#450 After Dark: Psychedelics

ADULT TOPIC WARNING. Psychedelic Drug use and Type 1 Diabetes

Psychedelic Drug use and Type 1 Diabetes

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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends and welcome to Episode 450 of the Juicebox Podcast. Today's episode is yet another in the after dark series. After Dark series you say, I don't know what you're talking about Scott Well, let me tell you all the way back in 2019 at Episode 274 we did our first afterdark when we talked about having type one diabetes, and drinking alcohol that led to 283 we'd edition 305 trauma and addiction 319 sex from a female perspective 336 depression and self harm 365 sex from a male perspective 372 divorce and co parenting 380 for bipolar disorder 393 bulimia and depression 399 heroin addiction Episode 422 is with Amy. And it was so varied and multifaceted. I think those things mean the same thing. But it was so much that that I just called it after dark Amy. The point is that these episodes are about topics that exist in everyone's day to day life. But there are topics that we don't talk about. And I thought that there should be a place for people with type one diabetes to talk about the stuff that goes on in everyone's life. That you know, for one reason or another isn't the kind of conversation you have and mix company or whoever proper people say stuff like that. Anyway, today's show is with Ashlyn Ashton is 23 years old, she has type one diabetes, and she used to psychedelics. So we're going to talk about it.

I want to start here by saying that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, please always consult a physician before you make any changes to your medical plan, or become bold with insulin. I'll also throw in that I can't. For the life of me imagine using psychedelic drugs. I'm actually not a drug user at all. I don't even drink but I also don't have any judgment about other people's business. All that said, it's gonna be some pretty clear talk about how to use psychedelic drugs in this. So if you're a kid, stop now do not listen to this without your parents. Please forget, please, I commend you if you're under $18 this Alright, that's it. You've been told. Towards the end of the episode Ashlyn is going to bring up something called dance safe.org I'm just putting it here, so it's in your head. It's an interesting organization that helps people test their drugs to make sure they're pure. There's a whole world around drugs that I did not know existed. But this seems like a kindness dance safe.org Alright, let's get going.

This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is brought to you by the Omni pod tubeless insulin pump, go to my Omni pod.com forward slash juice box to see if you're eligible for a free 30 day trial of the Omni pod dash or to get a free no obligation demo pod sent right to your house you can do all of that at my Omni pod comm forward slash juice box. The episode is also sponsored by the Dexcom g six continuous glucose monitor. Find out more about ardens cgm@dexcom.com forward slash juicebox Omnipod and Dexcom are absolutely indispensable tools for everyone using insulin. You know what else is pretty great. Touched by type one.org check them out at touched by type one.org or on Facebook or Instagram.

Ashlyn 3:53
My name is Ashlyn I'm 22 years old and I've had type one for the last 13 years I think 2008

Scott Benner 4:03
it wasn't seven you were nine

Unknown Speaker 4:05
Yeah,

Scott Benner 4:06
you were diagnosed Okay, that seems like a long time doesn't seem like a long time to you

Ashlyn 4:13
not yes and no. Yes When I think about it, but diabetes wasn't really something that the forefront of my life until kind of recently

Scott Benner 4:25
interesting. Okay, so you're saying when we do the math you recognize that's been a long time, but you didn't think about it till more recently. Is this going to be a story where you didn't really pay much attention to diabetes at first or your

Unknown Speaker 4:37
opinion? Oh no, I

Ashlyn 4:38
medium cared for a lot of like my teenage years. I never went like full burnout stop taking insulin or anything like that. But I just kind of, you know, I never the endo to me was just like the prescription lady.

Scott Benner 4:54
Medium care your first person has ever said that. I found that. I like that a lot. I took Medium care of the situation so

Ashlyn 5:02
well my my Awan C's were never like over, you know, seven, like, eight. I remember, you know, I don't think I really got it under seven and a half until I was like 17. Okay.

Scott Benner 5:16
Was that trying to think here? So you if you were diagnosed like 13 years, you know what year it was? Did you say and I didn't hear

Ashlyn 5:26
2008 I think.

Scott Benner 5:28
Okay, so what kind of technology Do you have at that time?

Ashlyn 5:35
You're gonna laugh but I've been on MDI the whole time.

Scott Benner 5:39
I'm not gonna laugh. So you were just MDI with a meter you didn't have a glucose monitor, nor do you have one right now.

Ashlyn 5:47
I'm wearing a CGM. Right now I have the G six on I think the first time I use Dexcom was maybe back when the g4 was a thing, the big bulky one. I didn't really like it. I grew up in Florida, like we we always were swimming and stuff. And it was just people gave me like, weird looks at the beach and stuff like that. And I felt a lot of like, pressure.

Scott Benner 6:12
Okay. I, you're not the first person that said they don't want something stuck to their body, that's for sure. I'm sort of like musing in my head that you call it the bulky one, because I do remember that it was taller by a bit. By I guess it has a different feeling when you're wearing it versus when you're looking at it on somebody to? Because like I

Unknown Speaker 6:32
also Oh, go ahead. I'm sorry.

Ashlyn 6:35
Oh, no, I also think I got bigger. You know, and I was like, 11 it was it took up a wave bigger patch of real estate on my body. I

Scott Benner 6:44
gotcha. I understand. Okay, so MDI for it sounds like a long time just to meet or do you remember, like, how frequently did you actually test? Was it just a meals? Or how did you handle day to day stuff?

Unknown Speaker 6:57
Um,

Ashlyn 6:57
I was younger, it was mostly at meals, if I fell off, you know, like, I'd say average three times a day. Not anything crazy. As I as I got older, I did go through some periods of burnout. But I always just kind of did it off a feeling for maybe a year, which is not the best.

Scott Benner 7:20
Before we keep going, is your cell phone near the microphone?

Ashlyn 7:23
Yeah, I can move it. Is that any better?

Scott Benner 7:28
Well, we'll know in a second. Sometimes you're, you're starting a word. And there's this electronic thing that happens. Because your phone's always like pinging sites and it's always getting information that kind of interferes with the mic if it's too close, but Okay, so three times a day to somebody who was diagnosed today, even to you now that you're using a CGM. Like think of that in hindsight for a second. If I if I told you today, you were only allowed to know what your your blood sugar was three times today. Does that sound insane to you now?

Ashlyn 7:58
No, I, I go not. I'm one of those people that freaks out in the two hour window. Now.

Scott Benner 8:05
No kidding. Say you're warming up new sets, and you're just like, the world's coming?

Ashlyn 8:12
Well, it wasn't always like that. I ran into some issues. I recently moved to Colorado. And the altitude has kind of,

Scott Benner 8:22
yeah, make sure

Ashlyn 8:24
changed everything to an extreme sense. I had to cut my basil in half. and troubleshoot doing that all on my own. Because, you know, I didn't have an endo up here. And because of COVID, they were all booked out. And I tried doing telehealth with my doctor in Fort Lauderdale. And he just didn't understand the altitude and just kept telling me to raise my basil.

Unknown Speaker 8:50
And

Scott Benner 8:51
I just, I just made me think of something. If we could build a colony for type ones, 6000 10,000 feet in the air. Do you think nobody would have diabetes? Because you're right, you're like the you're the countless person in a row who's told me that at higher elevations, specifically in Colorado, not for nothing, that they need significantly less insulin than they do at a lower elevation. Do you think it'll level off at some point you've been able to talk to anybody who's gone through it?

Ashlyn 9:21
So no, the answer's no. I've talked to a lot of people here in Colorado, and they say that you adjust and all of that. And I think that right now I'm making the switch over to tandem. I have my pump training on Tuesday. I'm very excited.

Scott Benner 9:38
Got the control like you're out.

Ashlyn 9:41
Yeah, just because I'm noticing that during the mornings, the basil seems to be pretty good for the 15 units, but overnight and like after 3pm it's just I'm going down. You know, and I can't keep waking up three times a night.

Scott Benner 9:59
It's super easy. First thing I'm enjoying talking to somebody who had an eight a one C as a matter of course, who's thinking like you are now it's so we're gonna have to get back to this at some point. But firstly, I want to know about about the growing up time with diabetes. I want to understand a little bit if it was you and your mom or you and your Dad, are you on both of them, or how did they management work?

Ashlyn 10:22
I got the diagnosis that night and I have a younger sister, they instantly put her in the trial net over at University of Miami. And I remember it vividly. We were on vacation at the Bahamas and she had got my mom had gotten the call that my sister had the antibodies and it was just like a vacation ruining

Unknown Speaker 10:41
moment.

Scott Benner 10:43
I think if I get that call while I'm in the Bahamas, I say hey, you know what you call back in a couple of days. I getting that now, while I'm paying all this money to be. That sucks.

Ashlyn 10:54
So yeah, so then my sister got diagnosed when she was five, and we're five years apart. So maybe a year after I got diagnosed. Okay.

Unknown Speaker 11:02
Wow. And yeah.

Scott Benner 11:06
Sounds like a lot. It really does especially so did your sister just do MDI as well, which she managed basically the same as you.

Ashlyn 11:13
So my sister has like a, she has a funny relationship with insulin and food and she's all over the place. Her a onesies have been in the 10s and just really weird, binge eating habits. She tried the Omni pod for a while, but she has. She has like severe eczema and the cranial I kept like rejecting for her

Scott Benner 11:40
severe eczema that can be auto immune to skin issues.

Ashlyn 11:47
There's runs in my dad's family pretty hard,

Scott Benner 11:50
does it? Can I say something that I found out about recently? Hold on one second. I don't know if this is for. We'll keep talking. But I'm gonna see if I can find something. Find out if it's for eczema as well.

Ashlyn 12:05
She also has issues with the Dexcom. And she's one of those people that has to put like the

Scott Benner 12:09
bunch of barriers and everything on

Ashlyn 12:11
Yeah, or else it'll come off like in a day.

Scott Benner 12:14
No kidding. Well, there are some newer drugs over the last couple of years, that are are for things like hives. allergic reactions, like the asthma, you know, stuff like that, that in the past people have thought of as not being you can't really impact it. But these, these newer drugs seem to have a real impact on something like that. And I'm wondering if there's something like that for eczema as well, though, I don't know. But I do think of it as a an autoimmune issue. When your skin and when your skin has odd reactions like that two different things. Which I guess we don't find crazy. But okay, so your sister sounds like she had or has an eating disorder? Would you call it dyeable? emia?

Ashlyn 13:07
No, she, she's like right at the cusp, where she's just eating and doing a lot of insulin at once. And she hasn't really figured out the whole not taking the insulin part of it. And that's why I try not to address it, because I'm like, I don't want to make that click in her mind. Oh,

Scott Benner 13:25
you think she's close to diet, believe me, but she hasn't actually figured out how to make it happen yet.

Ashlyn 13:31
Well, she just hasn't. She hasn't. She hasn't stopped like stop taking the insulin for what she eats. And it's at the point now where she's also on Metformin. And I just, she's a very, she's struggling. Yeah, very strong willed person, then you cannot make her do anything she doesn't want to do. And this is her life. And this is what she's choosing. And I have to step back. Gotcha.

Scott Benner 13:56
No, I understand. And she's entertained still. Is that right?

Unknown Speaker 13:58
She's 17. Yeah. Wow,

Scott Benner 14:00
good luck. I tried to talk Arden into taking a vitamin the other day, and it turned into two hours of my life. So I was just like, just swap this one little tiny bite, okay. I feel like I have a tiny bit of understanding about what you're talking about. And yet the rest of it is, is a little foreign to me, but we're not here to talk about her. I just tried to understand the vibe. And what makes you personally say, because it sounds like you were in your late teens when you decided you don't want your a one C to be in the eights. How does that it was

Ashlyn 14:36
it was really diabetes related. I just started taking more of an interest in like overall health. You know, I noticed that I felt better and I think honestly, it was just, you know, I was using the same dosing practices and everything. I just was eating lower glycemic foods.

Scott Benner 14:52
Okay, so just just an overall like decision on your part, like, Hey, I'm going to do a little better with my diet and then that impacted your diabetes.

Ashlyn 15:00
Well, I started working at like a health food store. And you know, the options there, everything was kind of lower gi and I started, you know, buying food at work. And then I was like, Hey, I kind of feel better. Wow.

Scott Benner 15:11
Yeah. It's amazing how feeling better will will impact your decisions. So I guess them with that in mind. You, you reached out to me and asked about coming on and you were specifically like, I think I could be in an after dark episode. And I'm always interested in those emails when people are just like, I'm definitely going to be an after dark episode. If I come on the podcast like, oh, okay, how come? Yours was just super specific. And I guess I want to ask you about it and find out more about it. So can you describe what made you reach out?

Ashlyn 15:47
So I started with all of these altitude issues in Colorado, whatever. It got to the point where I ended up going to the ER, they turn me away, and I called my primary care physician just out of, you know, sheer, like, if the hospital doesn't help me, who's gonna help me, you know? And one of the, the nurses, she was like, Look, I was really thinking about you and your situation. I don't really know how to help you. But I did start listening to this podcast, and I think it would be really helpful for you. And I, at the time, I was working in the cannabis industry, and I was, you know, trimming with my hands. So I needed something to listen to. And I was like, why not?

Scott Benner 16:27
Oh, that's so a nurse. So you have low blood sugar issues because of the altitude that sends you to a hospital. The nurse tells you about the podcast, you've got time to kill, cuz you're trimming? What do we call it? Is there a way to say, Are you trimming buds? What do you do?

Unknown Speaker 16:42
Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 16:43
there you go. Sorry. No,

Scott Benner 16:44
we're good enough. Wait, do you see how little about what you and I are about to talk about that? I understand. It's gonna be fascinating for you.

Unknown Speaker 16:51
That's why I was so nervous about this. I'm like, I'm going to talk to a dad about now.

Scott Benner 16:55
Don't think that just think of me as a guy who doesn't know anything about this. And is 30 years older than you. Okay, so. So do you do you smoke on the regular? Is that part of your life?

Ashlyn 17:08
Oh, yeah, it's been it's been a part of my life since about 1615. I wouldn't say constant until you know, I moved out 18. I really like marijuana because when my blood sugar is high, it kind of helps relieve the symptoms until you know, the insulin has time to work.

Scott Benner 17:30
Okay, so there was a time when you couldn't keep your blood sugar down. It comes with symptoms like like, how did it make you feel when your blood sugar was high just for people to understand.

Unknown Speaker 17:42
So

Ashlyn 17:44
I'm going to make like an allegory to like glaucoma where people have like the bulgy eye feeling. When my blood sugar's high, I get very sleepy and it feels like my eyes are going to bulge out of my head. And the marijuana kind of helps, you know, decrease that pressure behind my eyes.

Scott Benner 18:04
Now, I will sound like a dad for a second. Okay. When that happened, you didn't think I wonder if I gave myself more insulin if my blood sugar would go down?

Ashlyn 18:13
Oh, no, it's already insulin on board. It's not using lower blood sugar.

Scott Benner 18:17
No, no, no, no, I don't mean that. I just meant okay. So you weren't, you weren't higher all the times you were jumping up staying up? Kind of smoking not to feel bad while you were higher than let the insulin bring you back down. Now you do a better job of balancing the insulin against your meals, I guess.

Ashlyn 18:33
Well, yeah, I just I was smoking regardless. And it was just kind of like, Oh, my blood sugar's over 200. And I don't feel as bad and, you know, I mean, just kind of relax and wait for the stuff to kick in.

Scott Benner 18:46
Gotcha. happy accident that though, that the weed helps with high blood sugar kind of sickness that you felt.

Ashlyn 18:52
Yeah, it's just something that you know, over time, I was smoking regardless, and it was just like, cool side effect.

Scott Benner 19:00
Finally, a side effect that I love. Right, you're used to putting on those commercials, and all the side effects are like, you'll poop in your pants, or you might off and your kidneys will explode. But now you're just like, you're gonna feel good. So it just takes away that feeling. And that was a happy accident. Did you move to Colorado? To be closer to weed? Becca?

Unknown Speaker 19:23
No, no,

Ashlyn 19:24
I have family over here. And at the beginning of COVID, I had I just was at a job I didn't love and I just wanted to change and you know, my cousin lives out here and she's always just like, whenever you're done with Florida, come out.

Scott Benner 19:38
Okay, nice. Do something for me. If you were putting on the spot here for a second. Be a salesperson for a second talk. talk me into smoking weed tonight.

Ashlyn 19:51
Oh, talk you into it. Yeah, probably not a peer pressure. No, no.

Scott Benner 19:56
Don't think of it all like 2020. Thank you very much. You know, we're just sitting around like, you're a commercial. You're, and you want me to, you're trying to you're trying to get me to buy a Honda, except you're trying to bring me over to your side here. I'm just interested, like, what would you say to somebody if I said, I have tons of interest in doing this, but I just, I grew up in the wrong time. I don't think of it the way you do. Make me feel comfortable with it.

Ashlyn 20:24
So this is like when I got my grandma to smoke with me.

Scott Benner 20:27
Okay, you know what? I would have known to ask like that, I would have just said, How did you get your grandma to try?

Ashlyn 20:34
She has glaucoma. That's pretty much all I had to say I was really I don't know, it just, you know, it's something that helps pass the time. And honestly, during quarantine, it's been needed. I just, I have a highly anxious person. And it's just something like I can't drink. Really, alcohol is not something that sits in my stomach very well. Plus the diabetes aspect. So smoking weed naturally was just kind of like, well, if I can't drink, I'll do that.

Scott Benner 21:12
Well see now I feel like we're getting to it. So you do have a low level of anxiety kind of all the time.

Unknown Speaker 21:19
Oh, yeah. All the time. Right.

Scott Benner 21:21
And this helps with that.

Ashlyn 21:25
Yeah, it does, as long as you're in the right, like set mindset and setting, which is something we'll get into about the other stuff.

Scott Benner 21:33
Yeah, I love that. This is even why you came on. You're doing such a good job of teasing the story out. I don't know if you're doing it on purpose, and you're a genius or if it's just happening naturally. But I'm very much enjoying this. So. So you have a natural kind of level of anxiety. Has that. Is that a lifetime thing? Have you felt Oh, yeah. As a child?

Ashlyn 21:51
Oh, yeah. When I was like three or four, I was the kid that was hiding behind their parents legs would let my mom go out to the mailbox without me. It was not anything to do with the diabetes. I was born this way. No, no, I

Scott Benner 22:03
understand. So since you were little, what about? Can we help for a second? Like, let's use the lockdown for a second? Do you have any pile up feelings of like, like dread about the lockup? Like I'm never getting out of here. Life's never gonna be the same again. Do you? Has that become worse over the last year?

Ashlyn 22:23
It's not really much ado about the lockdown as much as far as like the diabetes not being the same, honestly. Because when all of this started, I drastically cut carbs down. I, I had a grazer when I eat, you know, and I had to stop doing that. And just like how many I broke out the food scale even which for me is unheard of.

Scott Benner 22:45
So you were said the lockdown for you. It's been more about like, not just being on a 24 seven, like popping a little something in your mouth, like snacking for out of boredom.

Ashlyn 22:56
Right. And I just you know, everybody says the diabetes is the job that like you can't take days off from and that's kind of the feeling that I have sometimes.

Scott Benner 23:05
Yeah, that idea that you can never get away from it.

Ashlyn 23:08
Right. And it's like the first thing that I do in the morning. And the last thing I do before I go to bed is probably looked at the Dexcom app.

Scott Benner 23:15
So just being high make you ignore your, your blood sugars, or does it just not make it feel as on the present?

Ashlyn 23:24
And I know that's a problem that a lot of people have. I know and you guys did like the after dark weed episode he he said something like that, like he ignores his diabetes. But for me, I've been smoking so long that like, No, not at all. You know, if anything, like I'll just be watching TV and like have my phone open. And I just glanced at every once in a while and just act accordingly. Yeah, you know, I just make sure to get some like, keto munchies. You know, pepperoni sticks are like my favorite.

Unknown Speaker 23:59
Because you do get munchie when you're high.

Unknown Speaker 24:01
Oh, yeah.

Scott Benner 24:02
Okay. Is there a level of trying to make this clear for people who don't know anything about it? Is there you know how you see a person take a shot, like a shot of whiskey, and they don't have anything else. You know, I go there that sometimes that relaxes a person, but that same person could have 20 shots, and then they would just fall on the floor into a puddle. So can you take like, how does weed work? Like is one hit the same as, like, could you take enough hits in five minutes to just obliterate yourself? Or is that not possible?

Ashlyn 24:36
It is very possible. I think what you're talking about would be similar to like a gravity bomb or ice I smoke concentrates, which is basically how it sounds concentrated weed through like a like a device that heats it up. And you know, I have a higher tolerance. It doesn't destroy me, but for you who's never released. moped, if you were to go and take a small hit of concentrate, you would probably be high for like five hours

Scott Benner 25:05
just shut my eye. And that would be like sitting down and kind of incapacitated. Hi.

Unknown Speaker 25:12
Oh, yeah,

Scott Benner 25:14
you've got me googling gravity bomb, by the way, in case you're wondering. I'm doing right now. Good luck. No, I found it. I'm good. I see. Okay, all right. That's something that can't be described on a budget. Okay, so that so that is, so that's a possibility. And I asked because then that means that you are thoughtfully smoking throughout the times that you are to keep yourself in a space where you can look at your blood sugar and say, I see that my blood sugar 68 and I should eat some carbs. Like not not Oh,

Ashlyn 25:49
yeah, I don't even let it get to 68.

Scott Benner 25:51
Okay, because you could smoke yourself to a place where you looked and were like, hey, my blood sugar 68 I'm gonna die, whatever. That could happen.

Ashlyn 25:59
Oh, no, that's not me. Other people's mileage may vary, but that's not me. I could never do that. Because it's just, that's not my personality.

Scott Benner 26:07
Okay, so Okay, that's interesting. That's interesting to know. So no matter how, what level of

Ashlyn 26:14
what's the word, we'll get into it. I feel when we start talking about everything else, you'll be like, Oh, okay.

Scott Benner 26:19
I'm trying to understand, because I'm trying to see like, no matter how, what level of high you are, it's funny. I don't even have a word like I would if you were drinking, I'd say drunk, right, no matter how drunk you are. But I guess it is no matter how high you are. Right. That would be

Unknown Speaker 26:33
there's other terms that would

Scott Benner 26:35
use some of the national order. Yeah. Which Oh, gosh, should I be saying?

Ashlyn 26:41
Do you want to be hip and cool? Like the kids? I guess I would say, and I get really high. Sometimes I'll be like, I'm Stoney. baloney.

Scott Benner 26:50
Okay. So what you think in this situation is what I should have said when I was asking the question, no matter how Stoney baloney You see, that doesn't work. I feel like these are not good adjectives.

Unknown Speaker 27:04
No, they're not

Scott Benner 27:07
great, where there's a whole section of society where enough words has been made up that you can't speak English with them anymore. Alright, so we have to stick with Hi, just don't think Oh, yeah. Okay. Okay, okay. Thank you. I appreciate that. I'm just trying to like, illuminate like, is it possible because he tried to understand the other side of this conversation right now You and I are talking. But somebody's mother's listening. And they're looking across the room right now at their seven year old who hides behind their legs all the time. And they're thinking, Oh, Jesus, Johnny's gonna smoke weed when he gets older. And so, it's so how, you know, so what's their level of concern? Like, look at yourself, from my perspective for a second, should I be worried about you?

Unknown Speaker 27:54
No, not at all. Okay,

Ashlyn 27:56
I, you know, I pay my bills, like, I'm going full time working full time going to school on top of, you know, the diabetes, the weed all of it. But if for a moment, my responsibilities were slipping, I'd cut all of it out. But I have that level of self control with myself and that level of accountability. And that's where things start to get shaky. If you have an addictive personality, if you you know, can't hold yourself accountable, then you can't play this game.

Scott Benner 28:23
So there are people who use and aren't addicted. And there are people who are addicted. You've seen both kinds of people.

Ashlyn 28:30
Oh, yeah, for sure. And it's, it's honestly, people with an addictive personality. It's not It's not the weed. It's the person.

Scott Benner 28:38
Yeah, okay. So even if this was Oreos, they'd be eaten too many of them

Ashlyn 28:43
right? And it's just whatever your brain chemistry latches on to and you know, you have to make that choice for yourself and really sit down and say you know, do I have a level of self control to where I can balance

Scott Benner 28:56
Yeah, I feel like my I don't even know see it's funny. I don't think of it as self control I would think of it is things that I'm more or less were just left my head things that just sort of naturally happened to me like more or less Where the hell's the word Ash on I didn't smoke anything and I can't find it. They call this a pothole right if you're smoking

Ashlyn 29:23
I have never heard that I'll

Scott Benner 29:24
have to use it like I've hit a pothole meaning I can't think of a word. Holy Christ. Wait a second. proclivity. Wow, that's why I couldn't think of it because it's a word from 1978. But but like some, like, I don't believe I have a proclivity towards like addictive stuff that way. Like I feel like you could give me weed and I could use it and then three days later, never think about it again.

Ashlyn 29:53
That's me with with everything though. Everything in anything, you know, I'm just not who I am.

Scott Benner 30:00
Yeah, like I'm not a smoker, but I could smoke a carton of cigarettes this week and then never think to have a cigarette again. But right, but smoking the cigarettes would feel like work to me. I'd be like, Oh,

Ashlyn 30:11
I could never I

Scott Benner 30:11
can't believe I promised I was gonna smoke a carton of cigarettes is how it would feel if that odd situation came up. And I feel like Alright, so what's the difference between smoking and edibles? I feel like I feel like I hear Seth Rogen talking about a body high versus something else but I don't understand the difference.

Ashlyn 30:38
So the difference between smoking weed and edibles is definitely duration of highness. And a lot of people if you're not living in an illegal state, and you're, you know, going down the down the street and buying it from somebody how much is in there, you don't really know. And that's where you kind of hear all these horror stories of people. You know, buying edibles and then you know, laying facedown for two days.

Scott Benner 31:07
So if I get a chocolate chip cookie, and it's not a it's not a weak cookie, and it's got extra chips in it. I think lucky I got extra chocolate chips. But if I get a gummy that's a weed gummy and somebody put in way too much weed in my gummy. I don't get to think who I got extra t hc is a THC PS. Yeah, I get to think oh, I'm laying on the floor staring at the car. So it's not like getting bonus chocolate chips. It's like it's a it's it's like somebody taking a prescription medication, compounding it wrong, and you're getting way too much in one pill. Well,

Ashlyn 31:40
from what I understand, it's a different absorption as well. You're absorbing the when you smoke, you're absorbing the THC through your lungs. And when you take an edible you're absorbing it through your stomach lining and to my knowledge is may or may not be right. There are two different tolerances. To listen. We're

Scott Benner 31:59
taking your word for it, because I don't know if you've noticed, but you're much more comfortable talking about this than diabetes. So

Unknown Speaker 32:06
you already know

Scott Benner 32:07
you're way smoother when you come to this. I'm like how did you get your blood sugar down? You're like, yeah, it's just a different food. Tell me about weed well, so you don't you don't eat your weed.

Unknown Speaker 32:19
No,

Ashlyn 32:20
I'm not I'm not a huge fan of apples. They do have sugar free edibles here now, which is great. But I just duration of time. And it's just sometimes like I wake up in the morning and I feel groggy after and that's like, I that's a commitment.

Scott Benner 32:43
There's a great article, I think it was from California as a number of years ago, when because weed was legal in California before Colorado, excuse me before like anywhere else, right? Like Colorado was diverse. So this article is out of Colorado is in a major newspaper. It was this big company that was thinking about leaving Colorado, because somebody in New York asked for something to be shipped from Colorado to New York and you know, supposed to be overnighted in a day or two later, it wasn't there. And they called up. And the person they spoke to was like, hey, Relax, man, I'll get there. How do we hire people who aren't high? Because if we can't do that, I gotta get any work done here. But I think that's how people think about it in general. Do you know what I mean? And I'm not saying that's true. I'm saying I think that's the like, I have no judgment about you smoking at all. Like I don't feel in any way judgmental about it. I don't like I'm not sitting here thinking like, Oh, you shouldn't do it. I'm not telling you. I've never done it. And then I'm telling you right now, I don't know why. Like, there's nothing stopping me from doing it.

Ashlyn 33:50
That's that's your prerogative and your choice. And honestly, everybody needs to make that choice for themselves. I'm not somebody who, you know, when somebody has never smoked weed, I'm like, why don't you try it? You know? No, that's, that's honestly horrible behavior. And I hate when people do that, because that's somebody's life and somebody's choice and don't influence them.

Scott Benner 34:11
Well, it is interesting, isn't it that, you know, that culture in general, especially, I guess, here, it says that when you turn 21 you can drink until you fall over on your face? And that's not just okay. It's almost like a rite of passage. But there's a guarantee somebody listening right now saying, well, like what about the person she said might get addicted to it, it could ruin their life, but nobody ever talks about like beer could ruin your life or, you know, cigarettes could ruin your life or any other things that sugar could ruin your there's a lot of addictive things that could ruin your life. This is the only one that people have judgement about, for some reason that they'll voice out loud. Like I'm sure people look at you kind of like side eyed if you're a drunk, but they won't say anything to you about it. And if they do, then they'll say to you Hey, I think you have a medical condition. You know, alcoholism is a medical condition. But nobody thinks of weed that way at all and other drugs. So the reason you came on is because you sent me an email and you're like, hey, do you want to talk about being a type one and using psychedelics? And I was like, wow, there's two things, one of them I know a lot about, and one of them I know absolutely nothing about. That'd be great. Why don't you come on the podcast and talk about that. So in my mind, when you say psychedelics, I think mushrooms, like psilocybin, these are the words that are popping into my head that I don't know anything about.

Ashlyn 35:40
So so when I said psychedelics I'm pretty much open to talking about whatever, silicided LSD you know, anything like that? I

Unknown Speaker 35:53
have.

Ashlyn 35:54
I have a lot of experience with that kind of stuff and trying to manage diabetes while you're doing it.

Scott Benner 36:02
Well, that's what the rest of this hour is about. So where do you wins the art? What's the first You caught me with the LSD for some reason? Cuz that feels like a 60s word in that funny. I'm like, Oh,

Ashlyn 36:13
I'm trying to talk to the moms on the podcast, you know,

Scott Benner 36:17
try to make sure they understand what you're talking about. Or you think I like I was hipper than them when I went with psilocybin. And they were like, I don't know what that is.

Ashlyn 36:26
Yeah, I was surprised. I was like, what are we on Joe Rogan?

Scott Benner 36:30
I know some stuff about a couple of things. I love culture. Like I love knowing about things. I don't necessarily need to need to ever try some things, but I do like knowing about them. So okay, so what's the first I was gonna say psychotropic, but I don't know if that's different than psychedelic. Oh, Christ. Okay, you explain it to me? What's the first thing you ever did? How old were you?

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Ashlyn 40:59
I the first time I tried psychedelics it was I just graduated high school and I kind of reconnected with some family and they were really into like the electronic dance music scene. And for my graduation, they bought me a ticket to go to a festival. Maybe two weeks before the festival I had to go up there to do orientation for my school and we wanted to do like a trial run and how everything would go you know, do it at home, try it be safe. And I took maybe 1.5 grams of mushrooms, you know, followed up by a little bit of a little bit of fruit punch because vitamin C potentially eight silicided.

Scott Benner 41:52
So you take 1.5 grams, and then you drink vitamin C to make it more potent.

Ashlyn 41:58
Yep, it makes it a bit more potent and the duration of action is maybe like an hour less.

Scott Benner 42:04
And this was practice getting high. You were practicing to go to an EDM concert where you would do it there. Is that right?

Ashlyn 42:11
Huh? Yeah, I just wanted to do a trial run just to you know, you have a handle on thing.

Scott Benner 42:16
This is the most responsible approach to an irresponsible thing I've ever heard. You made me think of when bank robbers run out warehouses and tape it off like a bank to try first. Like we just want to make sure we know where it's gonna be. So okay, so your practice at home? What did you find out when you're cracked? And you were like, 18 ish?

Ashlyn 42:38
Yeah, I was 18. I just went on a walk, you know, watched a movie went to bed. It was really relaxing, mild. And I was like, I can do this. Is it fine?

Scott Benner 42:49
is is that amount considered micro dosing? Or is that not? No, no.

Ashlyn 42:56
Anything like under point five, I believe is micro dosing. The beginners dose is about a gram to a gram and a half. And then like standard usage is probably two to two and a half grams.

Scott Benner 43:11
Hmm. Interesting. I feel like I'm not gonna be able to have ads on this episode. No, no, I'm gonna have to get different advertisers for this one. Find out who makes it gravity Bong and forget them here. Okay, because I've heard of people using like, micro doses of mushrooms to medicate. Like, day to day medical issues.

Ashlyn 43:36
I cannot speak to any of that. I am very skeptical of the whole micro dosing day to day ideal.

Scott Benner 43:44
Ah, okay, so that's a whole like sub culture of mushrooms. Maybe like that's a different branch.

Ashlyn 43:51
Yeah, that that's the you gotta talk to like the Silicon Valley guys who do that in code and stuff.

Scott Benner 43:58
I see what you're saying. I hear what you're getting at.

Ashlyn 44:00
You think I'm doing it. I'm doing it. I'm not taking point to to go do some math homework.

Scott Benner 44:06
Ashlyn like, I'm not screwing around. If this is happening, it's happening. How long does it happen for like you when you do it? How long does it last?

Ashlyn 44:15
So with with mushrooms, it's about six to eight hours, depending on how much you take. And then with acid, it's about 12. Plus,

Scott Benner 44:24
could you just jump right off the tracks onto something else? I wasn't done with the mushroom thing yet. So how do you So talk to me about managing your diet? Well, it's just gonna be a weird segue. But you said you've made changes in your diabetes care over the last couple of years. And you talked about earlier having a one season the eights, what is your a one c now?

Unknown Speaker 44:45
So

Ashlyn 44:46
I haven't gotten it tested for a while, but if I look at clarity, right now, it's 6.4.

Scott Benner 44:51
Okay. So I mean, I believe in the data, I use data to track Arden's you know, in between her blood draws, and I I find a number of different apps to be really close. So I'm how I'm completely comfortable saying you have an A one C, and the six is now. And so obviously your management is different now than it used to be you have a Dexcom, you said, You're obviously you're starting to see trends and understand the data and everything. What is it like? So you talked about, when you're smoking weed, you can keep up with your blood sugars? Is it still possible with mushrooms?

Ashlyn 45:27
Yeah, it's definitely possible. But there's a threshold. I have never, you know, taken more than, oh, I've never taken more than six grams at a time.

Scott Benner 45:44
Did that number scare you when you thought of it in your head?

Ashlyn 45:47
Well, because I, the one time I took five was a complete accident. And I normally don't even go that far, I'll normally stay around to maybe less than that. Just because I if you start taking bigger doses of psychedelics you cannot see. And that's not something I'm interested in.

Scott Benner 46:07
Okay. So hold on, I got a couple thoughts here. So there's an amount that you can take where you can still manage yourself. Do you always have a wingman? When you take them? Sir? Oh, yeah,

Ashlyn 46:17
100% 100%, I would not be doing this if I did not. And that's something that I want to stress. This is not a solo venture kind of thing. You know, when I do this kind of stuff in public, it's the only time I bring out the Dexcom PDM. And I make sure to give that PDM to somebody else.

Scott Benner 46:36
Okay, so you have a straight person with you. Every time you do mushrooms, there's somebody you know, that cares about you. And if it's going to sit with you for six to eight hours while you're high and they're not.

Ashlyn 46:46
Well, they're not not always straight, but it's another pair of eyes.

Scott Benner 46:50
So, okay, so we have two high people looking at your Dexcom person, is that right?

Unknown Speaker 46:56
Yeah, it's family, you know, they have my best interests at heart.

Scott Benner 47:00
Okay. All right. So there. So there's an amount that you feel more comfortable at, like you're you feel more in control that, but let's, let's go for Yeah, let's go for a second, to try to understand the difference a little bit. You smoke weed, you're relaxed. You do mushrooms? What are you

Ashlyn 47:22
so in the beginning phases, when it starts to kick in, I normally I'm anxious beforehand to begin with. But some people that I've seen online, they think compare the come up on mushrooms to similar to low blood sugar, you kind of get that disoriented, feeling sweaty, you're just kind of like what's going on. But then you've kind of hit the peak at levels out and then you're able to like you feel not as confusing bodily signals.

Scott Benner 47:52
Okay, what point to garden gnomes talk to you and dragons made of penises fly around? When does that happen?

Ashlyn 47:59
I've never been there. And I don't want to be there.

Scott Benner 48:02
Okay, so. So there's so there's a there's, so just like we talked about with the weed, you could smoke enough weed to knock yourself out, you could drink enough to knock yourself out. You could take enough mushrooms to put yourself somewhere else where your brain is talking in pictures that are likely

Ashlyn 48:16
Well, you reach a point in it's called ego. And what really happens is once you start getting into those bigger doses, it kind of feels like people call it being in a loop. And you kind of like your memory gets very scrambling. And you'll like it's like moments of clarity. And I like to describe it as like peeling the layers of high off. If that makes sense. Okay, you like peak, and then it'll be like mental confusion a little bit, and then it'll be like, you kind of gets stuck. Almost some people describe it as where you're just kind of like stuck in one moment. And you're on a loop. And that's if you take a lot and that's not you know, I I don't like that feeling. And that's not something that's very like, it does not make your diabetes easy to manage when you don't know what time it is,

Scott Benner 49:21
is what you're saying that things slow down so much that you can take a macro view of ideas that is so far back you've never been able to pull that far back in your life because everything's going so slowly.

Ashlyn 49:35
Yeah, kind of time distortion is huge. And then dispersion is huge. And I've only seen the looping thing through other people. That's not really something that I've experienced myself. I have no interest.

Scott Benner 49:52
What's the there are people who have done this that just never come back from it right? They're just like, they lose their minds afterwards. That's It's not.

Ashlyn 50:01
Yeah, it's people who have like latent schizophrenic genes and stuff like that I have a, an ex boyfriend who that kind of happened to and he never really bounced back. But that it, that's a whole other story.

Scott Benner 50:18
I'm not I don't, I don't need you to tell me about him. I just wanted to make sure I'm in an interesting situation here. I listen to everybody who, you know, you say I have type one diabetes. And if somebody were to send me an email and say, Hey, if type one diabetes and I, I pilot a train, you know of a locomotive, I'd be like, I would love to hear about that. You were like, I have type one diabetes. And I do like a dog. So I was like, I would love to hear about that. Then once you get on, we talk about it. It's not in, it's not every conversation where someone listening can go get a train and drive it. And so I want to make sure that while people are listening, that they they understand that, you know, that there's more to it than just like, Oh, I do a little bit of it. And you know, I see a pretty color. And six hours later, everything's cool. You also seem like you're not really well, you're not sure if you're able to manage your blood sugars? Or how do you do that? So how do you let's take any kind of judgment out of it for a second, you're a person who's decided they're going to do mushrooms and you have type one diabetes? How do you approach that, so that you get through it? Well.

Ashlyn 51:28
Like I said, before, mindset and setting, if you're somebody who's uncomfortable, and like kind of has like a little bit of trepidation about the whole thing, do it at home where you feel comfortable, where you have a whole gallon of juice in the fridge if you need it. You know, you want to make sure that you're comfortable. Because if you're not that's going to come out and you're not going to have a good time. And so for me, I have to make sure that I have a level of baseline comfortability, and I plan for a tizzy to happen.

Scott Benner 51:58
So the mindset impacts the high?

Ashlyn 52:01
Well, yeah, in a way, if you kind of it's easy to get, let your emotions get the best of you if that makes sense. And if you start, like fixating on a part of your life that you're not comfortable with, or there has been in the beginning, one or two trips, where I just bodily did not feel right. And I did. zeroed in on checking my blood sugar because I was like, this kind of feels like low blood sugar. And, you know, the trip was not as fun as it could have been just because, you know, I was paying attention to diabetes during that time.

Scott Benner 52:37
Are you saying that diabetes can mess up a trip the same way can mess up a soccer game, like it just doesn't act the way you want it to one day and I got my whole Saturday's ruined. Now. Let's get brand. So then you just you were able to then just like hyper focus on it, you just were like, I'm just gonna pay more attention to my blood sugar, because my body feels different. And that's an idea that I, I think a lot of people don't relate to, or at least I don't like the idea of how does my mind feel versus how does my body feel?

Ashlyn 53:06
Well, for me, I've really, I'm somebody who's very big on like, the brain body connection, like, if I don't feel right, I'm testing. Okay, you know, and I feel like that has been the thing that, you know, when things do get kind of crazy, or, you know, things go off the handle, that's been the thing that saved me

Scott Benner 53:24
that so like when you felt like really low, for example,

Ashlyn 53:28
well, I remember one of the first times that I had done like a bigger dose of mushrooms. In my dorm, I had my blood sugar went down to 40. And immediately it started causing like, visual distortion. And I was like, Whoa, this either just really kicked in or something is wrong. And so immediately, I just went to test and it was 40. And I, you know, drank a bunch of juice and then carried on. But the thing is that in my experience psychedelics do not affect my diabetes in any discernible way.

Scott Benner 54:04
Don't make your blood sugar go up or down or anything like that.

Ashlyn 54:07
No, it's just the stress that you have, or the you know, I make sure to eat a huge meal beforehand, just so that the fat and stuff tides me over. I want that straight line the whole way through.

Scott Benner 54:19
I would think to an anxious person in general, you've probably by now with a Dexcom realize that anxiety pushes your blood sugar up a little bit, right.

Ashlyn 54:29
And I don't really have that big of like stress, caffeine or adrenaline response versus what I've seen from other people.

Scott Benner 54:37
Gotcha. Oh, that's interesting, because I was wondering like this even weed when it releases your anxiety, do you see like just a gentle lessening of your blood sugar or not? I wasn't certain.

Ashlyn 54:48
Sometimes I can see like, if my blood sugar's already going down and I smoke weed, they can kind of exacerbate that a little bit but at this point, I'm so used to it or compensated It's not a big deal. Okay?

Scott Benner 55:03
Where do you get mushrooms from? Like, I don't mean the guy's name. I mean, is it? Like how is it regulated? Like if we can't if we can't regulate weed gummy bears, how are we like, meaning like for potency? How are we doing that with mushrooms?

Ashlyn 55:19
There's actually different strains of there's a lot of good information on the internet, if you look into it, the most common one, they're called a golden teachers. That's kind of the the bigger kept mushrooms. And then there's like the smaller ones, which have a name that I can't say. But it's just it comes with the territory. And honestly, I'm a big researcher, if I'm doing something, I'm going to find out everything about what I'm doing. So that you know just gives me that sense of ease.

Scott Benner 55:56
Have you ever tried to I Alaska?

Unknown Speaker 55:58
No.

Ashlyn 56:01
No, I have no interest that you kind of really lose yourself and you throw up and that that's like three days and I don't know how that could be managed with type one. I I've seen people do DMT and stuff like that. And I have really no interest that looks not very fun. What the hell

Scott Benner 56:21
is the empty? My Don't let me just cover your mouth when you're, you know, this generation. You don't you don't respect me at all. I'm just kidding. What is the Mt.

Ashlyn 56:33
DMT you may have to Google it.

Scott Benner 56:37
I can do that. Imagine if the FBI came in right now. And they were like, let's just look at your history real quickly. Wow. dimethyl tryptamine

Ashlyn 56:48
Yep. So it's, it's a psychedelic, and some people say, and this has been like debunked, that it's the chemical that your brain releases when you die. Okay, um, it's a five minute hallucinogenic trip. And you this is like, what when people imagine psychedelics, this is the drug that they're talking about? I believe, you know, you really. That's the one that kind of takes you to like another world for five minutes. And

Scott Benner 57:18
then we're tied I came from is what you're saying?

Ashlyn 57:20
Yeah, the Grateful Dead was not putting that in people's lemonades.

Scott Benner 57:24
So there's a chemical substance that occurs in many plants, animals, just like when you hear about people looking frogs and stuff like that in the

Ashlyn 57:31
Yeah, way more way more closer to something like that. Um, it's pretty much the the mack daddy of psychedelics.

Scott Benner 57:41
Hmm. There are there are some animals that do that with other animals too. Like there's there. I've seen like a video I think of a was a primate of some sort. getting high off of a another animal was interesting that it just sat there.

Ashlyn 57:57
Oh, yeah. Like the dolphins with like, the puffer fish,

Scott Benner 58:01
stuff like that. Like that's really is fascinating, isn't it? Okay, so that you don't do, but you've done it. Well, I like how you were like, no, but you've done LSD, or you just said LSD so that people would understand what you're talking about?

Ashlyn 58:14
I actually, yeah, that is, if I had a psychedelic of choice. It's definitely acid. Mushrooms kind of make my stomach hurt. Yeah, they kind of make my stomach hurt. And I've always just preferred acid. It's just a cleaner cut high, in my opinion, especially if I'm, you know, going to be doing 30 miles that day of walking and dancing and craziness.

Scott Benner 58:44
Tell me something. Have you ever gone to an EDM concert without being high? Yep. Does the music suck?

Ashlyn 58:50
No, I but I enjoy the music sober.

Scott Benner 58:54
That's what I was. Like. I'm wondering, is it like not i'm not making a judgment about EDM. I'm like, hold on a second almost died. Sorry about that. I am. I'm genuinely asking like, do you need the drugs to make the music palatable? But you like the music? No. So then it so for a person like me, if you said to me, Scott, I'm going to take you out of yourself for the next six hours. I would, I would genuinely not want that. So what what comes from it for you? Do you not I mean, like, what, what's the reasoning behind doing it? I'm not asking you to, to not ask you to talk me into why it's okay. I'm not saying it's not okay. I'm asking what you get from it, and why it's important.

Ashlyn 59:42
So for me, I'm among the group of people that see psychedelics as like a mental refresh button. It just kind of shakes up my perspective and gets me out of the same old rut that my brain is in sometimes and It's not something that I do all the time. I, you know, I, I haven't done it in maybe a year and a half now, since quarantine happened just because I'm not gonna sit at home and do that, you know, there's no point I'm not. I don't need it, you know, it's just when it's worth it, it's worth it. And if I'm going to go out to a club or go out and dance, then yeah, I'll probably take some but

Scott Benner 1:00:25
so I wouldn't see this any differently than a person who just says, Look, I've worked a long week, and I'm going to drink on Friday night and shut my brain off for a while and wake up Saturday morning and start over again.

Ashlyn 1:00:38
Yeah, but yeah, pretty much and I mean, I, the sad thing is, is that my body works better. You know, taking psychedelics or weed than having two beers, having two beers will mess me up for quite some time.

Scott Benner 1:00:53
Yeah, I don't get drinking. Just Personally, I don't

Unknown Speaker 1:00:58
know, I don't like that.

Scott Benner 1:01:01
But I, I also have never, I've never had the feeling that I wanted to reset. Like, I'm like, my life's become, you know, almost unmanageable at times, you know, there's outside influences people. And I grew up in a place where we didn't have any money. There's been things that as I look back, I think, well, if I was gonna forget something, that would have been a great thing to forget, where that would have been a perfect day not to remember, but I've never, I've never had anything that's wanted to push me over to doing something about it. And I've had plenty of opportunities to it's just never, ever occurred to me to actually follow through with it.

Ashlyn 1:01:41
Yeah, but that that's your choice. And, you know, honestly, psychedelics are not a one size fits all solution. Yeah, you know that that's something you have to decide for yourself. And I'm somebody who struggles with depression and feeling. You know, like, I need to change sometimes. It's just again, this is a really personal choice. And that's what I want to stress. I'm not glorifying this, I don't want people to feel like Oh, you got to do this. No, no, no, if this is something people are going to do this, whether you know the information on how to do it is there or not, and I mainly want to do this just for harm reduction purposes and to say you can do it, but make sure that you're being smart and taking care of yourself and that's your priority at the end of the day.

Scott Benner 1:02:24
At the end of this I want you to go over kind of all the things someone should do to be safe, but I have more questions. Do you think a Walton do you think are you using any pharmaceutical drugs for depression or anxiety?

Unknown Speaker 1:02:38
No,

Scott Benner 1:02:38
do you think you would be if you didn't smoke weed?

Ashlyn 1:02:41
No, I tried SSRIs when I was maybe 1516 I just really didn't like how they made me feel. And I don't think that it worked for me but at the same time my depression and anxiety isn't debilitating to the point where I can't manage my life right?

Scott Benner 1:03:01
So a sign of the the side effects of an SSRI that you experienced without the weed would you need them but be unwilling or unable to take them?

Ashlyn 1:03:12
No, no, I don't think so. At all. I you know, smoking weed is not like a must have for me. You know, I I don't think that anything would be different. If I wasn't smoking weed, I just would be a little bit more bored.

Scott Benner 1:03:28
I just wasn't sure if you were managing your health with it.

Ashlyn 1:03:33
No, I don't I don't see it like that. And I know a lot of people are pushing for medicinal marijuana and in the way that I see it. It's really good for physical stuff. Like if you have glaucoma or Parkinson's or whatever, but I really don't think that people should be using it for mental health disorders. I don't think that the studying and has been done and I don't think there's enough evidence for that. And I've seen it personally be negative for some people, and I don't think that people should be pushing it for mental health especially.

Scott Benner 1:04:05
Yeah. Hey, quick question. How did your grandmother like acid?

Ashlyn 1:04:10
Oh, she she hasn't done it.

Scott Benner 1:04:16
I'm sorry. I didn't think she did. I was teasing. You're, you're just you're just calm enough that that I can't tell if my sarcasm is coming through to you or if it's just coming through on a delay, like I'm not certain, but

Ashlyn 1:04:29
Oh, that that's me that I'm super monotone level. Jefferson. I can't tell

Scott Benner 1:04:35
if you're chill or if you're monotone like that was the but Are you high now?

Ashlyn 1:04:39
No, I I'm going to go to work after this.

Scott Benner 1:04:42
Um, what are you doing for can you say?

Ashlyn 1:04:44
Yeah, yeah, right now I'm doing a e commerce listing for goodwill. I like to call it budget antique roadshow.

Scott Benner 1:04:54
And you said at one point you were working at a weed farm.

Ashlyn 1:04:57
Yeah, I actually had to leave when all All of this stuff started happening with the diabetes. We were working out in like farms like 40 miles from the nearest hospital. And it just, I can't dig trenches and, you know, have basil issues,

Scott Benner 1:05:13
your blood sugar's work. Yeah, no kidding. Is that getting worked out? Or you're?

Ashlyn 1:05:19
Whoa, we'll see you on Tuesday. I really hope when I get the pump, it just makes things a little easier, because I just hate that I'm tied to this basil rate for 24 hours. You know, there's some times where like, last night, I, I, my blood sugar was just stuck at 90. And normally, my correction factor is really, or my insulin to carb ratio is really low right now. I thought I was at one to eight. And it seems to be like that during the morning. Like I just right now I had like some toast and stuff. And I i dose for and it went well. But last night, I was stuck at 80. And I ended up eating like, I want to say 40 grams of carbs. And I had like glucose shell I had a banana and the Dexcom never even gave me like one arrow up.

Scott Benner 1:06:08
That's super interesting. So you were clearly going to get lower. Because if you put that much food in and you weren't going up at that number, but are you comfortable at 80 or 90 when you're stable?

Ashlyn 1:06:19
Oh, yeah, I'm comfortable dosing it 80 or 90 for smaller meals. I just want all of this happened. You know, before this, my day, I had like a whole playbook. I was really comfortable. I was confident in using insulin. You know, I, I was really good. But now my confidence in the medication is kind of faltered. And I need to rebuild all of that. And that's kind of where I'm at right now. I've been trying to when all of this started, I was eating maybe 10 grams of carbs a day for months.

Unknown Speaker 1:06:50
No, I now I'm not. I'm sorry.

Unknown Speaker 1:06:54
Oh, no, you're good? No, I

Scott Benner 1:06:55
think you put that really well. That idea of like when the confidence is gone. It's impossible to make a decision all of a sudden, because you can trust it. Because it works a certain way I use this much insulin this happens. This much this happens if I get low I do this, I get high do this. You suddenly leave one place go to another place. And you can't feed a low enough. That's frightening like that.

Unknown Speaker 1:07:20
No, I

Ashlyn 1:07:22
want all of this started. I was I remember, I was working and I went to go take the garbage out. And you know, just to stay level. At that point. I was eating a glucose tab every five minutes. And at first I thought there was something wrong with the lantis I was taking. Because it happened and it happened overnight. Yeah. And I went to go take the garbage out if my blood sugar went from 130 to 55. After like lifting two bags of garbage.

Scott Benner 1:07:50
How much? How much have you reduced your Lantus since you've been there?

Ashlyn 1:07:57
The land I actually switched off of lantis, because I was noticing that during the day, it would just tank me like that. And then overnight, it would give up. And so during the day, I would be feeding, feeding the insulin feeding the insulin and then overnight, it would just stop working,

Scott Benner 1:08:12
you're gonna like having a pump.

Ashlyn 1:08:14
I ended up switching over to receba. I had done that. And it had better results in the past. And I just figured it would last a little bit longer and not just leave me with no coverage overnight. Now, and I switched from 20 units of lantis to 15 units of receba.

Scott Benner 1:08:31
Is that still too much? Are you still feeding insulin?

Ashlyn 1:08:35
I'm feeding insulin at night, it seems like during the morning. It's perfect. You know, I was this morning, I woke up at 140. And I ate some toast did like a unit and a half and it states like went down to 120 and then went up to 141. So it's hold. It's held there this whole time. So I can't say that. The basil is off right now. But it seems like as soon as I get home from work

Scott Benner 1:09:05
that it wants to just,

Ashlyn 1:09:08
it just falls and then I I try to catch it. But then it's just like I'm trying to nudge and then it gets down to like 90 and then I'm like okay, well now I'm going to have to start force feeding.

Scott Benner 1:09:20
Can I ask you something that's not in my business? Do you take birth control?

Ashlyn 1:09:24
Yeah, I do. And I kind of cut that out because I've noticed that on the days that I like do take it it's causes more insulin resistance. And during this time, I've just kind of cut it out because it's just a variable that I don't want to account for.

Scott Benner 1:09:40
Yeah, because I was thinking like there's part of me was thinking like maybe a birth control pill would cost them insulin resistance, which I you know, it's not really I shouldn't say that way. I don't think of it as causing insulin resistance. I think of it as causing a hormonal shift that makes your blood sugar want to go up and

Ashlyn 1:09:55
I know I've I've definitely noticed that But my thing is that right now, one unit of insulin is dropping me maybe 90 points.

Scott Benner 1:10:05
Wow, how much do you what can I ask you? i? Yeah, I

Ashlyn 1:10:08
feel like 124. Wow.

Unknown Speaker 1:10:11
Yeah, that's crazy.

Ashlyn 1:10:13
Yep. And so for small corrections in the morning, like, I laughed when you were talking about like pediatric dosing and you're not even pulling the syringe because that's that true.

Scott Benner 1:10:22
I am right now that that's cholera. Apparently, it's Colorado dosing. Isn't it funny that this conversation is partly about you getting high and partly about you not being able to stay high. This whole thing's about elevation. Yeah. Can I ask you, as we cop on an hour? Is there anything that we haven't talked about? Because I'm, you have the blind leading the sighted right now, because I really don't know what I should be asking you about? Is there something we haven't talked about?

Ashlyn 1:10:53
Um, no, I really wanted to do this, just because when I started, you know, dabbling in that kind of stuff, there really wasn't any kind of resource for people with diabetes, and people are gonna do this, whether the information is out there or not. And I just, you know, harm reduction.

Scott Benner 1:11:11
That's why I agree with that. 1,000,000%. I think, I think if you're raising, like, if you're a parent right now, and you've got like, a little like, eight year old, I go, you know, Jenny, I don't know, I said, Jenny. Oh, actually, I'm recording with Johnny tomorrow. That's why I think it's just in my head. You know, little Jenny, she's terrific. She's never gonna do anything wrong. And sometimes, you know, she won't, right? She'll just grow up and go on her way. And sometimes your kid's gonna grow up and drink or, you know, smoke or get high or do Do you know, LSD, I know, that doesn't seem like something you think's gonna happen. But here's Ashlyn telling you, she loves it. So, um, you know, could happen. And to pretend that it will never end do not speak of it out loud, is a mistake, because you feel like, well, if I don't talk about it, it won't happen, which is, you know, crazy, because you've never talked to your kids once about having sex, and guess what? You know, so you can't stop it by not talking about it. But you can be certain that if you don't have a situation where people feel like they can communicate that when they do do something like this, or like anything that they're not comfortable talking to you about, you're never gonna find out about it. And then you're not gonna have any ability to help them. And I think as a parent, you can't always think of helping as making them stop, you have to think of helping is giving them enough information that they can do it, whatever it is, without ending up with the you know, a terrible outcome or gonorrhea. So you see, got a, you got to talk about stuff like this. Okay, so let's take this last couple of minutes here. And you give me your playbook for how to do this safely.

Ashlyn 1:12:54
Okay, so the main things that I would stress is, you know, definitely go out and buy a test kit. Right now I have a test kit for anything that I have, you know, I have one for acid, and you can buy them off of Amazon for $15. I have these strips that like you can dip it in whatever you're going to take in, it'll tell you if there's fentanyl in them. You know, you want to protect yourself and somebody wants, I like to remember Somebody once told me that if you know, celebrities are dying from bad drugs, why? Why can't you? Why are you comfortable getting drugs from somebody and not testing them?

Scott Benner 1:13:35
So there are test kits that I can buy? That will tell me if what I'm taking is pure. Is that right?

Ashlyn 1:13:42
Yep. It's called a reagent. The one for acid is called like the Arabic reagent. And you just cut a small piece of whatever you're taking off, or, you know, you put it you drop them on. And then over the course of 15 seconds, it'll either turn purple if it's like, what you want, or it'll turn a different color based on what's actually in there. And I've, you know, I'm glad that I've had them because I've bought stuff and then brought it home tested it and I'm like, well, that's not good.

Scott Benner 1:14:15
And so people cut drugs with other stuff, I guess to make it

Ashlyn 1:14:19
it's it's called like a research chemical. A lot of people do it because it's a lot cheaper to produce and, you know, handout instead of having a $5 manufacturing cost, you have a $2 manufacturing cost and that's profit to these people. And you're just you're just a number.

Scott Benner 1:14:37
Yeah. Gotcha. And so they put stuff in it that cuts it so they have more to sell, and then you go home and makes you separate.

Ashlyn 1:14:44
It might be something completely different. And I've been in situations where you know, I I'm saying this for a reason. I've taken stuff to where, oh, this was supposed to last 12 hours. It's two days now.

Scott Benner 1:15:00
It's Thursday now and I'm still high. And what about? Do? Do narcotics ever end up in it? Or they're just people who are nefarious and just want to screw with people? So they put stuff in it that just doesn't belong there?

Ashlyn 1:15:15
Well, I really couldn't tell you why they do what they do. And I just all I'm saying is you got to protect yourself against it. I don't know. I don't know why anybody would do that. That's not something that you know, makes sense to me. So,

Scott Benner 1:15:30
so yeah, so basically, like your friendly neighborhood drug dealer might not be a great person. They might just have

Unknown Speaker 1:15:36
Yeah, newsflash.

Scott Benner 1:15:39
So I, because I'm imagining and i, you are so like, of this generation, like, You're not even willing to, like, Wonder out loud about what a drug dealer might do? That is nefarious. I really do like that about your generation. I'll do it for you then. So imagine that your drug dealer is a bad guy, and you're buying some mushrooms from him, but he really wishes you were buying heroin from him. Maybe he puts a little something in whatever he's selling you to get you going in a different direction. You come back to him, What are you looking for? And he goes,

Ashlyn 1:16:07
Oh, that that's extreme? Of course it is.

Scott Benner 1:16:10
But you understand that right now there is a 32 year old woman listening to this, who thinks that's exactly what's going to happen to Johnny when he tries mushrooms, right?

Ashlyn 1:16:21
That's a stretch, but you all you can do is really be one step ahead of them. And these tests to protect yourself. Yeah. And like I said, the website that I sent you a link to it's called dance safe. They, they show up at like any major Dance Festival in the US, and they have a little tent. And it's it's basically like no harm, no foul, you show up there with whatever you're taking. And they'll test it for you and give it back to you right on the spot. It just harm reduction. They usually have like a little tent or something. And I see people all the time go over there to get their stuff tested. Because they just they're trying to make sure that you the paramedics have less to deal with that day.

Scott Benner 1:17:06
Yeah, that's such a it really is a I've been through the website twice. And she sent it to me, dance safe.org and it's an organization that just does exactly what national just said. It's really lovely. Actually. Do people use it? Like when you're at the events? Do you see people lined up doing this?

Ashlyn 1:17:26
Oh, yeah. And they're, they're super friendly. I go over there just to talk sometimes. You know, they're, they're people with really good like knowledge base. They sometimes they'll have like the booklets where it's like if you buy like pressed pills or whatever, like look for the yellow school bus that you have, like on there, and it'll tell you if it's real or fake or whatever. And they're no judgement.

Scott Benner 1:17:50
Yeah, look at this cocaine test kits, LSD test kits, MDMA. I really do have something for everything.

Ashlyn 1:17:58
And you know, if it's $15 to save you from a hospital bill or a really bad experience, just do it. Why, especially if you're diabetic.

Scott Benner 1:18:11
You know, I'm gonna sound like a, like a rube for a second. But what is spent in on why do I not want it in my body?

Ashlyn 1:18:18
fentanyl is something that they that drug dealers, it's like, it's basically like super heroin. Oh, it's, yeah, it's they people cut like pressed pills or cocaine or anything like that with fentanyl. It's, it's been linked to like a bunch of people's deaths like Mac Miller, who's like a rapper?

Scott Benner 1:18:40
Yeah. died on that plane, right? No, who am I? Oh,

Unknown Speaker 1:18:44
I don't. Yeah,

Ashlyn 1:18:46
I don't think he died on a plane. He just I can't remember if it was Xanax or what? But he had gotten some kind of pill and they had mixed it with fentanyl. And if you look it up, the lethal dose for fentanyl is not. It's like not even like your fingernail. Okay, it's it's a crazy small amount. And so if anybody mixes that in you're, you're pretty much toast.

Scott Benner 1:19:11
You know, for some reason, I was thinking of juice world.

Unknown Speaker 1:19:13
Juice. Well, how

Scott Benner 1:19:15
did I do that? I don't know. I'm 50. You were like rap? And I was like, I know where I'm at I juice. Well.

Ashlyn 1:19:23
I forget that he died. Yeah. Or he? Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:19:26
he's the one I'm thinking of. May I have this right? He was on a plane with a bunch of drugs, and they got rated and his idea to get rid of them was to take them. I believe that's what happened. You'd have to Google that to make sure that I'm attributing the right person. But yeah, apparently. That's not a great idea. either case, you're looking for other bad ideas. Hey, can you put people at rest or maybe you won't? Do you do any drugs that people will think of is hard, like cocaine, or?

Ashlyn 1:19:56
Yeah, I have in the past. It's Something that, you know, I'm just out here doing. But I have done it. And honestly, the saddest part is once again, alcohol is worse on my system. Your I have an easier time doing harder drugs than alcohol.

Scott Benner 1:20:17
House. Can I ask you I know you're young. And and you are you probably don't realize that because you're as old as you've ever been right now. So it doesn't feel that way. But do you? Do you have any, like mentors that are much older than you? who have been through a lifestyle like the one you've kind of describe today? Because I'm wondering like, is this? How sustainable is this? over decades, not just a year or two? Do you know what I mean? Like,

Ashlyn 1:20:45
oh, I, at my level with not having an addictive personality and using it as like an anniversaries, birthdays, Christmas kind of thing. I really don't see myself having a problem as long as you take those precautions. I do know people who are older and I do have some family that have struggled with drug addiction, drug abuse. But they're still kicking.

Scott Benner 1:21:12
I genuinely from my perspective, and keeping in mind my perspective as a person that doesn't drink or get high. I don't see the difference between what you just said, and me making the point that I know some people who have a wine with dinner three times a week, and I know people who are alcoholics. Like I don't see the difference between that I think there are some people who do things in moderation. And there are some people who don't. And I imagine you can apply that aesthetic to just about anything in life, not just

Ashlyn 1:21:45
Oh, yeah, for sure. I mean, my sometimes when I, when I feel bad about being diabetic, it's gonna sound horrible, but I'll put on my 600 pound life.

Scott Benner 1:21:56
And you're just like, Oh look, because it's just other problems that aren't mine.

Ashlyn 1:22:00
Well, that's complete sugar addiction. And that looks so much worse than anything I experienced in my day to day life with type one. They can't even go take a shower, because they're so addicted to food and sugar. And like, that's not even technically a drug in the society. I mean, now people are starting to realize, okay, yeah, sugar may be as addictive as cocaine. But for some people, you know, I watch people at my job have three cans of coke in a six hour period. And I'm just like, Oh, God,

Scott Benner 1:22:35
I have no pain. Yeah, soda freaks me out. That is actually one of the funny like, that's one of those things. I would never drink soda. Like that has like, a massively crazy day for me would be if I had like a Diet Mountain Dew, and it would be like a 12 ounce can like like, Oh my God, I've done something insane today.

Ashlyn 1:22:57
I see people like I like last week, I saw one of my co workers go and get like one of those large ICS from like the 711. And just drink the whole thing. And I was like, wow, must be nice, huh?

Scott Benner 1:23:11
I listen, I have a hard time disagreeing with you. I think if I drank one of those, my brain would explode. And my heart would start racing. And I think I'm talking myself out of ever believing I should try drugs, because that might really might really, if he's gonna get me,

Ashlyn 1:23:27
honestly, at this point where I'm at mentally, and this is gonna probably sound insane. I judge people a little bit more for stuff like that versus like, Hey, I do psychedelics, maybe three times a year?

Scott Benner 1:23:40
Well, there you go. That is perspective. I mean, that's a perfect place to stop actually, that really is perspective. Because there's somebody right now, who listened to you and thought this was great. I'm glad she did this. I know what to look for. There's somebody who listened to us and just thought, oh, squirrels out of control. And they're literally standing there thinking that with their hand, like halfway down a potato chip bag drink. That's

Ashlyn 1:24:00
what I definitely didn't want to hear. I don't want to be that person who's, you know, drugs are cool. Okay. Hey, that's not what I'm trying to do. No,

Scott Benner 1:24:10
no, I think you've done a great thing. Like I really do. I think that the way you described it earlier, that people are going to do what people are going to do and information is power, and that they need to have it.

Ashlyn 1:24:21
Right. If this saves 117 year old kid from you know, going to the hospital because he took something that he shouldn't have. Yeah, then I'm happy.

Scott Benner 1:24:32
Yeah, I have to tell you that. To me, these episodes feel the same way as talking about diabetes aimia, which is there are people who tell you like don't talk about it, because you'll teach people how to use their insulin or not use their insulin to have to facilitate this eating disorder. Right. And I think, boy, that makes sense. Like, it really does like is there someone out there right now who doesn't know what it is and you explain it to them and then they go do it because now they have the explanation. I guess that's a, it's an argument that could be made. But I just think that the greater good is served by people having knowledge.

Ashlyn 1:25:10
No, I'm 100% there with you. I mean, I feel like if the, if the knowledge was more readily available, I would have saved myself so many weird, bad times, you know, and I just, I want to save people some time by saying, you know, this is possible. But let's make sure that we have everything in place. And that if something does happen, you can say, you know, I got this, even if I don't feel right, right now, I have the tools and I'm capable.

Scott Benner 1:25:41
Alright. Well, I appreciate you doing this. I really do. Because I know that I know that I probably to some people, they probably think that I'm full of crap, right that like, you know, why would Why would a person who's doesn't drink doesn't get high? doesn't smoke, have people talking about stuff like this on a podcast, I can see people who would just think that I'm saying I don't do those things. And I do. But I really don't like I just never have and, but I do really see the value in other people understanding and I have long believed that overarching Lee, in the diabetes community, what I've seen is people talking about very kind of surface things that in the end don't end up being super valuable to people. And I just always wanted to bring them information that I thought would be really valuable. So it was very cool that you reached out to do this. And and I just I can't thank you enough because it was it was it was brave of you to say that even though you're 100 you're 100% telling me like I do this once in a while, a couple times a year. But you know, you know, not everybody's gonna hear it that way. So I really appreciate this. Thank you.

Ashlyn 1:26:54
Yeah, no problem. I mean, if if people want to feel that way, and want to be judgmental that's on them, but I don't I don't live in that space. You know, I'm very active and open about what I have going on. And I feel no shame whatsoever. It's made me who I am today, and I can't think it enough. Honestly,

Scott Benner 1:27:12
it's beautiful. It really is. I want to wish you a ton of luck with your pump. I think you're gonna like it a lot. And I really hope that you would doesn't have to be a podcast. But if you could let me know if the pumps able to get ahead of the the altitude thing, or if the altitude thing seems to change. You live there longer, though. I can't imagine. I mean, that just seems strange to me. But I'd love to know how that resolves. Actually,

Ashlyn 1:27:37
yeah, me too. I mean, I really can't find any information about this online at all. I honestly thought I was going crazy at the beginning,

Scott Benner 1:27:46
the best I can tell you is that I've had more people than I can count, reach out and tell me they've gone to Colorado and required significantly less insulin. And the higher they go, the worse it gets. But I've never been able to come up with any real explanations for it. Oh, wow. So I'm sorry.

Ashlyn 1:28:04
Yo, no, it honestly this happened in September. And honestly, it's been six months of just re building confidence and trying to remake a playbook to something.

Scott Benner 1:28:16
Yeah, no, I I seriously want to wish you luck. Even if you just think to send me an email six months from now. I'd love to know how it worked out for you.

Ashlyn 1:28:24
Yep, I definitely will. I actually also scheduled an appointment with integrated diabetes. And that's tomorrow. Oh, so I'm gonna have like a pre pump. I guess consult with them and then go see my actual endo in person on Tuesday to do this

Scott Benner 1:28:41
very cool. Who you're doing it with it? integrated?

Ashlyn 1:28:44
It's not Jenny.

Unknown Speaker 1:28:45
It's some.

Ashlyn 1:28:46
It's another lady.

Scott Benner 1:28:48
I think I might have made Jenny a very popular person. So

Ashlyn 1:28:52
I figured as much I didn't request her specifically because I'm like, she's

Unknown Speaker 1:28:55
probably booked. She

Scott Benner 1:28:56
is I'm starting to have trouble getting her. So she's definitely doing well. I wish you luck. I think that's really smart. It's interesting. You're literally doing the same thing with your pumping that you did with your mushroom and you're like, let me just do a test run first before I get right into this. Your person? No, I'm

Ashlyn 1:29:14
a big preparer. That's why I logged on 10 minutes early. Cuz I gotta I gotta be ready.

Scott Benner 1:29:20
That's insane. That's exactly right. Like, I jumped on this. People wouldn't know that. Like I jumped on this really early, hoping that no one's ever early. But I was like, oh, it would help me today. If it was earlier. So in there you are. So I like your pre planning. It's, it's, it's exactly why you I think you thought to reach out about this topic. So very apropos.

Ashlyn 1:29:41
Mm hmm. All right, for sure. Thank you so much.

Scott Benner 1:29:43
Thank you. First, I want to genuinely thank Ashlyn for coming on and sharing her story. It takes a lot to tell people Hey, I do something that You might think is weird, or strange or questionable, but I think is completely normal. So judgments aside, because that's what I like, I like not judging people. You know, honestly, I don't see this any different than the how we eat episodes, right? Somebody wants to eat pescatarian What do I care, low carb, cool, whatever. I'm just interested in people's stories and what they do feel like that helps everyone who's listening. So anyway, thanks so much Ashlyn for coming on the show. Thank you on the pod Dexcom and dancing for diabetes for sponsoring this episode. You can check out that free no obligation demo of the Omni pod or look into the free 30 day trial the Omni pod dash at my Omni pod.com forward slash juice box, get yourself a Dexcom g six continuous glucose monitor@dexcom.com forward slash juice box both of these products are perfect for anyone using insulin. And of course, touched by type one is doing amazing things for people living with type one diabetes, and you should check them out on Facebook, Instagram, or at touched by type one.org. Can't remember those links. They're all at Juicebox Podcast comm or right there in the show notes of the podcast player that you're listening in right now. And if you'd like to find the rest of the afterdark series, go to Juicebox podcast.com. Scroll down scrolling and there it is afterdark audio diabetes topics that no one else talks about. They're all right there. And if you think you have a story that would work for the afterdark series, send me an email and let's find out. Lastly, I hope you enjoyed the episode. I really appreciate your listening and the support you guys give the show. When listeners share the show with others it is how it grows. And it's how we get these great stories. Thank you so much. Hope you have a great day. I'll talk to you soon.

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