome to the show. Like, do you ever add that to your house? When

Scott Benner 1:15:20
things are crazy? Your husband does something that's just regular stuff like not like, but not like, hey, like, don't forget that thing you did with the alcohol thing or any like big stuff? Do you ever look at him? Like, you're? You still owe me Just shut up? Like do you ever do you have a look that says, Not yet, buddy, for you?

Kathryn 1:15:39
knows when he's tip toeing the line like, I mean, and we still do a lot of what some people perceive, I guess crazy stuff or I can't believe you just let him do that. Like, you know, my husband literally came in the other day and was like, I'm gonna go get another tattoo now. Is that okay? You got the kids Sure. Have fun like, whatever. That's not going to hurt anyone. But yes, there is. He knows when he hits that point. Have I went too far? Yeah, I'd

Scott Benner 1:16:04
be like, I'm still like, I'm still trying to get back to even here. I definitely can't do whatever I just did. I need to stop. Like I always I usually. I joke that every time I do something wrong, my wife takes a point away. But I don't seem to get a point when I do something good. He

Kathryn 1:16:19
seems pleased you've not zeroed out you still have points to give away? I

Scott Benner 1:16:23
honestly don't know if that's true or not. But hey, not about anything. But because you and I are looking at each other. And you're so honest. Do you see this discoloration in the top of my cheeks? It's from Sun from like, watching my kids play sports out in the sun. Do you think I shouldn't say can you see it though? A little bit? Yeah. Do you think I could get that taken out by like a, like a plastic surgeon or somebody? I'm just looking at myself and I'm like, I'd like that to be lighter.

Kathryn 1:16:50
See what I see your face. See if that does anything. You

Scott Benner 1:16:53
have ideas that I have this could happen. I

Kathryn 1:16:55
literally rubbed some. I mean, the ice will make your face read first. But and it's

Scott Benner 1:16:59
always like this though. Like it's this color. Like I always think I'm gonna get like, I mean, honestly, when I was younger, I'm like, I'm gonna get skin cancer from being out here watching so much baseball. But it just it discolored over time as I got older. You see already I have like dark. My eyes are dark. That's like normal. By the way. I don't appreciate that a lot. I don't know if that can be fixed. I don't know if they can bleed. You know, they bleach souls. I wonder if they can bleach your eyelids? You know what I'm talking about? Right? And then I

Kathryn 1:17:26
mean, you can ask I don't know if it's a

Scott Benner 1:17:28
thing where you ask about that.

Kathryn 1:17:30
Great question. A dermatologist. I don't know. That'd be a strange dermatologist. Maybe? I don't know.

Scott Benner 1:17:38
And then my eyes are too squinty. Just a little bit of surgery didn't I mean like, what would have little Botox to do you think it's both? I don't know.

Kathryn 1:17:47
I don't know. I don't I don't even do all of the the cosmetic fixes.

Scott Benner 1:17:53
If your life wasn't so screwed up. I would have spent this last hour looking at myself going why is this camera on? But I couldn't focus on that. I don't like how squinty My eyes are. I sound like a so I don't know what I sound like right now. But anyway, I would definitely get let me just be clear, people are listening. I would definitely get like the coloration if that can be lasered out of my cheeks. And I would do a little eyelift if somebody

Kathryn 1:18:19
I mean wanted to offer analogy and medicine can do anything these days, right? I'm just saying

Scott Benner 1:18:23
like if you have a if you want some free ads, if you lifted my eyes, I would definitely do it. I just don't want to look like the Hamilton guy, George Hamilton. I don't know what that is. You're so young. You wouldn't know I

Kathryn 1:18:39
am. I'm a baby. And I was I'm a sheltered baby too.

Scott Benner 1:18:43
Yeah, we we heard we heard Catherine Don't worry. Seriously, were you just like a, like a fawn in the woods when your husband scooped you up?

Kathryn 1:18:54
Pretty much. Yeah, I was a totally innocent, you know, high school math teacher. And I saw a cute guy in the in the in the foods room, the culinary room in our in our high school. They had the height the college he teaches that was using I was like, Oh, he's cute. And somehow we ended up together. So

Scott Benner 1:19:12
yeah, like fix that check. I bet you that won't happen to you again. You're probably just like, so like suspicious. Are you did it ruin you? Or did you hold on to like that feeling?

Kathryn 1:19:23
I'm not suspicious about everything anymore. I asked me a year ago if I was suspicious about my husband's every move. Yeah, yeah. But I hadn't like you know, forgiven and now you're

Scott Benner 1:19:35
either lying to me or you've done a remarkable job of moving forward.

Kathryn 1:19:39
I sometimes looking back I'm like, at what point did I just say, Okay, I can't hold this against you forever. I don't even know what when I hit that point. But I'm definitely not lying to you right now. There's definitely moments where I look back and I'm like, so pissed at you that this was our life. But at the same time, like I have a husband and I now have three kids like I can't I can't Hold the grudge forever. Otherwise, I'm not going to be happy.

Scott Benner 1:20:03
How about that? You're not Irish? I'll be damn. Okay. I'm

Kathryn 1:20:06
not. Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:20:09
For you. For the Irish listening right now, you are you people hold grudges like, like it's an Olympic sport. It's amazing. I'm sure not every one of you. But I mean, it's a skill. So and they definitely have and trust me there Irish people laughing right now who were still pissed about something that happened 35 years ago. Let it go. Do it. Do it. Catherine did just move like what do they say? Don't fight back fight forward? Is that the same? It makes sense. Yeah. Doing Good job. That makes sense. You're pretty aggressive. Catherine. Seriously? Thank you. Yeah, I would have to give it up like six times. Like that. I'm good. That's fine.

Kathryn 1:20:48
I mean, there were definitely times in the building to forgiveness part that I thought about all the things in my life, that would be harder if I didn't have a husband, like, it's simple and stupid is lawn maintenance, or he cooks really good food. And if I say, like, being pregnant and having food cravings, it's great. When you're married to a chef, like, please make me this dish, and it's on the table in 30 minutes. There are definitely really stupid, stupid, trivial things. I was like, my life would be harder or not as great if I had to give that up. So that helped me work to the forgiveness that I didn't have to lose the, you know, the good stuff.

Scott Benner 1:21:23
That's amazing. I cannot thank you enough for doing this. You were really terrific. Seriously, I wish. I wish we were friends. We're not going to be by the way. But I really thought that you would want to be you're probably like, I don't want to know you after this. But you're a very cool person.

Kathryn 1:21:39
So thank you. No,

Scott Benner 1:21:40
it was fun. Yeah, did.

Kathryn 1:21:42
It's different hearing you like through my computer versus my car. So yeah, cool.

Scott Benner 1:21:47
Do I sound the same? Yeah,

Kathryn 1:21:49
you sound exactly. Like you do on the I mean, I guess we're recording a podcast, but you're not exactly like you do on the podcast. Okay.

Scott Benner 1:21:57
I wasn't sure if like my voice changes, like, because I level it out. Like later on. I'll put this through a process that will make sure your your voice and my voice are on the same level. So one of us, okay, like we're screaming and stuff like that. There's a

Kathryn 1:22:11
weird part of me that feels like I'm talking to my car, because I only I only listen to podcasts, usually in the car, because that's when I was, like I said, I'm not working right now because of the baby. But when I was working, that was the only time I had to listen to it. So you sound like my car is talking to me right? Now. Imagine

Scott Benner 1:22:25
if I was really famous. Like it was like Jason Bateman. You're like, you're the guy from smartlace or something like that. Like that would be insane. Right?

Kathryn 1:22:31
I mean, you're pretty famous in the diabetes world. Like I said, I was on a town square last summer. And somebody was like, hey, that's this this podcast? Have you heard of this stock guy? And I'm like, that's cool.

Scott Benner 1:22:42
In certain settings. I am. I am incredibly famous. Like I spoke at something recently. And someone came up to me and said, Do you want me to run interference for you? Do you need to go to the bathroom? Or get a drink of water or something like that? And I was like, Hey, could you do that? Like, I have to have people walk me places. So it looks like we're doing something so that I can like, but then the minute I leave that room, you're surrounded, if I got hit by a car, no one would look up, like but in a diabetes space. It's, it's actually kind of astonishing. Like I have trouble walking from one side of a space to another. Like it's, it's, it's very, it's nice. Like, don't get me I really do enjoy it. Like I don't like I don't mean I enjoy it. Like, like it's good for my ego. I mean, like it's it's lovely to meet people. And they some some people just want to tell you successes they've had some people think that maybe you could help them with things they're struggling with. A lot of people just want to tell their story, a lot of questions. But it was nice. I did an event a couple of weekends ago. It's actually three days in a row was really interesting the way it was set up. Like I gave talks that were scheduled like onstage talks, but then I was also scheduled just to be on the floor and just in like mingle with people and have conversations I found that really, like valuable for me. You know what I mean? That's

Kathryn 1:24:02
cool. See how many how many people you and your podcast have? reached, influenced helped.

Scott Benner 1:24:09
It's really crazy. I honestly like still some days don't like it's hard to, like process all of it. You don't I mean,

Kathryn 1:24:17
I mean in as well, I should say thank you, because in a year since, I mean, it's not even been a year I guess since I started listening to the podcast. We were stuck a one C in the nines is last one was 5.8. Wow. So I mean, we've we've come a long way. So thank you.

Scott Benner 1:24:33
It's amazing. That makes me feel like I don't know how to explain the feeling. But I almost feel like I'm going to cry for a second when you say that. Like I'm just happy for you like in him like your son really? I mean, because he did not. He didn't feel as good at nine as he did it.

Kathryn 1:24:49
I'm sure he didn't. I mean, I don't even know what we were at diagnosis. I think like 14 or something. We've come a long way. I've learned a lot and I'm happy I'm comfortable. Like I said, asking the endocrinologist and his team which are wonderful. But I'm comfortable asking them for forgiveness instead of permission now, because I've learned a lot from listening to the podcast or reading other people's comments on the Facebook group and things like that.

Scott Benner 1:25:12
So you mentioned it's weird to hear my voice. And I, earlier you said that phrase earlier, and I thought, Oh, she's repeating something I said on the podcast. Like, the, it's better, it's better to ask for forgiveness and permission, like, um, like I said, that like, and maybe it's, maybe it's a vibe that like the podcast gives, I honestly think sometimes my job is just sort of like a coach, like the, like, pat you on the ass and be like, get out there, you can do it, you don't even have that you get run over a couple times, and I come back and I go, don't worry, get back out there, you're gonna be okay. You know, like, I think sometimes that's what this is for. So

Kathryn 1:25:48
and I think it helps people realize, like, we're with our kids or ourselves, if you're the tea, Wendy listening, like, you know, your kid, like, I know my son better than his endocrinologist does, unless you're living with your endocrinologist or, you know, the diabetes nurse educator, whoever, like, they're looking at his stats from, you know, the clarity reports from Dexcom. Like, I can tell them as much as I can, but I'm living with it every day. So if I feel like something needs tweaking, I feel like I have the ability or the right to do that. I mean,

Scott Benner 1:26:22
100% Don't Don't turn back into a people pleaser now. Your kids got diabetes. But it needs you to make

Kathryn 1:26:30
sure he's happy. And that's, that's the person I want to please make sure he's happy. Well, to an extent every once in a while when I hear I don't want the Dexcom on, we're going to put it on, I'm not going to make you I'm not going to please do that. Mommy has

Scott Benner 1:26:41
a small list folded up in her pocket of things that have happened to her. She didn't want to happen, but we're still all here. So let's, let's get it. I've said to Arden, like when she was younger. She'd be like, I don't want this and I go, that's fine. If you don't want that, then this is what we're gonna do. Do you want to just pick one? Tell me which one do you prefer? Do you want to go back to testing your blood sugar 15 times a day. It's alright with me. Like, you know, but I can make that work. I've done it before. And she'd be like, No, I just think it's path of least resistance and their kids like they're looking to. I mean, to be honest with you, I'd ask every day if I was looking at, like, I remember myself, I would have been like, Hey, how about today? We don't do this. And yeah, you know, you just have to keep re explaining until one day they don't ask anymore.

Kathryn 1:27:25
Exactly. Exactly. Our son gets really excited when he gets to have like device free bath time, because it happens to be changed night. We're like, hey, device, free bath time have fun. But yeah, we've definitely done the he doesn't like that tick, tick tick boom of the Omnipod. When it goes in. It's like the anticipation. It's like once it's on, it's fine. We might get one hour from him, but it's fine. But he'll ask Can I can I not have it on? And then it's Yeah. Do you want to go back to have like eight shots a day? Now? Okay, put it on? Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:27:55
I listen, I've said it before. I'll say it again. I don't know another world where we let four year olds make medical decisions, but and I get that it's their body. But they are going to get accustomed to it at some point. And it's a huge benefit for them. And you're going to be happy you did it. I think also, are you the kids a big spider verse fans, because you just quoted a song from the spider verse movie. Did

Kathryn 1:28:17
I if I did, I did it by accident. I mean, he watches like Spidey and His Amazing Friends on Disney Jr. But we're not up to the I don't know how close that is to

Scott Benner 1:28:24
Yeah, yeah. No, he hasn't seen it. It's by accident. Arden met Tom Holland once. Oh, that's cool. He was so excited. Like stupid acts. I have to get her to tell that story on

Kathryn 1:28:36
here. Like accidentally ran into him somewhere, like perfectly ran into him somewhere forced

Scott Benner 1:28:40
us to take her to a thing where she could stand in a line and get her picture taken. And she was younger. But she had all worked up about what she wanted to say. I think she was trying to, like, marry him. You know what I mean? Like, I just feel like, it's like 16 And she's like, like, What can I say in this 30 seconds is definitely gonna get this guy to like, you know, ruin my life. Boy. Ever wonder mothers and so many other men to their wives. Instead, she just like, she got all flustered, like, just ran up to him. And she's like, I have diabetes. And like, she never she never tells anybody that like like, I've never heard anybody I've never heard I'd walk up to someone and introduce yourself as I have. She just blurted it out. And then like, like, you know, took the picture and then walked out the curtain in the back and she was just like, what? starstruck Why did I, what? Oh, my God, that her friends screaming they're like, ah, like I always thought about like, he's only on the other side of the curtain. And every five I mean, every 20 seconds. A different little girl is walking away from him and screaming. And He must feel like, I don't know must he must feel amazing. I don't even know how he possibly stays grounded. Like where everybody's just like, Oh my god. Oh my god. Oh my god every time they see him and blurting out stupid stuff, but anyway,

Kathryn 1:29:57
all right. It's probably funny what some of the people I'll say, I mean,

Scott Benner 1:30:01
Arden. Still to this day, if you ask her, she'll be like, I have no idea why I said that. Like, I was like, it's not a huge selling point. If you're trying to if you're trying like

Kathryn 1:30:12
it's a small percentage of the population, so it makes you stand out what makes you a little bit more memorable? Maybe?

Scott Benner 1:30:17
I don't know. I can't I'll ask her about it. Like, you know, like, it's a wonder she didn't start off like, do you have medical insurance because I'm, I'm gonna need insulin pumps, when we obviously get married five seconds from now. But anyway, he's very short. By the way. I just want to say that he does look at Yes, he's a teeny tiny person. I'm looking at about right now, in case how tall is these? Five eight? Yeah, he's on the short end for a guy I that's got it. I mean, if he's really five, eight, then okay, but he's look smaller to me any slight too. So it's got like that, like your your son's friend came over to the house vibe about him. I'm sure as he's getting older, he doesn't look by the way I really liked those movies. I'm not not much on them or anything like that. Just he's a tiny guy. Katherine, you were terrific. Thank you for doing this hold on one second.

A huge thanks to Catherine Omni pod and US med Catherine of course, for sharing her story on the pod of course, for supporting the podcast, Omni pod.com/juice box greet yourself and only pod five right now, speaking of Omni pod five, there's new Omni pod five. Who should I tell you this? Yeah, I'll tell you. There's new Omni pod five content coming very, very soon, he says in early November of 2023. Thanks also to us med 888-721-1514 or use the website us med.com/juicebox. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back very soon with another episode of The Juicebox Podcast. A diabetes diagnosis comes with a lot of new terminology. And that's why I've created the defining diabetes series. These are short episodes, where Jenny Smith and I go over all of the terms that you're going to hear living with diabetes, and some of them that you might not hear every day, from the very simple Bolus up to feed on the floor. Don't know the difference between hypo and hyper will explain it to you. These are short episodes, they are not boring. They're fun, and they're informative. It's not just us reading to you out of the dictionary, we take the time to chat about all of these different words. Maybe you don't know what a CU small respiration is, you will when you're done. Ever heard of a glycemic index and load haven't doesn't matter. You will know after you listen to the defining diabetes series. Now, how do you find it, you go to juicebox podcast.com up top to the menu and click on defining diabetes. You'll be able to listen right there in your browser. Or you'll see the full list of the episodes and be able to go into an audio app like Apple podcasts or Spotify and listen to them at your pace. Download them into your phone and listen when you can. The defining diabetes series is made up of 51 short episodes. That will fast forward your knowledge of diabetes terminology.

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