#519 Sunk Cost Fallacy with David Copeland, Ph.D.

David Copeland, Ph.D. is the father of a child with type 1 diabetes and a professor of Psychology.

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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends and welcome to Episode 519 of the Juicebox Podcast.

On today's episode, I'll be speaking with David Copeland David is the father of a child with Type One Diabetes. But that is not nearly why he's on the show today. David is also an associate professor of psychology at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas. And he's kind enough to be on the show today to answer a few of my questions. Not the least of which is what is sunk cost fallacy. Now, don't stop your player. Don't go oh sunk cost fallacy with Scott What? Just stick with me on this one. Okay. It's an interesting look into how our minds work, and how maybe they impact us when we make decisions about things like I don't know, life stuff, or maybe even diabetes. While you're listening, please remember that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, please always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan. We're becoming bold with insulin. I promise you this will be interesting. I promise sunk cost fallacy and other things.

This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is brought to you by touched by type one, a wonderful organization helping people with type one diabetes, learn more about them at touched by type one.org. Or you can find them on Facebook, and Instagram. Before we start, I want to remind you that if you're a US resident living with Type One Diabetes, or a US resident who is the caregiver of someone with type one, I would love it, if you'd go to the T one D exchange and fill out their survey. It's at T one d exchange.org. forward slash juicebox. Others who have done this already have contributed to their registry. And because they share their experiences over the past two years that he won the exchange has gathered the stories of nearly 15,000 people to better understand how the community is doing overall. And in the future. They'll identify trends and improve T one D care with the answers to the survey that you can give. You can give those answers at T one d exchange.org. forward slash juicebox. When you do that, you're going to be helping research for type one diabetes. And you'll be helping me a little bit because I'm going to get a little bit of money every time one of you signs up. T one d exchange.org. forward slash juicebox. I've done it It took me about seven minutes. And it really was super easy, completely HIPAA compliant. totally anonymous. The questions were not difficult. I did it on my phone. You could also do it on your computer. It's not a big deal won't take long at all. Alright, let's get to David, and talk about how your brain works. And how it sometimes it tries to fool you.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 3:11
My name is David Copeland. I'm a professor at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas, otherwise, typically known as you nlv. I've been a professor there for about 15 years now and I originally got my degree from the University of Notre Dame.

Scott Benner 3:25
You know, I said to my wife that you went to you and Lv and she looked right through me. And I thought for a minute thought and I was like, she doesn't watch college basketball. no memory of the right and rebel. Because if she would have grown up when I grew up, and I said you lie to her, she would have been like, yes, also, I believe Randall Cunningham son is a quarterback there, right?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 3:46
I not aware about the son, but I know Randall was Randall

Scott Benner 3:51
tech. Yeah. And I'm from Philly. So Randall Cunningham was the first like, real athletic quarterback in the league. In my opinion. Some may argue Warren moon, but you'd be wrong. Sun Moon was more of a thrower. So yeah, I know. I'm just telling you, Randall Cunningham. I saw Randall Cunningham do things that would just like fry your mind like leap over men who were standing up or get knocked down to basically do a push up to keep themselves off the ground, pop back up and throw the ball 90 yards and

David Copeland, Ph.D. 4:22
one new i think i think i remember some of those. I'm visualizing right now.

Scott Benner 4:27
absolutely insane. One time it was third down and we were trapped in our own end zone. And they had him punt. So who even know you can do that you can apparently punt whenever you want to. And it's third down he punts from our end zone. I believe it's the longest punt in NFL history. Get like rolled out at the wall. Yeah, cuz no one is back there probably kept rolling. No one was thinking he was gonna pump but he like really struck the ball. Well is my point. The man was an athlete, as I'm saying. And you went over and that's why my wife didn't understand what I was saying. So anyway, I really appreciate you doing this. I am going to tell you for a moment that your response made me feel like warm about the podcast. Because I had this feeling like I was like, I wonder what I couldn't wish for that might not happen. Like because yours is a real? Like I said online like it, can anyone come on and talk about sunk cost fallacy and I was like, no one's gonna respond. And then there you are. On a nerd like me. Excellent happens to know that, to be honest, you saw it, where you're like, finally, I'm being called on.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 5:39
Well, at first I thought, you know, I was in a different, you know, Facebook group or something like that, you know, for, you know, teaching related issues or something like that. And so then I was like, Oh, wait, no, this is juice.

Scott Benner 5:51
So when you? You know what I'm asking this question later. First, tell me what your connection to type one is.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 5:57
My daughter who is currently three years old, it was diagnosed as a type one diabetic at age of 14 months. So So we've been dealing with this for about two years now.

Scott Benner 6:08
Wow. That's pretty damn young.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 6:12
Yeah, so are and when we first met with them, he said, I've seen younger, but not very often.

Scott Benner 6:18
I mean, I don't know that you're trying to win that race. But you're pretty close. That's although i think i think there's a woman who gave birth to a baby that had type one. I can't I can't get that story straight or fine. seem to find her. But I've heard some crazier stories. But I mean, Arden was, you know, just turned two. And I remember feeling like she was, you know, a fetus though. Like she was so little.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 6:44
Oh, yeah. She's, I mean, it was tough at first, you know, seeing her in the hospital with, especially all the tubes and wires, you know, attached and everything when they first admitted her. But she has been a champ throughout this whole process. And you know, she'll have a little bit of resistance here and there. But she's, she's really good in terms of, you know, she knows it's time for your shot, for example, and she'll point to where she wants it. And, Wow, she's ready to go. No,

Scott Benner 7:10
not there. Over here, buddy. Right here. Arden does the same thing. I'm like, hey, it's time for a pump. And you can see her looking around herself. I don't know if anybody makes like, if that makes sense that actually what am I saying? everyone listening knows it makes sense to them. But I can see Arden kind of visualizing her body and she then she kind of chooses a place. So only child, your 17th kid like where does she fall in the family.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 7:33
She's our first child. And we read this past year, we have a son. He's now about nine months old. And so far, he's showing those signs. But as he's only nine months old, so we're keeping our fingers crossed and hoping for the best with

Scott Benner 7:47
David, obviously, the magic number is 14. So you can't you oddly feel that way. Like you have to get past 14 months.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 7:55
Oh, I know that it can happen in pretty much any time. And so so it's one of those things that we just you're just gonna progress through life. And it might happen and it might not.

Scott Benner 8:06
So it's just one of those things you have to accept. You don't have that kind of unrealistic idea. Like my dad had a heart attack when he was 46. And I'm gonna have like, you don't feel like that?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 8:15
I don't think we think of it as inevitable I think you can think of is in terms of probabilities. And that Yeah, because you know, sibling has it has diabetes, that there's a maybe increased probability of the second child having it as well. But I don't see it as inevitable or once we get past the marker, we're fine. You know, right. It's just always one of those things where Yeah, it's there's a chance.

Scott Benner 8:41
No, I I think that's a I think that's the right way to think about it. I just think that people's minds sometimes jump to you know, they started seeing connections that don't exist, and then they start believing in them. But

David Copeland, Ph.D. 8:52
oh, yeah, our minds, our minds like to put things together. That's why that's why there's conspiracy theories.

Scott Benner 8:58
Yeah, no, you don't. You don't think all that stuff didn't really happen to you? I like I like hearing about the, the UFOs. And I don't I can tell you that for certain. I don't know, if they're, you know, flying saucers and people from other planets and stuff like that. I have no idea that really very well could be in there very well might not be. But I know when people talk about it. It's fascinating to listen to them speak about it, because they have they have built in all of these like, well, you know how you can really tell? And they're like, well, what you just said doesn't have anything to do with reality. But okay.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 9:30
Well, that just there's been some recent reports out of the government that they're, they're saying that there are unidentified objects being reported by Navy pilots and things like that. They're actually admitting to this. But the key idea here is that it's literally an unidentified object. It's not saying it's a UFO with little green men in it. But that's where people's minds automatically jump to. Yeah, but the connections together, you really

Scott Benner 9:51
only have to read the first three sentences of anything that the government said or the news story to realize that what they're telling you is there's something moving around We think, and we're not sure what it is. Thank you. What a revelation.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 10:06
These things are funny though, because if you look back in history back before their aircraft, you know, people, when people see things up in the sky, they thought they were witches or something like that. And so it's all a matter of you know, what our current belief system and society, you know, has in their pop culture views.

Scott Benner 10:22
Yeah, I do love it. When you start hearing people give you reasons, and I'm making air quotes. You can't see me and neither can anybody else. And you're like, I think that's the plot of a movie I saw made is what you just said there. You know, wouldn't it be crazy if this happened? I'm like, I think it did happen. I think Steven Spielberg directed it, I think, I think you're confusing your thoughts with something you've seen before as a child. But nevertheless, and I like I said, honestly, and I'm not just like playing both sides of the argument. If I looked out the window, and a flying saucer landed, and people got off, and I'd be like, Huh, no, Kevin, like, I'm not telling you it couldn't happen. I'm just saying, I love hearing people talk about

David Copeland, Ph.D. 11:00
it really, I think one of the cool things about is that it really connects to my field, because it really kind of illustrates the idea that we don't always see things that are real out there. We over interpret things in our minds, and we place meaning on things that might be very meaningless, because, you know, we want to see patterns, we want to see, you know, make sense of the world. And so we just, we don't like things that were that are just two seemingly random.

Scott Benner 11:28
So I I feel like if I understand correctly, that the concept of sunk cost fallacy can be considered from two pretty specific points of view, right, like, from an economic point of view, an economics point of view, and from a psychological is that about fair?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 11:49
Yeah, and I think I think the two areas, you know, overlap quite a bit. But it's the basic idea of sunk cost fallacy is that we don't necessarily make a decision based on what's logical OR rational, or in our best interest based on the current moment, we also will bring into play factors or behaviors or experiences or things we've done in the past, and bring it into the the current decision. So So yeah, so it's not just a rational, logical computer, you know, making a decision based on the current pieces of information. It's bringing past for lack of a better term baggage into play as well.

Scott Benner 12:29
So is this something that is just the thing you see sometimes in people, or is it just incredibly common amongst everyone?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 12:39
It's, it's actually pretty common. Now. We're in psychology, a lot of times when we talk in generalities, we're talking about patterns that we see. So we test a group of 100 people, and we see this pattern amongst 60 of them or something like that. So. So yeah, we're not saying it's going to happen to each and every person in each and every circumstance. But we're saying it's a pretty common pattern that you see, yeah,

Scott Benner 13:01
you can kind of isn't it interesting to say this before I say the other thing, that you can see something like this in another person, and very, very frequently cannot see it yourself at all?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 13:14
Oh, yeah. We were not the best judge judges of and evaluators of ourselves and our own performance. And in abilities, we tend to be a little bit biased. And it led us to be a little bit more on the optimistic side of things. But, but yeah, we can be a little bit more realistic, and, and I think, unbiased when it comes to looking at other people and evaluating them. So yes, sometimes it's a lot easier to see it in someone else.

Scott Benner 13:45
So I just the generalized, made up example of a sunk cost would be I bought a plane ticket. And I bought boots, and a stick to climb with and a hat to keep the sun out of my eyes. And when I get to the mountain, and it looks like it's going to erupt, I'm still climbing it anyway. Because I put all this effort into getting here when common sense would tell you, this hill you were planning on climbing now looks like a volcano and we should run away.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 14:11
Yeah, I mean, I think you've nailed it on the head that, you know, if you just take in this snapshot of the moment, you're there, you arrive that morning at the mountain, and you're deciding, am I going to climb it? Or am I not going to climb it? The rational choices if it's going to erupt? Or there's horrible weather or whatnot, is to say no, it's not worth it, I might get hurt or even die, you know, in this endeavor. Whereas the sunk cost fallacy basically brings along all these things that you've done beforehand, such as buying those plane tickets, you've invested all this planning all this time, all this all these resources, all this money. And so you said to yourself, I put all this into it, I'm going to do Oh, anyway.

Scott Benner 14:50
So when you notice that the person asking about this wasn't on a teaching website, it was about this is the thing you follow for type one diabetes, which by the way, we'll talk about later and I appreciate your following But did you immediately understand why he asked?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 15:07
For me, it was one of those where I'm thinking to myself, okay, what's, you know, one of the cool parts about a lot of these biases that we talked about within psychology and cognition, is that there are applications to them. Otherwise, it's, you know, what's the point of talking about them, if you if the, you know, if it's not happening in real life, and so so, you know, I'm racking my brain a little bit, you know, thinking myself, okay, what's the application here? What's the kind of perspective here, and so one of the things you look at is, you know, I can see it from a perspective of maybe the approach someone takes to treating diabetes. So for example, maybe they're investing themselves and their time, energy and effort into a certain way of treatment. And then maybe there it comes a point where maybe they learn from someone else, or from their doctors, or from another source, that maybe there's a different way, maybe just even a tweak or a completely different way to to approach things. And they might be hesitant to make a change, because of all the time and energy and effort that they have already put into the prior

Scott Benner 16:13
approach. So yeah, and it for me, it struck me but but I started thinking about, I don't remember why I was thinking about it one day. And I thought, This is what I see with people who have had Type One Diabetes for decades. And it might be that I tried to help a person who had had type one for like, 30 years or more. And they wanted a change. Like they didn't, they couldn't take what was happening anymore. And had reached out to me privately. And I said, I I'd be happy to see if I can say something that, you know, might make sense. And it didn't matter what I said or what I suggested, or how I explained it. It was every time met with No, that won't work, or I can't do that, or this isn't right. And I finally just said, like, you know, you asked me, this is my opinion, like, it's cool. If you don't like it, you know what I mean? Like, I'm alright with if you don't want to do it is I'm not here to push myself on you. I was trying to help. But why can't you make the leap? And it was fascinating, because everything they were doing was leading to these like failures, but they weren't dying, you know what I mean? Like they were existing? Yeah, couldn't break away from it. And

David Copeland, Ph.D. 17:31
I think, you know, what you have coming into play is, you know, can maybe, you know, put, I'm not trying to diagnose it, per se, but I can say, you know, some of the difference

Scott Benner 17:41
is David just got a lot of a lot of electric noise from you. I couldn't hear what you said, What happened there? He said, What comes into play? And then you were gone?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 17:53
Can you hear me now? Yes. Okay. What comes into play here is potentially a number of different biases or heuristics, you know, that, that we you know, identify it from a psychological perspective. You know, there can be something for examples, such as the confirmation bias. Confirmation bias is a big one where we let our prior beliefs influence, you know, what we learn. And so essentially, this is why it's very hard to change people's views on a lot of things. Because when you, for example, teach them something or expose them to new information, if it doesn't fit nicely into their prior worldview, they sort of ignore that new pieces of information, and maybe only pick up the pieces that fit into that prior worldview, okay, and so, so people just basically want to confirm their existing beliefs rather than challenge them. And so, so learning new information or new approach can sometimes threaten that. And so, so that's one of the reasons why people kind of, you know, will dig in their heels, you also have the idea that our brains are somewhat lazy, for lack of a better term. You know, our brains require energy, just like the rest of our body, you know, we don't, if we don't have to, we don't necessarily want to get up and run five miles if we don't have to. And so the, you know, our brains kind of a similar manner, where if it doesn't have to think too hard, it's going to want to think in in very, the path of least resistance, if you will, and usually that's going to be in doing a habit or an approach that you're very familiar with, and you're gonna stick to it.

Scott Benner 19:28
Interesting. So the, the, you can look at a person and they physically appear to you like someone who's like, I'm just not gonna try very hard. This is working well enough. But there's an actual physiological component to that, which is, I don't have to expend too is that to save your energy in case you have to run from a tiger or something, or

David Copeland, Ph.D. 19:47
Yeah, I mean, like I said, it's just kind of an idea of, you know, our bodies just you know, want to, you know, just the same way we conserve energy from running you know, our brains gonna possibly conserve energy from overthinking if it doesn't have to. Wow So, you know, our brains an organ just like any other parts of our body?

Scott Benner 20:04
Is there a cut off where people, generally speaking, Don't Want to learn more? Like what like, because, as you were saying that all I could think was like, why would you want to not hear another idea? Or the truth? Or, you know, or whatever, like, I mean, if I, if I thought something for years that I was, like wrong about, I'd want to hear about it. And I understand it would be uncomfortable for somebody to challenge something, because you probably, I'm assuming your brain starts doing that thing. And you start thinking about kind of subconsciously, all the decisions you've made based off of this idea. How many times have I been wrong in the past, like wanting to not be wrong? Like I get all that, but it is,

David Copeland, Ph.D. 20:44
I think the key idea is they don't think of themselves as wrong, necessarily, because the past behaviors or approaches have been good enough. And so to them, it's like, well, why mess with it? You know, I know what I'm doing here. And a lot of times people have hesitancy about making changes, because they're afraid of they take action to alter their behaviors or alter their approach. And then let's say a problem occurs, they're going to feel really bad that they were the direct cause of it, because they didn't stick to their prior approach is that well, this never would have happened if I just stuck with my old approach.

Scott Benner 21:19
So if we all just keep our hand, our heads buried in the sand, then there's no problem. Wow. And that's how a lot of personal relationships ended up going. Right? Like, nobody wants to talk about anything for fear that it will explode the situation instead of heal it.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 21:33
Yeah, it's more of the thing that why rock the boat because it could create something worse. And you know, but in real reality, you know, if there's data out there that, for example, it shows that maybe that new approach is more probably, from a probability perspective, much more likely to lead to better outcomes. Our brains are most people, you know, don't think in terms of data and probabilities. We're not that good at that. And, you know, we can think that way, if we, you know, put ourselves you know, put our thinking hats on and say, okay, you know, I want to digest the numbers I want to think of from a rational perspective, but that takes a lot of energy and efforts. You made me think of

Scott Benner 22:14
the the idea of Moneyball for data driven baseball training. Like, like, if somebody came up to you and said, Hey, you know, your favorite team is going to try swinging in a different launch angle. Now we're going to see what happens. I don't know why people don't go Hmm, I wonder what would happen if they did that? Let me say, like, why do they feel so much? like no, you can't change that. That's not what baseball is. And like, I don't know, just understanding the angle your bats at versus not understanding the angle your bats that doesn't change baseball, again, might change your approach. And maybe you'd find out later that it doesn't work for you. But I don't understand the the unwillingness to even allow change, it's something that doesn't really impact you even

David Copeland, Ph.D. 22:56
it lets it's really just it, I think it's it's, that's a good, good analogy, because it took a while for other baseball organizations to really switch over into that Moneyball type of a mindset. A lot of teams were very resistant for a while. And even when the you know, the Moneyball team started winning more, they were still, you know, digging in their heels, because this is like, no, my, I've been doing this for years, I know how baseball works. And this is the way I'm going to approach it, I'm going to, you know, we steal bases, we hit for singles, you know, things like that, and we don't get anything, you know, you're not supposed to take walks, you know, those all those types of things, you know, from the old school baseball, that was just how they did it. And that was the approach. And they kind of scoffed at the new ideas, and people who did make the switch benefited from it.

Scott Benner 23:47
And so agreeing that maybe it's agreeing that something that you don't understand might be better makes you obsolete.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 23:55
And then, and, you know, and you know, it's it's a whole new world, in some regards, like I said, the executives in baseball today, they're all looking at things from a analytical perspective, they're crunching the numbers, they're making the decisions about which guys to retain on their team or design a free agency. And, you know, maybe which pitches for pitchers to throw more often and stuff like that. They're using data for that. And, you know, people wouldn't think otherwise nowadays, but you know, 10 2015 years ago, that just wasn't the approach for most individuals. And their worldview was, Oh, no, you don't throw that many curveballs, it's off, you know, fastball and slider, you know, and that's it, you know, or something like that. And you keep your to your to bread and butter pitches and whatnot. And that was just that was the worldview that was the way they viewed the game from that. Those are their core principle values. And if you're going to come in with the data perspective, that was going to change those core values, and people don't want to make that overhaul in their heads.

Scott Benner 24:59
I think That, um, the interesting thing is that they act like it will be the disillusion of the thing they're talking about, like, it will just disappear. But I think I don't, I'm gonna, I'm gonna show here that I didn't go to college in a second. But there's this kind of thought exercise, right? Like if, if you leave ashore on a ship, and through the course of your travel, there's another ship next to you that has all the parts. So every part that your ship is made out of, is on another ship next to you have a spare part ship. And through the travel of your of your, your time, you ended up replacing every part on the ship during the the, you know, the trip, did you arrive in the same ship that you left it? Right and everything? There's a that's a it's like, I'm sure you'd studied that when you were nine, right? What is that? I guess? Yeah. But is it called?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 25:54
Well, it's just the idea of, you know, kind of slow, steady changes. And, you know, and sometimes that is an easier way to do things, especially when people are resistant to overhauling the whole way they approach something, you know, it's kind of like, if it's like that death by 1000 paper cuts kind of an idea. Where if you just make slow, incremental changes that people won't resist, because they seem so small and minor, that you can eventually keep adding on top of each one, you know, each of the previous ones still, eventually you've made significant change. The drawback, too, is it takes a while to do that. And you have to be steady and consistent with it. But but it can be a way to avoid upsetting people who are having their core beliefs challenged, and then resisting it with everything they can, you know, muster.

Scott Benner 26:45
So is the use of I've heard people say that, you know, as far as progress goes, that you're born, you know, there's sort of that like, like, how do you explain it the best like, like everybody thought there'd be peace in the world because of the hippies in the 60s, right. But now the hippies in the 60s all have like $2 million in the bank, and they're getting ready to retire. So they stop their fight somewhere, and they're off doing this other thing. So there's this idea that you have this, this youthful exuberance to change the world through your teens and your early 20s. But then at some point, you make a baby and the baby needs to be safe. And then you sort of, you know, you keep moving down that, that that path until your best interests don't look like things changing or improving. And so you hear people say, Well, yeah, we'll we'll get that fixed when this generation dies off. And they stop resisting it, is that really just how it has to be? it? Well,

David Copeland, Ph.D. 27:47
it doesn't necessarily have to be, you know, that extreme per se. But I think one of the things that, you know, kind of, you know, just kind of fits into this whole, you know, idea that you just described is just the idea that, when we're younger, we don't have so many habits, if you will, or ways of thinking that are so ingrained over decades. Whereas as we grow older, as adults, we start really establishing this, these mindsets and these habits, and these approach ways of approaching issues in life. And we're really ingraining them and as long as they're working good enough, we're gonna stick with them.

Scott Benner 28:23
Yeah, I, I keep myself honest, by listening to rap music, because I am not inclined to enjoy it. And yet my son likes it. And I figure he must know, like, he wouldn't be listening to something that's terrible. And, you know, you always think of like, you know, at some point, I mean, the way I think is, you know, at some point, somebody's parents were yelling at somebody because they were listening to Elvis Presley, right? And then and then it was Pink Floyd. And then it was Aerosmith. And then it was Metallica and Guns and Roses, and that it's whatever it is now. And so I think to myself, to try to keep that muscle limber, I, I listened to pop smoke and other rap.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 29:04
I mean, I think I think what you're getting at with that idea is it's you're really getting at the idea of whether things are unfamiliar to someone, and whether exposure gradually leads to more familiarity to, to an idea. And when you become more familiar with an idea, it's that is It's not scary anymore. You know, when you don't know anything about, you know, know anything about a topic, you know, it can be really scary, you know, if, let's say, for example, the metric system is, you know, something, you know, if for people, you know, 50 years ago, you know, when the when the metric system was, you know, when they're making attempts to you know, convert people to it. Those who were not at all familiar with it, maybe didn't get it at all in their early schooling. Were just like, Oh, hey, what are you talking about metric and I'm using, you know, ounces and you know, pounds and miles per hour, I'm fine with that stuff. Let's not make any changes. Whereas people maybe who have a little more exposure, you know, let's say maybe Our generation where we've grown up, and we learn about grams and kilograms in school and meters. And maybe we're not using that all the time, but at least we're we have more familiarity with it. So we might not be as scared of that type of concept. If everyone, you know, third proposal out there, yeah, let's start making the conversion of metric system really, you'd be like, Oh, well, yeah, I guess I see liter bottles, you know, in the store, you know, not all that. It's not always just gallons. And so you have a little bit more familiarity with something. And so it's a little less scary to you, because you've been exposed to it.

Scott Benner 30:33
I always when I'm imagining endocrinologist hearing the show, I always imagine that it either falls on someone who thinks, Oh, that makes sense, even though it's not what I usually say, let me hear more what you hear from people, or it falls on, you know, the we don't change, this is how I do it. And I don't want to hear anything different. That won't work. And that's, I mean, partially why ash to come on and talk about it's partially because I believe that more endocrinologists are listening to the show. Now, it's partially because I think that people have had type one for many decades might be rigid about new ideas. And it's also about, listen, I want to be in the heads of people who right now are on the cutting edge, like the bleeding edge of how to take care of their diabetes, because I'm telling you all that five years from now, you know, 10 years from now, there's going to be something else, and there's going to be a better way to do it. There's always going to be a better way. And you I am in my heart, I want to I want to know the better way, as long as I can. Like, you know what I mean? Like, don't get me wrong. If I'm at five at one point, I'm like, Listen, I got to stick with this music player, because this new thing you kids got, that's a hologram. I can't make my fingers work. Like I'll stop at some point. But But I just think you need to, for your health. Stay on the edge of what this is?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 32:00
Well, yeah, and I think the the 85 year old example is kind of a good one, too. Because maybe at that age, you want those well established patterns and habits, you know, because if you're showing any type of cognitive decline, you don't want to, you know, to be sitting there thinking, Oh, what was this new approach is that, you know, do I do this, that or this, you know, and you don't want them overthinking it, and forgetting, you know, important steps, and maybe just following that routine is good for them. But for people younger, yeah, I think an openness to new experiences can be a very good thing. You had mentioned doctors as well. And I think there's two important perspectives to take on that. Number one, doctors can be just like the rest of us, they can, you know, cling to that prior worldview, those previous beliefs that they maybe learned earlier, and they, you know, hold their ground and stick to those even when there's new evidence out there. And then another perspective is, and this is something I'm seeing more, you know, in college classes is I'm seeing more pre med students taking psychology classes, because of the emphasis that they can have great advice, but if they don't take human nature and human, you know, psychology into account, they might not convince us or convey teach us how to do things in a way in which we're actually going to follow through and do that. I mean, a doctor can tell a patient Yeah, you need to lose weight. That doesn't mean the patient's gonna go home and lose weight, they have to present that to them in a way that's going to motivate them and get them to actually implement a plan.

Scott Benner 33:28
Yeah, so it's not just enough? Well, that's really something I brought up with. One of the psychologists that I had on the show recently might not be out yet. I'm not sure. Where I said, like, it's nice that we're getting together and talking about this stuff. But you know, most people don't put it into practice, right? Like, it's, it's, it became popular because of the internet, like, I'll get together, and I'll give you the 10 steps to make your sex life better. You know, like that started back in magazines. And you know, I'll do this, it doesn't mean somebody reads and goes, Oh, yeah, I'll do all these things. I do want my sex life to be better. Like, it's not how it happens. And when these things get more and more difficult, I think sometimes these conversations can serve to make people feel worse instead of help them because they're like, Oh, so you're telling me there is an answer. And I'm not taking it. And so it makes you feel like not only you're doing something wrong, but then somebody gave you the answer, and you ignored it, you almost feel like you're doing it wrong twice. So the idea, you know what I mean, the idea of getting someone to something is much more important than the something out if that makes sense.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 34:31
Well, and it's part of it, too, is Yeah, people just won't typically just change on a whim. They're like, you give them piece of information. They're Okay, I'll change you know, I'm there. And you're like, oh, wow, that was easy. It doesn't really work like that. Typically, you have to have the individual want or really want or need to make a change in order to really follow through, they need that little you know, kind of motivation to it. And, you know, and also you got to make it easy on an individual. You know, if there's There are barriers in the way you like, you know, it's like the whole idea of like with weight loss, if you still fill your fridge up with, you know, cookies and cakes and ice cream, you know, you're gonna walk past that fridge in the kitchen, and you might have the belief that, hey, I'm going to lose weight. But you know, that barrier of it being right there in front of you, you know, as the temptation is probably going to be too much to pass up. So you really have to get it to the point where someone really wants to make that change that, hey, you know, what, what I'm doing is good enough. But this could be really significant better. And I want to make, you know, improve my health, or my child's health to the point where I'm going to follow through and, you know, expose myself to these new ideas and implement them, right,

Scott Benner 35:43
sort of the, the people get kind of caught up in kind of that zero sum thinking, I guess, where, like, I have an idea, my ideas, the idea. There's no other idea, like, leave me alone. That's the end of it. I mean, when we see it, I mean, listen, I don't care what side of the argument you're on politically, you're, we're all being manipulated. And I'm not saying it like, it's some, you know, like, there's UFOs, what I'm saying is that, that it's marketing, right, everything is marketing. As soon as someone figured out marketing, we were all in trouble. Because Because someone figured out to say something to you, or to choose something from your childhood, or to you know, ignite one of those, those fires inside of you, that makes you defend an idea because you think baseball is going to be ruined by something. And then people who are trying to get you to cast a vote or buy a soft drink or something like that can reach into your brains and, and drive you in a direction that that you might not want to be in, if you were left on your own to stand at the mountain and say, Okay, I'm here, it was my intention to climb up the mountain, but it's on fire. So I'm going to go home.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 36:58
And that's one of the interesting things about that topic. And that issue is that you can use those powers for good or bad if you you know, depending on your perspective, you know, if you think of, for example, marketing, or maybe even tech companies, how they make our smartphones, so addictive nowadays, you know, you would say, okay, they're using those powers for evil, if you will. But we can use a lot of those same principles for good, when you're talking about changing our behaviors, you know, a lot of the things, for example, with their smartphones is based on very simplistic behavioral types of issues such as like, you know, like our, our smartphones almost work like slot machines, if you will, in that you get random bouts of force alert, or some kind of new new announcement or something like that from one of your apps. And by doing that, it makes it more addictive. And you can't put it down just like someone who's at a slot machine. And every once in a while it gives you a when you get that victory, and it once makes you keep going. And so so yeah, you have those little things. And we can use some of the same things with us. Like, for example, one simple thing you can do with when you're trying to change your own behavior, is if you successfully do it, reward yourself, you know, give yourself a simple reward, you know, for doing something, you know, do something that you've always wanted to do, or make a purchase you wanted to make or go on a trip or whatever it was, and your bed, essentially, it's just like, you know, giving that dog a treat after they successfully rolled over. You're doing it to yourself, you're basically rewarding yourself and increasing the odds, you're gonna do it again. Hmm.

Scott Benner 38:29
So take the way that that manufacturer manipulates you and manipulate yourself to do something good.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 38:37
Yeah, that's me, it's almost as simple as that. I mean, obviously, they're using algorithms and, you know, and in technology tools to to implement that. But But yeah, you know, we can do this, you know, similar basic things in our own lives.

Scott Benner 38:53
I guess that's what a chore chart is for a kid, right? Like, you fill in the line. And when you get to the end, you take a toy out of the thing or whatever, you get to go somewhere to a restaurant or whatever it ends up being. And so yeah,

David Copeland, Ph.D. 39:03
we'd like for my daughter, you know, in this over the past year, we were dealing with potty training, you know, and we were debating about well, you know, how do we you know, reward the behavior to, you know, to encourage it, and, you know, is one of those where, okay, well, you know, she's she has, you know, type one. And so do we use candy? Do we use, you know, like a toy we don't What is it? Essentially, regardless of what it is, it just needs to be something of value that the person is going to see is you know, a reward that's going to reinforce the behavior,

Scott Benner 39:31
you make me think of this person that I spoke of earlier, when I said to them, Look, if you if you do this, then you won't have the same outcome. And they were just so sure that it was going to go wrong. They almost kind of they skip to the end without trying the thing. And I'm wondering now, if there was, I mean, it's an adult like, I don't know how you would incentivize an adult in that situation, but there has to be something you know, you know, I'm jumping around here a little bit, but

David Copeland, Ph.D. 40:01
I think i think i think one thing from from your perspective is you have to understand is that not ever, ever, not everyone is exposed to the ideas or the information is going to make a change, because there's so many people out there who are fine with their current good enough approach, that it's just from the get go, there's a percentage of people who aren't even going to be receptive to it, they might think it's a good idea, but they're just not even gonna apply it to their own lives. It's kind of that other percentage that you're really dealing with.

Scott Benner 40:29
Yeah, and when it's a personal thing, I honestly, if I'm being honest, I don't care. Like if you're on a path to something that's not as good as it could be. And you're happy with that, like, right on, like, I'm fine with that. I don't care. I don't, I don't pretend to want to manipulate people into having a different outcome. But if you're sitting there thinking, This isn't right. But I don't know how to break free of it, that feels sad to me, you know, the edifice, and

David Copeland, Ph.D. 40:57
I think it's just, you know, the person has to want to make the change, or in some cases even need to make the change, you know, and the need comes more from there's something really wrong with the current approach. And, you know, it could be somebody who's just hitting too many lows, or, you know, staying up 300 too much, or something like that. And then it turns into, you know, a need at that point, you know, it's like, you can tell someone you know, who's smoking, you know, oh, you need to quit smoking, it could lead to cancer, you need to quit smoking leads to cancer, you tell them year after year, if they visit their doctor, and they don't see it as a need, because they don't have cancer, but then maybe one time they get diagnosed with cancer, and the doctor is like, Listen, seriously, you need to quit smoking at this point. And now suddenly, they're a little bit more motivated to actually try something else.

Scott Benner 41:41
So have you heard me say, I think anecdotally, I have not spoken to enough people who have changed their health, be for another person, that I'm almost positive that that's what happens to people. Like, if you can't do it for yourself, you could do it for a child, or for a spouse, like I've just met too many people who said, You know, I decided to get my blood sugar's together when I met this woman, or this man, because I suddenly could picture a long life with somebody, or I didn't really care until I had a baby. And then I realized I needed to be here for the baby. Like is that I mean, from your perspective, and from your, your learning is that a real thing that happens to people,

David Copeland, Ph.D. 42:28
there are certain things in the world that can be very strong motivators. And you know, you know, politicians have learned that, you know, instilling fear in people can be a very strong motivator, in some cases to get them voting certain ways. But as you noted, to, you know, caring for someone can be an also an extremely powerful motivator. I think a lot of people when they're single, maybe you know, and childless, will kind of maybe write it off, you know, but then once you become a parent, you know, it kind of it's, you know, there's a, you know, lights a flash in your head that suddenly that little person in your life is extremely important. And you're willing to do anything for that person. Yeah.

Scott Benner 43:06
I don't mean to jump around, but I feel like I have you here now. So anxiety is at an all time high in society. Is that fair to say?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 43:15
I don't know if I'd say all time high. But I'd say that, I'd say the pandemic is probably triggered, and maybe exacerbated some aspects of it. Yeah. Do you buy into the the idea

Scott Benner 43:25
that we have nothing to do with our focus? Because life is easier. And so smaller and smaller things? Feel like the worst thing that's ever happened to us?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 43:38
Yeah, there, I mean, there's something to the fact that focusing and thinking too hard on on certain issues can cause anxiety. I think one of the big things about his anxiety is when we feel that it's outside of our control, is that's a really big kind of contributor to anxiety. And when we're able to, you know, exhibit some control over a situation or change an approach where we do have control and we can make changes to it. Yeah, a lot of cases you do see anxiety decrease a little bit in there. I don't want to talk too much on you know, making claims there because I'm not a I touch on anxiety in some of my the areas that I research, but it's not, you know, kind of the focus of what I do.

Scott Benner 44:24
No, that's fine. I just I listen, the what I can confirm that I know fits in a thimble. Okay. But it's hard to imagine that we went from people who like won World War Two to, you know, a friend of mine that I had in high school I haven't seen in 30 years said something a little cross on Facebook, and I think it was directed at me and now I'm melting down. Like it's a weird it's a weird shift in a short amount of time and less that used to exist and I just not aware of it because I didn't live at that point.

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David Copeland, Ph.D. 46:15
Well, I think one of the things we have to look at is that, you know, fields such as psychology are relatively new in terms of their emergence, you know, we're talking, you know, 20th century and 20. Now, 21st century, and, you know, we have no real data besides anecdotes or stories, you know, from his store from history, as to what really was going on in the past, and they're very well could be lots of cases of, you know, of high anxious individuals, you know, throughout history, but we didn't really have measures and, you know, there weren't, you know, psychologists around, you know, to really study it, you know,

Scott Benner 46:51
is that the natural progression of healing, then, like you're hiding it, and then a generation learns to let it out. And then another generation learns to deal with it, like, is it not? Is it your sort of your piece of building the bigger fabric of society, like, maybe we're all not going to get the fix that thing for us, but we're moving the whole group forward?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 47:16
Well, I think I think what happens is when when a topic or an idea is, you know, kind of in his infancy, and people don't know much about it, we use techniques that we think work, and they could be superstitious types of things that you try out, or maybe were passed down, you know, from family members. And, you know, they seem to work or seem to do the job. So you do it. But it takes, you know, kind of a field to emerge to really start investigating a topic and exploring it and putting these ideas to the test to say, Hey, is this effective? What about this versus that which one's more effective? And, you know, then maybe you start tweaking the techniques to say, Oh, this one works. But what if you tried this, you know, changing part aids to a one or something like that. And now suddenly, you have a new approach to it. And the more people you have that are investigating exploring topics, you know, the more likely people are going to throw out new and innovative, you know, solutions to it.

Scott Benner 48:11
Well, so there's no sort of back to where I said to the therapist earlier, that, you know, I feel bad, because you're pointing out, we're pointing these things out. But there's no tried and true way. Like there's no steps one through 10 that make this better, like you, you know, your therapist usually says, go to therapy and talk it out. And maybe you can get through it. Which seems like the best at the at the moment. But what do you do when it's something like? I mean, the stuff we've been talking about confirmation bias, sunk cost fallacy, like how do you stop yourself from doing those things, especially if you don't even know you're doing them?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 48:47
I think one of the first things are to know are that psychologies, psychologists, and psychology professors, and researchers, have been shown to be susceptible to some of these things as well, maybe not to the same extent as the general public, but it is measurable. And so sometimes, you know, you get a chuckle out of it, like, Oh, this study investigated the confirmation bias with psychology professors versus the general population, right. And, you know, this, the psychology professors actually showed too. And so it's one of those things where it's human nature, but I think there are ways to minimize it. And part of the ways to do it are to start becoming aware of some of these things, you know, start understanding that, yeah, there are different ways to make decisions. And yes, I can be influenced by my prior beliefs, prior experiences or emotions. And maybe I need to just sit there and think about right now, in this moment going forward, what are the pros and cons of going down path a versus path B, you know, regardless of what happened beforehand, you know, you can learn you know about these types of approaches and you can make improvements.

Scott Benner 49:53
I have to say that one of the more difficult things that I've done is to say settle on an idea and put it out into the world. Because I am most of the time of the, the opinion that the thought I have is the best thought I could come up with. But it doesn't mean there's not a better thought and more likely there might be one. And I keep looking for one of my one of my favorite exercise, like, you know, thought exercises, is to try to imagine what lies beyond what I don't understand. I and

David Copeland, Ph.D. 50:29
I enjoy. And I think that I think that perspective is, you know, a great way to, you know, to approach things because, you know, one of the things you want to do is you want to tell yourself that there might be approaches, and there might be people out there learning things that are different and possibly better than what I know about. And now of course, it's very important to to take into account the source of information, especially with, you know, you know, what we've seen, you know, in recent years where people are using, you know, social media or YouTube videos as their exclusive news sources, you know, you want to ideally be using things that have been tested, where there's some data behind it, you know, where it's coming from, you know, somebody who's studied it, and it has some expertise in the topic. You just don't want to take, you know, advice, you know, from your neighbor, Bob, or something like that, you know, just because Bob said, so that must be true. Yeah. So So yeah, you have to take the source involved, as well. But I think it is a good first step to realize that my knowledge, my information might not be perfect. There might be some better ideas out there.

Scott Benner 51:31
I saw what you just use such a nice, like, example, you're like, you know, I believe Bob, but maybe there's more beyond Bob, I was like, literally thinking like Flat Earth conspiracy. Like what you said that, like I I'm fascinated that, and if anybody's listening who believes the earth is flat, you can still get diabetes, like, stuff for me, but I think you're wrong. And I think there's enough examples of why your might be wrong to to get me in that camp. But what makes someone want to believe it so fervently, because I have to tell you, David, I believe the world is a sphere. Yes, but I don't have enough Karen, that I don't have a dog in that fight enough to get into an argument with you about it. I can only be like, I if you said to me, it's flat. I'd be like, ah, alright, man. Yeah, I couldn't sit here and work myself up over that. But you could but what you don't mean,

David Copeland, Ph.D. 52:27
but I think what you're what you're kind of conveying in there is, is something that emerges is that, you know, whether or not that person believes that the world is flat, or that it's more of a, you know, sphere or round, you know, object is that, ultimately, in their day to day life, 99.9% of the time, that belief, regardless of which one they have doesn't matter so much. You know, they're, you know, the only time it might as if they stop themselves from travel, do taking a long trip, because they think they're gonna go over the edge, you know, or something like that. But, but other than that, you know, that belief really isn't going to have an effect on their day to day life. And so, so yeah, so I think I think your idea there were, your choice to not engage on that particular one is probably a good one, because it really doesn't have that big of an effect. Whereas maybe something was someone's house, that could have a big major effect.

Scott Benner 53:20
I even think about when I started the series within the podcast about how people eat, I got notes from people, like you can't do that there's going to be big arguments as like, first of all, I don't care. And secondly, like, I don't think there's really big arguments, I think that we, we do this thing where we we've told ourselves if if you're on the internet, right, or if you're on Twitter, or Facebook or Instagram, we we've convinced ourselves that that's everyone's opinion. And it's really a fairly small percentage of the people on the planet are even on social media. So there are there are things happening online right now that people online believe are the most important thing in the world that most of the people on the planet are completely unaware of, and could not possibly care less about.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 54:12
Oh, yeah. I mean, we we have a very egocentric worldview in that we we think our own interests, and our own beliefs are the most important things in the world. And and yeah, and we we emphasize and elevate that and projected on other people and think that they also are going to highly value those beliefs in those perspectives and those topics right and so so yeah, we think those sorts of things. But yeah, it really a lot of it goes back into you know, digging our heels into our own current belief system. And you know, you can present for example, you can present people all the you know, all this evidence that, you know, drinking heavily in smoking isn't good for a long lifespan. But if they have a belief that that doesn't matter, they're going to find that one example of their you know, Aunt Karen, you know, who smokes like a chimney and live to be 90 Six years old. Yeah. And they're gonna say, you know, see, look, look at aunt Karen there, that scene doesn't matter.

Scott Benner 55:04
You know, it's, that's the same, the same muscle that gets used for people are like, I don't want to dig in and get a real job because I might be Kanye West one day or Drake or, you know, the best. The, I don't know, the the best softball player in the world or whatever you're trying to be like it, you know, you need to realize that those people are are an anomaly. Like right there, they're a collection of luck, hard work, you know, more luck in maybe how their body works, if they can sing or run or whatever it is they can do. And you're only aware of them, because of the way social media works now, right? Like, even 25 years ago, you didn't know how much money like a wide receiver made, that that was not not even something you were aware of.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 55:53
And, and a lot of it too, is just depends on what's valued at the time, you know, that, you know, 100 200 years ago, nobody would care if you could dunk a basketball. Yeah, but now, you know, that's, it's a popular sport, that's entertaining. And so if you can do that, you're you know, you're gonna, you can make yourself millions of dollars, right. So, you know, it all really matters, what is valued by people and what they want. So,

Scott Benner 56:17
I have a question that you might or may not have input on, but why is it comfortable to pick someone out in the world, who you deem as not as smart as you not as good as you are? not as popular? not as successful? Like, why does it? Why do we like to find things that were better than? I mean, did I just get out myself? Nobody else thinks that way. I'm not saying I feel like that all the time. I do see people do it. Like, yeah, it's, it's pretty, it's,

David Copeland, Ph.D. 56:51
you know, I think it's fairly common. And I think I think it can be a boost one's ego and their confidence. And, you know, no one ever wants to, you know, feel like the the kid you know, picked last gym class, you know, because they're, they're not as good and not as talented. Everyone wants to feel like they're good, they have you know, skills and they can do something better than each other. And, and part of it also in this kind of bleeds into the, you know, the social psychology world to where we like to categorize the world into groups. And, you know, we have our in group of people who are like us, and we have the out group of people who are not like us, and things associated with our in group are all positive and good, and we like, and things associated with the other groups are bad and different.

Scott Benner 57:33
That's where that's the fascinating thing about watching people argue about how they eat when they have diabetes, like that, like, I think in the end, everybody's saying the same thing. Like I, I found a way to do this thing that leads to stability and health and happiness. And they can't just be happy that they found it, and it's working for them, anybody who's not doing it, they feel like they want to ram it down the other person's throat. But you only see that online, it doesn't exist in the real world. I've never seen two type ones meet each other in the real world, and be like, I'm low carb, and the other ones say, I'm not and then they have a fistfight like that. It doesn't it. So what happens online? Why do people feel so confident? To be so aggressive with their ideas online?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 58:21
Yeah, I think of them as like keyboard warriors, or, you know, kind of cyber bullies in the sense. But it's, it's really one of the big things about it is it's the feeling of being anonymous when you're online. And, you know, researchers speculated for a while there that that's why, for example, messageboards, for a while, we're just random people making comments. And then eventually they switch them where you have to log in with your Facebook ID, you know, to make a comment, because they thought, oh, adding your name, and you know, Facebook identity to it is going to make people feel a little less anonymous, and maybe slow it down. And I don't remember seeing any data as to whether that had a major effect, or not. But my impression is that it hasn't had that big of an effect. Because I think just hiding behind the keyboard, people feel a little bit more anonymous. I usually, you know, when I talk about this, this idea with students, I usually use the example of you know, driving versus pushing your shopping cart in the grocery store. You know, when you're driving on the highway, you're gonna see people left and right, you know, cutting in line or cutting other people off. And in the car, you're anonymous, you know, nobody really sees your face, you're gonna drive away, they're never gonna see you. But in the grocery store, you're not going to be you know, standing there right in front of the checkout line and have another person just cut you off and go in front of you. Because they're right there in front of you, you know, face to face. And so there's, you know, you lose that level of being anonymous in that circumstance.

Scott Benner 59:46
But do you agree with maybe you won't agree with what I'm about to say, but I don't think people in a personal situation like the grocery store, I don't think they're having thoughts like, Oh, I'm going to get in front of you. I'm going to cut you off. I want to win. That seems to go away. When the anonymity goes away, like even the desire

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:00:03
does, though. Yeah, and I think that's just the the, the the whole lack of or presence of anonymity, you know, can just alter how you approach the whole situation.

Scott Benner 1:00:14
Yeah, in a second I am. I try very hard to apply that. The, the concept from it was a god, what's his name? Hold on a second. Isn't it funny I think about this constantly. And his name is David. David Foster. Wallace was a writer, he I think he committed suicide many years ago. But he he gave a speech at a college commencement. And it's, it's available now you can read it online or buying the book for him, or I think you can hear him on YouTube still, but it's called This is water. And at one point during it, he makes this point that has stuck with me forever, that the, these aren't his words, but here's the idea, like someone will cut you off in traffic, and they're a jerk. And maybe most of the people that cut you off in traffic are a jerk, but one of them has to go to the bathroom really badly. So what would it hurt for you to just imagine that every time you get cut off somebody who's in a dire situation, they really need to go, where they're going? And like, what would it hurt you to just believe the best in people. And I

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:01:21
know that that's another egg angle that a lot of people we make assumptions, you know, very easily. And part of is just because we don't, we're dealing with incomplete information about the world around us and every other person been. So it's as easy for that's why we make stereotypes and stuff like that, too. But yeah, we're drawing assumptions all the time. And we're just going with what's the easiest, you know, assumption that pops in my head. And typically, like, when you're driving, it's the fact that the person's a jerk, right, you know, and trying to cause you harm. Whereas like you said, it's very easily could be a case where someone's having, you know, a bathroom emergency or something else, right?

Scott Benner 1:01:57
I'm about to go do something horrible. And a Burger King, you got to get out of my way. And well, not only do you fill it in with the easiest answer, but I do think it's part of the other thing that I said, where you fill it in with the answer that makes you feel superior to

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:02:12
Yeah, and, you know, especially when you think, you know, you think of the other drivers as the outgroup. You know, there are others you don't know who they are, they're, they're definitely a part of your in group. Bad Guys, and

Scott Benner 1:02:23
good guys, I boy, I was talking about this with my son this morning. I don't want to say it's a family issue, because then if they hear it, they might know but, you know, let's say people I know that aren't in my house. And there's this one person that everything they talk about, they want the story to be there, the good guy, and there are other people and those people are bad guys. And, and when the bad guys aren't there, they'll make them. Because they don't seem comfortable when there's no drama. Like what makes people comfortable with x. I

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:02:58
think I think one of the big things is we always try to present ourselves in the best possible way. Because we want other people to like us and you know, we want to make connections, you know, we're humans are social beings. And, you know, we want to make connections, and we want to have friends and, and good family relations. And so we want to and we we think in our perspective, that always presenting ourselves as good and positive and having, you know, you know, making the right decisions on things, you know, is the best way to do that. And so so we're not very good at always admitting fault.

Scott Benner 1:03:33
So if I don't feel good about myself, the next best thing is to make everyone else look under me. So I rise up. In Yeah, that's definitely can be a coping mechanism. Wow, people are so screwed up. I'm gonna have more and more therapists and psychologists and people who think about stuff like this on the podcast, because I, I'm fascinated by all this. And, and, and back to the original point. You know, it's funny, because I just wanted to talk about sunk cost fallacy because I think that people can get too invested in how they take care of their health, and that might keep them from seeing other stuff. But then you brought up confirmation bias, and I was like, This conversation is going to be terrific. So I'm having a very good time talking to you. Can I? Are there ways for me to see my biases?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:04:24
I think the simple answer is to recognize that we are not perfect and we don't have all the answers and that ways that we're doing things could be good or acceptable, but maybe not the best. And I think just simply telling yourself that, you know, is, you know, kind of a very good starting point. You know, a lot of philosophers you know, will state that, you know, a high sign of intelligence is admitting that you don't know something and being able to utter that phrase, I don't know. Because because too many people are Afraid of looking, admitting that in that scent making them seem unintelligent. And so maybe they you know, give some kind of other answer confidently even though it might not be the correct answer.

Scott Benner 1:05:12
Well, let me say this because I made it because I'm trying to be funny. I'm not sure if the next thing I'm going to tell you if I was right about or not. But I found myself recently talking to an 18 year old with type one. And this person wanted to wants to do something with their life, they have a goal, right? And they're struggling right now with their blood sugar's, they're probably just not paying quite enough attention to it. It's not a big misunderstanding that they're having. And I don't know what happened, I was maybe having a day. And I was trying to squeeze some things in. And so I'm talking to this person, while I'm on my way to see something else. And maybe my day was getting away from me, I wasn't as focused on being maybe the person that you hear on the podcast all the time. And I just said to them, Look, if you keep doing what you're doing, now, you're going to get to this thing that you want to do later. And you might fail at it. And you're going to want to blame the diabetes. But the truth is, it's going to be your fault. And I thought, like, as soon as I said it, I was like, Wow, it was harsh, like, I shouldn't have said that, like that. But I went back over it again. And I niced it up, and I said it again. But as I must have thought about it for hours afterwards. And I was right. Like they put if this person would put a tiny bit of effort in right now, to kind of tighten up a couple of ideas and get these things working, then this next goal in their life would would go so much more easily, and they'd have a great chance of success with it.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:06:49
But and you know what I mean, in the end, I think what you're getting at is a little bit of an idea called the attribution error of when, you know, when I make a mistake, it's due to some external circumstance, you know, affecting me, you know, it's somebody else's fault. So, you know, so to speak, where is if someone else, you know, you know, messes up, then it's something about themselves, they screwed it up, but, you know, kind of an idea. And so I think it really gets back to is that wheat as kind of a coping mechanism, again, you know, for our confidence is we don't like to admit, we're wrong, you know, and, you know, when you know, something goes wrong, we like to put the blame on other things, or other people, and it wasn't ourselves that really, you know, could have done better.

Scott Benner 1:07:33
Yeah, it's, you know, listen, I, I don't, I'm not saying I don't do those things, I want everybody to understand that I don't think David's saying he doesn't do things like this either. But being aware that they exist, is your only real chance to get ahead of them at some point. Otherwise, you know, your life could end up being a series of, you know, things that happen that you think are decisions that might be a lot less about your decision and a lot more about how you feel about yourself, based on what somebody said to you, when you were 10 years old, or you know, that kind of stuff, like I don't want, I don't want to feel like I'm being drugged through life by that kind of randomness. And I just wanted to pick an episode to talk about it here. So maybe other people could have a chance to see their biases and, and stop themselves from getting caught in repetitive decisions that are not the best that they could be for them.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:08:30
But yeah, and you know, part of it is that, you know, if you're perfectly fine of envisioning yourself five years from now in the exact same patterns that you're in now, and you're happy with that, maybe maybe you're good, maybe you just stick with what you're doing. Yeah. But if you want to picture yourself in five to 10 years as living an improved life, then you probably have to make some steps to to make some changes so that you aren't doing the exact same things and making the same patterns in your life. And so that you can make progress. And you have to understand that it is possible when you make change, that hey, maybe things you know, you can have some problem run into some problems. That's okay. Maybe you don't do it well enough. Or you don't learn quick enough. And hey, that's okay. We're allowed to fail in life. You know, people think that, you know, sometimes it's unacceptable. But people who are they tried something out, it didn't work, you know, so then I tried something new.

Scott Benner 1:09:24
Yeah. Is that why we break everything down into like these little like slogans so that everybody can wrap their heads around them? Like, you know, people will love to tell you that. millionaires have gone bankrupt like three times before they became millionaires, which is a nice way of saying don't give up.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:09:38
Yeah, essentially, it is. The problem with it is it's typically an empty phrase to most people, because most people don't think too deeply about it or just, you know, don't don't

Scott Benner 1:09:49
go back to themselves. Yeah, no, I don't. I've never once thought I'll have a million dollars one day, but I guess I would think most people don't feel that way. But that that That does become the problem is that these things are so they're so empty that they they'll ring true for a moment, but then you can't hear the bells anymore. You know, you're like, Oh, that makes sense. And then it's gone. And yeah,

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:10:10
like the Nike slogan, just do it is great in terms of, you know, inciting people to take action to you know, make a change or, you know, do something in their lives. But we've heard it so often Now. Now. It's just this random slogan that just bounces off our ears when we hear it. It's super

Scott Benner 1:10:24
exciting, right till I jump up in the air and realize I can't get anywhere near the rim. It reminds me of when my son was super young, he might have been seven or eight years old, his friend is at bat at a baseball game. And the kid's father stands up and yells his name and the kid grabs his attention as he's like getting into the batter's box and says, just hit the ball. And the kid stopped and what? Oh, thanks. Yeah, that was not valuable advice. If it was that easy. A baseball wouldn't be fun to watch and be everyone would be amazing at it. I didn't know I just had to hit it. I appreciate you're doing this with me. And I do wonder if you'll tell me if you think I'm well, if you listen to this, and then tell me what you think. But I don't believe that everybody needs to go out and change themselves. I don't believe anybody has to. But I do think that if people were self reflective, they would change. I don't know if it would be better or worse for them that I can't say. But it would be different. And it would be progress of some sort. Do you think it's odd that I wanted to put this episode into this podcast? You listen to the podcast?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:11:35
Yeah, I don't think it's odd at all, I think I think one of the things to understand is that people work in different in different paces. And different people are different in terms of their willingness to try new things, their motivations, their goals, they're wanting to make change themselves. And so I think if people are fine, where they're at, then, then as long as they're getting good enough results, then they can do that. That's their choice. But some people will kind of hope they had better results, but aren't, you know, but that hope isn't enough to get them to make a change. And you hope those individuals can start to see that there is some psychology to this and that, we have to recognize that a you have to get yourself to really want to make the changes, you know, step number one, and then number two, you have to tell yourself that, hey, what I believe in what I'm doing might not be the best ultimate, you know, way of doing things and way of believing things. And maybe I should go out there and listen to other pieces of advice the best, especially from things, ideas coming from experts, and people who have tried them out and found great success with it, I always just think it's been specific focus to diabetes, I just always think find somebody who's doing it better than you and find out what they know that you don't know.

Scott Benner 1:12:51
Like, that just makes sense to me. Like if you're having trouble keeping your blood sugar stable, like, you know, go find somebody that doesn't like see that as hopeful instead of instead of them making you feel bad about it, which is, which is a thing i abrasca guess I don't think that sharing success makes people feel badly. I think sharing success gives people can give them hope they can choose to feel bad about it, I guess if they want but but the idea is pure,

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:13:16
you know, again, if that information isn't out there at all, then there's not a chance at all that they're going to try something because because then they don't have any ideas because

Scott Benner 1:13:25
of what I said earlier, which is you can't imagine what lies beyond your understanding. Right, so you can watch your blood sugar spike up after a meal, and then crash back down again. But if you don't understand what Pre-Bolus means, if you don't understand how to make your Basal insulin, right, then this is just this thing that happens to you every day, it's just the thing that is happening to you. And if you don't have the words to put to it, or the tools to fix it with, then all you're left with is the idea of like, I know this isn't right, but I don't know what to do next.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:14:00
Well yeah, and then at that point, you might just try it through trial and error, try something and by chance it might work you know, and sometimes it could be an effective tool. Other times it could just be random that it just you know you did something and adjust your insulin, you know, regimes just happened to work that day and so you think that this random thing that you did works, but if it's not an effective tool that a lot of other people are using and and you and you don't know about it, then odds are you're not going to stumble upon

Scott Benner 1:14:26
it yourself. Or you might just give up and believe believe it to be unconquerable I saw someone today say something about my blood sugar goes up but then it comes back down. I know my body I know it's gonna do that. And I read that and I did not have the time to respond. But what I wanted to say was is this has very likely little to do with your body and what you know about it and a lot more to do about the fact that your insulin is probably not set up, right.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:14:53
Oh, yeah. And when when they think it's an evident when a person thinks is inevitable. It's kind of related to an idea like a learned helplessness It's like an idea of when you think no matter what I'm going to do, it's not going to fix anything, you kind of give up. And but when the reality there might be some real tools out

Scott Benner 1:15:10
there, but I think if people feel that way, if you're listening and you find yourself feeling that way, I mean, I get that that would be a gut punch for a second, if what David just said, you're like, Oh, god, that's what I do, like, you know, but now, you know, don't do it. Yeah,

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:15:25
that's where if you can hear examples of people, you know, succeeding in overcoming that problem, exposing people to that, then that can, you know, give them inspiration, give them hope to that there is a method out there they can try. Cool.

Scott Benner 1:15:37
Alright, so I'm gonna Thank you for coming on. But I want to ask you one last question before I let you go. So do you listen enough to the podcast that you have a vibe for it?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:15:46
I've listened to a handful episodes, I've gone through different sources, you know, with citizen books or conversations with their endocrinologist.

Scott Benner 1:15:55
So you feel but but I'm talking about just me specifically, like the thing I'm laying out like, do you have a grasp of what I'm doing? Yes. Okay. So is it hard for you, when you're listening to something like this with your background? to not see what I'm, how am I want to ask the S? Do you see how I'm trying to help people along? And is it hard for you to listen to something when that when there's a secondary thing happening that a lot of people are listening to don't hear, and maybe you don't know what I'm talking about? I'm interested to know.

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:16:28
I think I think that providing the information out there is it in its of itself is a way to do it. And I think another thing that's very important is that it's got to be presented in a way there that people want to, you know, listen to it, you know, you if you present it, you could you know, very well present all this information in a very dull, like scientific conference way of just like reading something in a very monotone voice. But if you make something a little bit interesting, you know, add some story to it, then you're actually going to get people's attention to it. And it actually make them want to listen, and that and people want stories,

Scott Benner 1:17:06
right? Like that's Yes, sir, very much. It's a very human thing. I just, I always wonder like, I wonder if a person like you, like, it's almost like sitting in school again, after being through like, the first time you go through you, you just think you're having this experience. And the second time you go through, you're like, oh, the teachers getting me somewhere there there on purpose, moving me from where I am to this other place?

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:17:29
Well, it kind of gets the idea of when you don't know anything about a topic, most people shy away from it and call it boring, or you know, something that they're not interested in. But as you get exposed and learn more and more about a topic, you'll find people actually develop an interest and sometimes even a passion toward it. And so it's a really kind of an interesting thing. So when you have the availability, the resources out there for people to continue learning, once you kind of snowball up that, you know, knowledge base, then people can really get into it.

Scott Benner 1:18:01
Alright, I appreciate your time. I greatly thank you so much for doing this. You did it kind of on short notice even and I'm gonna put it out pretty soon. So I'm excited about it. Is there anything you want to share with people I know, we were for four seconds, we're like, My daughter has diabetes. And then we were like, jump right into this. But is there anything diabetes wise? I never usually asked at the end. But is there anything about diabetes, you want to talk about that? We didn't? Ah,

David Copeland, Ph.D. 1:18:26
I think just like anyone else, I'm, you know, continuously learning about this. And I think it really to bring it back to one of the points that you'd mentioned earlier. You know, I think that I care more about it, because it's with, you know, an issue with my daughter than even if I think of it was about me. And so I think it's one of those types of things where it's, you know, being a parent makes it you know, a little bit more motivating, even for me to learn more and more about this, this particular topic, and to, to improve, because I want her to live a fantastic life. Yeah. Oh,

Scott Benner 1:19:03
God. Well, what's your Cheers to that, that's a that's a great way to end. Thank you very much. And thank you for inviting me. A huge thanks to David for coming on the show and sharing his expertise with us. I'd also like to thank touched by type one, who you can of course find at touched by type one.org on Facebook, and Instagram. And I just want to remind you one last time, head over to T one d exchange.org. forward slash juicebox. fill out the survey. If you're a US resident, and you have type one diabetes, or you're the caregiver of a child with type one, it won't take but a few minutes, it'll benefit the podcast and it will benefit everyone living with Type One Diabetes even you.

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#518 Brownie

Shaun Brown is an adult living with type 1 diabetes.

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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

Scott Benner 0:00
Friends Hello, and welcome to Episode 519 of the Juicebox Podcast.

Today's episode I'll be speaking with Sean brown Sean's an adult living with Type One Diabetes. And he and I go on a journey together, we talk about a little bit of everything. If I remember correctly, I was sick when I recorded this one. So I'm not 100% certain what I said. So you can't hold me accountable. Please remember while you're listening that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, please always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan. We're becoming bold with insulin. Now, there are some things you can do without consulting your physician for instance, you can listen to the diabetes pro tip episodes of the podcast. They begin at Episode 210. And they're also available at diabetes pro tip.com. So what I did there was like a weird little. Anyway, I turned it into a thing for you have a little extra stuff here? Oh, yeah, Sean's on Instagram. I wanted to tell you that because I really like him. And I thought if you want to check him out, you could he Shawn brownie, sh a un, br o w n IE.

This show is sponsored today by the glucagon that my daughter carries. g vo cuyp open, Find out more at G Vogue glucagon.com forward slash juice box. We're also sponsored by the Contour Next One blood glucose meter. I'd very much like it if you would check it out at Contour Next one.com forward slash juicebox. There are links in the show notes of your podcast player and links at Juicebox Podcast comm to these and all of the sponsors. Check them out. This one's gonna be interesting. I don't feel well this is the closest you're going to come to having conversation with me when I'm drunk or high that you're ever going to find because my face feels like it's seven inches in front of my skull for some reason. That's not good. I don't know what's going on. Exactly. I don't have any the COVID symptoms. So I'm feeling pretty good about that part. I just got sick the other day. But I don't I don't have any symptoms other than my head feels a little dancey and I'm a little achy, but that's about it. So, bomber. Yeah, sorry. Sorry to hear that. It's okay. I'll get through it. I usually the fit. I usually get sick and I usually kick my illnesses in a day. And this one's cuts quick. Yeah, this one's Hold on to me a couple days. So this must be worse than usual. My immune system is probably what killed Arden's pancreas honestly, it's really strong. I just don't normally get second face, Eric.

Shaun Brown 3:02
My name is Shaun Brown, type one diabetic, just turned 40. And honestly didn't have anything prepared. I thought you're just going to ask me questions.

Scott Benner 3:14
Because I just need you to introduce yourself. That's all you listen to the show. Right, john? You know, I listened to it pretty frequently. Yeah, I think beginning of every episode, someone's like, Hey, I'm Sean. Like, Bob, you knew this was coming. Did you? Yeah, I honestly didn't premeditated it very deeply. So I'm kind of I'm good with that. I appreciate that. Actually.

Shaun Brown 3:33
Yeah. Um, yeah, I figured it out. I actually at first, I had written some stuff down that to kind of think about what I may need to say. And then I thought, That's absolutely pointless, because I already know how you do the show.

Scott Benner 3:45
We're not gonna ask a bunch of like, scripted questions. That won't be right. Well, listen, you You said you're 40 years old. I just turned 40. Yeah. Happy birthday. And you've had diabetes for quite some time. How old were you and you're diagnosed.

Shaun Brown 4:00
So here's the funny thing. Like, I don't ever I always have to kind of quantify it by the grade I was in because I I never deeply thought about, like, even the idea of when people call a diversity. Yeah, that's absolutely new to me. Like I've never even heard of such a thing until I kind of joined the ecosphere of Instagram and such.

Scott Benner 4:22
Yeah, that's a social that's a social media construct, I think.

Shaun Brown 4:25
Yeah, it must be because I'm like, What is that? And I honestly was completely foreign to me to celebrate it to it seems kind of weird, but I guess I get it. But so I was in sixth grade and are just starting sixth grade. So that puts me probably around 12.

Scott Benner 4:45
Okay, cool. Well, I and I completely have to say I completely understand you thinking about that. We've never had a celebration marking Arden's day that she was diagnosed. I don't know that I could. Well, I do know about myself that if I didn't have my vlog, I wouldn't know when Arden was diagnosed other than to know that it was after her birthday, which would put it in the later summer. But I do know it was in August. But even as I'm being pressed, I don't know the date. So, yeah, and you know, it's up to you, right? Whether you how you want to deal with it or not deal with it or, you know, I think it's one of those things. Maybe you see people do that. That has a lot of value for them. And if you don't need that, then then oh, no, I didn't. Yeah, I didn't mean to like, downplay it like that. You didn't. By the way, don't forget, I'm sick. So this is gonna go. This could go awkward. Like, I don't know, I've definitely recorded when I had a head cold like this.

Shaun Brown 5:43
I'm pretty sure I already said that foot because I was all nervous about how to introduce myself. I did. I did the hard work for me.

Scott Benner 5:52
No, no, I listen, I What I'm saying is I can see their side of it. I can see wanting to mark the occasion, and celebrated like, you know, look at me, I've gone another year with this thing. And, you know, I completely get that. It's just not something that is occurred to us to do.

Shaun Brown 6:06
Yeah, I mean, it just kind of happened. And then it became my life. So I didn't beyond that. Right? I never. But yeah, I vividly remember specifically because, you know, I was not diabetic until sixth grade. So

Scott Benner 6:21
maybe the sixth grade gave me diabetes.

Shaun Brown 6:24
I think it was Yeah, although it was nice getting to go to the nurse office. And and ivig class. I used it as a tool not gonna front.

Scott Benner 6:35
Hey, I'm a little what would you say you were to get out?

Shaun Brown 6:38
I would I feel so bad admitting this. I just would you know, because it was it was totally new to me. And I knew I could leave the class. If I said I didn't feel well. So I you know, went to the nurse office, which in retrospect is terrible. And and kind of, I don't know, it makes me a crappy person.

Scott Benner 6:59
You think so? I don't think a 12 year old can be a crappy person for Oh,

Shaun Brown 7:02
no, no. Well, I you know, what's, what's ironic too, is when I think about it, I would tell the nurse like I feel low and she always had these Donald Duck juice OJS in the fridge. And she would have me test my blood and I know for a fact and right in retrospect that wasn't always low but she was still give me the oj I'm always scratching my head when I think about that one because I'm like, she was the she gave me the juice even though I didn't need it. Which would you know, do worse arm in the end?

Scott Benner 7:35
Maybe Maybe it's it's, um, maybe it's more sinister than that. Maybe she just wanted to, you know, she's like, Look, I need to, I need this job. So I need to, I think she felt bad that she was trying to be consoling, probably making juice make you feel better? Well,

Shaun Brown 7:49
there's, you know, there's psychology wrapped around it, too. Like she probably was aware I was going through stuff. I was newly diagnosed. She was hanging with you. Yeah, I think she probably was humor me To be honest, even though it was a poor choice.

Scott Benner 8:03
I'm thinking of sixth grade. I, my God, it was as it was a long time ago, sixth grade, I had algebra. Now that's pretty common or not. Nowadays. I think they teach kids algebra in like preschool. But I did not understand algebra. I was not good at it. I couldn't follow it. Mixing letters with numbers was not a good idea for me. And I tried for a while I finally came up with it. I was like, I can't do this. I have to drop this class. So that I don't fail it. You know, I'll go back into some general math class, I went up to the teacher. And I don't remember any of my teachers names. But this man, his name was Ted combs. And I remember going up to him and saying, Mr. Combs, I gotta get out of this class. I don't understand algebra. And he laughed. He said, Yeah, I've seen your grades. We know you don't understand it. I was like, Okay, see, this guy's on board, you know. And he goes, but it's too late to drop this class. So you're just gonna have to try harder. And I was like, I don't think that's gonna work. So I tried for a little longer. And one day, I just went up to him. And I basically just made him a deal. And I said, Listen, I will sit in the back of this class. I won't bother you, I won't cause you a problem. I am going to fail this class. I'm not going to hand it homework. I'm not going to do assignments in class. I'm not taking the test, zeroes fail. I'll go to summer school. And he said, Okay. And that's what the education system used to be like. Just see, do you can you imagine now that happening? No,

Unknown Speaker 9:29
no,

Scott Benner 9:30
that was sixth grade, sixth grade. I was 12. I was very premeditated and forward to tell the teacher Oh, the only thing stopping me from ruling the world as an evil genius is I have a pretty big heart. Otherwise, I would just like it, which reminds me that two years later, my guidance counselor said Scott, we we don't talk much. But you should consider becoming an attorney. And I was like, Oh, no, no, no, I don't want to do that. And he said, Why? I said, Well, two reasons. I don't want to do the same thing every day for the rest of my life. Be it Be an attorney. And then I was like, I guess it's three things. And I said, I think I'd be bad at it. And he's like, No, I think you'd be good. And I'm like, No, no, you're misunderstanding me. I was like, I think I'd be bad at it. And like, you know, and he was like, Oh, I'm like, I feel like there's like a sinister part of me that could take over and I could just be, you know, like a bad guy in this story. I was like, I don't want to do that. So I just know that I, I just know that I could be a televangelist. If I had the right heart for it is what I'm saying, Shawn. I definitely didn't go that route. Yeah, I definitely think I could get up on television and be like, just send me some money and everything will be fine. But it work. Yeah, I can see that I broke for you that when I was younger, but when I was younger, I was broke. And I grew up kind of poorly. And I knew I was bright. And I always was afraid I'd I'd like, it's funny. I never had any thoughts about it. But I was always concerned for it not to happen to me. But anyway, there's a long way to go to say that I think your your nurse, I think you're right. She's probably somewhere between trying to be kind to you. And maybe not even understanding the whole thing completely. How long did it take you? Yeah, I think it was a mixture for sure. How long until you understood. Man, I'm embarrassingly still figuring it out. So I think that's good to admit, actually. Well, well, how did you manage back then? cuz I've you and I've emailed back and forth for a long time. Now. I feel like

Shaun Brown 11:22
yeah, I guess it's, it's been a while I'm one when I was diagnosed, it was like old school, I was put on mph and regular. You know, he had that he had the vial, you had to like roll in your hand gently before you drew out into the syringe. And it was it was a pretty like set schedule where it was just like, here's how much you take. And this is when you eat type of thing. Yeah. And man, looking back, but kids these days, I will say, You're so lucky. As far as information is concerned, because it's still scarce, ironically, but with the internet. And with, like communities, like on Instagram, where there's like a thriving community amazingly, yeah. Man, I wish I had something like that when I was younger. That's all I can say. Because information is like the vital component to put you on track. And, you know, obviously, you can get bad information too. But being able to actually interface with other people that live the same life also, and see how they deal with their problems and what works good, what doesn't work and things like that is highly beneficial. And I've never had any of that when I was, you know, younger. And I'm an old guy now.

Scott Benner 12:51
So. So for decades, you were just was it really wasn't that long, you were just shooting at certain times and eating at certain times. And that was it.

Shaun Brown 12:59
One so I wasn't I wasn't on mph irregular for like an eternity. That's what they started me on. But I remember moving into the rapids, like as soon as they became available. And so after that, it was pretty much lantis and homologue or lantis and novolog. And ironically, I'm still on the same type of insulin regimen, even though at this point, I'm so done with it to be honest.

Scott Benner 13:29
Well, okay, so um, I have here, I just did some quick googling. And it looks like humor blog came out in 1996. Hmm, that sounds about right. Sounds about right. So that would have made you How old? So 96 I was 16. Okay, so you did it the first way for about four years, then? Yeah, it wasn't forever, right? And then into the fast tracking stuff, but like you're saying with no real information about how it worked? And is it even more looking back? Is it even more confusing? To go from the just put it in and make sure you eat at the same time to this new insulin that basically works completely differently?

Shaun Brown 14:08
Are you referring to comparing, like mph and regular to novolog? and such?

Scott Benner 14:14
Yeah, like, what was that transition? Like?

Shaun Brown 14:16
It was pretty seamless. I remember just kind of it was the same type of thing. But the problem is, is that we I had always, like, I was never I never got an endo. Even I still to this day, don't have an endocrinologist you've

Scott Benner 14:31
never had.

Shaun Brown 14:32
Dude, I've been my own endo since day one. The day I was diagnosed, you know, I was pretty much like doing it myself. Which is insane. The more I think about it, and I did, I did definitely like once I ironically started to learn more from a health scare that kind of put me on a different track about a year ago. And I started really digging in and saying I you know, I can't Keep doing what I'm doing. I need to re examine what I'm doing. I got so angry at my past because I realized that this entire time, like, I had not been given the proper tools, you know, it's not like I'm a dummy. I'm a pretty smart dude. But I've never been given like the right tools to, to, you know, really succeed properly. Some honestly, it's in so many ways. lucky to be here. Lucky to you know, still be healthy. Yeah. As far as I understand, you know? And, yeah, that's one thing I can say is I'm I'm thankful that it didn't go a different route. For sure.

Scott Benner 15:45
So you basically live like 2025 27 years, with just winging it?

Shaun Brown 15:53
Yeah, it's like the ebb and flow of like, I don't feel good. Let me check it. I The thing was, is I was always, like, pre good about checking my blood. I've always been like, you know, if I don't feel right, I'll check. And if a tie, I deal with it, I don't like sit on it. And, you know, watch it go crazy. I admittedly, during my, you know, teen through younger college years, I was a little rambunctious and did not take it as seriously as I should. Like, I wanted to be in the moment more in certain events or occasions that would allow it to kind of go high when I shouldn't have. But most of the time, you know, I had always been pretty good about it, like, my age, I wish I could find out what my agencies were like when I was super young, because that information is gone now, and I can't get ahold of it. But like, the data, I do have a, I was always in, you know, high sixes to like, low or mid fives. And so I was always kind of managing it, obviously. But sorry,

Scott Benner 17:04
were you getting low a lot back then? Yeah, okay. I

Shaun Brown 17:08
definitely do. I had, I had a lot of experiences where, you know, I got used to waking up with paramedics around and it was just like, this is just diabetes. This is, you know, see what it's like to be diabetic.

Scott Benner 17:20
Sean, that's really interesting. So you had somebody told you lower a one see better, so the number was lower. So you felt like you were doing well, which had to have meant that passing out and then needing an ambulance was just part of it?

Shaun Brown 17:34
Well, I just was never, like, corrected, and I never had I never had proper guidance. Really? Yeah, is the thing. Yeah. And so, and sadly, you know, my, my parents always did everything they they knew they could do to I think but we were all uninformed. And, and, you know, like, I don't want to throw anybody under the bus. But like, I am frustrated that I love my folks. They love me to death. They're amazing, but I wish they had searched out like, you know, finding an endocrinologist I think they they understood that we were in good hands. And arguably we were to a degree but you know, my needs were specific and, and then rapturous, back and

Scott Benner 18:24
exploration, though, I was just saying, reflect if somebody sets expectations in a certain place, and it feels like you're meeting them, and your parents might not have any reason to want to look exactly

Shaun Brown 18:33
and that's what I wanted to kind of know is it's not like they weren't making sure I was it was okay. It's not like they were just like, you know, you're not caring about

Scott Benner 18:46
my well being Yeah, you weren't a dog bed at night, right? They didn't like like put on their plate on the floor and be like you're showing ads for you know, you were being well cared for by people who were given a certain set of things to do and they were doing them for you. And that was

Shaun Brown 19:01
Yeah, it was pretty much you know, like I one of your old shows, I remember you saying you know that Turner what he called it like the kind of don't die, toolbox or whatever.

Scott Benner 19:12
Yeah, I tell you give advice that I consider to be do not die advice. It's just enough to keep y'all that's exactly

Shaun Brown 19:18
what I was given. You know, I remember when I'm when I'm, you know, I might when I was diagnosed, we we basically kept my pediatrician till I think I was like 18 ironically, maybe 16

Scott Benner 19:37
it's actually common nowadays to keep them longer. If you really if you go into college, they'll kick me out, kicked you out.

Unknown Speaker 19:44
It's like yeah, Shawn, I

Unknown Speaker 19:45
don't let people come in here that can kick my ass. You gotta go. He was like, dude, you're so old. You gotta you gotta go to another doctor. You know? That's funny.

Scott Benner 19:56
But yeah, nowadays. Like my kids pediatrician will Be happy to keep them until they're done college. Night. Oh, wow. Yeah. Never heard of such a thing. Yeah. So you don't have to be looking for a doctor while you're going to college. So through college age?

Shaun Brown 20:13
Well, that's kind of good. I mean, if you can stick with somebody, the longer the better I figure.

Scott Benner 20:19
No, I think so too. I agree. Well, I want to dig a little farther into this. So you're doing what you're supposed to be doing. And you're just in that world. And by the way, you're not the nearly the first or the 100th person to tell me that I just feel like waking up with a paramedic overtop of me is part of having diabetes. And it usually does come from people have to say, who have had type one for a couple of decades, usually or longer, like, people who got that, that initial like, Hey, here's humalog You know, this is new and exciting. It's so much better than the stuff you've been using. And wow, look at your meter. You can carry it with you now and stuff I get like in that space and time of diabetes. A lot of the people with expectations like that come from that space, I find, but it's amazing. Yeah. So what what changed for you like what happened two years ago?

Shaun Brown 21:14
So I was progressively getting like stomach discomfort. And it wasn't like excusing it bump the wire here fine. So so I was getting kind of like a cramping but it wasn't like intense. And then it progressed into almost like, it moved into my chest area. And I was starting to freak out thinking like, Am I potentially having a heart attack and it kind of kept getting worse? One evening, I could not get it to go away with, you know, taking antacids or pepto or anything like that. And I just remember, nothing made it better. And it was so intense that, you know, I nervously submitted myself to the ER, to go see if I was having a heart attack. I wasn't apparently. And then I then I thought, well, maybe it's pancreatitis, and it wasn't that my bloodwork came out, okay. They did it like a rib scan. Everything was good. It's really strange. And so I stayed there till like 3am, I came home. And then I saw my doctor. And he he inferred that it was like, severe GERD or something. And so he put me on a proton pump inhibitor for a bit. And that actually made me worse. I felt terrible. I felt terrible on this. And I kept telling him, you know, I think I might not need this. And I don't think it's I'm reacting properly to it. And it was really bad. And then eventually, you know, I told him, I think I'm having an allergic reaction to this drug because it's it I'm feeling way worse. I was feeling like sick from it. And, and at first, I thought I felt better. But then it progressed into an area where I was just, I knew something was wrong, and it was the drugs. So I told him, I'm not taking this anymore. So you kind of partially bicker with me on at first, but then you decided that, you know, the patient knows best type of thing. And then, and then I quit taking it. And I felt immediately better. Well, you

Scott Benner 23:27
didn't have any stomach acid to help you with your food.

Shaun Brown 23:29
Yeah, it was it was intense. And so at that point, I kind of just I had like a wake up call where I'm like, I already was like for a while progressively for about 10 years, cutting things out on my diet that just were junk. You know, I grew up on a very standard American diet. And I, over the years kept pulling things away and being more meticulous about how he thinking about, you know, eating healthier foods as much as possible, removing processed food as much as possible. And at a certain point, I just figured I need to examine my diet even more. I also had been pretty, pretty consistently a drinker for a long time. So I was concerned maybe it had something to do with alcohol. I'm not like a binge drinker or anything, but like, I would definitely have at least a beard a night to take the edge off or whatever. I think in retrospect, I realize ironically, I was probably kind of self medicating with alcohol, not knowing it.

Scott Benner 24:43
So stuff self medicating,

Shaun Brown 24:46
dealing with the stressors of diabetes. I also am a you know a father to an amazing kid who's nine now but he he is on the autism spectrum. He also has Has Tourette's? And it's a full time job, you know? And so that kind of added to the equation when we had my son.

Scott Benner 25:13
Well, that's not. I have to say, I just wanted to take a detour for a second. Not sure off, but I see online. There are plenty of dads of kids with type one. And drinking does seem to be their major way to deal with it. If I'm Yeah, and it's, it's no good man. Wow. So yeah. So you come home at the end of the night, you're having a beer every day, you're having these pains, stomach chest, and it just generally makes you feel like, I need to do better for myself, because especially because they didn't come up with anything, right?

Shaun Brown 25:48
Yeah, the crazy thing is, is they could not find anything. And I was quite determined to figure it out. So I had them scheduled me for a full abdomen scan, they didn't find anything. The only thing that was left was like a what? When the scope you and I never got the scope done, because I changed my diet. And I improved dramatically after I changed my diet.

Scott Benner 26:11
I have to tell you that I've tried very hard over the last couple of years to remove processed foods, certain oils. And I thought that was hilarious, actually. And I feel much better. Last night as an example, like, everybody wanted something specific, and I made it. And then I had some and I just didn't. I was like, uh, later I was like, I'm not gonna eat that again. Like, I shouldn't have that you don't I mean, like it just it just wasn't worth it. And when you're younger man, your body just like your body can eat tin cans when you're younger. You don't I mean?

Shaun Brown 26:50
Yeah, absolutely. You get into the hat. That's the problem is you form habits. And yeah, I certainly formed a lot of bad ones when I was younger.

Scott Benner 26:57
Right? Well, so in the, in that process, then that taking care of your diabetes just came along with eating better. You just were like, Well, let me manage this more specifically as well.

Shaun Brown 27:09
Yeah, what so what's it's so weird, because I'm like a completely different diabetic now. I mean, very much the same, but totally different in that. You know, in the past, I was only testing on a meter. I finally acquired CGM that changed everything for me. Just having that data. And and then I found out about in pen, amazingly, through Instagram, and so ironic how Instagram has informed me. It's so it's so like, in retrospect, it's just silly to me, because I've learned more from this from social media and podcasts such as yours, than anything that my doctor could have given me,

Scott Benner 27:59
Sean, you're just old enough to understand when I tell you that. I'm incredibly proud of this podcast. I think it's one of the better things I've done with my life. And yet, when I stand in front of someone, and they're like, Hey, what do you do? I'm like, Well, I have a podcast. It feels stupid when I'm saying it. And you know, and if I was younger, I wouldn't if I was 25, or 30. And I think I have a podcast you know about AI? That would seem realistic to me, but I am older. And when I say it, I understand anyway, how you feel when you're like, I can't believe that Instagram is where I get good information from it just seems ridiculous now. Yeah, yeah, I totally understand. So you learned about in pen through there.

Shaun Brown 28:45
I think I think I stumbled on someone that was using it. And I was like, Oh my god, you can take half units. Sean, you're pretty far behind that. I know. I'm a dinosaur now. So I almost didn't want to do the podcast because I was like, I'm gonna embarrass myself so bad. I'm just gonna sound so I'm educated.

Scott Benner 29:05
No, no, I listen, I think that what you're doing is valuable because I believe that the other side of Instagram is that you're usually only see from people who are doing really well. And I think more people lived the way you did than you think. And they get no I think you're right. Yeah, they don't speak up as often so I'm glad for you to do this. Yes, sorry. So okay, see a diabetes for 27 years and you're like wow, half units, game changer.

Unknown Speaker 29:34
I mean, really

Shaun Brown 29:35
was I'm not gonna lie. So but the thing is, is if I can jump around a lot here, but I'm absolutely still totally sick of not having enough precision. And I never really even had you know, pump therapy pushed on me so much as just mentioned by my doctor like, Hey, you know, you could get a pump, right? And that was about it. Like I was never informed on like, Here's why you should get a pump. This is what a pump can do. When you have pumps, this is what you can benefit from, you know?

Scott Benner 30:19
Gee vo hype open pan has no visible needle, and it's the first pre mixed autoinjector of glucagon for very low blood sugar in adults and kids with diabetes ages two and above. Not only is chivo hypo pen simple to administer, but it's simple to learn more about, all you have to do is go to G evoke glucagon.com forward slash juicebox g vo shouldn't be used in patients with insulin, Noma or pheochromocytoma. Visit g Vogue glucagon.com slash risk.

Stop right now and think, ask yourself this question. Is the blood glucose meter I'm using or using on my child? Is it the best one I could have? If you don't know the answer to that question, I'd like it if you could go to Contour Next one.com forward slash juicebox. To check out the Contour Next One blood glucose meter, this meter is ultra ultra accurate, it is super simple to use fits very well on your hand or your pocket or your purse, or your bag, or wherever you needed to go. It has Second Chance test strips, right? Meaning you can hit the blood not good enough or mess up a little bit, you know, and go back and get more without wasting the test strip or ruining your accuracy. Now I'm not saying that it needs a lot of blood, cuz it doesn't. I'm just saying if you shouldn't quite get enough The first time you know, like sometimes you'll squeeze in and it won't come out. That's when that that's really helpful. Anyway, that wasn't a very clean explanation. But you get what I'm saying you can go back and get more blood without ruining your test trip for your accuracy. accuracy. Oh, what letter was I leaving out their accuracy, accuracy accurate? Whoo, hello, Contour Next one.com forward slash juicebox. Head over and check it out. It's a terrific website. It's well designed, it'll be easy to get around and use. And you'll be able to learn all about the Contour Next One blood glucose meter, you may actually be eligible for a free meter, you have to see also, there's some test strips Savings Programs, you can look into what else Oh, supplies might actually be cheaper in cash than they are through your insurance company. That'd be crazy, wouldn't it? There's only one way to find out. Contour Next one.com forward slash juicebox. Let's get back to Sean

Shaun Brown 32:53
when I was younger, and it was kind of like, you know, the only thing I was told was don't mess up or you'll have problems. You know? No, I was just fearful of screwing up all the time. I just tried really hard to not screw up as much as possible. But I also didn't know like, you know, I honestly in retrospect, may have gone on a pump like much younger. I was really aware of the benefit. And I can see like how much I could improve control with one

only someone would have invented podcast 25 years ago, you would have been saved? Well, you just said that you were told to just not mess up, or else. Were they specific with you? Did you get the like, you want your legs to fall off and your eyes? The pop out was? Yeah, that type of thing. I was really yeah. Yeah. So first, my pediatrician was kind of on the same. The same thing. And then, you know, when I graduated out of him and went to a new doctor who was recommended to me, who was I was told was a specialist in diabetes, but not technically an endocrinologist, we only have like one endo in town, ironically. And I didn't know that at the time, but my parents were referred to him, you know, and we just went to him because he was highly recommended. And he's a great guy. I'm not gonna, you know, I don't want to throw him under the bus or anything. He's a really nice guy. And he's always helped me out with financial issues that I've had along the way too, right? He's always been like caring about, you know, making things affordable. And I've always appreciated that and he's always been, you know, available via email if I need them or something like that. And he gets back quick. So I can't complain, you know, but at the same time, it's, it's not like I was getting guidance, a whole lot either. You know, he definitely made sure you had the insulin and the syringes. He just didn't

that's about it. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. If he ever listened to this. I'm sorry. I'm not Trying to say you're a bad dude.

Scott Benner 35:03
You think is he still practicing? Yeah, I still see him. have bad blood with my doctor even though Can you imagine? That is an adult need, like Didn't he was like, oh, Sarah, you're here for prescriptions for me? Yeah, I suppose I overthink stuff. It'll be fine. Well, listen, I'm not gonna lie to you. A lot of doctors do listen to this podcast. But I was just interviewing someone yesterday who said they were in the office and doing much better, you know, than they had been doing. And the doctor looks at her and goes, are you being bold with insulin? And she goes, do you listen to and the guy goes, I do. So

Unknown Speaker 35:44
that's pretty cool. does

Scott Benner 35:45
happen. Yeah, I have to say, too, and I'm going to, I'll say it here. And I'll say it in a couple other places. If you are one of those doctors, and you're listening, who recommends the podcast, if you would come on the show anonymously, I'd love to interview you. So

Shaun Brown 36:01
they should do that. I really, I would be impressed if someone stepped up to the plate and did that.

Scott Benner 36:06
You don't have to say your name or anything where you're from, or anything like that. But I would love to, I would love to pick the brain of a person who is in that position and has said to another person. Hey, there's a podcast I think you should listen to. I think that's kind of fascinating to me. Actually. That'd be brilliant. Yeah, but yeah, you'll be alright. Listen, and here's a disclaimer for your guy. You're off the hook. Man. Sean thinks you're cool. Let it go. We're just trying to get out what happens when you're diagnosed A long time ago. And for reasons that, you know, I think we've picked apart now a little bit, your parents didn't look much farther into it a little that you just didn't know. And then you know, you have a kin, who's got a lot of responsibilities with your family. And, I mean, luckily, I guess your stomach started hurting. Seriously.

Shaun Brown 36:50
Yeah, you know, it's so ironic because I tell people now like that. I'm so glad it happened to me, because it really changed my life for the better. Like, you know, I'm still trying to get to where I want to be at. But man, I put me on the right track for sure. And I the irony, though, the irony about that is I've always very, very, very strongly not wanting to be that guy. I've always not wanted to be the guy that waits for you know, shit to hit the you know, yeah. You know what I mean? hands dirty to do something about it. Yeah, you know, I've seen that happen to too many people. And, you know, I I've always been adamant about not being one of those people. Which is ironically, I guess why? I don't I'm not blind yet or something. But, you know, at the same time, I'm not gonna pat myself on the back and Sam like him? Well, I think diabetic either

Scott Benner 37:45
No, it sounds to me like you were playing in the side of the pool that was more aggressive with the insulin. So while your issues were wrapped around lows, which might have helped you a little bit, stay away from the higher one so that you don't know you didn't have a CGM. You could have been 400. And then 50. Right, you have no idea. You

Shaun Brown 38:02
know, that's another thing I think about all the time. And I'm actually very, like, hyper aware. And so I probably because of going hypose so much in the back. I mean, here's a funny thing, like just as a side tangent, just to inform me on like how uninformed like I was for very long. Like when I would give myself insulin, I would just say I took insulin, I didn't even know the word Bolus.

Scott Benner 38:29
here that's not uncommon though. Shawn,

Shaun Brown 38:31
man like stuff like that. I had to I had to like cram for a test for like a year straight pretty much is how I've felt

Scott Benner 38:38
learning diabetes

Shaun Brown 38:39
since last October. Yeah, it's been an interesting. Yeah, because I like, I'd be like, Huh, Basil profile. I'm gonna search that now to like,

Scott Benner 38:53
do you find the defining diabetes episodes helpful?

Shaun Brown 38:56
Yeah, I do. Ironic stuff like Pre-Bolus ng I, it's not like I was unaware of what Pre-Bolus was, but it helped put the idea of it a lot more front and center in a way that was way more expansive than I ever thought about it. Because I was always just told, you know, wait 15 minutes. Yeah, right, you know, and that it doesn't work that way, especially depending on activity level. And I've learned all this like, in a very short span of time, ironically. Now, how much hydration you have, what how sensitive you are at the moment, like all these things change, and I would have never known you know, in the past

Scott Benner 39:40
Yeah. I don't know. I don't get deep into a lot of things. Then and you know, I'm, I'm a, basically a person who enjoys like living like I like being around people I care about. I like having a little bit of entertainment. I like being rested. I like You know, I like watching my kids do things like I'm not a person who picks something and, like, digs super deeply into it all the time I have the interest, I'd never have the motivation, but it wasn't hard to want to pick into the diabetes. Once I noticed that, but even in the beginning for me the first couple of years, I was just you, like, you know, you 18 months ago was me when Arden first had diabetes, I was just like, I don't know what any of this means. I don't know why this is happening. The guy said, 15 minutes, the lady said, half an hour, you know, like you I was doing everything like that. Yeah. And it wasn't until one day where I just, I don't know, I just started picking through it. And I found one little like, it feels like, if diabetes me feels like I'm picking paint off a wall. Like I just I saw a little chip and I pulled it off. I was like, Oh, I wonder what else is under there. And I just kind of kept pulling and pulling until I stood back in it, you know, look like that wall for a memento. And I was like, Oh, I understand all this. And, and I know why this is important. Like, and I and maybe one part of my personality that helped was I don't like platitudes. They make me upset, like so saying something just to say it bothers me outside of diabetes as well. And so that statement, oh, that's just diabetes, which you said here earlier, which was part of your life? And was an answer that I would get back all the time or find online, by the way, because as valuable as online is right now, up until a handful of years ago. Nobody was really being that helpful. It was always very, like aspirational stuff, which I I'm not, I'm not shitting on I think is really valuable. But I mean, it never went farther that nobody was ever like, Hey, you know, here, here's a Pre-Bolus broken down into why and how I no one was telling you that except in maybe a couple of books like I might have to give. You'd have to give john Walsh credit for pumping insulin. That book, like where he broke things down there. I've never read it. But I hear from everybody how amazing it is. And he's and he's been around for a while. Oh, certainly a long while. I think he wrote that book with his wife got I think she's his wife anyway, maybe not. JOHN, come on the show. That'd be nice. But um, but that digging through it. Once I dug through it, and it made sense to me, then it felt really wrong not to tell somebody, like, you know what I mean? Like I thought like, well, now I know, somebody else needs to know toe, I'll just start writing, I'll start telling people that that really, to me is how, you know, I'm not taking credit for the entirety of the space. I'm certainly not saying that. But people doing that is how you ended up. Moving forward. You know what I mean? And had no one ever done that you probably would have just written this, you know, this dumpster fire out to the end and been like, hey, and

Shaun Brown 42:55
I would argue No, no, really, I don't mean I don't I don't, I don't think I would have, I still don't think I would have gotten see I'm like, I'm the type of person where I will read a book. If I have if it's really going to have some nuggets of info information that'll help me out. I really just want to get right to the meat and potatoes of what's going to help me get on track fast. And then I can dig into the the you know, details later. And that's what your podcast offers, in my opinion. It's, it's like it's like, well, I don't I don't I hope I'm not, you know, glossing over all the other great things that it does offer. But But for me, in my experience, it kind of just narrowed it like you know, gave put a bull's eye on what I needed to hear. Right when I needed to hear it instead of having to weed through a ton of other nonsense.

Scott Benner 43:45
I'm glad. And you also said the most masculine thing I've ever heard in my life, which is I'll read a book if I have to. I do read, I actually enjoy reading something I would say by the way. I don't mean it like that. I know. It's funny. No, but I hear what you're saying. Like I got what, like, I'm ready to hear it. Give it to me Don't

Shaun Brown 44:06
Yeah, yeah. Well, you know, I, I find a lot of authors like to really kind of, it's almost like they need to fill the pages or something.

Scott Benner 44:17
So people asked me to write a book about diabetes that happens every once in a while. I'll give publishers will come and say Hey, could you turn your podcast into a book? Or would you do this? And I'm always like, I don't know, man, like diabetes keeps changing, you know, make a book and then amended and amended and amended, and then people have to read it. And what if they read one page and not the other? Yeah, I don't know. You'd almost have to only live in the digital realm where you could just have it on online space where I could constantly change and it would still be a never ending battle and not for nothing, but don't people read books a lot on tape. And so isn't that what this is? And then why do I need to be published about it? Like it just seems? I mean, also, I've been published before, I guess so this excitement of that, isn't it? know what that is, you know what I mean? Like it was, it is really nice, but I don't need to do it again, kind of a feeling. But at the same time I going back to what you said, I agree with you. Less is more. And often it is be direct, right? So tell them what they need to know, don't like you write a book a lot of times it's a lot of filler. And I mean, I could I could write an amazing book about managing your diabetes right now probably about like, 35 pages long. Like is, you know, that's a pasture not a book. Yeah. So and, and I don't and the other thing, too, Shawn, no lie is just had this conversation with somebody on over the weekend. I, I don't like the idea of you or anyone else listening having to pay for this? Like, I don't like that. So I don't think you should have to pay somebody 1995 to know how to Pre-Bolus I don't feel like I should I am not a person who would put up a program online and be like, for just $60 a month, you can understand what I know about that, like that stuff. I don't like that at all. I'm trying not to be harsh about it. Because I know people who do this as a business model. And I don't think that all of them are. I don't think they're bad people. But it rubs me the wrong way. Like

Shaun Brown 46:20
I could I couldn't understand why I mean, you're connected to it in such an intimate way to you know, being that your daughter's diabetic, I mean, you're giving something back to the community. That's, you know,

Scott Benner 46:31
it's such a, it's such a very strong feeling for me that that money should not be the the the the access point to you understanding how protein affects your blood sugar, you know, and so that's why I'm like, while there are some people run around and like, get on people, like you take ads and like take ads, I'm actively looking for ads. I'm like, I want the podcast to get made so that someone can find it. Like Sean, you found that a year ago. And it's done for you what it's done, which is great. But the podcast has been alive for five years prior to that, too. It helped other people who are long gone now. And I need to keep making the podcast to the next you finds the podcast, has these experiences and moves on to a healthier situation. And I just don't know, I'm an American, Shawn, like, this is how things work. I build something popular. You buy an ad on it, I use your money to get my thing to people. Like that's basically what I do I take advertisers money to make a podcast, and you use that podcast for what you use it for. Hopefully it works for you. If it does, you tell somebody else about it, that keeps the podcast moving forward, it's very transparent, and I make some money so that I can spend the time doing this, like you and I are talking right now. I feel like I'm going to die. Just so you know, like, like, I really don't feel good. And, but but this is my job now. So I do this today. And I will edit the show later today so that you have a podcast to listen to on Monday. And like, you know, like, and that takes money. Because if I if I didn't have money from the advertisers, I you know, I'm still I'm a stay at home dad, yes. But I still have to make some money, I'd have to go get a job. At the very least I can't sit up here at this desk for five or six hours every day, which at this point is about what the podcast takes to run. And then what go down to my wife and say, Oh, don't worry, I'm helping people. You know, it's just, I don't know what people think. But that's not how the world works. So you know, but and and I don't want to take money from listeners. I trust me there are people who come along all the time. And they're like, hey, how many downloads do you have? And I tell them and they're like, why don't you charge 89 cents for a download? You'd be wealthy? And I'm like, Huh, seems wrong. really does like seems wrong to me. So you'll know if that ever happens that all the all the advertisers are gone. If all of a sudden you're like, I don't know, back in 2021. He said, he didn't want to do this. But now suddenly the podcast costs money, you'll know that I couldn't get an advertiser for that. And by the way, if I can't get an advertiser, it means no one's listening to the show. So you should probably move on anyway. Seriously, you know, like, think about it. It's just common sense, right? I really am a little woozy. Sean. My head's dancing around a little bit. Hang in there. Hang in there, Scott. Don't worry. I have clear instructions for people for how to release all of the recorded episodes if I should die prematurely. So this could be the end of it right here like and Shawn was the last one ever talked to him? He said he doesn't read and he's he just learned about diabetes after having it for 30 or 30 years. Wow. Can you imagine if you were the last one you'd like come on. Just one more cup out after this terrible summary of who Sean is.

Unknown Speaker 49:56
Yeah, no,

Scott Benner 49:56
you're not obviously you're not in this. You know, I like to really In this last quarter of the show, like really summarize who you are, you're a person who a year ago, figured out a ton of new stuff. And I want to hear about your life now.

Shaun Brown 50:12
Yeah, okay, well, now I eat completely different. And I approach food differently. Also, I also work out every day now, which is completely new to me. I, you know, in the past, it was never a part of the culture of my house, even like, you know, getting exercise and that type of way we play ball, we played, I played baseball, I played on soccer teams, I skateboarded growing up, like, intensively, right, a lot. And after that, you know, I just kind of stopped doing active stuff, but I never, there was never like this idea of like, you know, do this to take care of your diabetes also, but also do this because it'll just, you know, keep your body in tune. It just wasn't a thing that my family did. And I, that's another area where I wish it was part of my routine. And early on, because it would have, I think, just that even alone would have set me up for a lot more success.

Scott Benner 51:20
I'm gonna find out more about that. So how did you change your eating first.

Shaun Brown 51:24
So I had already been like toying with the idea of, you know, cutting me out of my diet for a while, because I would always notice, I just didn't feel very awesome when I would eat it. And I enjoyed it. I it's not like I didn't like eating it. But I, I always found like, it just, I would kind of feel sluggish, I would feel good gross afterwards. And it wasn't like a blood sugar thing. That was the concern so much. It was more just like, I didn't enjoy how I felt. You know? And so I it kind of weirdly graduated me to going completely vegan, weirdly, I just, I was like, Well, here's another thing I don't really want to have in my diet anymore. Let me see if I pull this out if this will help. And and then I kind of was like, Well, I'm already pulling this out. Let me see. You go down rabbit rabbit hole real easy once you start kind of just researching, you know, different new ways to proceed with you know, diet, and I stumbled upon the mastering diabetes guys, by complete happenstance, it wasn't I the name of their, their organization, or if the anonymous they are organization, but the team of two guys who who are like real hardcore about, you know, teaching about what causes insulin resistance and informing you on how to how to reduce your insulin resistance via diet and exercise, essentially. But I didn't mean to go to them for diet advice or diabetes advice. I was actually googling online, how to figure out my insulin to carb ratio, and it came up. So I was like, oh, check this out, too. You know, because, for me, like, it's even the idea of the math of doing like, insulin dosing was never something I really did until recently. And so I and I had periodically asked my doctor over the years, like, well, like, how do I figure this out? And he just be like, you know, that's something you just get it changes, like, he would always kind of give me a wishy washy answer. And then I think he honestly didn't know what to tell me. Yeah. And, and so he would, he would write at the time, we did have one endo in his practice, but I didn't see any purpose of going to one because I was always told I was on the right track. And my agency was in range and doing good, you know, so I just thought, like, what is the purpose of Siena, endo? At that point. And so but I also needed advice on like, how did I figure these things out and like, have like a starting point. And so I would periodically Google these things over the years, not not just up until a year ago. Now, I would always feel kind of dumbfounded because I wouldn't just find like, exactly what I was looking for. So just keep doing what I was doing, which was go by the ebb and flow of how my blood sugars were, and just, you know, correct as needed. And I finally found like one website that actually really did summarize how to get your insulin to carb ratio and your ISF. And, I mean, I'm assuming it's accurate, because I've been using this information for years like now Come

Scott Benner 54:53
to think of it. I just did find it on the internet. It was a What is it? Should I not name a website right on your show, it doesn't matter to me. Okay.

Shaun Brown 55:02
Yeah, it was, um, I'm trying to remember it was like I you know, I don't remember anymore. It's a popular it's, it's it's something it's like diabetes info dotnet or something like that I can't honestly can't remember what it was now, even just

Scott Benner 55:18
like anyhow, probably just sent everybody to a porn site. So yeah,

Shaun Brown 55:20
sorry, guys. So anyhow, what I did was I started, you know, doing the math with that the best I could. And I started kind of, like getting me at least started with, like having a truer idea of, you know, how it was really dosing. And, and eventually I even like found a really cool app that lets you take an Excel spreadsheet that that you can, like, you know, put math into, and then you can make the Excel into an app. And so I have a little app on my phone that I built, essentially, that uses that math that I call ratios, I just it's like right next to my and pen app, and I'll adjust it on the fly. Like I'll, I'll assess my seven day, report in in pen. And I'll go off of that. And I'll kind of keep changing my baseline is on the carbon ISF from that. And then I'm still too much of a dummy to like know, how to, like, mathematically quantify what what my daytime and nighttime icy and ISF are. But I know just from the feel of how things go like in the morning, I usually need to have to a unit more on top of recommendation. And at lunch, I'm about recommendation. And that dinner, I'm like a half unit to unit less than recommendation often interesting what whatever that quantifies to so like in, in this little, you know, app thing and I made based on the information I found on that website, I set one field to my way, another field to my Bolus, my total Bolus amount, another field to my total base basil amount, and that gives me my, you know, total daily dose. And then after that it spits out the insulin to carb ratio. But you know, it's like their formula was like 2.6, you know, times your weight divided by your your total daily dose type of thing. And that's, that's what I'm going off of. So that's correct.

Scott Benner 57:31
If it's working for you, it's great. Yeah, it can be working.

Shaun Brown 57:34
But I still feel like it always needs a little fine tuning like, I feel like so then there's the ISF and I kind of built this into the app to where you kind of play with the rule, the standard rule was always like 18 100. But then I learned on that same website that I guess if you're, if you're a real 5050 split, this is my understanding anyways, like if you're, if your your basil is about 50, your Bolus is about 50, then you kind of apparently, and please don't quote me on this because I could be absolutely wrong. But that's more when you use 1800. But if your basil is less, and your Bolus is a little more, you kind of play with the rule and move it down to like, you know, 1750 or 1700. So I because of my ratio, excuse me, I have mine at like 1700. And then that kind of you know, helps me calculate out my ISF.

Scott Benner 58:34
So I think Jenny just explained the 1800 rule on the podcast the other day, it's interesting that you're bringing it up right now about how endos find those your insulin sensitivity factor, but by the way, just so people know, whatever. I just checked the the URL you said and it is not where you

Shaun Brown 58:53
Yeah, you know what here don't go you're done cuz I got my boots, that's all. But now that I know that was wrong, it's diabetes net. Let me see diabetes net calm.

Scott Benner 59:05
Sorry about that. Okay, so yeah, the other one is just like a link farm. Sorry. It's just it's one of those somebody grabbed it because I thought it was a good URL that people might type in. It's funny. I've never heard the one handed there, man. No, you're good. I appreciate you talking about I it's funny. I've never seen this website before in my life.

Shaun Brown 59:26
I only found it because it was like the only place that that really dug into insolent action times. And also, what else? Just like, you know, figuring out your insulin to carb and all that, like in an understandable way that, you know, my simple brain can figure out

Scott Benner 59:43
I'm glad you found something. Give me that cisors I've never seen this website my life. That's interesting. Yeah, look, it almost looks fake. You're not exactly selling it. Just enough. Yeah, so I'm

Unknown Speaker 1:00:03
cracking up for a second,

Shaun Brown 1:00:05
though. That's really dope on those guys as well. guys actually helped me out. I just wanted to let you know,

Scott Benner 1:00:12
for your trouble, I wanted to let you know that your site looks fake. No, um, I think that's cool that you figured stuff out like that, that you were just like, I need to know how to do this. No one's telling me but she wanted at this point, like, how can we haven't just found an endo that you really like? You just don't think it's necessary.

Shaun Brown 1:00:30
So I never was really, I was always reassured I was doing a good job. And I was always put the whole like, sorry,

Scott Benner 1:00:40
do you think you were Do you think somebody was just telling you that he didn't know what they were talking about?

Shaun Brown 1:00:44
Well, naively at the time, I really did think I was doing well. And I guess I knew like, you know, I definitely knew for sure, you know, I need to cut back on my drinking at the time. I always knew that was like, a big No, no. But like, you know, I knew I needed to lose some weight at the time, I was pretty, I was getting heavier. And I knew I needed to get more activity. But beyond stuff like that, you know, I just thought like, Well, every time I would always be super nervous to get my labs and then my labs would come back and I wouldn't have red flags, or anything look good. You know, eventually, I began to have really high cholesterol. And that was one of the that was another one of the main reasons I changed my diet, which I totally forgot to mention was for about maybe five years straight. I had really bad cholesterol, and I completely annihilated that going off and plant base.

Scott Benner 1:01:40
I have to ask you a question. It's gonna sound like I'm joking, but I'm not. What you wake up. There's three paramedics standing over top of you. You think this is okay. Doctor said I'm doing good. No, no, no, absolutely

Shaun Brown 1:01:51
not. I never thought it was okay. Or, you know, it always just made me feel like well, you know, I really, I really messed up and I see Okay, let me try not to repeat what got me there the last time.

Scott Benner 1:02:04
So it felt like a fumble. Like I'm playing a great game. I just dropped the ball for a second.

Shaun Brown 1:02:09
Yeah, gotcha. Yeah. You know, and I guess you can say got it just got normalized because it happened throughout my life, not like a ton, but enough to to the point where it was just part of my life. You know, like, I remember in high school, which was probably the first time it happened. I passed out on the quad. Like on my way from one class to another, I had just gotten Oh, yeah. And I and I didn't realize it, I passed out. I woke up with paramedics. I was told I even seized

Scott Benner 1:02:42
HD my whole goal was to see everything I just said my whole goal used to be just that Arden was never the kid who passed out at school. That was like the first way I used to think of it but then that led me to you know, her blood sugar higher than I wanted it to be. And then soon my goal morphed into how can I keep her blood sugar down but stable in a way where it won't just randomly drop anywhere? And then you know, he just kept picking through things and picking through things and until the the insulin made more and more sense to me about how to use it where to put it where to take it away you know when to be more aggressive and less aggressive and all that stuff. But yeah, it all started with that like oh god I just don't want Arden to like I don't want the story to be that girl passed out at school. You know, it was like my first thought when she was a little you testing your blood sugar now.

Shaun Brown 1:03:40
I'm actually given a Bolus because I am blue it when I I kind of heavy handed my breakfast and I ended up kind of going low right before the the podcast and I was like, Well, I don't want to go on go low. During the podcast,

Scott Benner 1:04:00
I find myself wondering how often people are like, I really have to do a good job with my blood sugar water.

Shaun Brown 1:04:06
Pressure, like I actually kind of blew it. So I ate a whole persimmon which persimmons are kind of that's like 20 grams,

Scott Benner 1:04:13
then you went up? Yeah, just a little too much. So I did an interesting interview with an older person the other day. Who has gastro precice on top of you know, other stuff. And she got low during the show. And we kept going was really interesting like she treadle allow it didn't come up, but she traded it again. Her diabetes alert dog started bothering her. It was really like we can stop and she's like, No, no, it's okay. She's like, Yeah, and I was like, okay, so we kept going and it was it was interesting. It really it really was. I felt like I was watching it happen to my daughter but through headphones, kind of a kind of a thing.

Shaun Brown 1:04:53
I often wonder if that's something that it may be linked to the stomach issues that I was having, because I didn't know about Either and I had just learned about that recently, the Gasser purchases?

Scott Benner 1:05:03
Well, I think if I mean the very basic, I'm obviously not a doctor, but if your food is digesting the way you expect it to, you're not having any other neuropathy issues or nerve issues.

Shaun Brown 1:05:17
So that was another reason that I definitely was like, I need to get my act together was I was, you know, when I didn't go to sleep, I started getting to the point where I was worried I was beginning to experience neuropathy, and I wouldn't I would tell my dog like, Hey, is this neuropathy? I think I might have it, you know, me and he would kind of quiz me on it and then tell me no, no, that's not really neuropathy. So I don't know if he's just, dude, where are you gonna sleep here?

Scott Benner 1:05:45
What public state you live in? You're in California, aren't you? Yeah, I mean, California. That seems like a place where they have doctors. We got them exist. Let me just give you the neuropathy quiz real quick. Batman or Superman, Shawn? Oh, yeah, you're fine. Don't worry about it. Let's get out of your crazy kid. How many times have the ambulance come to here twice? Doing great buddy. Yeah.

Shaun Brown 1:06:13
I mean, I don't know. I honestly, I debate if I do I if I do. It's extremely minor. But like, to give you an example, I hate the weight of the sheets on my toes. If my toes are, like being pulled down by this by though, like the weight of the conference or too much. But I don't know if that really like qualifies as neuropathy. To be honest, have

Scott Benner 1:06:41
you had that your whole life or just more recently,

Shaun Brown 1:06:44
more into like my, into my 30s? Yeah. And so I always like that was what started me being all paranoid about it.

Scott Benner 1:06:52
Do you have any other tactile issues, the things you don't like touching you? Or sounds or tastes like things textures in your mouth? anything weird like that? case, really, just like stuff that throws your way off or you don't like the feeling of something in your mouth? Or you can't talk No,

Shaun Brown 1:07:09
not like that. No, no, no. Okay, but like, I like if I get a high blood sugar, and I think this is more a symptom of hyperglycemia. But like, I will experience like, in my sciences, my sciences will feel like dry and almost like I'm smelling metal sometimes. And that drives me nuts. Like, I will almost think like that's odd, you know, just because my sciences always seemed a little off.

Scott Benner 1:07:44
Or your is your blood sugar a certain way when you smell metal high?

Shaun Brown 1:07:50
No, it could be like, so for me, like I here's, here's a tidbit. Like just when No, it's not like that high. Like if it's just maybe going up. But like, if if I'm even like above 130 these days, I hate it. Like I can't stand it. Like I have to make sure that like it's one of the things that I think in general always kind of kept me taking care of myself pretty well. Is I absolutely despise the way it feels like to be terribly out of range anyways, even though I admittedly I was worse, but I was younger.

Scott Benner 1:08:24
Well, I think that's, listen, I I'm sorry, if you don't feel well, but I think it's great that you've because that what that tells me is that you've gotten your blood sugar so stable, and in a good range that you can tell now when when things aren't the way they're supposed to be?

Shaun Brown 1:08:41
Yeah, I would, I would definitely say that time and range was completely foreign to me. When, you know, not very long ago. I mean, I knew what time and range was, but I never understood the emphasis of it. I never understood like, how vital that is compared to other things ironically, because like now, you know, I can probably say like, you my standard deviation, which I also had no idea what what what that was, you know, ranges anywhere from, like, 20 to, you know, 28 often on an average basis as long as I have my basil locked down, which I'm really proud of, because I can only imagine it wants to be in complete garbage in the past, you know?

Scott Benner 1:09:22
Yeah, dude, I can't imagine either because you said you lost your data, but I had I was thinking that the way you were going especially from such a young age on your own like you're a one sees must have been pretty bonkers at some points,

Shaun Brown 1:09:34
I would think Yeah, and I mean, we ate like typical, you know, regular stuff, you know, go to pizza. I'd have like three slices type of thing. So

Scott Benner 1:09:44
think about that. Now, like if you had three slices of pizza now, how much insulin would that take?

Shaun Brown 1:09:49
Well, so here's the weird thing is since going vegan, my insulin needs dramatically dropped like so, so much. And also what I've learned is Removing or reducing fats as much as possible dramatically improves my sensitivity, like your measure to the point where I will have problems with hypose quite frequently, if I get a lot of activity Plus, I mean, I've eaten very lean that day.

Scott Benner 1:10:16
Yeah, right. Well, keeping the fat out of your diet helps the food to digest more quickly and get through you. And, and not Yeah,

Shaun Brown 1:10:22
it builds insulin resistance, which I never understood until now, you know, so

Scott Benner 1:10:29
the fat Yeah, the fat in your diet builds insulin resistance, I would think of it as the fat in your diet is slowing digestion down, which keeps the food in your system longer impacting your blood sugar. I don't know that I call that a resistance to insulin. It's an it seems like a need for insulin to me. But it might just be semantics. I'm not sure exactly how you're thinking

Shaun Brown 1:10:48
No, well, that that's correct. And like the immediate I think, but when when you're say consuming ample amounts of like, you know, animal protein that also is bundled with cholesterol, and, you know, saturated fats even, or you're also eating processed foods that have saturated fats or dairy products that have a ton, which dairy typically has a lot of saturated fat. And you're eating that consistently in the immediate Yes, it's like slowing your digestion and, and changing your insulin needs and kind of stretching them out and awkward, more dynamic ways. But

Scott Benner 1:11:27
I'm sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off. No worries. I was just gonna say it's really kind of fascinating, because I've been talking to people about how they eat more recently. Excuse me. And that same argument made by I hear made by a vegan, or by somebody eating carnivore, they're making the same, the same claim about eating a certain way. And I know I've heard that and each person's argument is poo pooed. By the other side, it's very interesting like this, you know, I'm not trying to Oh, no, no, no, don't do No, I understand. Go on. Sorry, I just I weren't, I wasn't saying you were starting some, like turf war about eating. I just, I'm like, I'm just kind of, it's fascinating, that it can work really well, for one person. Like eating the way you're eating, obviously, is doing a great thing for you. And it's really fantastic. And then I've had people on here, like, I just eat meat, and they have the exact same outcomes. I just, I always wonder why. I always wonder why they have opinions about the opposite, the opposite way of eating. That's the part I'm always confused about. I'm like, why does it matter to you? If this is working for you? And that's working for them? Yeah, who cares? You know, but

Shaun Brown 1:12:41
I don't personally, I care more about just, you know, my, I mean, people can eat however they want to eat. But when it comes to how I consume food, with anything, really, I want to know, you know, is it back? Is there science backing these days? Anyways, when I approach eating food, I want to know, is there like, you know, sound science backing the way that I'm choosing to eat? And does it make sense at all? Aside from pleasure, you know, like, does it make sense that I'm cutting this out of my diet? or putting this back in? And there's a lot of, like, evidence supporting, at least to my understanding, you know, removing animal products and dairy because of, you know, how they because like, one of the number one things that diabetics die from, is, you know, heart attack, or basically, cardiovascular related issues. Yeah. Right. And that's, like, it's one of the number one things and when you, you know, consume a lot of high saturated fat foods, you're contributing to that, essentially.

Scott Benner 1:13:51
So I have two separate thoughts here. I'm gonna lose one of them if I don't get it out of my head. I think I am really woozy. What was the first thing I was gonna say? Dammit, dammit. Dammit. Dammit, dammit. Oh, I loved what you said earlier about this. The way I'm eating now fits me. Like in the end. Like, that's my opinion of eating like, everyone's body is going to be different to some degree. Yeah, totally. You gotta eat something that works for you. You know, I don't think it would matter what it is it needs to work for you on all levels. And the other thing I want to say is, while I'm not making the point that being unhealthy is good for your heart. I am saying that a lot of people with diabetes die from cardiovascular issues because they're uncontrolled blood sugars, cause rips and tears in arteries that then repair themselves and eventually clog arteries and stop blood flow and give them a heart attack. So not that not that having a healthy heart otherwise isn't really important. But I don't but I don't want to leave anybody with the idea that if you just eat a bunch of stuff that's bad for your heart, that you're automatically going to have a heart attack because you have diabetes. Is it in my understanding that is got a lot to do with your, your blood sugar management, you're keeping a good time and range, you know, not fluctuating up and down all the time. That sort of stuff is is Yeah,

Shaun Brown 1:15:14
absolutely. I mean, no matter how how you eat if you're if you're not, I mean as as a type one if you're not controlling it at the same time. I mean that,

Scott Benner 1:15:26
yeah, you don't ask for complicated you don't want to compound it by doing two things at the same time. Right? Right. It's just, it's really, it's, I don't know, I find the whole thing kind of fascinating. I feel way better when I eat more meat, and less carbs. So like that, that works better for me. You know, a lot of my eggs, Turkey, chicken, some beef. Like that whole, like, like, leaning in that direction. leads me to a better day. It's fascinating. And I that's why when you said earlier like that, that really wasn't good for you. I was like, Oh, that's really interesting. How people are so different. You know? It's really cool, actually.

Shaun Brown 1:16:10
Yeah, I mean, I'm really just trying to kind of plan out being able to be here, man, I just want to stick around. And so you know, when I when I it's it's like, it's this it for me, it's the same thing is like cutting toxins out of out of, you know, the things that I consume, or whatever it is, you've been

Scott Benner 1:16:29
out of your body that your body doesn't want their and longevity, by the way. I'm glad you said that. Because in the end, that's really what we're all talking about. It's about Yeah, yeah, it's about staying here.

Shaun Brown 1:16:39
Yeah, absolutely. And so, um, you know, it just makes sense to me. I mean, if you guys if there's people out there that want to eat nothing but slim gems, and they have standard deviation and 15 or something awesome, dude. I mean, I hope that works out for you. And then but

Scott Benner 1:16:58
I gotta say, I don't think Slim Jims is exactly what we're talking about. Let's go with slim Jen. Yeah, I think I think that guy was on a little while ago. And I think he you know, he made the point at some point that when I'm talking when he said I'm talking about eating meat, like he wasn't talking about, like hotdogs, and you know, like, like, that doesn't count. It was a bad sorry. No, no, bad. No, no, I don't think it's a bad thing. Because I do think people can get confused. And think, Oh, I'm very, like, you know, I do this this way. I yesterday I had ring Bologna. Yeah, that's not the same thing. As as a, you know, maybe a well prepared, I don't know, well raised piece of meat, like, you know, I don't think they're, I don't think they're commiserate in the same because you're still processing with food, then when you're making hotdogs or making stuff like that, just because there's no carbs in them doesn't make them not processed. Anyway, I

Shaun Brown 1:17:51
had no idea what I what I found with food is that people are very attached to the way that they eat. And so I mean, most people will, very vehemently argue whatever it is, in the way that they you know, you know,

Scott Benner 1:18:04
it's funny, I take your point, because I've seen it too. But I sort of think of it as more of it's more of an internet thing. I don't I don't it to become that for sure. Yeah. Meaning if you put 10 people in a room and gave him you know, and we were all sitting around talk and somebody said, Hey, I'm eating vegan, that's been really good for me. I don't think someone across the room would stand up and go, you're wrong. I think people would just be like, oh, wow, Sean's a vegan. That's cool. And let it go. I think it becomes something you attach your it's not like an identity component. Yeah, it's not unlike other things you see online where people are virtue signaling, right? They want to make sure that you know that they are on the right side of this argument. Whenever I forget food from it, whatever the argument is, I know better. And I want to make sure everyone knows that I know better for I don't know what psychological reason that is that. I don't know how that helps you. But it seems very important to people.

Shaun Brown 1:19:02
I think it's I guess it's what like a kind of a dominance thing, potentially. I don't know.

Scott Benner 1:19:09
I always thought it was just currency. Well, yeah, I would, I would probably say that more. Yeah, it's Yeah. And then you get a group to accept you. And then you have, then you have community. Right, because you're against it. Again, yeah, adoration for the way that you think you could do it with politics. You can do it with food, you can do it with a lot of different things like, Oh, I'm on the side of this, because good reasons. Like I've, you know, it's I've never heard anybody argue one side of anything, and not come forward with a ton of good, you know, good, reasonable ideas. like nobody says, You don't mean like no, one side doesn't say I'm for good eating. And this is what good eating looks like and the other side's like, eight paper and weeds I find in the yard, and I smoke black tar heroin, and I'm helping out And I want to make my argument about being healthy now like nobody ever does that, like everybody thinks they're you. Because probably because they're doing it in a way that's obviously working for them. And so then you get that feeling of like, I need to tell other people like I just talked about it earlier, right? Like, I learned how to use insulin. And I wanted to tell other people because I saw how it saved my daughter.

Shaun Brown 1:20:20
Yeah, I absolutely agree with that. Yeah. And I think when you feel like you're on the right track, you do want to inform people and like, Hey, man, this is this is doing a big thing for me. Yeah, you should try it out to type of thing. I mean, I think in that sense, is quite harmless. If you're just trying to help people, it's when it becomes you know, like your those are the kind of you get on a soapbox, and you kind of have to tell people like this is the way that I think when when you get to that degree, then you've kind of crossed the line. Yeah, potential.

Scott Benner 1:20:51
Oh, no, no, yeah, there are fringes to everything. So you know, you're, I think most people are pretty, you know, I'm gonna use a word that sounds political, but it's not but I think most people are moderate and they're thinking about most things. Right. And there's some people don't lean in different directions. I'm not saying left or right. I'm saying like, you know, a little more vegan, I'm a little more beefy, I'm a little more about, I don't eat processed foods. And some people are like, screw you. I'm gonna have a Twinkie but I learned how to Bolus for like, everybody's got their own kind of like, vibe. It the people who scream and yell I always think of as being on the as far away from the centers as possible. Like they're they're

Shaun Brown 1:21:30
probably the most undecided in the end to ironically, I would think that's interesting. Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:21:35
I just know that.

Shaun Brown 1:21:36
Maybe that that confident in themselves after all, and I feel like they need to be louder about it. But who knows?

Scott Benner 1:21:42
I have no idea in the in In the meantime, and super sincerely. I think that's fine. If you're out on the fringe, and you don't really relate to anything anyone saying and you feel passionately about it. You young I've never looked at one of those people and thought, oh my god, they have no right to be you know, I don't care. Like I think it's great if everybody says what they think so yeah, should go with me. That's all. Sean, this was good. I probably used up every ounce of energy I have today to talk to you. And I think it was well worth it. But it's possible. I'm gonna stop this recording and crash. Not not wake up for a couple of hours. Did we not get to anything you want to talk about? Um,

Shaun Brown 1:22:26
there's so much more I can say. But you know, I'm gonna let you go, man. Sounds like you're not doing well.

Scott Benner 1:22:30
No, no, listen, I'm just you know, I'm a little euphoric at this point. Like, things are coming back around. I'm seeing colors. And now I'm just kidding. No, but seriously, is it? Did you have anything you want to talk about that? We didn't get to tell me if we did? I wouldn't ask if I didn't wanna know. You know, not really. It was a good chat, though. Scott had a good time. Did you really have fun? Yeah, man, I'm glad you had me on. I was thrilled that I was glad to hear from you. I think it's amazing as an adult, for you to have found. I mean, you move to so far from where you started, in a year, like your first emails were like, they had panic in them almost. It was, it was like someone showed you a completely different world that you didn't know existed, and you were excited to find out about it. And absolutely, yeah, it's really cool to see how much you've like absorbed on the way do you think you're gonna get a pump?

Shaun Brown 1:23:25
So I actually tried to like six months ago. And then it was a weird thing where I was told by the doctor's office that my insurance had slowed it down. But then I left it alone, because I was bummed about it. And I didn't I figured, well, I'm not going to get it then. And then I think, I don't know if it was like three months ago or so I had called my insurance to check in again, just to see like, you know, how much is it going to cut? Am I going to be covered on these? And they they are apparently going to cover it? So I don't know if there was a miscommunication or what, but I guess I could have already been online like six months ago.

Scott Benner 1:24:06
Oh, no kidding. Well, I hope you get what you want.

Shaun Brown 1:24:08
I have to tell you that you I'm a little terrified of trying to figure out how to make the I'm so used to like low tech, so I do need guidance on it. That's the only thing is I really want to feel like I'm making at least an informed starting point with one well, you know

Scott Benner 1:24:25
your settings, right? Like you do know how much how much do you use in a day. So here let me look at set your pump up right now. You know,

Shaun Brown 1:24:38
my bad I don't even need to look that up. So I take right currently I'm taking nine units of lantis. Which, just as a side note, man, I absolutely love lantis these days, like it was working for me quite well. And then as I leaned out and lost weight and became more sensitive and needed almost like half units which I can't administer with Those solo stars. It's just a pain in the butt.

Scott Benner 1:25:05
Okay.

Shaun Brown 1:25:06
Well, it has a terrible peak to like Jenny noted in one of the podcasts. Yeah, it has, it has a terrible peak that it will always wake me up at like two in the morning. It drives me insane. And the thing is, is if I'm like, it's a very like, like hair trigger type of insulin. So if you take if I take, like seven units at night, and two in the morning, I get an even keel through the day. And in my mind, blood sugar's look amazing. And my graph looks quite flat overall. But if I but I'll go hypo at night, which I don't want, obviously. So then if I back off on my lantis, split dose, and I go to six, and then I swap that unit over into the day, right? And so I'm doing like six and three. All my night will look better. But then it just, it completely takes a dump of my day, like to the point where I no longer have any coverage for Dom phenomenon at all. My am cortisol spike like is like a sledgehammer. I need like immense amounts of Bolus insulin throughout the day for every meal

Scott Benner 1:26:14
shown here. It's love a pump.

Shaun Brown 1:26:17
It's tough man. And so I'm just sick of that. And I'm honestly, one thing I'm worried about with the pump is I'm so damn thin now. I'm like, I'm worried about like trying to put one on my legs. Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:26:30
now I'm sure you'd be able to find place I've seen thinner people than you wear them less and less, your basil is gonna start at around point 375 point three, five, like somewhere around there an hour, you probably need a little more It sounds like you know, in the in the morning, then you'll need you know, overnight, and you'll just you'll make a couple of GDC I think the way you're thinking about all this really would lend to digging deeper and and

Shaun Brown 1:26:56
I honestly want to loop like I would love to start looping that sounds amazing. Do my iMac is like seriously antiquated and I in it. From my research. I don't think I can build the app or whatever you might have with my computer. And I'm doing we're scraping by right now. So I can't really get a new computer.

Scott Benner 1:27:17
What I'm what I'm pumped Are you thinking about

Shaun Brown 1:27:20
I was I really never was interested in palms when I was younger, primarily because of the tubing. And so when I saw when I saw Omnipod hit the market before I even knew about your podcast, I thought it was intriguing, but I didn't learn much about it. It's kind of the same thing with like, the Dexcom what I was watching it, I was always watching diabetes tech, but I was always unimpressed. To be honest. Like I I remember seeing like the the earlier Dexcom and just being like, ooh, the applicator does not look fun, you know. And then when the six came out, I was like, I can mess with that, you know. So then the more I listened to the podcast and heard you guys kind of pitching it to I thought well, actually doesn't sound that bad. I saw a lot of people on it using it. And I actually looked quite painless. And I that was one of the best things I ever did for myself was getting the Dexcom Yeah, to

Scott Benner 1:28:10
be honest, I have to be honest, either applicator works fine. Like the auto one with the G six is great, but I didn't have any trouble putting it on but the G five and before I get that it looked more

Shaun Brown 1:28:20
it was intimidating for sure. Coming from you know, an old head like me,

Scott Benner 1:28:25
you're not the only one who thought about that way either. I don't think that they made that applicator for fun. I think they made it because it was a it was a an impediment for a lot of people to try.

Shaun Brown 1:28:33
Yeah, it looked like a science experiment, but

Scott Benner 1:28:36
just pulled up on the ring and pushed down to the thing at the same time. I remember, oh my God, I've done so many of them.

Shaun Brown 1:28:43
Yeah, so any Anyhow, I would very likely if I'm gonna go pump it all going on the pod just because to my knowledge is the only one of its kind.

Scott Benner 1:28:53
So your play in my opinion, that is you wait until 2021. And you try the on the pod five the horizon? And is that one that drops? That's Yeah, it'll, it'll be in the, from what I understand it should be in the first half of 2021 you won't need a computer. And the really cool thing about it is that the algorithm will be burned, right, like baked right into the right itself. So you don't even need to be near your phone for it to work.

Shaun Brown 1:29:21
I'm definitely very interested in that. I'm just more wary of like, like making user error with programming. Because I want to feel like I'm starting on a on a like a safe starting point with it. Well, you know, I'm a smart Dude, I can figure it out from there on out but like, you know, I do feel like I I need a little guidance in that department. I understand. I definitely don't think I'm gonna get it from my doctors.

Scott Benner 1:29:46
Well, I agree with you. I think that algorithms in general as they're coming into the market, are the I think one of the problems they're having is the support of how to set them up. But really, you're just looking to get your basil right your you know, your sensitivity Close and then you'll see what happens. You can move it around a little bit till you find it.

Shaun Brown 1:30:04
You're trying to go but humor me real quick joking. You can program your basil to like, build around your knees through the day, correct? Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:30:15
man, you could have point three to five overnight for a couple of hours and then say you're gonna wake up every day at seven. And you get some feet on the floor some kind of a rise around seven 730. You can have your Misal go up the point for born four or five at 6am. So that it's build up for when you wake up in the morning. Oh, yeah, yeah,

Shaun Brown 1:30:34
I know exactly. When that happens. Now, too, I would have never known it without, you know, seeing my data from the CGM?

Scott Benner 1:30:40
No, no 100 per day, you can absolutely do that. And if you like, you know, look, if you you know, if you get low every day, blah, blah, blah, you can change if you have a meal that you eat, and you know, you get higher from this meal, but it doesn't happen with any other meal, you could like do a Temp Basal increase like you can, I don't I don't know

Shaun Brown 1:30:57
this stuff is that's so foreign to me. That's why I'd be like a little intimidated, those only thing, just think of it this way.

Scott Benner 1:31:03
Think of it having your lantis on a dimmer switch like a light. And you being able to like Turn it up or turn it down when your needs and you can automate the light. So it happens at certain times. That's awesome. A weaker, that's all it is. It's having control over your Basal insulin. I think that's still the biggest deal about a pump. And that's the side of algorithms because in algorithms, you there won't be Temp Basal increases and decreases, because the algorithm is going to do that kind of stuff for you. But But yeah, I mean, just on a regular if you just got a regular old on the pot right now you'd have, you'd have, you know, control over all that stuff.

Shaun Brown 1:31:42
That's what I was going to get. And then I kind of I don't know, got lost in the ether, and I just didn't get it.

Scott Benner 1:31:48
Yeah, I think if you um, I mean, it's November now. I mean, I don't really know when it's going to come out come out. But if you've got the okay to do it, try the Omni pod now learn how to use it kind of more manually, the way it is set up now and then make your decision. If you want to go to the algorithm when it's available. What

Shaun Brown 1:32:04
is the minimum amount of insulin that you put it into the pot at?

Unknown Speaker 1:32:09
I think 70 or 80? I haven't used that a minimum amount in a while. But you'll use,

Shaun Brown 1:32:15
like, good. I'm just doing the math real quick, because I use it about and that'll be about right. Yeah. Although I'm assuming that we weigh less actually, because you're only using one insulin?

Scott Benner 1:32:28
Well, because Wouldn't it be or Wouldn't it be more because you're you're going to use so you're going to use point, but I just say

Shaun Brown 1:32:37
well, I was looking at my total daily dose, like you know, Basil plus Bolus type of thing. And at the moment, I'm at 24.40, you're

Scott Benner 1:32:45
not need more than 80 then because you're going to use Yeah, I'm gonna use 27 units at a minimum, I would think for just your basil. And then 24 times 372 plus 27, you're gonna probably use about 100 units every three days.

Shaun Brown 1:33:00
Okay, cuz that my concern too was like, I don't want to waste insulin. Sure. Just but I'm very naive to it, because I don't know like how much it actually be using. And I just know I'm using a dramatic Li less amount than I used to use.

Scott Benner 1:33:15
Yeah, I'm looking at now the pot holds 200 units. at its maximum, it holds a minimum of 85 you won't waste that you're going to use more than 85 every three days. You know what what rapid do you guys do? Arden uses a Peter.

Shaun Brown 1:33:29
See, I've never experimented with any other analogues beyond novolog and Himalayan, which are essentially the same thing.

Scott Benner 1:33:36
Yeah, we've used novolog. I found it to peak like too harshly for Arden. And she'd crash a lot afterwards. And try it and

Shaun Brown 1:33:47
I experienced that myself, which is which is kind of that was what I want to ask.

Scott Benner 1:33:51
Yeah. So then we tried to Peter I find a feature to work very predictably and smoothly. Like I know how a pizza works after using it for so many years, and I'm good at using it. But Arden tried fiasco recently. And that was really good. And yeah, I caught that episode. He said it stung. Yeah, but it didn't work for her. Her physiology but the way it worked specifically was good. Like, we didn't have to Pre-Bolus as long we could be she could like have food that was I don't know how to put it like like stronger carb food. Because it was working more quickly. We weren't seeing as many like spikes her but I think if I could have kept her on it for a long time. I actually think I could have brought her a one c down a little farther. And I think that I think that her stable times would have been more stable. It worked really well. It just burned and Brewster and she just couldn't use it. Yeah.

Shaun Brown 1:34:45
So it does a Peter have the same type of action or is it different?

Scott Benner 1:34:50
a pizza doesn't I? The way I used to explain a pizza to people is that I haven't seen double arrows up or down and I don't really see single out arrows up or down ever on a pizza? Huh? So it can be very user, like driven but I am good at it. I'm not saying that but I'm saying Yeah, I just I was good at it when I had no vlog and it didn't matter. Like, I wasn't as good with no vlog as I am with a pager. And that's interesting. Yeah. So it's, it's, it's got like a different slope, then. I don't know, dude, I don't know what it is. But no vlog felt like it went in, took forever to work and then worked really, really intensely and then stopped. And

Shaun Brown 1:35:32
that's Yeah, that's my experience. That's I mean, I pretty much use novolog my entire life. I'm just kind of used to it. It can definitely be a pain in the butt.

Scott Benner 1:35:41
fiasco times started working right away, and felt like it was out of our system

Shaun Brown 1:35:46
sooner. Really, in a Piedra, say I wish we talked about it. And instead of me talking about my my mess ups all the time when we talk about this stuff before we are talking about it. Don't worry, I don't want to keep you man. I

Scott Benner 1:36:00
know. I still haven't thanked you. You do this thing that I don't know that you realize is the thing for me. But when you really like an episode, you share it on Instagram. And oh, yeah, I'm happy to share him. No, but it's not because that's not what I'm saying. I'm happy to share them too. But you're one of the people that when I see you share it. I feel like oh, because you don't blindly share everything. So I know when I did a good job because you share the episode. Like that's one of the ways I tell how I'm doing.

Shaun Brown 1:36:28
I would not use Shawn as a barometer. But I appreciate that. Shawn is not a good barometer. No. Is that the title that I do? I'll take the pat on the back. I dig it.

Scott Benner 1:36:39
You're just one of my little metrics I use so and you know, one day you'll be gone. I hate to say it like this one day you won't. And and then I'll find somebody else. But you're a person that I identified as, like Shawn doesn't just like throw kudos at me. You know, like, I'm at a wedding and he's got a bag of rice. Like so like he's very you're you're you're stingy with your praise. Yeah, I am a little bit yeah, no, dude, I it's interesting that you would notice that damn right. I did. How do you think I make this podcast popular? I know. Yeah, no, but you're one of my people. Like I'm like when I when when you're like, this was a good episode of My Damn, that must have been good.

Shaun Brown 1:37:18
See, I'm the same way with music. I'm absolutely the same with music. Like I won't. I won't just like Pat artists on the back just because, you know, they want the adoration. I actually come from a music background and I think a lot of young kids that wanted to make music with me thought either I was amazing, because they looked up to me or they probably thought I was a big app.

Scott Benner 1:37:44
I lately over the last year or two I can't tell people enough about Gary Clark Jr. Oh, he's amazing. Yeah, but I don't spend a lot of time on big fan actually. Yeah, I don't tell a lot of people about my my music likes i'm not i'm not i don't really share my music. interest. But if I go if the world ever gets right again, I want to see Gary Clark play live. And and the last I think he'd be amazing to see live man. Yeah, the last person I made the effort to see live was yo yo Ma. I don't don't go to a lot of live music. But I want to see Gary Clark play live somewhere. And I haven't been to a show for way too long. I used to go all the time. You got old man. Tell him I know. It's so sad. I told my daughter the other day. I said the best live show from just performance I was ever at was Guns and Roses. I said oh, that would be fun. Axl Rose ran and you're thinking you had to think of Axl roses. You know, like, not the not the old man. He is now but he ran around that stage for three hours. 100 miles an hour and sang the entire time. It was the most impressive thing I've ever seen. He was really impressive. I thought Metallica was really great live. I could never get into Metallica. But I know everyone seems to love Metallica or love they were very good live. You know who else was really good live thing of all things staying that Oh, you saw staying dude. Yeah, he was really good live. I saw him at an outdoor concert with Kelly when we were really young. actually want to sing songs. A remake he does is my wedding song. So but yeah, he was really good, but I've seen some max out do Hoover's great life, the Black Crowes. Really, I sat through a heart concert to watch the Black Crowes open for heart. I don't mean to insult anybody who likes heart but that Barracuda song gives me what the kids called douche chills. It's really bad music. And for me at least, but yeah, I lived through an entire heart a concert so I can see the blackrose open for them. But, you know, and and Alyssa told me I should come to Germany and hear her play. She was on the other day. So I was that where she was. She's actually in Germany. I think she was talking about this one concert hall that I think she said it was in Germany that she said, it's just amazing to see her play. She was a really, really cool episode. I like that one. I appreciate that. Thank you. I love the cello. So by the time this comes out, I should have another I can tell you now cuz nobody will hear it. I think I got the Hey, everyone jumping in for a second here. I'm sorry, I can't tell you who I got yet. still working on it. It's taken a long time. And then somebody just like during the broadcast, or like he has type one diabetes. So I've been trying to get him on the podcast since then. I can never get any traction on getting him on. And I did something for I did something for a charity the other day. And when we got done, the person was like, hey, this was great. Thank you. If you ever need anything, let me know. And who was playing at the charity event? I said, Give me up Give me the address the email address of his manager all were even. She's like, All right, here it is. So I think I got him. Excited. I love I think that's a I don't know why very strange mix of

Shaun Brown 1:41:19
No, you know, that's, that's pretty cool. And I think it's, it's interesting when you you learn how music touches people. And music is such a, like, amazing component of our lives, even if we don't realize it. Yeah. And I mean, I've been surrounded by it since I was a kid. And I can't imagine a life without music,

Scott Benner 1:41:41
music or play when you were playing. Went out? Well, I'm sorry. I played Yeah. Or that I was just around. No, I thought you said you were playing. You've had played music for years. Oh, so I

Shaun Brown 1:41:54
come from more of a like hip hop. Production background. Okay. Engineering, mixing. And I ironically, have a bachelor's in Recording Arts even though I learned everything on my own. It's more just a fancy piece of paper on the wall. But um, I just I've always loved being able to, like create something from scratch with friends. And I've kind of lived and breathed hip hop since I was a little kid. I had like, you know, fat boys on cassette. So it's just always been a part of my life. My dad actually managed Tower Records for 30 plus years. No kidding. Yeah. And so I grew up, I get it. I grew up in a record store. It was it was amazing.

Scott Benner 1:42:45
Well, let me measure my, my, my rap likes, and then we can get out of here. I like Dave East a lot. Do you know him?

Shaun Brown 1:42:54
So yeah, I'm, I'm kind of an old school head. Even though I do listen, I try to tune in to newer stuff, right? I'm gonna, I'm probably gonna kind of square myself out a bit. But I can't really dig a lot of the new stuff these days, even though some of it I kind of see where they're going with it. Yeah. So I'm not familiar with that guy. But they're there. What happened to me, in my opinion, along the ways, I started just noticing too much redundancy and music. And it made me kind of like, not care about a lot of the new stuff coming out. It just it felt so predictable, during the 90s. And I hate to you know, pitch up the 90s, like a lot of people do and say it was the golden era or whatever. But there there was a lot of push to be like a unique version of yourself, at least in hip hop. But I think across the board, really. And there was the dynamic between record labels was different. I think it's all for the better these days, to be honest, because there's more, even though there's saturation, and there's too much out there. There's a lot more organic stuff being created these days, which is also great.

Scott Benner 1:44:07
At least the artists have control of their stuff for the most.

Shaun Brown 1:44:10
Yeah, totally. I mean, it just goes to show he really didn't need those labels in the first place. And they were just kind of milking. Yeah. But at the same time, they did become sort of like a vessel to put people into more people, you know, ears. And I think that that was one thing that you can't deny about certain record labels. There was there was good labels along the way to that they really grew artists. Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:44:36
well, they had distribution channels, too, that exist until the internet

Shaun Brown 1:44:41
Exactly. And distribution is vital. Like if you don't have a distribution, you're back when it was hard copy. You know, you weren't you weren't going to get into anybody's household. So that was a big deal. And I think that's part of what played into being a very original version of yourself. With music back then. Was It was like, there wasn't, there was way more push to create something that was highly unique in that not just the way it sounded, but like, you know everything about you even, like, from the way that you even your style was a component. Ironically, it's

Scott Benner 1:45:19
interesting because I probably have a mix of that because I brought up Davies because I like his voice. And when my son listens to him, and I'm like, this guy's got a great voice. I don't think he cares. Like my son hears like the beat underneath of it and all that other stuff like that. And I don't care about that as much I I even like, I like pop spokes voice. Like I hear voices more, but I don't. It doesn't open up a doorway for me to talk about it with younger people who like rap music. That's interesting, because most people do gravitate to the beat more. Yeah, yeah. I don't really care about the beat so much. I'm like, this guy's voice is really neat. And and my son's like, What is wrong with you? And I'm like, you don't hear? I'm like you're listening to the same thing I'm listening to you don't hear that. He's like, Nah, that's not the part I care about. My God sent you this very interesting. So Alright, I'll let you go after you tell me what's the best rap app ever?

Unknown Speaker 1:46:06
Who you love

Scott Benner 1:46:07
the Best Rap? What act Who's Who? Who? Did it right in the 90s.

Shaun Brown 1:46:11
Okay, so, man, that's completely like so you know? Yeah, of course, your opinion. I can't honestly like I've been influenced by so many artists. But like a top one for me would be Pete Rock and CL smooth. Those guys were phenomenal. They were kind of like, for me personally Anyways, what made me want to be part of the culture what made me want to make my own version of whatever that is. and contribute in my own way. You know, their their music kind of really set a fire under me. But so many because I I've had I've had I really do like all kinds of music like I really enjoy almost everything. Mine is I suppose country and I can listen to like older country, like Johnny Cash type stuff. I can't I can't listen to modern country that makes me cringe. But I love the blues. I will listen to the blues any day. Yeah. You know, I listened to all kinds of stuff like Afro beat, whatever. I really enjoy a variety. I you know, it's kind of boring. I only listen to one thing.

Scott Benner 1:47:23
I heard the you know what i heard recently that threw me off as I started watching justified. It's available now on Hulu. And the theme song is a bluegrass rap mix. And I can't tell if I I really liked the show. But in the beginning when I think the like I wanted to watch another episode to hear the theme song again. I was like, Well, that's it. A mixture I've never heard before in my life. Yeah, it almost sounds confusing. We'll have to hear it to get an idea. You find the justified theme when you get off of here and tell me it's not a little catchy? But Cool. All right. Well, Shawn, now we've gone from an hour an hour 45 minutes. Okay, but but I really I had a really good time talking to you. I'm really glad you did this. I'm super happy that you found your way and, and you're, you know you're making so many positive changes for yourself. It's fantastic. Yeah, thanks, Scott. I enjoyed chatting with you, man. Me too.

A huge thank you to one of today's sponsors. Je Vogue glucagon, find out more about chivo hypo pen at G Vogue glucagon.com forward slash juicebox you spell that GVOKE gL use C ag o n.com. forward slash juice box. You know where to go to find a great blood glucose meter. Contour Next one.com forward slash juice box. Thank you so much to the Contour Next One blood glucose meter for sponsoring this episode of the podcast and of course, a huge thanks to Sean for coming on the show and sharing so much.

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#517 Meet Arden

This is Arden's first appearance on the podcast.

You can always listen to the Juicebox Podcast here but the cool kids use: Apple Podcasts/iOS - Spotify - Amazon Music - Google Play/Android - iHeart Radio -  Radio Public, Amazon Alexa or wherever they get audio.

+ Click for EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends. Welcome to Episode 517 of the Juicebox Podcast.

In August of 2006, our two year old daughter Arden was diagnosed with Type One Diabetes. Much like all of you, this took us completely by surprise. We didn't know anything about autoimmune issues, even though now with hindsight, we can see different ones. In my wife's family. I'm adopted, of course, so I don't have any medical knowledge of things like that. But we were blindsided on vacation at the beach, at a big family gathering. Our daughter was just wasting away and dying. And suddenly we know what was happening. I don't think that our life has ever really been the same since then. It's much better in some ways, and there are obvious deficits. Anyway, I'll tell you a little more in a second. But remember, while you're listening that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, please always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan, or becoming bold with insulin. This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by the Dexcom g six continuous glucose monitor. It is also sponsored by Omni pod makers of the Omni pod dash. You can find out more about the Dexcom and get started@dexcom.com forward slash juice box or to learn about the Omni pod promise. And see if you're eligible for a free 30 day trial of the Omni pod dash go to Omni pod.com forward slash juice box. Before we get started, I want to remind you that Arden has just turned 17 that she's never been on a podcast before. And that I asked her before we started for one thing I just said please just be honest, be yourself. The goal here with this episode was for you to get to know Arden a little bit. Before we got started with a series where I'm going to talk to her about things that I'm hoping she'll do for herself and her health. As she gets older and goes off to college. I didn't want you just to not know who she was because Arden has a very sarcastic sense of humor. She's dry, she doesn't have a filter. I know some of you may have expectations of who Arden is. But by the time this is over, you'll know for sure. Hope you enjoy this episode. I really enjoyed sitting with my daughter and making it I have to say that this podcast has afforded me a lot of wonderful things. And to sit down across from my daughter and talk like this is one of them. I hope you enjoy getting to know Arden I really love talking to her. If I'm being honest, I don't think she ever but here we go. Alright, you recording now ask your question again. No, snap for that and just keep going. I'm going to ask, I'm going to answer you now.

Arden Benner 3:29
No, I don't know. I don't want this used.

Scott Benner 3:36
So if you want to curse, you can curse and it gets beeped out. But that's stupid. Why would I curse then? People can still tell what you say. They don't I just so the reason I don't have cursing on the podcast is because children listen. No, they don't. They do. And because it would preclude me from being in certain countries on iTunes. So those are the two reasons. Do you want to introduce yourself?

Arden Benner 4:02
No. Y'all know who I am? We can proceed. You can drag it out there with the water cuz I need hours.

Scott Benner 4:14
Alright, so first, let's be honest with people tell them while you're doing the podcast,

Arden Benner 4:19
I need a parking spot at my school and I have no community service hours. And and I you know I should get community service for being alive. But that's not enough. So I'm here.

Scott Benner 4:29
Okay, so we went to Your what? We went to the school and we asked them if being on the podcast would count. And they said yes.

Arden Benner 4:37
Yeah, a little bit. Yeah. They said that's fine. Yeah, that was very nice of them. didn't have to do that. Yeah. I mean, Paul didn't have to get community service for being related to me, but that happened.

Scott Benner 4:45
So you're saying when Cole was in high school, he got some community service because his sister had diabetes.

Arden Benner 4:50
Yeah. Which seems you know, horrible. But

Unknown Speaker 4:52
whatever. I think maybe his his guidance counselor was just trying to help him out but you think why are you talking to me like I'm full

Scott Benner 5:00
I'm not talking to you like your, this is gonna be so strange. So two things. First of all, I've never interviewed somebody face to face before. So it's a little weird for me. Hey, look at the wall. I don't know what you're doing here. But of all the people in our family you and I talk the most though. Right? We're the chatty is that before? Yeah, right. Okay. So like when we get in the car, we drive somewhere we talk the whole time. No, but all right. We talked last night, we took Samson at home in the rain.

Arden Benner 5:29
That was a, you know, different scenario. But all right, what scenario was it? You know, breaking laws? Oh,

Scott Benner 5:35
you just driving through some floodwater? It was fine. Okay, so I'm gonna, here's my plan for this. It's a very loose plan. We're gonna get to know you in this one. Okay, around diabetes. And then we'll talk in future episodes. And I will be you and I will be talking together about the idea of sort of transfer of power, like diabetes power from me. And Mom, to you. Right. And that process? Okay,

Unknown Speaker 6:10
yep. Sounds good. Okay.

Scott Benner 6:11
And on a scale of one to 10? How excited are you to do this

Arden Benner 6:14
about a three? Okay, not at all? Easy. That was way higher than I'm actually thinking.

Scott Benner 6:21
So let me ask you about that first, then. Is this just something in general, you wouldn't do? Like if someone else asked you to be on their podcast? You'd be like, I don't want to do that.

Arden Benner 6:30
Yeah, I don't see the point in this. You don't think anything? I have no knowledge about anything. I'm just the name.

Scott Benner 6:37
So this is very interesting. Okay, because everyone who comes on this podcast, I'm seriously everyone later will say to me, hey, if you don't want to use that episode, I understand. I know, we didn't talk about anything. But I've used every episode that I've ever recorded, with the exception of a couple because of like other personal reasons for people. But the point is, is that everyone share something that's really helpful to other people. So you might not know that you have some good information, or something to share. That'll be valuable, but you do. Okay. Yep. All right. So, first serious question. Do you What's the earliest you remember having diabetes?

Unknown Speaker 7:22
What's your question? Is that I don't know. What's your first memory of it? I don't know. Do you remember having it when you were two?

Unknown Speaker 7:31
I don't even know

Scott Benner 7:32
what I would think. No, I'm just asking the question.

Arden Benner 7:34
Yeah, I don't know. I remember yesterday, like, I don't understand what type of question this is.

Scott Benner 7:38
Do you remember when you were five? Like, that's kindergarten? Do you remember having diabetes in kindergarten? I don't think about it like that. I know. That's what we're trying to get to. I think that you consider diabetes in a much different way than a lot of people do. So that's what we're trying to get to. Okay. You understand what I'm saying? All right. You're combative witness here. You don't have to be combative. Just answer the questions. If you don't know, say, I don't know, it's fine. Here's the question for you that will answer at the end of this episode. Try to think of on this podcast. What word has most frequently came after the word artists? It's art and and then second word? It those two, these two words are used most frequently together? One of them being your name? Yeah, I know what it is. What is period? You got to quickly

Unknown Speaker 8:32
you have someone right now. You have your period right now, you wouldn't ask me that. I wouldn't know my period right now.

Scott Benner 8:40
Okay. All right. So let's not ask you about how far back you remember, diabetes instead. Let's, let's talk about the way you think about it. So in the course of a regular day, when's the first time you think about diabetes?

Arden Benner 8:56
I don't, I don't think about it. Ever, literally ever. I don't think about

Scott Benner 9:01
it. If I asked you to do word association, and I said, Arden is you would never say diabetic, right? No, but you know, you have diabetes, obviously. Yeah, no, no, I have no idea. But you just don't. You don't see yourself that way. No, I don't see myself that way. So it's not a weird question. Because a lot of people do. or more importantly, a lot of parents are afraid that that's how their kids are going to see them. All right. So did you know when you were a little kid, and you would come home from school? The first thing I would say to you is what's your blood sugar? No, I have no idea. You don't remember that. So that's a really impactful thing for me. Because it It took me a little while, but I realized that I wasn't even looking at you. I was just worried about the diabetes. And so I consciously stopped myself from asking about it when you got home even when there were times when I thought thought your blood sugar might be low or that you could be in some sort of trouble or something like that I would stop myself. I'm sure I wasn't listening to a word you said when I got it. I think this is important for people to hear. Cuz I had a lot of anxiety around it at the time. And you now are how old 17? And you have no memory of it whatsoever. Yeah, memory, a lot of stuff that happens. So do you remember anything in your life? Like, I don't remember very far back in my life, I'd never have been able to fit some pieces. I don't know. Yeah, but you have a very good memory for like, present day stuff.

Arden Benner 10:33
Joe, losses, tests and quizzes.

Scott Benner 10:38
Because, like, you'll get up in the morning and have had like a really weird dream or something. And you'll tell me about it in really like specific detail. Yeah, that's probably a psychological thing. Like, I'm just, I don't have any problems like that. Yeah, yeah. You seem like you're gonna be okay. So far. We've been looking at this timer. Don't look at it. Don't watch that. We're just talking. Trust me, that takes people 15 minutes just to relax. Okay. So, back to my original question. So when's the first time you think about insulin or diabetes? Or do you not even think of it as diabetes? Just think of it as I'm going to eat? Yeah, I don't think diabetes. Okay. Yeah. How frequently do you think you use the word? Literally, never. I don't think I do either. Like outside of this podcast. I don't think I say diabetes in my personal life. Yeah, such a long word. They could have named it something better. Don't you think the beats that would you would call it No, no.

Arden Benner 11:43
But wait, what? If you're diabetic and you have a fat ass, you're diabesity

Unknown Speaker 11:49
that's what love tells me. Your friend tells you that if I ever,

Arden Benner 11:53
you know, get sick, I'm a diabetes now, okay. In the winter, you know, like when you put on weight?

Unknown Speaker 12:00
Like so? Like, like a bear? You're gonna go into a cave and Hibernate for a while. Everyone gets bigger in the winter. Okay,

Scott Benner 12:07
so what so you brought up your friends? You brought up live? How much do your friends know about? Uh, do you think?

Arden Benner 12:16
I know nothing? Nothing? I don't know. They? I honestly have no idea. I cannot tell you. I don't even know if they know I'm diabetic.

Scott Benner 12:25
I know that they don't appear to have any even general knowledge about it. Yeah. So I think parents listening would then wonder how that happens. Because their concern is that other people might see their children as only like a person with diabetes. But you have a close group of friends. And they don't. They don't even understand anything about it. Right? Yeah. Have you ever said to them like, this is my chivo hypo pan. This is how it works. You know what that means? So you so you have no idea what the hell? Okay, so you know, you're carrying glucagon?

Unknown Speaker 12:56
Yeah, it's in my purse, right? Yeah, I throw pasta purse. But you don't know what it's called? The in the package, right? Yes. Yeah. I don't even know how to use that. Okay. Well, now's a good time. They're not gonna think you're a great dad outside of this. Well,

Scott Benner 13:10
I it's a hypo pen. It's this. Alright, you don't need to teach me right away. Fine. But in front of everybody. This is important. You know, I've showed this to you. Right?

Arden Benner 13:19
Yeah. I just have no recollection of how to use it. Okay, because I won't get in that situation.

Scott Benner 13:24
Well, this is super okay. You don't think it'll ever come up? No. You don't think you could have like a mistake or a problem or something could happen now? I'm completely fine. You're completely fine.

Arden Benner 13:33
Yeah. I've gotten to 20 before and, you know, strong brain I have. I can keep myself awake. Your brain. Your brain holds up? Yeah.

Scott Benner 13:43
Okay, so But seriously, for people listening. I've showed this to you. Yeah, I can't get up off.

Arden Benner 13:49
I'm aware. You showed that to me.

Scott Benner 13:51
Okay. But you didn't remember? No. So this is so this is? I'm very glad you're honest. Okay. I seriously, um, because I think that that's could be one of those things that people right now are like, Oh, my God. You mean, my kid might not remember this. I explained this to them. It's super important. If

Arden Benner 14:08
your kid is older than 15 when they walk out the door, they're not listening to you. Just so you're aware. I I went on my first drive after I got my license mom screaming stuff in my ear. And I was like, Yeah, that sounds good. Okay. You don't know. I was out the door. I don't even know what she was talking about. She told me not to drive into a tornado. And I was like,

Scott Benner 14:29
so it's interesting, because mom doesn't want you to die generalized. She's just like, Don't crash into anything. That's her worry. And I really am more concerned that you're what a lot. What's the only thing I said to you when you left?

Unknown Speaker 14:42
Check your blood sugar. Yeah, and make sure you're I always do that.

Scott Benner 14:45
Yeah. And make sure your Dexcom is not silenced. Right.

Unknown Speaker 14:48
Yeah, well, I mean, it's connected to the car. It's not it's gonna laugh at me. So I was really loud when it's on CarPlay

Scott Benner 14:54
now that was a lie. But um, but I but I do. It makes no sound at all. Which is it because your phone is muted. Now my phone's not muted. Well, it must be because so this is another interesting thing that we go through all the time. You kids in general, you don't like your phones to make notification sounds. Yeah, cuz of school. Right. But then it stops the Dexcom for making notification sounds to

Unknown Speaker 15:20
it was making them all day in Buffalo Wild Wings in Buffalo Wild Wings. Yeah. Because, like, so loud.

Scott Benner 15:26
So I think it's important for to, especially while you're driving.

Arden Benner 15:31
Yeah, I'm completely I'll check. I mean, you know, I'm not supposed to go on my phone while drive but like, I track it.

Scott Benner 15:38
So you understand, but you understand why though, right? Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 15:41
I'm aware. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Being like interrogated. We're just talking Really? Okay. It's not It's not an eye contact with me.

Unknown Speaker 15:53
There's a lot of eye contact. Yeah, it's weird. Let me drink some water. He was saying no. He was such a pretty singing voice though. Okay.

Scott Benner 16:05
Okay, so you don't really identify at all with diabetes, but you're not embarrassed that you have it.

Friends, you can get a free 30 day trial of the Omni pod dash if you're eligible. By going to Omni pod comm forward slash juice box. Omni pod would like to make you a promise also, that there is no need to wait for the next big thing. Because with the Omni pod promise, you can upgrade to Omni pods latest technologies for no additional cost as soon as they're available to you and covered by insurance terms and conditions apply. But I think you hear what I'm saying. Find out all the details at Omni pod.com forward slash juicebox. While you're there, check out the Omni pod tubeless. Insulin pumping is way cool. The Omni pod even though not sure where we're at in the episode right now the Omni pod or Omni pod. I guess as Arden must have heard about it when she was younger, is it's been a friend to us. My daughter's been wearing it since she was four years old. You're hearing her today having just turned 17 that is a long time with the Omni pod. And it has been nothing but a friend this whole time. On the pod.com forward slash juice box tubeless insulin pumping, wear it out. So everybody can see it or hide it under your clothing doesn't matter. Whatever you want to do. Beyond the pod is there for you. You might also want to look into the Dexcom g six continuous glucose monitor. Why? Well, seeing which way your blood sugar is moving is super important. And I guess if you're ever going to have a kid one day like mine, you're going to want them to be able to see their blood sugar right on their cell phone. As a matter of fact, not only can Arden see her blood sugar on her Dexcom app, but so can my wife, myself, and up to 10 followers on our phones. These could be androids or iPhones. It's pretty amazing. up the middle alerts, seeing your blood sugar in real time, what direction it's moving, how fast it's moving in that direction, and what number it is knowing your blood sugar is 85 if you're testing with your you know with a meter, even a great meter like the Contour Next One still just tells you that right now your blood sugar's 85. You have no idea if it's going to be 80 in a couple of minutes, or 110 and a couple of minutes because there's no directional arrows. But a Dexcom CGM will show you just that dexcom.com forward slash juice box learn more today or get started if you can't remember these links, but you should be able to buy now dexcom.com forward slash juice box on the pod comm forward slash juice box if you can't remember them, go to Juicebox Podcast COMM And click right there. I have links right there. They're also in the show notes of your podcast players. It's time to get back to Arden. I don't want to give anything away but she's going to say more things that are both funny and strange. And I'm think I still have a fair amount of beeping to do. girl loves the curse.

Arden Benner 19:45
I i don't i don't think about it like at all. Yeah, I don't care.

Scott Benner 19:50
Like if somebody at school said no one at school says anything. Right? But if they did, you'd have no trouble being like yeah, I have diabetes.

Arden Benner 19:58
Yeah, no one I can say that like, I'm aware people at my school are intimidated by me. Um, so I've been told, so no one really approaches me. And if they do, I'm actually very nice person. They're very nice. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 20:16
yeah, I should probably be given metal for that. But, you know, why would these people think you're not approachable?

Arden Benner 20:22
At my school? Yeah, I'm very quiet. You're quiet? Yeah. No, you know, like, I don't talk unless I want to talk. Once when class is over. my headphones are in and I'm out the door. Okay.

Scott Benner 20:31
Are you like serial killer? Quiet? Do you think they don't talk to you? Because they're afraid of you. Now? Oh, maybe I'm not maybe that's good. Okay, but hypothetically, if someone came up to you in school and was like, mocked you or tried to make fun of you,

Arden Benner 20:46
I cannot see that happening. Okay. I'm taller than half of the guys at my school. No one's doing that to me.

Scott Benner 20:51
I say. What if a nine foot person amen? Would you? Would you just be like, yeah, I have diabetes. Leave me alone. I don't care what you think.

Arden Benner 20:58
I wouldn't. I would walk past them. Okay. Yeah, I wouldn't say anything. Okay. mock me. Do you

Scott Benner 21:04
think? Yeah, like, what if somebody tried to so there was a woman on here once, who shared with me that during the AIDS epidemic, she was younger. And like her, like, there were kids at school that would call her like, diet aids or something like that, like make, like, really try to come out or about diabetes through like the AIDS thing. But like, if that happened, you wouldn't would you not be upset?

Unknown Speaker 21:28
I put you would think it was kind of funny. I really diet AIDS. That's horrible. I'm gonna do name.

Scott Benner 21:34
I know. I thought so I forget exactly what she said. But when she told me I did think that's like such a bad thing. Like who came up with that? Alright, so do you know your laid back? What? Are you aware that you're a laid back person?

Arden Benner 21:48
Oh, I think there's crazy people in the world. And there's not crazy people in the world. And I don't think I'm crazy.

Scott Benner 21:52
You just think you're not a crazy person. Yeah. Okay. But you don't see that in general that your attitude is relaxed. No, I just I feel normal. Well, yeah, you're you. Yeah. Here's a different way to think of it. When you look at me and you look at Mom, do you see that your personality might be more like mine. And like mom's? No, you don't think of it that way?

Unknown Speaker 22:13
No, I think I work more like mom. You work like mom. Yeah. What about your sense of humor? I'm my own person, dad. Yeah. Thank you very much. You

Scott Benner 22:21
don't want to identify with me at all in this conversation? Oh,

Arden Benner 22:25
I know, as you get older, I don't really want to say that my sense of humor is like yours because it's getting worse.

Scott Benner 22:29
You see, you think my sense of humor is getting worse? Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 22:32
I think ranking in the family. I'm now above you. You're above me. And I think me and the dogs are only one of the dogs. But mom and Cole are nowhere near

Arden Benner 22:41
Yeah. Wow. It's like, you guys never want them on this. Ever. Your mama put her gas station voice on. She'd be super sweet. It'd be really sweet and nice. Yeah, yeah. And then we'd finish and she'd be like, Oh, my guys, cable.

Unknown Speaker 23:00
And she wouldn't say that. Not really what I should be talking about you about me? Okay, great. Very

Arden Benner 23:06
nice. People. I mean, you. You have a lot of leaping to do on this just kind of comes out to me. I understand.

Scott Benner 23:11
Yeah, I can see you getting more relaxed. So that's good. Okay. All right. Well, I find what you're talking about interesting, because I've spoken to so many people who don't feel this way. And yet, I think that you are tackling it from a common sense approach. As far as I can tell. I don't see why. Why you should identify yourself as a problem, or an issue or a size or height or hair color, anything like that. So hair color. Yeah. Like if somebody your hair changes color sometimes. Yeah, it's gonna say. But you don't mean like, I don't think that ain't mean if somebody called you, Blondie and you had blonde hair. I don't know how you could get your feelings hurt by that, like, so I don't understand. So there's a I'm with you. I don't understand either. But I do know that there are plenty of people who feel that way. And it's very real for them. And it's an issue for them. So I was just wondering about you. So people listening might assume that because you were diagnosed so early in your life, that you really don't have any knowledge of not having diabetes.

Arden Benner 24:16
I literally I don't, I could not tell you. I literally have no knowledge of anything. I don't know. Like, I just don't think about life like that.

Scott Benner 24:25
Yeah, at all. Okay, no, I understand. I hear you. So of the things that you do know, let me ask you this question. If I if I if I just disappeared, right? I just pooped off the powwow. Right? Like the snap happens. I'm gone. Mom's gone. I'm gone. But they keep sending the diabetes supplies to the house is called gone. Doesn't matter for this scenario. I think it does. You think you can take care of yourself. Okay. Yeah, probably. I'll be fine. Yeah. I'm thinking about going On the way to college, what parts of it?

Arden Benner 25:02
Oh, the only part that I'm gonna up is alarms when I'm sleeping. That's it. That's, that's my only problem. Okay. I do not hear anything at all. I have a problem if I do hear, I just keeps. So even if you work so even if you weren't here like last night, I was like mid sleep and it was like Barbara robot and I was like, oh, someone will get it. Someone will get it. Yeah, I didn't feel good. I went to bed. Yeah.

Scott Benner 25:28
So you're sure your blood sugar was like too low last night for a couple hours?

Arden Benner 25:31
Yeah, I hear a beep in my room. And then I hear a beep in your room. And I think Whose turn is it? Dad's?

Scott Benner 25:39
Have you ever once gotten up and done something?

Arden Benner 25:41
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, that I haven't gotten up. I just haven't gone to sleep yet.

Scott Benner 25:46
Okay, so if you think I'm asleep, and you're still awake, yeah, then you'll do something

Arden Benner 25:51
all last summer. Like when we were like COVID like we cannot leave the house I used to call doesn't know this. But I used to like really late at night. I'd be up to like three in the morning and I was like binge watching the Percy Jackson movies. And I would text called be like call my blood sugar solo. Please get me a drumstick. And some toast Tito's like I really don't feel good, this whole thing. And he'd like run downstairs and get them in my blood sugar was completely fine. That's horrible. Yeah, don't talk. I am so bad. He doesn't listen to this. Because I want to try that again. No, don't do that. Dad. Come on.

Scott Benner 26:25
I don't know. It seems efficiency, efficiency for me. Bye. But to my original question. You'll hear

Arden Benner 26:33
me the first couple of times it was low.

Scott Benner 26:36
Right? Oh, and then I was like, Oh, looks like it's working. Okay. All right. So but wrapped around that idea? I mean, you're thinking of going to college? Right? Yeah, if I can get in? Yeah. So you're not thinking of going to college somewhere locally? Where you live here? No. So what are you going to do?

Arden Benner 26:58
I don't understand what your question is. What am I under? About? What?

Scott Benner 27:01
What are you going to do if your blood sugar gets like dangerously low?

Arden Benner 27:05
Take care of it. I don't. This isn't a worry. Like, I don't understand what the big deal is about this.

Scott Benner 27:11
It's interesting. So you don't remember having a seizure? So you're gonna say no, but not. You've been using an algorithm for a while now. That stops your blood sugar from getting super low. You don't remember?

Arden Benner 27:25
I do remember what it was like without it? Yeah, didn't haven't had it that long. Okay. Yeah, I'll be fine.

Scott Benner 27:30
Yeah. Wait, are we still gonna? Cause? Well, so there's a good question, right? What if the, what if that just what if the loop just disappears?

Arden Benner 27:41
That, you know, it doesn't seem like it's gonna happen? Okay, why? Wait? There's a lot of reasons it could happen. Oh, I think you're wrong about that.

Scott Benner 27:50
It's just people on the internet making a thing. Okay. And it needs like other stuff to work? What if this? What if the company's not making the stuff? That was

Arden Benner 27:58
that company making money? They're not making that. Okay, so you're not worried about losing the algorithm? Everything? I I'm such a mellow person, whatever, go with the flow, you'll be okay. We'll be fine.

Scott Benner 28:11
Are you? Do you know that I'm, I'm thinking that you should try the Omnipod five when it comes out. I have no idea what that is. Okay, so on the pod is gonna have their own algorithm that's gonna come out. And I was thinking we should try that. Because that would take away the orange link. Okay. You just want it to work.

Arden Benner 28:32
I really don't care about any of this, like all this, that this that like, if people who listen to this understand what they're doing and listen to this for like, like the knowledge of diabetes, I don't understand why. You're not gonna I could never do that. Okay.

Scott Benner 28:48
Well, but what? So the question is, then, you realize, I forget in the moment, but do you realize that one day, you're going to need to understand that? How this works? Yeah.

Arden Benner 29:03
I think I understand this better than half of these people.

Scott Benner 29:07
know any of these people? I

Arden Benner 29:08
know. I don't know them. But you know, but well, but you gotta listen for a reason. I know, some people just listen because they like, I don't think that's true.

Scott Benner 29:16
You believe that no one could possibly be listening to us because they enjoy it. Do you think they're just getting answers? And that's it? Yeah, I think that's not right. I think you're not right. So let me tell you what they tell me. Okay. All right, is that there? There can be this loneliness that happens for some people, okay. There can be loneliness that happens where they don't know another person that has type diabetes, like no one else. So if they have a problem, or a fear or something like that, there's no one to talk to, and no one to to get answers from. So this can actually serve as like a community for them here because people come on and talk about their diabetes. That's the Last thing I want to talk about, you don't want to talk about that. That's fine. If that's not what you want to talk about. But is it nice to think that if one day you did that there'd be somewhere you could go to find? You know, because

Arden Benner 30:09
I, I genuinely don't think I would ever do that in my entire life.

Scott Benner 30:13
We don't think you'd want to talk to other people. Like

Arden Benner 30:14
you could all be really nice people. I The last thing I want to talk to you about is diabetes.

Scott Benner 30:19
Okay. So you just want to if you met some of these people, you would just talk about something different.

Arden Benner 30:23
Yeah, I am not a diabetic or you're like anyone else. Like, no, no, no.

Scott Benner 30:28
So so you don't I? So listen, first of all, I find this very interesting. I know this about you. But I mean, we've never said it back and forth to each other. I'm, I mean, I was gonna say proud, but I don't even think there's anything to be proud of, I think you're just acting like yourself. Like, I think this is how your personality adapts to this situation. I think if, if, if if I had diabetes, I would react differently than you do, and just as everybody else would. But it's it's, I don't know, it's very interesting, because the algorithm, as an example, is not easy to get set up. Which is one of the reasons why I would like you to go in on the pod five, and I'm hoping I fingers crossed that it's going to work well for you. Because I don't think you're going to be the kind of person who's going to want to sit down and make an app and upload it on your phone for the rest of your life. And when you do, though, don't you have make an app? You certainly sat here with me while we've put the loop app onto your phone through that computer? Yeah, I

Unknown Speaker 31:31
go to sleep on the ground. Like, I'm not part of that you just lay on the floor with a turn. So you're unaware, I don't even

Arden Benner 31:36
know what your turn means. I don't know what I do to contribute to that. I think I put my passcode in. And I don't even know my passcode

Scott Benner 31:47
I'm trying to decide how people listening are feeling right now. If they're if they're like, Wow, my clay might hate me. Well, they might I don't think they're gonna hate you. But So listen, if I had to guess I think most adults with type one will hear you and think this is a very relaxed attitude that will take you a very long way with diabetes. And I think some of the parents might be thinking, wow, this is cool, you know, to see that she's not burdened by that is probably their biggest worries that their kids are burdened. You know what I mean? Because some people really are. And there's nothing wrong with that. It's just It's how I mean, you're lucky that you don't have like, an anxiety disorder, for instance, because you would feel completely different. Maybe. So,

Arden Benner 32:25
yeah, I can't I don't know. I can't speak for them. First of all, idea.

Scott Benner 32:29
No, I know. I understand. Alright, well,

Arden Benner 32:32
they gave me two other disorders. You know, I'm good. What else you got going on over there? A bunch of stuff. That's why Cole said to me, he goes, you're not wearing your mask anymore. And I was like unvaccinated and the chances that I get COVID vaccinated with three other autoimmune diseases. I was like, I don't believe in God, but like, he's not doing that.

Scott Benner 32:53
You think you think that you've had your share of tough luck? And yeah, nothing else could happen. Yeah, you know, that's not how COVID works, right?

Arden Benner 33:00
No, I'm aware of, I'm not an idiot, but I am vaccinated. Okay, you should all get vaccinated. So

Scott Benner 33:05
you're vaccinated. And you have

Arden Benner 33:08
one of the celebrities that they like pay to like be vaccinated. I don't think they pay them. Most definitely pay those people.

Scott Benner 33:17
See what else you have hypothyroidism? Yeah. And what else? He said three things.

Arden Benner 33:23
Yeah, I do some I don't even know I have something else. And I don't know what it is. Oh, iron deficiency, iron.

Scott Benner 33:29
Well, no, but we think that's not that. I don't even know what's wrong with me. Right?

Unknown Speaker 33:34
Yeah, it's cuz it's so hard to keep up with a lot of blood comes out of me.

Scott Benner 33:41
So I think what we've, what we've kind of landed on for you is that your iron was getting very low. Because your your period was really

Unknown Speaker 33:51
why are you giggling? It's because I say

Scott Benner 33:53
Ardennes period a lot. I've never said it in front of you before. If you have not while someone else was

Unknown Speaker 33:59
recording to us right now. Alright, so fine. Let's feature them. Okay.

Scott Benner 34:03
So you're, you're sort of, I guess people will know this anyway. But you were bleeding for like a really long time every month. Yeah, I still believe but but. But not for 11 or 12 days at a time anymore. No.

Arden Benner 34:17
Yeah, I forgot to take birth control, by the way.

Scott Benner 34:20
You forgot it today. Yeah. Oh, today. Yeah. Oops, whatever. So Arden's taking like a low dose of birth control now, which regulated our periods and allowed your iron to come back up.

Arden Benner 34:31
This is time for all the men to just skip the portion like oh my god, no,

Scott Benner 34:35
it's important because because iron issues with people with type one are kind of common, as are like thyroid, celiac stuff like that. So

Arden Benner 34:45
yeah, I know, like 100 people who have iron deficiency, do you really live has it? Okay. Yeah. I'm just told that if you stand up and you're like seeing whatever, you have iron deficiency, and that's like half of my grade apparently.

Scott Benner 34:59
So how After your grade stands up and gets woozy are there drug addicts? I don't really. I'm not sure if they could be drug. So either this generation are doing you think either their iron is low where they're on the smack Is that right? Okay. Yeah, whatever floats their boat is heroin big in the high schools? I actually don't know. It's good. Don't do any drugs.

Arden Benner 35:20
I don't do any drugs. I'm drug free other than whatever have insulin I take and all that super interesting.

Scott Benner 35:27
Do you know what your your insulin is called? No, I don't know. But you have to

Arden Benner 35:32
know cuz you switch it on me and then you try to mess with my head. But

Scott Benner 35:35
the one so we tried fiasco. Yeah, I hate that you don't like because it burns? Yeah, but it works really? Well.

Unknown Speaker 35:41
I disagree. Okay. What's the other one called? I don't know. Pick your best guess. I don't

Scott Benner 35:48
know. I'll tell you. It begins with an a dad. I don't know. You really don't know the brand name. I have no idea what it's called. Alright. So your insolence called a pietra?

Arden Benner 35:59
I also wasn't aware that it was an omni pod until like two years ago, I thought was ami

Scott Benner 36:05
he thought it was ami pod? Yeah.

Arden Benner 36:08
I don't care. Like I'm not looking at the logo on it like this the last thing? Yeah. So apparently, I've been telling everyone I'm wearing the wrong thing. But

Scott Benner 36:16
whenever you didn't know there was an end in it.

Arden Benner 36:18
No, I know. I was Oh, am I? I don't even know what Omni means. I think it means one. Yeah, well, they don't teach us at school. So.

Scott Benner 36:30
Okay. Do you know what version of the Dexcom you're using? Nope. Come on. I don't know. I literally have no idea. G and then a number. Okay, great. Doesn't matter. Yes. No, just pick a number. No. I'm gonna see I don't want to be part of this. Whatever game we're playing, I'm it's not a game. I'm interesting. I'm trying to find out what you what you know, and what you don't know. So you have a Dexcom

Unknown Speaker 36:56
don't seem to know anything.

Scott Benner 36:57
You know more than you think. So you have a Dexcom g six. Okay, great. Yeah, he's an omni pod. Omni Omni pod. Right?

Arden Benner 37:06
So I didn't I heard you say at once. And I was like, What the hell is he saying?

Scott Benner 37:11
Oh, you thought I was saying

Arden Benner 37:12
I thought you were saying it wrong. Because you say a lot of things wrong. But like, like water is water apparently.

Unknown Speaker 37:19
Where do you say water? Water? Water? No. Say to go? Water. Water? No. All right, I'm gonna try to copy it this time. Grab Water, water. I do it play sounds. Okay. It sounds wrong when I do it. Everything sounds wrong.

Scott Benner 37:34
Okay. Omnipod and sompom? Dexcom. g six. All right. The the glucagon is called the G vo hypo pan

Arden Benner 37:42
i would i i'm looking at the time I think we talked about that, like 20 something minutes ago. I have no recollection of that. Okay,

Scott Benner 37:49
this is good for people to know. Alright. I don't know what your meter that's called. You know what your meter is called? The meter? It's called the meter? Yeah. Okay.

Arden Benner 37:58
It's not called anything. It's called hand me that. And if I need someone who doesn't know what it is, we'll be like kameena. Like the longer black thing like this and like, no.

Scott Benner 38:09
So that meter is super accurate. It's the best one you've ever had. But you don't know that. That's fine. I'm not judging you. I'm asking questions. Alright, let's think of all the other stuff that you don't know. All right. Tell people more stuff. Could you give yourself an injection with a needle if you had to?

Arden Benner 38:27
I could write I will. I choose not to?

Scott Benner 38:30
Yeah, you don't want to? Okay. You're okay. You know how to put your army pod on? No problem. Yeah, yeah. And you can put a Dexcom on.

Arden Benner 38:40
I'm not flexible like that. I don't know if I can turn

Scott Benner 38:43
because of where you put yours. Yeah, but if you put it somewhere where you could see you would have no trouble diet. Yeah, maybe? Who knows? Yeah. You put one on me, right. Did I don't like kitchen? Yeah. You know,

Arden Benner 38:54
I don't know. Like, I literally when that stuff happens, I erase it from my memory. And then I'm off and I go watch television.

Scott Benner 39:00
Okay, so is. So being clear. Like I'm trying to find a is is the are the things you do around diabetes? More like wiping your butt? Like, I have no idea what that means? Like it stuff you do during the day, but you don't think about it or retain it. No, I think about it when I went my ass. No, I don't mean like you're just stabbing around hoping to get to the last part. I'm just saying like later if I said to you, Hey, did you wipe your butt today? You go I don't know. Right? I wouldn't know. I'd say yeah, I think I went my ass. So do you know that your pods getting low on insulin right now?

Arden Benner 39:38
Yeah, I do know that. Okay, why do you know? Because it popped up on the thing like it was off insulin. Okay, and what I did nothing. Okay.

Scott Benner 39:51
Do you know how long a Dexcom lasts for

Arden Benner 39:53
a week? I think 10 days. Oh, yeah. Well, close enough. Whatever. who's counting?

Scott Benner 40:01
Well, I am, because that's how we know when to put the new Dexcom on.

Arden Benner 40:05
Don't just be that you like? Yeah, I guess that's how I know to put the new Dexcom on. Okay,

Scott Benner 40:10
so let's say for a minute that it's important for you to have a deeper understanding of some of this stuff. I disagree, because that's what this conversation is going to be about. So I didn't know what you were going to say today. I'd absolutely not one idea in the whole world I there. I really didn't even think about it. I didn't try to wonder I just thought I'll let you say whatever you're gonna say. I didn't know you're gonna malign all the sponsors at once. But that's fine.

Unknown Speaker 40:37
That's kind of what my line was. I mean, I did the word I don't know.

Scott Benner 40:45
I don't know what that thing in my bag is I just move it from purse the purse. I thought it was an arm. Yeah, well, thanks for saving my life. But like, that's enough. But But as you're talking, I started to really feel like just let you say whatever you're going to say, first of all, which I was always my intention, but then it might be really important for people to hear this. Because I'm now wondering how many adults out there like, I don't know what version of the Dexcom I'm using either. Scott. Like, I wonder how many people just have your feeling about it. And I don't not understand it. You don't even see diabetes is like a dire medical issue, right?

Arden Benner 41:26
Yeah. I don't I don't see a lot of stuff as a dire medical, as you know, what I saw as a medical issue most thrown up in the car. That was a medical issue that needs to get away from me.

Scott Benner 41:34
Do you want to tell people about that? That was hard. It's never been on the podcast before.

Arden Benner 41:38
It was horrible. All I know, is I was going 75 and a 25. And I still had my permit. And I was like, Oh, God, that wasn't the worst part. The worst part was that she she threw up. Right? She turned her head towards me. Like that was the way to do it. I tried to put the window down.

Scott Benner 41:58
Shouldn't like that. Nicole and I were in Seattle. Yeah. And Ma and you texted you texted me. It felt like it was like two in the morning. My time.

Arden Benner 42:08
It was 3am. And she was when she woke me up from my my perfectly nice sleep, by the way. Okay,

Scott Benner 42:14
so maybe it was more so it was 3am here. So it was more like midnight where I was. Yeah. And you texted me and you said I think I'm taking mom to the hospital.

Arden Benner 42:23
My mom texted you first. I listened. I didn't know we were going to the hospital till I was like up in the car. Okay. I didn't know it was what I thought she was messing with me. When she woke up to she woke me up and Netflix was still on the TV. So I thought I'd fall asleep for like 15 minutes or something. Okay. And then she was like, we're going to the hospital and I was like, the hell are you talking? But no, we're not. And then I looked at what time it was. And I was like, Oh, okay. All right. So then I just got my wisdom teeth out. So that was horrible. Tastes like throw up in my mouth. Like, Oh,

Scott Benner 42:55
my God. And you did not have a driver's license that No I did not. And mom was retching and paint. What was it a kidney stone? I don't know. Yeah, it was a stone of some sort. Yeah, she had a kidney stone, apparently. But she didn't know that at the time.

Arden Benner 43:08
Yeah, I thought her appendix was about to burst. That's Yeah, yeah. She's like, I'm in trouble. And I was like, yeah, it's really nice getting yelled at when you're trying to help someone wishing you? Well, I, I was told to go over the speed limit, which I did. And when we hit a bump, she was like, Oh, my God, what are you doing? And I was like, What? What? What?

Scott Benner 43:32
So I think, you listen, it's hard for people to see themselves. I've interviewed a ton of people when I'm done talking to them. And they're like, I don't think I said anything valuable. I'm thinking how do you not realize how valuable what you just said wasn't? And similarly here with you? I think that if you wake a lot of 16 year olds at the time, right, you were 16 you're 17 now Happy birthday. Yeah, a lot of 16 year olds up out of a dead sleep in the middle of the night and yell Hey, you're driving me to the hospital. And then that, but you so here's the part like you've been teasing along and we've been joking a lot and everything but I haven't been I know you. When you left for the hospital. tell people what you brought with you.

Arden Benner 44:15
Well, first, I got myself a toothbrush. That was the first thing I got. It was on toothpaste. A charger I got I don't know what I got. I was carrying a lot of stuff. I like threw a toothbrush to please charge your phone. You know other things that keep you alive and I went downstairs to pack some insulin pod blah, blah, blah, blah. Because I had no way of getting home legally. does not mean I wouldn't have driven home legally. But like, I had no way of getting home so that I brought all that

Scott Benner 44:47
so you brought all of your diabetes supplies with you? Yeah, and extra stuff in case you needed it. I think I brought insulin. Yeah, you brought pods. Yeah, you bring a Dexcom transmitter or sensor

Arden Benner 45:00
Probably I don't know. I don't know. I was home later that night asleep. So

Scott Benner 45:04
then in a panic situation in the middle of the night, you pulled yourself together and remember to take care of yourself. Yeah. Okay. And make sure you didn't have bad wisdom teeth breath.

Arden Benner 45:15
Yeah. She was still throwing up and I was like, Where's the bathroom?

Scott Benner 45:20
brush my teeth. You even brought a bag for the car for mom to throw up it right?

Arden Benner 45:23
I brought two and she dropped the first ones. Thank God, I brought a second one. Oh, my God, that would have been horrible. Because I was not gonna come I was gonna make hard clean. Get back out there. Go ahead.

Scott Benner 45:32
So you thought to bring two bags? Because she thought she might throw up? Yeah. Okay,

Arden Benner 45:38
and I don't do throw up. Right. I will not be a nurse. Oh, also, if you're under the age of 18. Just guilt trip nurses.

Unknown Speaker 45:47
So easy. How did you get mom help tell them

Arden Benner 45:51
diabetes, and I have two dogs and my dad's not here. I don't know what to do. I just only why it's so easy. And then just you know, you're fine after

Scott Benner 45:58
because they wouldn't come in and help mom right? It was Yeah, too long. Yeah. You guys should probably fix the system. I don't think the people listening are in charge of the system. One of them's gonna be a nurse if one of these people made the matrix or something. I mean, maybe. Would that be odd? You just gotta be like a billionaire. I'm coming for your song. I think there's a billionaire listening.

Arden Benner 46:24
Maybe what? Well, I don't know how you feel. Listen, at least a millionaire. A Millionaire listening to this. All right. You're the one who can follow me on Instagram, the rest of your data in your declined?

Unknown Speaker 46:35
Do you decline a lot of diabetes people who try to follow you

Arden Benner 46:38
if I don't? It's only because it says you follow my dad. If it does not say you follow my dad when it pops up. Goodbye. Now you're gone.

Scott Benner 46:47
Do you remember but you okay, but one of your very good friends. You met because of diabetes? I don't know how I met her. I thought back then you told me you thought she thought that you were me?

Arden Benner 47:03
I don't actually know. I don't remember All I know is that like I have her. I know her. I don't remember how we got in touch with each other.

Scott Benner 47:13
How long have you known each other?

Arden Benner 47:15
I can check. Okay, good. Good luck. I can check on Snapchat. I have no idea how long I've known her. I added her or she added me or something on Snapchat February 25 2017.

Scott Benner 47:30
That's like four years ago, plus maybe four and a half. But you met like it's been longer than that though. Like it's because I think you met on Instagram. You haven't had Snapchat for as long as you've had Instagram. I don't I do want to say hi to her. She's almost into this. How do you know?

Arden Benner 47:47
I'm well aware she's not listening to this. Okay. I mean, I don't actually know. But like, I know her. I don't think she knows. Just in case she's listening. Now she's not.

Scott Benner 48:01
You know, a lot of people listen to this, right? Yeah, I'm aware. Okay. wasting your time. clean the dishes. They can clean the dishes and listen to them.

Arden Benner 48:11
I don't think people are really great at multitasking. So they are not these people. I'm just kidding. I don't know most of you. But some of you gotta be bad at it. What?

Scott Benner 48:19
You just think a general portion of the population can't multitask.

Arden Benner 48:22
Yeah, for sure. Especially men. All right. No, I take it back. Women to some girls are really stupid. You should probably edit all of this out.

Scott Benner 48:32
You think I should just be about anything you say this controversial?

Arden Benner 48:34
Yeah, like a minute straight. It's just like i'm not i'm not cursing. I just, you know? Yeah. pretty blunt.

Scott Benner 48:42
So on online, you're not? There's no identification around diabetes for you. Yeah, no, it's just because you have a very uncommon first name. Probably the people can find you.

Arden Benner 48:52
which apparently I don't there's a girl who goes to a school near her girls My name so follow her.

Scott Benner 48:57
Do you know there's a girl? I think her mom listens. Who has your first name and your last name? And has diabetes. That's crazy, right?

Arden Benner 49:08
Is she younger than me? I think so. Hmm. So we copier on my hands? Trying to be like me fix you.

Scott Benner 49:16
Do you think she got diabetes on purpose? Yeah, I see what's happening here. Well know that

Arden Benner 49:21
why don't you get this juice box tattooed on you with my face on it. This? I'm coming to your house and erasing it.

Scott Benner 49:28
Well, we took your face off of it a long time ago when you ask Do you remember asking? Yeah, I don't want my face out there. Yeah. Remember the thing you said to me? No, I don't want to look like a baby on the internet. Yeah, that's very valid. I didn't think it was invalid. As soon as you told me I took care of it. Well, kind of I fast as I could.

Arden Benner 49:46
It was a drawing but you know,

Scott Benner 49:48
I moved to a draw and now it's gone. We don't use it for anything anymore. Interesting. It was a very nice picture of you when you were a baby.

Arden Benner 49:55
I bet there's a lot of nice pictures of me.

Scott Benner 49:57
Oh yeah. You're very photogenic. No. Okay, so you were not, so you're not identified online at all through that we can get even in your crack my neck once you get closer to them like

Unknown Speaker 50:11
okay, proceed, okay, you're very cranky. Yeah, that's another problem I have we found out would result in early death. It can result in early

Scott Benner 50:20
people have a sense of humor. Yeah, they do, you're gonna have to figure out that you're joking. Yeah. We did learn that your cortisol level is higher. I have no idea what that means either. Which is why you're taking magnesium now. Sure. So, you're telling me that you think that most kids have this level of understanding?

Arden Benner 50:41
I don't know what they understand what am i their mother? Well, generally, you should all understand what your kids under. I'm sure they do my job. But you

Scott Benner 50:48
so it's funny, you're coming off about the way I expected. Like I you're not surprising me at all. Which is partly why these next recordings are going to be like valuable because we are actually going to talk about how to take care of you in the coming recordings. So it'll almost be like diabetes school. That'd be fun, right?

Arden Benner 51:08
I don't know how we're gonna do another one of these. Another one. We're gonna do a few more. Okay. Actually, at least three because that'll get me up to 15 hours. So

Scott Benner 51:19
well, whether you whether you mean to or not, what you're doing is gonna help people.

Arden Benner 51:23
Yeah, I bet I have a very soothing voice. You have a soothing voice. I'm just canes very manly.

Scott Benner 51:29
You think you have a manly voice? I do have a very deep voice for a girl get closer to the microphone and try to get the I'm not getting get deep voice so wrong. It doesn't just feel like say something like with a really deep voice.

Arden Benner 51:40
Know what? What? No, I don't want to be the next internet joke. Think you're gonna be an internet show one of those people that needs to know how to edit.

Scott Benner 51:51
What is your favorite social media app? You don't really care. You

Arden Benner 51:58
know? I'm okay. If you told me I had to delete all social media right now. Never use it again. I'd be like, okay, that's whatever. That's fine.

Scott Benner 52:05
Do you have friends that couldn't do that? They couldn't do that. Um, do you think they'd all be okay, well, I

Arden Benner 52:13
think that I'll be fine. Without it. I think you would be bored. I'm on board with it.

Scott Benner 52:22
Yeah. Were you bored before COVID? Or has?

Arden Benner 52:26
Yeah, life is very boring in New Jersey. I see why it's a joke in movies to live here.

Scott Benner 52:33
What do you what would you like to be doing? I'd like to be in the city. Doing why making money. Oh, you want to be an adult? You want to get a job? Oh, yeah. Let's get out of here. Get going? Yeah. What are you gonna do with your money?

Arden Benner 52:46
I think I'm just too intelligent for this town. You think so? too bright for the people here? Oh, my God, especially people who drive here at the speed limit is 40 don't go 30. Like, come on. You live in Jersey.

Scott Benner 52:57
You don't think that that people basically drive the same everywhere? No, I do. Know. I think it's some places.

Arden Benner 53:06
I had to merge today. And I was like, Oh, God. But you were in New Jersey. Right? Yeah, that's what I'm saying. It was like, everyone's like a maniac. Wait, have

Scott Benner 53:14
you not merged before?

Arden Benner 53:16
No, I have. But every time I emerge, I think, Okay. I saw something online. That was like a lot of people were like, when I'm married. I just close my eyes, which is, you know, probably you probably shouldn't have your license. But I mean, I feel that way. But I don't close my eyes. You said you went to Wild Wings.

Scott Benner 53:31
Yeah, you go to the one out on Route one. Yeah. Oh, that is kind of dangerous.

Arden Benner 53:36
Yeah, yeah. I did that. Yeah. I'm very special driver. You're special driver. Yeah.

Scott Benner 53:43
We should get a sticker that says that. Okay, well, then I'll get bullied at school. That's how you get bullied at school. Everyone.

Unknown Speaker 53:51
tell people you're a special driver. Don't be like, hey, especially if you can't park your car. My God. Imagine that and they'll be all over you. Yeah. All right. Okay, here's another question for me. Yeah, I

Scott Benner 54:02
think we're doing pretty well. Next year. Any questions for me? Nope. So that's what I wanted to tell you. Someone on line said, I'd like to hear art and ask Scott questions. And I said, I don't think Arden thinks about me enough to have a question to ask

Arden Benner 54:19
us. What's for dinner? And I but the answer is I haven't thought about it yet. Or mashed potatoes and chicken. Which I don't want by the way. Yeah, you're not gonna get that.

Scott Benner 54:28
No, you tell people that you had like a weird thing for a while where you couldn't eat meat. That I don't think they care about that. I think people care about that a lot.

Arden Benner 54:35
I made hotdogs yesterday. I was like, Oh, that's horrible. So you're still like sent me to? I couldn't do

Scott Benner 54:41
it. You're still having a weird aversion to some meat. Yeah. We had to get you some low rent Chinese food the other day? Because

Arden Benner 54:47
because it didn't actually tastes like chicken.

Scott Benner 54:53
Like I can eat this chicken because it doesn't taste like chicken. But that just started happening a couple months ago, right?

Arden Benner 54:59
Yeah. Yeah, I've lost like, a couple pounds because of that.

Scott Benner 55:03
You just can't you have no taste for me, right?

Arden Benner 55:05
Yeah, it's horrible. Just taste like disgusting.

Scott Benner 55:08
And at the beginning of this, you weren't hungry at all for a little while.

Arden Benner 55:11
Yeah, right. I'm still really don't get that hungry. You're not getting that hungry. Yeah, like when I went to eat today, I was like, I don't really like if you told me like, you can eat but you don't know. I just probably wouldn't eat. But I mean, probably good. You know?

Scott Benner 55:26
You don't want to starve. Well, some carrots. So there's really a great thing that you wouldn't know, right? If you weren't using if you weren't using an algorithm end or if we didn't really know how to handle insulin. You couldn't go for long stretches of time like that without eating. You would have you have ended up having to eat so there have been times you've gotten up in the morning that I'm not hungry, and you haven't eaten till like two or three in the afternoon. Yeah, intermittent fasting, everyone, it is intermittent fasting. I lose a couple of pounds, but not on purpose. Really? Yeah, no, that's all. But you understand that keeping your blood sugar stable without eating is something that a lot of people aren't able to do. Right. All right. I don't know. I don't think about that. You don't know that? Yeah, no, I know. That's interesting. So you have if you asked me to step back and and see this from a third party perspective,

Arden Benner 56:18
I'm not asking you to do that. But go ahead.

Scott Benner 56:21
wasn't talking about you specifically, it was sort of like the Royal way. Like, let's say now I was moving the conversation. Okay, perceive that. You have to cut me off that if you're

Arden Benner 56:30
cutting you off. I tell conversation works is it? That's what you told me? It is when we had a fight? Yeah. We have to go back and forth. Yeah. Cuz I was like, let me finish my sentence. And he was like, that's not how compensation works. Yeah, you guys should be here. That's fun. She's not always sweet. Oh, I don't think I'm I don't think oh, yeah, but here's a secret. I'm going to give all the secrets out about you. I'm not gonna ask you a question. I'm gonna tell them the truth. After he gets off the phone with all of you and answers us, He's so nice to all you and gives you all the information you need or whatever. I'll ask the same exact question. He's like, Are you serious? You'll know that you do. Pre-Bolus Oh, my God. So.

Scott Benner 57:09
Okay, so I don't talk to you like that. For the last 15 minutes, you've laid out that you don't really know what you're doing anyway.

Arden Benner 57:18
If I know sometimes, Okay, listen, I'm a child, if I forget to Pre-Bolus or let's, let's make it even better. If there's a bag of chips in front of me. I'm gonna eat them. Okay. So don't yell at me.

Do you think you get all that? Yeah, you don't think I'm just like are you get upset when they call you in? Pre-Bolus? Oh my god. I'm like a diabetic. God has never said that. Nor have I ever thought that you should start calling yourself that. I call myself lady Jesus at school.

Scott Benner 57:44
I should start calling myself out because you call yourself lady Jesus. Do Is this catching on lady Jesus? No, no one says we should get that sticker for the car. Lady Jesus. Yeah,

Arden Benner 57:56
if they Oh my god, imagine if they love this color in our parking spots at school. My will just say reserved for lady Jesus.

Scott Benner 58:03
I don't think they're gonna let you do that. I know. But they should. Anyway, that the Pre-Bolus thing is really, really important. Okay, so that's when we talk in future episodes. That's what we're going to talk about. Oh, that seems so boring. I know. But we're going to do

Arden Benner 58:20
I don't know how the talk like you're not gonna. It's gonna be you talking not me.

Scott Benner 58:25
Well, you could just be interactive. That's what I do. Uh huh. Well, you could also I'll think of questions while we're talking and you'll answer them.

Arden Benner 58:35
Why don't you have any questions written down? It seems like you're unprepared. I don't use

Scott Benner 58:39
that's not how I prepare very

Arden Benner 58:41
messy desk. desk. You

Scott Benner 58:42
have my desk is really messy. Yeah. Wow. You want to see some people's questions? What? Some people have questions? Yeah, I don't want to see them. Well, now you're talking. And you're gonna see them?

Arden Benner 58:53
No, I'm okay. We're almost out one hour, I need to seven minutes left everyone.

Scott Benner 59:01
So we're gonna ask, we'll see what people's questions were. And then we will

Arden Benner 59:05
let's go a little bit over one hour and use me to edit some of this out. Okay, I really need this community service. I really want a parking spot. Well, do

Scott Benner 59:12
you think that anything you've done right now will be of service to the community? Now that who needs to know that? So? I don't think that by the way. I think that what you've talked about for the last hour is really interesting. And I think that a lot of parents will find what you said. enlightening.

Arden Benner 59:32
I think the dumbest question you've asked me was what my favorite social media app is. Really? Yeah, that was horrible. That was a horrible question to ask me my favorite color next time.

Unknown Speaker 59:40
With nothing to do with anything that you didn't like? No, I didn't like you also didn't answer it. Why don't have a favorite favorite.

Scott Benner 59:47
What's your favorite TV show right now?

Arden Benner 59:50
You know, I'm watching Teen Wolf at the moment. And let me just it's a horrible show. I've never seen such horrible acting in my life. But Dylan O'Brien is a good looking man. So I'm gonna keep watching it. Um, and but One Tree Hill is a good show my favorite of all time. I could watch any Marvel movie religiously. Like if you guys are, you know on Family Feud and they asked that question or Jeopardy or whatever phone a friend, it's me, it's you. That's the one time you get to request me on Instagram. And then what else do I like? I'm a very dystopian lover. Like the hunger. This is a lot of bloody Dexcom.

Scott Benner 1:00:28
So I'm looking at what's going on here and I'm scrolling through the pictures that are on the Facebook page right now looking for a picture that I attached to her to her thing and there have been a couple of people who put bleeders up on there.

Arden Benner 1:00:39
Some of you need to get some better angles on their pictures.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:42
Yeah. You think you're critiquing people's photography? Yeah, that's horrible. I like babies. Aren't those kids cute? Those that post is the most part of their names. Oh, bad interviewer No, you don't know dad. They even write their twin girls their twin girls, but I

Scott Benner 1:01:09
asked that they name if they named the babies after me. No, there'll be a horrible name. They did not. But the mom the mother. So let me find where I sat it.

Arden Benner 1:01:20
I'll tell you what I think if the names. Oh, okay. I'm just kidding. I won't do that. I'm sure this will go horribly. If I say anything.

Scott Benner 1:01:27
I'm sure they're lovely names. I just don't remember. I'm scrolling. Whether you guys love this post so much. I can't find my Oh, here it is. Hannah and Nicole.

Arden Benner 1:01:43
Wait, no, it's his hand and Nicole is in pink.

Unknown Speaker 1:01:46
Yes. I don't know how to say that other name. Hadassah. Hadassah Grady.

Arden Benner 1:01:50
I like that. I like that one better. Katie. Yeah, I like that better than Hannah. Okay, I mean, no offense to Hannah or anything but like I'm more of a heavy person. I don't think she can take offense. For four minutes hold. Which one do you think it is? I think Hannah is

Scott Benner 1:02:06
well that's interesting. Wait, don't answer I'm gonna guess so one babies and pink one babies and purple. And your Oh wait, actually

Arden Benner 1:02:12
that What? I didn't even look over here. But I did now and now I know who it is. And that's what I was gonna say. Okay, Haiti looks more badass than Hannah. Thanks. So that's my picture.

Scott Benner 1:02:22
She's looking more at the camera has kind of got her hand over her face. Like Yeah, she's shy. Why are you? Yeah, don't please don't? What did their shirts say? worth? were you telling your children what they're worth? No, I don't think that's what it says. worth something worth to. I don't know. I don't know. I know. I'm gonna be honest. You don't need to tell me. I'm gonna move on with my life. Now. You don't want anybody? Okay, can we get back? Let me find the thing. That does not like good food. Something you need to learn how to cook. You're critiquing people's food. Yeah. Is that a selfie you took that's horrible that alright. I was thinking people for something. Where is this picture at? Guys post so much stuff on this board, which is very cool. But I'm having trouble finding what I'm looking for because of that. Reading. who's reading? People read your reading? What are you reading right now for school? Oh, I didn't start any of that. What are you supposed to read for school? I don't know what it's called.

Unknown Speaker 1:03:23
Do you have the book? Yes. You have a book? two books. Your two books? Yeah. ap literature.

Arden Benner 1:03:30
Let's hope that goes well. I took AP Lang I made it. I was also online the whole year. If that means anything,

Scott Benner 1:03:38
tell, listen, while I'm scrolling tell all the parents. If their kids got a good education when they were online, they

Arden Benner 1:03:45
did not. They got really good at cheating. And they're gonna go back to school and take that exam they have to take on the first day of school and an AP class. And they're gonna come home with a zero, and you're just gonna sit down and eat dinner, because everyone else got a 02 except for that one girl who's a kiss ass who didn't cheat the whole year. Like, like no one cheated that year. So you're saying a lot of people were cheating while they were on one. Yeah, everyone was cheating online. Which is very weird because when I'm in school, I do not cheat. I feel very guilty if I do that. Okay, but I had given up I was like, this is a joke, right? I was like, What? Come on? How were the teachers sent me? No, that looked just like me.

Unknown Speaker 1:04:31
Back when I was little. You have a little girl pretending to kiss the fish. Yeah, your child looks like me. Yeah, when you were little How about that? Right? That looks just like me. Thanks. So to let me look and see if we have a name. That does look like me when I was little. She does look a lot like you. Maybe but if that was hard and better,

Scott Benner 1:04:47
that'd be really weird. The other girl the other Arden better. This person didn't put her name up. But her mom's name is Megan. She's my aunt's name. She is your aunt's name.

Arden Benner 1:04:57
Maria connected. I don't know how it's spelled. Yeah, I mean We're not very connected. She does look a lot like me. Yeah. Okay, we have the same head shape. That's actually what stood out to me was her head.

Scott Benner 1:05:08
What shape is your head? I don't know. Whatever that is. You're aware that when you see your head shape on someone else, you know what your head shape? Yeah, but you're not aware she did look like Oh, no. No, no, not here. I'm agreeing with you.

Unknown Speaker 1:05:24
Look at this kid thrown up. Deuces. Yes. Sorry. pyside. Everybody. Is that a gang sign? That's peace. This is can you find this post? I know. I'm gonna have to leave because we're you know, we have a couple seconds left dad.

Scott Benner 1:05:35
Oh, you're staying till we're done. Oh, relax. Hold on.

Arden Benner 1:05:39
Oh my God. He's sitting as water. I'm

Scott Benner 1:05:41
thirsty. Let me do a search for it instead.

Arden Benner 1:05:44
Oh, you could have done that the whole entire time? I

Scott Benner 1:05:46
don't know. I'm not great with the internet.

Oh, it popped right up. That's embarrassing. Okay, guess I could have just done that. Alright, let's see if people had questions. Let me pull up all the comments.

Arden Benner 1:06:02
Let's not answer the bad questions. Okay. Don't say them out loud. Because then they'll know their questions bad.

Scott Benner 1:06:11
They're gonna think we're making hand signals each other right now, which we're not. No, I'll make a hand signal. No, you won't make people think you're speaking behind their back. That's not behind their back. I hope it's her the interviews. You

Arden Benner 1:06:24
know what I said? Heather? No, no, no. That's not gonna happen. Hold on. Oh, pay her. Yeah, I'm not getting any money for this apparently. Because it's community service. I feel like I should get paid under the counter. But whatever. It's under the table and whatever. I don't work with drugs. So I don't know

Scott Benner 1:06:47
you. But when you have a job and you're not paying taxes called under the table, not under the counter,

Arden Benner 1:06:52
whatever. Alright, anyways, Aaron, no money.

Scott Benner 1:06:55
This person wondered. Had you ever been on? Okay, this person asked. Do you know that you're practically a celebrity? Me? Yeah.

Arden Benner 1:07:03
I'm not a celebrity until I'm on the red carpet with Anne Hathaway. I'm not a celebrity.

Scott Benner 1:07:07
Why Anne Hathaway because she's in the best movie ever. Devil Wears Prada ever worse problem. Such a good movie? Yeah, great movie.

Arden Benner 1:07:15
I just feel like Anne Hathaway is like, you've made it if you're on the red carpet with her

Scott Benner 1:07:20
with her. Yeah, but but this person's point is that to the people listening to this, you that that that you may be not a celebrity? I don't think that I'm not saying you are Yeah,

Arden Benner 1:07:32
most people don't know my name in this town. So trust me, I'm not a celebrity.

Scott Benner 1:07:38
Okay, now, here's a super serious question. Do you realize the impact that you've had on the diabetes community in general and people's health?

Arden Benner 1:07:46
I don't think I've done anything. I think this is all you.

Scott Benner 1:07:49
But do you see that? His point? Is that is that without you? I don't have to figure out diabetes

Arden Benner 1:07:56
to her. Now let's have him. I'm trying to read the national woman with a middle name of Seth. Why are you assuming? I mean, there's a man and a woman in the picture. So wait, let me see what the job is. I can figure it out by that.

Unknown Speaker 1:08:12
They don't give women good jobs. They don't give women good jobs. Not in this generation.

Scott Benner 1:08:17
Manager part. Manager, this is a man. Okay, but be so wait a second, like, let's stop on this one for a second and be super serious. If? Who cares? What if you were the reason that I don't know, I made a widget. Right? We have a little, a little device that helps people something. So let's say you were born. And you had, let's make something up specific. Let's say you were born, and you had really fat fingers. So you couldn't pick your nose. And I may, what the hell and I made a little thing for you to pick your nose with. And then it turned out there were a lot of people with fat fingers that couldn't pick their nose. And we started selling them and help everybody get the boogers out of their nose. Would you be able to see that because of you? These people didn't have boogers in their nose anymore. I don't think that would be because of me. They do.

Unknown Speaker 1:09:14
Okay, well, then we have different views and they're grateful for it. Okay, yeah. All right.

Scott Benner 1:09:19
I think they're also grateful that you don't limit me from talking about you.

Arden Benner 1:09:26
I'm not his mom, I can't do anything about that. So you

Scott Benner 1:09:29
could you could say Please don't say my period. But it ends up being really important. You're

Arden Benner 1:09:34
too late, because he's already said and I didn't know so.

Scott Benner 1:09:38
But you've never come to me and said Please don't say that.

Arden Benner 1:09:41
Yeah, I don't really whatever is happening here. It's just not my world. So whatever. Right?

Scott Benner 1:09:45
I've tried to make that clear to people, but I think some people don't understand. Okay. All right. Let's scroll.

Arden Benner 1:09:55
I can tell who's older based on the words they use.

Scott Benner 1:09:58
Really? Yeah, give me Don't say me. His name give me a word that tells me somebody older.

Arden Benner 1:10:03
Well, no, I can see that. They're gonna know it's them.

Scott Benner 1:10:06
everyone listening Well, no, only the person that did okay, whoa, Ray. Ray. Yeah. Ray says you older or younger than 35? Older. Okay. Do you see any young words?

Arden Benner 1:10:19
I'm not a very fast reader. So hold on. Um, no, not yet.

Scott Benner 1:10:25
Can you verify that you are not sitting in the new chair?

Arden Benner 1:10:30
Yeah, I was I tried to sit in that he told me don't move it. So. Yeah, no, trust me. I'm not sending it.

Scott Benner 1:10:39
See, this person is interested in your perspective, which you've been very free with it. I think that's excellent. All right. Okay.

Arden Benner 1:10:48
He's not famous continue.

Scott Benner 1:10:52
Okay, so I'm not famous, and I agree with you.

Arden Benner 1:10:54
What is he thinks he's so cool, because he showed up on that one app when you look up his name. Oh, what was that? I don't know what it's called. It was like it was like a morphing app. Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:11:03
yeah. Oh, like there who? No kidding. There was an app where you could pull up famous people more for your face with them. Yeah. And I was on there as famous person. Yeah, that was stupid. Yeah. But it was also kind of scary. That my face was there. Yeah. I thought so. It took me by surprise.

Arden Benner 1:11:21
Yeah, I should be there. Apparently. I'm the good one here. I should be getting the money. Actually, technically, I do get the money. A lot of clothes.

Scott Benner 1:11:30
Yeah, we you guys support the sponsors? You are you're definitely paying for artists clothing. Yeah, for sure. So but take her question. How did you convince me? No, wait, but take this question. Okay, but take the word famous out of it.

Unknown Speaker 1:11:42
Does it have a dad everyone loves? Well, everyone doesn't love me. But how does? She just said that what she said but my new school and pass it? I can't read it feel uncomfortable?

Arden Benner 1:11:52
uncomfortable? What do you 12? Let me read it. I don't know how to answer this question. Like,

Scott Benner 1:11:59
it doesn't feel different to you that I don't really care if other people like you or not. Okay. Yeah. What's a good answer? Okay, here's Next, I think which so you would say for clarity, you've never walked around and thought, it's cool. My dad has a podcast that people

Arden Benner 1:12:12
know. I actually think it's kind of embarrassing to say it. Okay. Yeah. I don't tell people that you have a podcast if people ask what my parents job is. I tell people that mom works for a company. You don't mention me. Uh, you know, everyone kind of knows you have a podcast, right? Okay. So it doesn't come it doesn't like no one ever, you know, ask that question either.

Scott Benner 1:12:37
Okay, I'm reading sorry. Some I have to be honest, some of you the way you're right. I don't understand what you're talking about. This woman's gonna let her daughter listen. Do you think that's a mistake? What do you think that her daughter will turn to her and be like, I don't know what that glucagon is called either.

Arden Benner 1:12:56
I don't know what her daughter you're asking me questions I clearly cannot answer. You're interesting. You're from

Scott Benner 1:13:00
you're definitely from a generation that will not generalize about some things.

Arden Benner 1:13:04
I don't believe I connected my generation whatsoever. What

Scott Benner 1:13:08
generation do you connect to? Oh,

Arden Benner 1:13:09
I don't know. But not this one. Because I hate every child in this not your children. But everyone I know at my school I'm not fond of what is that?

Scott Benner 1:13:19
What bothers you about the in

Arden Benner 1:13:21
they just they worried about the dumbest things. Okay. Like, apparently, let's I'll put this out there. Apparently, no one else thought it was funny to make your Instagram account named Ashton Kutcher. Like, cooter Come on. Ashton Kutcher, Ashton Kutcher. That's hilarious, right? I have like five people save. It's funny. And everyone else was like, that's so weird. I was like, you have no personality. But then it changed back because I was like, oh, colleges, look at your social media. And I don't want to be Ashton Kutcher. So

Scott Benner 1:13:53
So in general, you're not happy that people didn't understand the actual Ashton Kutcher. Yeah,

Arden Benner 1:13:57
no one appreciated my periods.

Scott Benner 1:14:00
Well, last night, we're not going to tell people but I made a joke last night in front of your friends that only you got. And none of them. Yeah, they didn't get it. Right. This is sweet. This person says that.

Arden Benner 1:14:11
I read that one already. I'm a faster reader, apparently, because you're taking forever. I

Scott Benner 1:14:15
had read it before as well. I'm bringing it back up now. So we can speak about that.

Arden Benner 1:14:18
She calls those crazy. Yeah, do what? Matt is correct, Matt. Matt is correct. I don't think you're crazy. I just think that it's crazy that you're listening to this.

Scott Benner 1:14:28
You so you've so far as we scrolled through. Agreed mostly with Matt. Yes. That's very interesting. That's from Australia. He's got a wave.

Arden Benner 1:14:39
That's my dream accent. Okay. Yeah. You know how everyone asked if you could change one thing about your body? What would it be? Mine was not anything physical. Like, I want a different accent. I do not like, you know, being American.

Scott Benner 1:14:54
Here. Well, my point wasn't about the accent. It was that Matt's got a different sensibility about them. There's an Australian sensibility, more Matter of fact, like you, so maybe you're more Australian than you think.

Arden Benner 1:15:06
Oh, are you saying that maybe Chris Hemsworth would like me?

Scott Benner 1:15:10
Yes. Maybe Chris Hemsworth will like, Okay. All right, people looking forward to Okay, here you go. How How accurate is this one? That's a lot of reading. I imagine her to be very chill and laid back. Or you chill

Arden Benner 1:15:24
my hands. I don't know how to answer questions about myself. It's interesting, isn't it? Um, I heard it.

reading, reading, relaxing the diabetes and Scott keeps an exterior cool. Oh, he does not keep his cool. Basal. Yeah, that's, that's gonna be our next episode. Basically makes it look easy. ninja skills. Yeah, I believe I'm a ninja. You believe you're a ninja. Basically, I imagined her as a pretty cool girl. I'm with Jessica.

Unknown Speaker 1:15:52
Yeah. You believe in Jessica. Yeah. All right. I think she's younger. You think Kate is younger? Because of how she wrote?

Scott Benner 1:16:01
Oh, my God. Yeah. I don't think she's young. I think she's younger. It's interesting. Kate is the person who put your name in general hospital. Oh, really? Yeah.

Arden Benner 1:16:14
Maybe she's just like in the writing? No.

Scott Benner 1:16:17
Do you want to thank her? No. Okay. Next, okay. What about Tommy's idea? This might be really interesting. Would you answer questions

Arden Benner 1:16:35
from children? I don't think I could put up with children. No, I don't that's I've actually been told that the one job I should not have is a teacher or a nurse.

Scott Benner 1:16:45
We wouldn't bring the children on the panel. Oh, wait, what? Yeah, they would just write their questions.

Arden Benner 1:16:50
Oh, yeah. I can't just i, this can't be a live talk with children. Like, I'll be like, Listen, shut up.

Scott Benner 1:16:57
No, but if so if their kids send questions in would you answer them? But would you answer them? Like if they said, Hey,

Arden Benner 1:17:04
I don't think kids would understand what I'm saying. like little children. Wait, how old? Are we talking? I don't know. Because anyone like under the age of 12. I don't think their brains developed yet. Like where it needs to be to understand what I'm saying. So even 13 year olds, they still have braces. So I don't think do you

Scott Benner 1:17:20
think some people are going to be disappointed after hearing your talk?

Arden Benner 1:17:24
A lot of people were disappointed after they hear me talk about the rest of that even says she's using abbreviations.

Scott Benner 1:17:31
Alright, this person is just very excited. Okay, and says, Do you think she asked me if I think you're gonna roll your eyes at me while we're doing it. You didn't roll your eyes at me?

Arden Benner 1:17:39
Oh, my eyes on people. Yeah, I just tell them they're being stupid. Okay. All right. Well, I feel that these people have me all wrong. Well,

Scott Benner 1:17:50
no, yeah, they you're, you're a one dimensional person to them. Oh, no, that means that's not what I'm talking about. What do you mean? How do you not know what that means? You You love One Tree Hill. I bet you they say that all the time in that show. What do you want to tell people that you went to a One Tree Hill convention?

Arden Benner 1:18:06
We went to two of them. Thank you very much. Um, the first time I didn't get to meet Sophia Bush, because the tickets were sold out. But I met James Lafferty, James Lafferty, if your wife is listening to this because I speak Let's all talk about this for a second. Go ahead. James Lafferty decided to marry a diabetic. I'm a diabetic. So if he was looking for a diabetic why not make

Unknown Speaker 1:18:30
literally one more year till everything's legal? Oh, my God. He could have waited. Well, you didn't put it in your Instagram bio. So how would he know?

Arden Benner 1:18:36
You know, Chad Michael Murray did like my photo though. He did. Yeah. And I don't you know, I don't think he's like the famous enough type to have someone else run it for him. So I think he liked the photo. Cool. What's his wife's name? I don't like a row. I don't really know. It's I don't think she's American. I think she has some foreign name. You don't know her name? No, she's not she I know. She's type one. No, it's no, it's not Tom Michael Murray's wife. It's James Lafferty, his wife. Oh, James Lafferty. His

Scott Benner 1:19:05
wife has type she's more famous than john Michael Murray. His wife. What's What's her name?

Arden Benner 1:19:09
I don't know. Look up James. I pretty much have James Lafferty fiance they just got engaged. I know everything. Oh, speaking of Wait, we should all we should all start a club. That now I'm in with you guys if we start a club, too. Oh, yeah, that's her. Alexandra Park. could have been me anyways. If we all started club to get me on the one she held podcast with Bethany joy Lenz, Halliburton and Sophia Bush, then I'm in that you could that I'll do for no community surf service hours.

Scott Benner 1:19:43
Would you really be able to dig in and talk about that show? Oh, I know everything about that show. That's probably not good. What what? What's your second favorite show? I don't know.

Arden Benner 1:19:54
I'm a Gossip Girl fan. I like you. I can't wait for the season three to come out of you. That's something you probably should let your children watch. Okay? Yeah, I started watching that on a road trip in the car, and I realized that I probably shouldn't watch that in the car with you guys. But I didn't anyways, um what else do I like? Well, what

Scott Benner 1:20:13
shows have you turned me on to?

Arden Benner 1:20:15
New Girl? That's a good show. I'm if you don't like New Girl, I believe you don't have a sense of humor. Anybody on here who decides new girls not a good show? Stop listening. You don't deserve to listen.

Scott Benner 1:20:27
First of all, you can still listen to No, I don't think you can. But tell them what we do to mom. I don't understand what do we we have tried twice for

Arden Benner 1:20:39
three times three times. I've started out show over three times for her.

Scott Benner 1:20:43
And it's hilarious. And she never laughs Yeah. Mommy likes TV shows with like the word Chicago in it.

Arden Benner 1:20:52
Even the episode if anyone knows what I'm talking about the episode when Jess Nick and the like janitor or whatever. In the apartment, like he tries to have a threesome with them. You probably can't put this up now. I can. Okay, when that happens. It is hilarious. And they start playing that song from Matilda. She did not even crack a smile. I was like what

Unknown Speaker 1:21:14
my mom says humorous, weird. And just starts playing the drums in the air. Yeah.

Arden Benner 1:21:18
Oh my god. Come on. Yeah, anyways, that's they're, they're engaged.

Scott Benner 1:21:22
I see that. Alright, so Alexandra Park has type one diabetes. Yeah, she can come on the show. She wants to.

Arden Benner 1:21:28
I don't think she she made a book about that song. She's got she's got money.

Scott Benner 1:21:32
Let me ask the question. If that girl came on this podcast, would you co host that episode with me?

Unknown Speaker 1:21:37
No, I wouldn't do that. And you can tell her I like her husband a lot. And that actually, no, don't don't make it creepy. We want to get lunch with them or something. We don't we don't want to make it creepy. Yeah. Okay. Let's just hope she doesn't listen to this. He looks a lot older than you. Yeah, he is. He's almost 40. Now he's in his 30s. He's 35. It says, Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:21:58
I can tell. You can tell. Yeah, he's he's in his 30s. All right. Well,

Scott Benner 1:22:02
maybe this will get back to him. That'd be crazy, wouldn't it? Yeah. Okay, wait, here's something interesting. I think New Girl is terrific. You introduced it to me during COVID. Yeah. When we were just like, literally trapped in our house. Yeah, it's amazing. I'm getting hot again. But you don't like to have last? Oh,

Arden Benner 1:22:21
no, I mostly because I think soccer is the worst sport to exist. And I just I can't anything that involves soccer. needs to be shut off.

Scott Benner 1:22:29
Yeah, you know,

Arden Benner 1:22:30
I cannot do soccer. If your kid play soccer, like good for them. I don't know if I can be friends with them.

Scott Benner 1:22:37
What about what about when I introduced you to pulp fiction? You didn't like that?

Arden Benner 1:22:41
No, I didn't like that. I think all those movies like Pulp Fiction Kill Bill. Wait, is that is it Kill Bill? Is what it is with the with that girl? Yeah. Okay, all of those movies. Everyone's like, Oh, it's a cinematic masterpiece. It's so slow. Which like I can appreciate to an extent. But like, you got to like, Come on. Let's go. There's too much dialogue. There's no there's like not enough dialogue or something. There's like too much nothing happening.

Scott Benner 1:23:07
So blackwidow way better than Pulp Fiction.

Arden Benner 1:23:12
Yeah, I also very big black widow fan. I really liked the movie. I would not put that top five though. top

Scott Benner 1:23:19
five in your in your mind Marvel category or even your Marvel category? Yeah, what are your top five Marvel? Oh,

Arden Benner 1:23:24
wait, we can't do this right now. This will take me a while. Why? Cuz? I don't know. I think this is so hard. I'm a very big fan of the first Avengers movie. Okay, Thor Ragnarok. Winter Soldier. endgame. I'm actually a lot of people like Infinity War better than endgame but I'm more of an endgame person. Okay, um, I really like Iron Man. Three. I think that's the best one. If you disagree. I don't know. But I think we should make it clear that Captain America is the worst of the six Avengers. You really don't like Captain him. I don't dislike him. But he's so cheesy.

Scott Benner 1:24:01
Right? And you didn't like Black Panther? Very much. No. Oh,

Unknown Speaker 1:24:04
I feel like I'm gonna get a lot. No, I don't think you would. You didn't like a lot of people. for that. I don't know why we're not liking Black Panther. Yeah, I mean, you don't hate it. No, I

Arden Benner 1:24:12
don't hate it. But I think it's overhyped for sure.

Scott Benner 1:24:14
What about the TV shows? Have they been good? so far?

Arden Benner 1:24:17
I I liked one division a lot. Loki like slowed down at some point. And they made it like too much. Like, like topless or something. I don't know. The Winter Soldier Falcon. I was really lost and what the villain was like, Yeah, what was that? Like? Like? Was she like Irish? I don't know. What was one girl with a curly hair the curly hair the like the red hair and freckles? Yeah, I don't. I don't understand what like where she come from.

Scott Benner 1:24:47
I don't know. So so far. I agree. wandavision was pretty good. This is the best one. Yeah, Falcon and Winter Soldier. That's my least favorite. I wasn't sure what was happening and Loki

Arden Benner 1:24:56
got started good and then got worse. But I think Because it's supposed to be longer the season supposed to be longer in the middle kind of slow down I think it was gonna pick back up there was a scene towards the end of the last time we should become like a you know those like nerds who do this for fun we could do this. Oh my god yeah,

Scott Benner 1:25:12
we already have microphones so at the end of Loki this isn't even diabetic related everything your diabetes, okay, whatever at the end of Loki there was a scene before they went into the house where they were outside of the whatever. I don't want to give it away for people. You know what I mean, though? Yeah,

Arden Benner 1:25:29
I don't know what they're doing. Like that guy has so many powers and they're doing nothing with him.

Scott Benner 1:25:33
I kept thinking, did they mean to edit some of this out and they forgot. Like, why is this taking so long? Yeah, it was not. It was a I didn't like it.

Arden Benner 1:25:41
I actually can't wait for Hawkeye. If you dislike Hawkeye. You just don't understand. Watch Voltron again. He was great. Yeah, yeah, he's legit. Yeah, he's got a nice bond with a black widow. Yeah, exactly. And if you Okay, this is this is this is where I stand. blackwidow is my favorite avenger of all time. But she still should have died. I think we should all he had a family. And yeah, I know she had she was family with the Avengers. And she had her bow. She didn't have a kid. So you know, she can go she's my favorite. And she can still jump off that cliff.

Scott Benner 1:26:14
Okay. You know, she's suing Disney. Yeah, I heard about that. She should. They're doing that thing where they're, they're giving

Arden Benner 1:26:21
five G's on her side. He's helping her.

Scott Benner 1:26:23
Yeah, they gave him contracts where they get pieces of the box office, and then they're releasing the show the movie online where there's no box office, so they don't get paid for that part. Yeah, yeah, they're stealing from them. I think

Arden Benner 1:26:35
that's her last movie just over the money.

Scott Benner 1:26:37
Yeah. Plus, she made that guy with a big head. Yeah. So she's gonna need money to buy hats. Yeah.

Arden Benner 1:26:41
Well, it's all just hope and pray they get divorced. And she ends up with Chris Evans. Why? Because they're meant to be hurt or something.

Scott Benner 1:26:49
You think Chris Evans and Scarlett Scarlett Johansson should be together?

Arden Benner 1:26:53
Yeah, that's something definitely went on when they were younger. You think so? Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:26:59
Interesting. You liked him in knives out? Right?

Arden Benner 1:27:02
Yeah. I think he's a good actor. I just his character. Like, I want to punch him across the face.

Scott Benner 1:27:08
You don't like Captain America is too earnest for you? Yeah. Okay.

Arden Benner 1:27:14
All right. That's actually I had to take a quiz at school. That was like your, they give you like, 30 I don't be called like 30. Less the word 30. Like, I don't know, just like things about you. They put them in order. My last one was spirituality. But my second last one was kindness.

Scott Benner 1:27:32
Kindness fell pretty far. With

Arden Benner 1:27:34
my first one. It was like I had like sarcasm like humor. bravery. I'm like, something like, I don't know, like trust, like all that was at the top. Also at the bottom was, um, was like, work like teamwork.

Scott Benner 1:27:51
So, we're gonna wrap this up. Okay. Okay. Let me ask you a question. How much of what you said today was sarcastic. I don't I'm not trying to be sarcastic. No, I don't think you're trying to do anything. I think you're being yourself.

Arden Benner 1:28:04
Yeah. So I don't know. I, I guess 100 not 100 an hour and 22 minutes of it.

Scott Benner 1:28:12
Think you think you're generally sarcastic?

Arden Benner 1:28:14
Yeah, I'm not a very. I'm a serious person. But like, emotions are my thing. I think you should deal with that. And I'll deal with mine. Okay. Yeah. Like if you're crying, it's not on my shoulder.

Scott Benner 1:28:28
That's a T shirt. If you're crying. It's not on my shoulder. Should copyright that. That's a great idea.

Arden Benner 1:28:33
Yeah, like if my friends are upset. I'm not the person to go to if someone is upset. Don't text me

Unknown Speaker 1:28:39
know. You get very like analytical about it. Yeah, just like suck it up.

Scott Benner 1:28:44
You're like this happened. And then she did this. And then that happened. that's reasonable that she's upset now. Let's get past it.

Arden Benner 1:28:49
Yeah, exactly. That's how everyone should think you

Scott Benner 1:28:51
think everyone should think like you? Yeah. Again, what your insulin pumps called?

Arden Benner 1:28:56
It doesn't it doesn't matter. You see what I mean? Doesn't matter.

Scott Benner 1:28:59
My phone will not stop beeping. Oh my god. It's the dentist office that wants to know how close hygiene experience was today. to the dentist all lievable

Arden Benner 1:29:10
close tiptoeing outside the door right now is he or him?

Scott Benner 1:29:13
You can hear him outside? Yeah. Alright, so we're gonna get back together and do this again. Oh, great. Okay, um, but we're going to talk specifically about using your insulin. Understanding the Dexcom understanding the GMO understanding the Omni pod, understanding your meter understanding all of it. Okay? Because Listen to me. Don't get distracted. Now. You're doing great. I got distracted. All right. I'm like a squirrel. I'm good. What we're gonna do is we're gonna have these talks, they might not be this long. Okay, like, we might break them up into little sections. And we're going to talk about each thing individually. And I'm going to do my best to tell you everything that I think you need to know. If you were going to just leave right now and take care of yourself. Okay,

Arden Benner 1:29:58
I could leave right now. Until care of myself.

Scott Benner 1:30:00
Do you think your agency would be in the mid fives? Whatever. Do you understand why that's important?

Arden Benner 1:30:10
Yeah, no, I yeah, that's important. Sorry. I was not thinking I was reading this. Okay. I we really need to get her on the show reading about James Lafferty. So yeah, so I just get this off the screen so you don't get confused by it. That is not a real sight that they have. They're not famous enough to be on tmz.com I, you know, don't get them on this because they're gonna hear how poorly and talking and they're not gonna like me, or they're really great people and they're gonna be like, you know what? She's right. I'm Agila celebrity. It's fun. Whatever.

Scott Benner 1:30:39
I had five minutes of fame. They're still you're like some of your favorite celebrities, though. I don't know who that woman is. Oh, you don't know who is? She's in a show. Alexandra Park. Yeah, she's in the Royals. Do whatever that is. I think that's FX. Is that even famous? That's what I'm saying. I might be more famous than her. Oh.

Arden Benner 1:31:05
Oh, she gets one of these on the side. You're not more famous.

Scott Benner 1:31:07
She's from Australia. Oh my god. Your net. See? She got it. She got him with the accent. I told you. You blew it. I told you guys all you had to do. She's been in one TV show and what appears to be a very bad shark movie. If I'm guessing 12 feet deep. What is 12 feet deep about?

Arden Benner 1:31:29
I'm guessing a shark debt. Oh, she's also in his new show.

Scott Benner 1:31:33
What's his new show?

Arden Benner 1:31:34
He made a show with another guy from One Tree Hill called everyone is doing great on Hulu. Everyone's just doing great. I think I heard a good wait. Click on it. Let's see if that's a lie.

Scott Benner 1:31:42
I believe you mean, I heard it did well,

Arden Benner 1:31:44
whatever. They don't teach me anything. Um I pray to God that the guidance counselor's don't have to listen to this. Can you

Scott Benner 1:31:53
imagine that? Like we are not giving her? We're not giving her community service for telling us that the kids at school are? What did you say earlier? Oh, that's a drag. All right. Anyway.

Arden Benner 1:32:09
You should also get Harper from Wizards of Waverly Place. She's also a diabetic.

Scott Benner 1:32:14
Yeah. What's her name?

Arden Benner 1:32:16
I'm sure a lot of these celebrities are going to be diabetic in like three years.

Scott Benner 1:32:19
I think people are just getting more diabetes. Because this is type one. Yeah, I know. But she's type one. Isn't she Alexandra? Yeah,

Arden Benner 1:32:26
she she just got she pulled out a book about it. She put out sugar. I think that's it sugar high sugar high.

Unknown Speaker 1:32:33
Have any of you read it The Unexpected Journey

Unknown Speaker 1:32:35
of an inexperienced type one does he get her on experience her? Let me see something. Check into this book for a second. Where's Amazon when you need it? burp. burp into the thing? I didn't I turned. Hey,

Scott Benner 1:32:56
she just put this book out. Yeah. Get her on. Maybe I could.

Arden Benner 1:33:02
I think I could totally do it. I can get them on

Scott Benner 1:33:05
the queue here. Come on.

Arden Benner 1:33:06
Now. That was a total lie. But I could try.

Scott Benner 1:33:10
We're gonna hit her up on Instagram.

Arden Benner 1:33:11
I feel like you could use the whole thing. Like we gave you all that money for a photo op. Just be on the podcast?

Scott Benner 1:33:17
Because you paid to take a picture with her boyfriend who's gonna be your husband?

Arden Benner 1:33:20
Yeah, exactly. Alright, so it seems pretty okay to me. Okay. Though. A lot of money for that photo up.

Scott Benner 1:33:28
The show is pretty popular in Australia. Maybe she knows that. It really is. What show my Oh, this is not a show. I guess it is no, that's not what makes this different than anything else.

Arden Benner 1:33:41
Like everything. We're doing this in a room that's painted a horrible color.

Unknown Speaker 1:33:46
On who picked it? It's mom, it's the spare bedroom color. Yeah, mom's really not good at this stuff. A color picking? Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:33:53
Okay, so. All right. I really do want to stop. I want you to tell me. No, yeah, you're gonna tell me something. Okay. So look at me in the face.

Unknown Speaker 1:34:03
Stop looking at that. I can't look at you in the face real quick. Otherwise,

Scott Benner 1:34:05
I'm gonna look at the painting. Okay, look at the painting and listen to me. Okay. What do you think the most important part of managing insulin is? Be serious. Like,

Arden Benner 1:34:18
if you're asking me questions I genuinely don't have an answer to

Scott Benner 1:34:21
okay then why do you think you'd be okay taking care of yourself? Because it's not that big of a deal. What if you eat french fries? What happens if you eat french fries?

Unknown Speaker 1:34:31
I do myself. But then what happens later? You must actually close your loop. close the loop. you close the loop. You're near your phone. Now you're closer to it. I

Scott Benner 1:34:43
can't bend right now. You're gonna make me get the phone.

Unknown Speaker 1:34:45
Yeah, don't get the phone now. You're gonna come off poorly. If you don't get the phone. Now you get the phone. Get the phone. Come on. Your Pants will match your shirt. You get the phone. My pants don't match my shirt. Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:34:55
I'm being punished

Arden Benner 1:34:56
collar crime. Get the phone. A white collar crime. That sounds horrible.

Unknown Speaker 1:35:00
No it doesn't. Yeah does sounds like a crime if I put on there colors that don't go together here they don't hurt while you were in your Outer Banks pants.

Scott Benner 1:35:12
So if I have shorts on that look like they're for the beach. They're my Outer Banks pants.

Arden Benner 1:35:18
Yeah, that's the only beach. I remember going to when I was little. You don't remember

Scott Benner 1:35:22
St. JOHN. Yeah, that's completely different. That's like an island. Oh, islands. Just the giant beach you know?

Arden Benner 1:35:28
Yeah, but it's different. The Outer Banks is not like St. JOHN. No, it's not. Yeah. That's what I did. I not what,

Scott Benner 1:35:36
but they're still both beaches. They are Okay, so what do you think the most important thing is, buddy? You're sweaty? Yeah. Probably shouldn't say that microphone. I don't really edit this. Anyone have a good deodorant brand? He needed new deodorant? Yeah, here's doesn't work.

Arden Benner 1:35:52
No, not for like natural, like smelling purposes, but like sweating purposes,

Scott Benner 1:35:57
you need an antiperspirant? Yeah. Maybe people will send in suggestions. Now, don't do that. I'm not gonna read them. Okay, so when we talk, coming up in these other these other episodes, here's what I feel like we're gonna talk about, you're ready. We're going to talk about your Basal, and how to get it right and how to change it if you need to. We're gonna talk about Pre-Bolus in your meals. We're going to talk about how different foods need different amounts of insulin. We're going to talk about how to handle fat and protein when it makes your blood sugar go up later. Okay, and we're going to talk about other things like how you can help yourself if you're in a real bad situation, I'm not gonna be in a bad situation, just in case you are, it would be nice to know how to handle it. Right?

Unknown Speaker 1:36:45
I can handle it. Well, but if you passed out right now, so you're an ICU.

Scott Benner 1:36:50
So your blood say your blood sugar is so safe. You're asking

Arden Benner 1:36:52
me question, if I pass out, I can't help myself. So it's over.

Scott Benner 1:36:56
What if you knew it was going up? What if you could look at your CGM and say to yourself, my blood sugar's falling? I can't stop it. I could do something. Now to stop myself from passing I'll drink a juice or something. Right? What if that doesn't work? So you have no context for that? Because it just doesn't happen to you. Yeah. Do you know why it doesn't happen to you? Because I have a diabetic guard next to me. No, that's not why. It's because your basil is really well set. You do a really consistently decent job of Pre-Bolus and your meals.

Arden Benner 1:37:28
I don't think we can do another one of these. I can't listen to that for another house.

Scott Benner 1:37:31
Your settings are right. And that's the stuff we're going to go through next. Okay, are you excited talking to the microphone? No, I'm not excited at all. Actually, that part you're not gonna like, Alright, but we're gonna do it anyway. Yeah. I really want to thank you for doing this with me today. Would you like to say goodbye to everybody? I would

Arden Benner 1:37:47
just like to say Haiti grows up to be like, more badass than Hannah. I called it. I believe it's Hattie. No, I think it's Haiti.

Scott Benner 1:37:54
Do you think they're calling their kid to Haiti? Yeah, I believe it's Hattie. I think it's Haiti. Why would you think it's Haiti? Ha TT right. Wasn't it is DD it was DD. Yeah, that sounds more like happy. No, it's a Haiti to me. Haiti is H a TI. It sounds like Haiti. To me. Haiti is a country you know that right? Yeah, I'm aware. Okay. Hold on. Let's see. So, I can't believe this is what we got on this is what we're talking about. Hannah Nicole. We're not arguing about how that's pronounced. Yeah, I know how it's pronounced. Hadassah grace. Is it Hadassah? Yeah, but it's Hattie. Why would someone called her kid Haiti?

Unknown Speaker 1:38:37
I think it's a cool name. Hate IE. Haiti. Yeah, that's a cool name. Well, that's not what they're calling the kid. And you should try it. You want them to change the baby's name? No, I don't like change. They just try it out. for like a week. Yeah. She's she responds to it. So I'm gonna tell you I think it's happy.

Arden Benner 1:38:54
I don't know. We're gonna have to ask Chelsea. Is that her name? Her name is Chelsea. Chelsea. Sounds like a character's name.

Scott Benner 1:39:01
I don't know that. She wants her last name. Oh. Yeah, see? All right. Well, I'll cut I bet it's fine. That's you're putting it online? That's a private Facebook group. Only the people who are members in there.

Arden Benner 1:39:16
Oh, well, then why don't they just join? Like I'm getting you more people. Now if you join you can see children.

Scott Benner 1:39:23
You get to see the babies. Yeah, it is a really good fit and we can all fight if it's Haiti or whatever. How it's clearly not Haiti. It should be heavy. I think they should try it. But you see now that it's not. I don't know. I'm still against it. What do you think we should call this episode? Hey, be rowdy. No, hey, it's gonna be called conversation with art and part one. Oh, no, that's boring. Don't do that. What should we call it? Call it a? I don't know. It's think. Do you believe that people have gotten to know you're doing this? A little bit better?

Arden Benner 1:39:59
No. I Think people who don't understand my sense of humor. Think of more real brat right now.

Scott Benner 1:40:03
You think they think you're a brat? Yeah. Yeah, I would think I would tell you that. I think you

Arden Benner 1:40:10
a lot of people think that I treat you poorly, like my parents poorly. Oh, I

Scott Benner 1:40:15
don't feel like that. Yeah.

Arden Benner 1:40:16
I don't know. Being White is completely different. That's what I've learned being white. Yeah. Because none of my friends all my friends are like foreign of some sort. Okay, and their houses are so much different.

Scott Benner 1:40:27
Okay, hold on a second. Let's go through this one at a time. So you know, you have a lot of Indian friends. Yeah. kylian. They all treat their parents differently. Oh, yeah. Yeah, they're much more like Reverend of them. Yeah. Especially Filipino. Right. Which, I don't know, which one of your friends would be would dare to be harsh against their parents? Don't you don't say their name. I know who say their background. Is that Italian? Okay. That's the that's the besides you.

Arden Benner 1:40:59
So when you she's also the closest to like, She's like, closest to like, I don't know, like, I like more Americanized.

Scott Benner 1:41:07
But then people from other countries who are more recent immigrants know, like,

Arden Benner 1:41:13
what I'm saying is I have friends, I will openly curse and come home and say what I think I do not hold back what I believe like, I will tell you what I think. And I've had friends who were like, Oh, I can never say that to my parents.

Scott Benner 1:41:27
But do you think that has anything to do with our background? And not being white? Yeah, yeah. 110%. You think of that? Yeah. It's not that mom and I are just open minded. We let you say what you want. No, wait. You can move your chair. You sticking to things? Yeah, I have a skirt on and I'm sticking. Alright. Wait, I need it. I have shorts on. I mean, it's okay. Okay, get back on the mic. So you don't think it's because mom and I like consciously raise you to say what you think

Arden Benner 1:41:55
that's part of it? Yeah. We actually actually talked about this last night with Liv and Tom. What did you guys thought about cursing? We're talking about cursing. We're saying how, like, when we were younger, like a lot of like houses would like to be like, oh, there's a baby in the house like don't curse. And I was like it was minimum really do that. Like we grew up like cursing. It's just part of life. Just do it. And then we're just talking about it. Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:42:17
yeah. So I don't so I think you want to hear something? I think seriously, I think you should be allowed to speak the way you want to speak, I think you should be able to say what you want to say. I think there have been times in your life where your opinion is not fully formed. But it doesn't mean that it's not your opinion at that moment. It is difficult as a parent sometimes to be have something thrown in your face. It's hard when you're wrong. And you say something, but I still let you have your opinion. And it's often your right or wrong. Often you're right about it. And it's difficult for me because I'm faced with the idea that I was wrong. And I think some parents don't want to hear that they're wrong. So that's where the you can't say, yeah,

Arden Benner 1:42:58
a lot of you are wrong. Well, I'm wrong a lot, right. Unless your kids just, you know, really wrong, you know, all the time unless they're going down a bad path. Yeah, you're probably right.

Scott Benner 1:43:12
So you think in general, like day to day stuff. That doesn't involve you becoming a meth dealer. Parents are not understanding what's happening with kids here. Oh, I don't know. You will not generalize. No, you're funny. Don't care won't generalize. But you do generalize. You're like I'm not generalizing about people. But white people are definitely like that. Yeah, for sure. And,

Unknown Speaker 1:43:34
like, well, I'm white, so I can definitely say that. You can say that. Well, I okay. I'm not stopping you from saying,

Arden Benner 1:43:39
let's be honest here. The worst, like group of people is white boys. Not white men, but white boys.

Scott Benner 1:43:47
Those are the worst group of people.

Arden Benner 1:43:48
They're like the most like, Oh my god, just like if you punch them in the face once I think they'd be okay. I think they just need a slap in the head.

Scott Benner 1:43:55
Do you think white boys need to be slapped in the head? Why is that? You're from a very diverse place. Like we live in a fairly diverse place.

Arden Benner 1:44:04
Yeah, a lot of white boys who live here look like they have rocks in their head. Like I think if you just slap them across the face once they might be okay,

Scott Benner 1:44:12
maybe just make the rocks into a brain. Yeah. Okay. You think that has something to do with their background? Yeah. Why would that be?

Arden Benner 1:44:21
I don't know. Maybe they just have more stupid look on their face like I don't know. Maybe they're more unattractive? Who knows Dad?

Scott Benner 1:44:28
Do you think that other backgrounds have it more together? Yeah, really? Yeah. Okay, because they maybe it's because their parents then let them curse and say what they thought. I mean, maybe you know what? I don't know. I know. You don't know. I don't know how you start talking about this. Oh, no. Do I actually we were talking about we're talking about a happy Yeah. Wait, how did we get here? I don't know someone comment down below. I'm just kidding. This isn't YouTube. Is it? Yes, it's not YouTube. Okay, that's interesting. So when should we get back together and record the other stuff? When would be good for you keeping anytime before September 2. So we're gonna need to get on the calendar and do this a bunch of times. Yeah. All right. Well, why don't we say goodbye to everybody and then we'll pick some other days. Wait, I can't do it on his birthday. You can't do it. Take that out of here. You can't say Paul's name a friend.

Arden Benner 1:45:26
But we take that out. That was a that was a joke too. So take that out. Okay, please.

Scott Benner 1:45:33
Alright, so we'll um, we'll pick um,

Arden Benner 1:45:36
I definitely can't do it when cause an eye appointment.

Scott Benner 1:45:39
God will stop very busy that day. We could do tomorrow. We get it tomorrow is not that that's his birthday. But we could do tomorrow and Sunday and then we and that we could do tomorrow and Sunday and then maybe finish up next weekend and we'd be done. just burped I did off to edit that out. Yeah. Disgusting. What do you think? We're gonna do it like that? We'll do a little more tomorrow a little more Sunday. I don't think I can do this again. Tomorrow. You can speaking for today. We're not gonna talk nearly as long.

Unknown Speaker 1:46:08
Oh, yeah. what's what's the weather like tomorrow? I think it's supposed to be on TV. Tomorrow, okay, well, I am going out tomorrow with mom. Okay, well, we only need an hour

Arden Benner 1:46:18
Yeah. If any of you know how to so I will pay you to do my portfolio what you

Scott Benner 1:46:24
that you want to cheat to get into college? No,

Arden Benner 1:46:26
I'm not cheating. Again. The colleges need little help. little push.

Scott Benner 1:46:29
So tell what's finished with that. That what do you want to do in college? Oh. What are you interested in?

Arden Benner 1:46:39
I don't need them to know my whole life story. Okay, that's okay. Can you hear me? Yeah. Okay. All right. This is where it gets personal. Yeah, you guys can hear all about my bloody hoo ha. But not what you're generally interested in. Yeah. I don't want you guys know anything else about my life.

Scott Benner 1:46:56
Alright, well, that will stop it right here. Thank you for doing this.

A huge thank you to Omni pod. Get a free 30 day trial on the pod dash today at on the pod comm forward slash juice box. And don't forget that there's no need to wait for the next big thing to come. Because the Omni pod promise tells you that you can upgrade to Omni pods latest technologies for no additional cost as soon as they're available to you and covered by your insurance terms and conditions apply on the pod.com forward slash juice box and get yourself a Dexcom g six continuous glucose monitor right now. Right now. dexcom.com forward slash juice box links the shownotes links at Juicebox Podcast comm I have a couple more things to say before this is over.

I just want to say here at the end in case 20 years from now an adult Arden comes back and listen to that art and I love doing this with you. I think you're terrific. I love you. Hope you guys come back and listen to me in art and talk some more about management stuff. We're gonna do our best on a father daughter level. I don't imagine it's going to go incredibly well. But I'll get to tell what we need from her. And we'll get to hear her responses about what she understands what she thinks she can put into practice. And maybe we'll have to make some plans for how to get to where we need to be before she takes off for college. One way or the other. It should at least be funny. So they'll always be that

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