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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

Scott Benner 0:00
Welcome back friends. This is episode 840 of the Juicebox Podcast.

Today I'm welcoming back Erica Forsythe. Of course, you know Erica is the licensed marriage and family therapist who I speak to frequently on the show. She's in California. But if you live in California, Utah, Oregon or Florida, you can use her services. Check her out at Erica forsythe.com. Today, Eric and I are going to talk about burdens and how you can help to alleviate them. While you're listening. Please remember that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan are becoming bold with insulin. If you have type one diabetes, or are the caregiver of someone with type one, filling out the survey AT T one D exchange.org. Forward slash juice box would go a long way towards helping people with type one. It'll take you fewer than 10 minutes. It's absolutely HIPAA compliant and completely anonymous. He one day exchange.org forward slash juicebox. Take the survey

this show is sponsored today by the glucagon that my daughter carries G voc hypo Penn Find out more at G voc glucagon.com. Forward slash juicebox. Today's episode is also sponsored by ag one ag one is from athletic greens. It's the green drink that I have every morning. And you could too. When you go to my link athletic greens.com forward slash juice box, not only will you get your first order of ag one, but you'll also get a year supply of vitamin D and five free travel packs. Athletic greens.com forward slash juicebox. Erica, welcome back.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 2:10
Thank you. Thank you for being here.

Scott Benner 2:12
Thank you, I appreciate you being here. We talked last time when we were recording about this episode, and we said we're going to talk about how you can share a burden that you're carrying. And I don't know a lot about this. So there's going to be a lot of talking from you, and not so much from me. But my expectation here is that people do a pretty good job of hiding what they're going through. And that you think you're doing a good job of dealing with it. But you're not if you're suppressing it. And how do you recognize that there's too much going on in your life and find a way to I want to say offload it. But that seems wrong, right? Because you're putting it on someone else maybe. But then how do you how do you do that? How do you first I guess how do you recognize when there's more going on? than maybe you should be dealing with?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 3:13
So how do you become kind of aware that maybe you are carrying you're carrying more than you need to be? And I think I would even I would take a step back and think about well why is there something preventing you from sharing your burdens or your hardships? Whether it's something diabetes related or you know, other stressors in your life? Maybe that's how maybe that was modeled to you as a child. Maybe it's part of your family system. family culture is just you know, keep it, keep it going keep it in the house, don't talk about it with other people. Maybe you are the recipient of other people sharing their burdens, you become known as a safe person. And you don't feel comfortable reciprocating because that's what people do. They come to you and not as it not as a therapist, but just as a friend. So maybe that you know, pattern has been established.

Scott Benner 4:17
Maybe you are okay, sure. Sugar getting high.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 4:21
Well, I am Did you call it picked it up? Yeah. It is. I am I am stable, but a little I'm writing a little bit high. But I think I'm good. Hopefully, we'll see if I go oh, that would be exciting.

Scott Benner 4:37
Well, I've done that once. It was it was not good. For me. It was very stressful. I don't wanna get off the track, but this older woman in her 50s So and she was recording from a hotel room, and she got low. And it was it was anxiety inducing for me.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 4:57
I think I actually listened to that one. Yeah, it's just did she start eating sugar packets? I think are some one yams. Please

Scott Benner 5:03
don't do that to me. I've done that once in my life. I'm good. No.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 5:10
No, it's okay. So okay, so why I think yeah, asking, Why would be the first question maybe two. And you might have you might not know to ask, Why am I not sharing my burdens, but maybe some symptoms to look for behaviors are if you're kind of checking out when other people are sharing? There's Okay. So you're kind of like a Ha, ha, ha. And then later, you're kind of what did i What did they say, because maybe you're so you're drowning in your own grief and your own stress. Maybe after a conversation with a family member or friend, you come home, and you experience feelings of resentment, or bitterness, like they're complaining about missing their flight home from Hawaii, I have to deal with this and this and this and SMS, but you aren't communicating that. But so you're feeling your thoughts and feelings are resentful, or bitter. Maybe you don't know how. And you are feeling trapped in your own mind and hearts. And every time you open your mouth to try and share, you either just cry, which is your body's it's your body's way of letting something out. Or you're really angry and irritable all the time. But, and you're you're maybe putting your anger on your partner or your kids, or your employer, co workers. So those would be I think, two markers to look for. If you aren't, don't have the awareness that you aren't sharing your hardships, maybe look for like that anger that irritability, the kind of constantly crying could be things to look for?

Scott Benner 6:52
Do we dump things on people? Who we know? Or hope, I guess in our heart won't tire of us? Do you ever notice like, I don't know what I mean? Like, like, like partners will be different to each other than they would be in the outside world. I always feel like that's when you see that. That's because you like in your heart you think well, this person is not going to abandon me over this. So I can, like, do this thing. Is that accurate?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 7:20
Yes, I think in a, in a safe and trusted, you know, and in a relationship in which you can trust your partner and what you have established in your relationship that you can, you know, unload your your burdens your emotions, that's what you know why often white people choose to be in a partnership to have that reciprocal conversation and that you're aren't feeling alone, right in the world. And so, I think part of that is also having, if you were to think about can I share safely with my partner? Great. Do I feel like I have people outside of my home or relationship expert who I can share with? Having that kind of social awareness is also important, because you might want you know, I think about some people who would say, well, this, my friend is going through so much right now I just feel like I can't share, you know, my, my trauma, or my kids diagnosis story. Or, you know, I don't feel safe sharing this information with this person, because then they're gonna give me a whole bunch of ways to fix it.

Scott Benner 8:29
Yeah, it's interesting online, sometimes people will say, I'm, I'm gonna tell you something. I don't I don't need your judgment. I'm just trying to get it out. So those people are looking for, for like, it's almost one way sharing, but it's the only thing they seem to have, if that makes sense.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 8:48
Yes. And maybe, in the initial stages of learning how to share our learning how to or it's a new, it's a new, you know, trauma. You just want to share, you don't want any problem solving or conflict resolution. You just want to and I applaud those people who can be clear and ask for what they need to say, Hey, I'm going to share something and I just, I'm looking for validation, or I'm looking for to not feel alone in this. And then they'll they'll get what they need. Back is, are those things

Scott Benner 9:23
one of the big surprises of the podcast for me? Is that it it somehow offers that to people even though it's not a two way conversation, like hearing. I'm maybe you understand this better than I do. I mean, what's honest, let's be honest, I hope you understand it better than I did. But when you hear two people, me and another person having a conversation about that person's life with diabetes, and you're and you're a fly on the wall for that, somehow that gives people a lot of comfort. And that part of I didn't first of all, I'd probably heard me say it. I didn't expect that to be the truth about the podcast and it still takes me by surprise a little bit, you know? But that's a real thing. Am I wrong?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 10:07
It's a totally real thing. Because as a listener, you're, you can feel like, oh, that I'm not alone in that feeling or that experience. You you have that thought of, oh, that they experienced that too. I'm not crazy for thinking or feeling this way. And that minim minimizes that feeling of isolation, which is a key factor and leading to you know, depressive depression.

Scott Benner 10:34
So you're almost in a three person conversation, like you're sitting around the campfire, except you're not actively involved in it. But you are, in your mind going, that makes sense. Oh, I've had that feeling. And then that makes you a part of the conversation one way or the other? Whether it's virtually or if you're in person.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 10:53
Yes, yes. No, I think that's a that's a great point. And so in going back to the, you know, do I feel safe sharing with, with my partner or with friends? I think, if you don't feel safe, listen to that. Also, um, you know, we don't want to say go and share your burdens with everybody. Understanding that, that sense of safety? Can that person give you what you need? Can you ask for what you need, are all really key points, I'm gonna

Scott Benner 11:23
bring something up that I witnessed online, I'm not gonna give anybody's details. And I'll be very vague about it. But it's so interesting how this all layers together, I saw a post in the private group, where a person was trying to share with everybody that they thought would understand that, how kind of defeated, they felt that in their personal life, they tried to organize a thing around diabetes. amongst their family and their extended family, I think they shared it with like, 30 people on Facebook. And besides their parents, no one responded to it. And they were really, like, devastated by this. And I'm reading the posts. And I think I think that myself, I mean, I don't know like Erica, I, I pride myself on trying my best to sit in the center and see 360 around things, I think, sort of my job on some level. Yes. And so I'm listening to what she's saying. And I'm like, I get it, like you reached out to 30 people and not one even privately, like, get off of like, but she never thought of what if they didn't see it? What if it made them uncomfortable? What if they were just busy? Like she didn't put any of the context of what might be happening on their side? Or maybe they just didn't want to? I don't know, like, I have no idea. But she came online to say to people can you believe this happened? And instead of, and some people were very supportive, overwhelmingly people were supportive. But it's always a couple of people who have to step in and say what I just went through my head out loud, as if it's the only consideration in the story, like, what you shouldn't have put them in that position. It's such a small part of the conversation, right? Like maybe, maybe she shouldn't have, like, I don't know, but there's no good that comes from saying that to a stranger, who's clearly here for you to just, she just wants you to say I have diabetes, too. I know how much that sucks. And by the way, everybody knows it sucks. But interesting how some people feel like they have to step in, and, and defend some other idea within the bigger idea. And it's felt like you were almost going through them earlier, like, you know, like, why would I not share something with someone else? While it might be because I feel like people are sharing too much with me. But you don't know. That's why you're doing that in that moment. And as those people are coming back at her with what could have been constructive conversation, if they would have communicated it better. It felt it felt a little attacking. And then, of course, as soon as that happened, then the original poster, then just lashes back. And I'm like, here we go. I've seen the story about a million times. And so I'm watching them do it. It's interesting to be able to sit, I feel like a little bit of my might give me a little insight into what your job is like, cuz you can point you can go well, that person is doing it for this reason. And that person is doing it for that reason. And this person is responding like this, because you can see that it makes them uncomfortable that she shared it outwards to people was fascinating how many different responses there were. And they almost all were just mirroring how they felt back to her. And she obviously didn't have any of those thoughts. She was just trying. She was just trying to get her family to recognize that it was hard to raise a kid with diabetes. It was really it, you know, and she

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 14:49
was coming to the group with to have to be validated.

Scott Benner 14:54
Yeah, she wanted to commiserate and listen, 98% of the people commiserated with her Oh, But the ones that didn't, you could have sectioned them all off into another room and said, Hey, you got to go see a therapist about why you answered this way. Because you're mad about something else,

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 15:11
or Yeah, or maybe not respond online, you know?

Scott Benner 15:16
Or take that into account into consideration that your thoughts are not so important that you need to like torture this person more, but they don't think they are. They think they're showing her some truth that she's missing, which by the way, might not be her truth, or the people who she was speaking to. It's just your, I mean, it's never lost me that I make a podcast and then I'm like, listen, sometimes people should keep their opinions to themselves while I'm gonna go. But, um, anyway, it's just how it seemed to me

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 15:47
and I Yes. Sorry, go. Go ahead. I was gonna respond. No, please do. Okay. So I think the that's part part of the risk me there's a risk benefit, right on sharing something like that online, where you're coming to a trusted, you know, forum, that maybe they received comfort in the past. And so that's the benefit. But the risk is, you really don't know how was going to land, you know, you are you are the sender of information. And as how are the receivers of that information going to respond, when you don't hear tone of voice really, in a post. So it is that's a risk that you're taking, sharing something really vulnerable in the group. But most of the time, you probably your needs are going to be met. But I also as the sender of information, you cannot control how it's going to land in the receivers lap.

Scott Benner 16:42
And it's odd to expect that you'll get 100% compliance from the from the responses, like why not be listened, it took me a long time to figure this out. And I had to get, I mean, the way I got to it was I got a very, very harsh review of my book. After I got five or six glowing reviews, like professional reviews, I, I was like on cloud nine, I was like everyone's gonna love this book. And then like the sixth review, basically, was it just it read to me, like, I hate this guy. I hate what comes out of his mouth. I hate the kids. He talked about the wife, his life, everything. Like it just they did not like me the way I told us nothing, right? And it knocked me back. It was the first time. And my publisher said if you're gonna put yourself out in the public, this is the game. Like, you can't like did you like the book? And I was like, yeah, and he goes, do you agree with what was said here? And I said, No, but it hits every one of my insecurities. Every one of my insecurities like what he said, especially about the writing, specifically, because I'm not Eric, I mean, I don't think it's any great. Like, I'm not a writer, you know, Damien, like I barely got through high school, I, if I'm good at one thing in writing, I come off the way I come off in person. So it's, it feels very, like comfortable, right? But it's not, it's not correct. I still, when I got that I wrote a book and I read the whole manuscript or something to look for where I didn't put the commas. I don't know what I'm doing. Okay. Anyway. But I learned to, I learned to say to myself, if this is the space I want to be in, then this is what's going to happen. And I have to be open to other people's ideas, and hear them as like possibilities of constructive criticism, but I can't take every one of them on as if they are gospel every time they come to you. That's crushing. And I do think that that inability to do that, maybe is what sent our online society in the direction it went more recently, in the last couple of years where no one's allowed to say anything that isn't perfect. Because what if you hurt someone's feelings? And I don't think that's valuable either. So, but you have to be ready for it. If you're gonna put yourself out there. If you're gonna say, I need somebody to validate me, you have to be ready to look at one thing and go I don't agree with that and just never think about it again.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 19:09
Right, then that like for you, like what you shared? That might take a little bit of processing and that's okay, too.

Scott Benner 19:16
We it was a weeks Yeah. But it helped me because now I'm i I'm good with it now, you know?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 19:27
Mm hmm. And I think for some people who aren't comfortable sharing what's going on with others, there might be fear preventing them to do that, right that they it might. It might actually even feel like if I verbalize out loud how hard this feels right now. I'm thinking of, obviously the caregivers with their Newt their child who's newly diagnosed. These are caregivers that I meet with and they feel like how do I if I share it out loud? Not me. makes it feel real. There might be it kind of made, there's might be fear that it's going to make it feel worse. If you share it out loud to somebody, or a pastor or a priest or a therapist or a friend, it doesn't really matter. But in any sense, if there's a fear of like, you're gonna be, like swallowed in grief, when in fact, actually by keeping it inside, that's where you drown.

Scott Benner 20:27
Yeah, but it, it collapses on you, like a black hole instead of the explosion that you're expecting. You know, which doesn't really come I mean, saying it out loud. I mean, there's a million different ways to say it. But there's a I talked about it in an episode recently, but there's a great book, I read about back pain. And that just says, like, Look, if you're not really hurt, if you have a pull, like, you know, if this is a tension thing, just saying, my back is okay, I'm not hurt that it actually helps, you know, like, you go like, okay, like you believe it almost and, and to say, this is really difficult. Do you think people expect that, like the world just gonna end if they say it out loud?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 21:07
I think that's part of the fear for sure. And and I understand that if you are, again, all the reasons that we talked about not comfortable, haven't been exposed, don't know how. And the beautiful thing about sharing your, you know, your grief, your emotions, your hardships, is that there isn't really a right way. But as long as you are in a safe position to do it, I think for those people who are just testing that out.

Scott Benner 21:31
So you got to sort of acknowledge how you feel acknowledged what the reality is, and then make sort of intentional movements towards a resolution. Does that is that kind of how it works?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 21:43
Yes, I think that might be after the sharing, right. So I think if you are able to say, I think a beautiful way to do it is to also articulate to the person who you're sharing with is that this is new to me, whatever all the things that you're fearing. This is new to me. I'm not really comfortable sharing this hard stuff that's going on in my life, so bear with me. I'm not sure I need anything back from you. Besides just Wow, it sounds like it's really hard. And oftentimes, we feel like it's weird to ask for what we need and that emotional exchange Yeah, but that's one of the most beautiful ways to get your needs met without like, I'm going to share this and hope that they just give me what I need. But then you kind of end the conversation feeling misunderstood, not validated and all those things

Scott Benner 22:32
I think two things you're making me think first thing is that men

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Men are much more open to this than you would think they are As long as it's privately a group of men, if one starts talking about something that's going wrong, you can see how almost excited most of them are that someone's saying something that they think. And it's not normally how they communicate. I've seen that for certain. But the other thing I wonder is, what if you just don't have someone? Like, what if there's just like, There's no one I see that happen. Sometimes I see people say, I can find it in my sister in law, but I knew she was going to blah, blah, blah. And you know, like this is because if, Listen, everyone is struggling, everyone, okay, on some different level. And the fear in this scenario was this person who wants to talk about diabetes, if I share this with my sister in law, she is going to lord it over me. She is going to treat me he's like, Oh, look, there's a person I'm doing better than take hold to so that she doesn't feel the pain of her struggle, right. And if you can't find somebody in your life, because your parents are tough, because your parents will start trying to fix it, especially if you're an adult, going back to your adult parents, and you're like, I'm really struggling with your mom is going to be like, Oh my god, I knew this was gonna happen. My baby needs me. Like, you know, now you're a 35 year old woman, somebody's baking your brownies?

Unknown Speaker 26:21
You're like, no, no, I don't need this. So like, where do you like, is therapy? The only way to find up? There's

Unknown Speaker 26:27
got to be another way. For a bartender like not that, um, but you know what I mean? Like, it's not what a bartender is?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 26:34
Well, I think, yeah,

Unknown Speaker 26:39
they're just listening, because they want the tips, but who cares? Your thing, you know? So?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 26:43
No, I think what the beauty the kind of the magic of therapy is, yes, you can, you can receive tools for stress management, you can use coat, you can utilize coping mechanisms, you can process trauma, but kind of the magic of it is you're telling your story. And someone is there to witness that. Someone is there witnessing, listening, validating your pain. And that's what we need as human beings is, you know, someone to witness bear witness to our life and our story and our pain. So obviously, that can happen. Hopefully, it should happen at therapy. If you feel like you can't afford it, don't want to try it, I would try. There are a lot there are a lot of free resources on line. There are a lower cost type of therapy, there is if you are a religious person seeking, you know pastoral care within your church that is usually free. Or seeking those types, your your pastors, your elders, those types of community members and asking for their referrals. Maybe seeking a friend who if you and if you if you don't have those, and there are people who don't have those close knit friendships. Maybe that would be when you want to go to therapy. But seeking support groups, you know, there are a lot of meetup groups, diabetes support groups, obviously, the online forum is a place. But if you're wanting that in person, touch point, there are lots lots of ways to do that, that are, you know, low cost,

Scott Benner 28:25
I'm going to make a couple of weird, like, so. Can I go to a grave side and speak to a past loved one like that, like, does that is that a healthy way to have that conversation when you don't have someone to have it with? Where's that order line? Am I about this? Am I about to describe like a time when you might want to go to the hospital and check.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 28:48
I mean, I would say you know, on occasion, particularly if you're grieving that your loved one and you're wanting to just share and reflect I think, speaking out loud is powerful. Even if there isn't an actual human being there. People feel that connection. That's why we do have gravesites. That's why people go. I would say if you were doing that every day, that might be an indicator.

Scott Benner 29:11
Like once or twice. People say, I've heard a number of people say they talk to themselves in their car. Almost like therapy when I was a child really young. I remember being it struck me one day, like what would I do if my parents died? And I couldn't figure out what I would do. And so I I kind of roleplayed it in my head. Like I it was a one time thing but I can picture it as clear as day. I gave them some sort of a you know, I don't know it was a car accident or something like that. I then thought, okay, they're gone. How would I feel that I worked through how I would feel that I wondered where I would go and then I did that and then I never did it again. And I never worried about them dying again after that was very injured. thing. I don't know if that's wrong. Also, the last thing that I made a note by I know, I'm not saying you should do this, but I have heard more than a number of prostitutes in like documentaries and interviews say that you'd be surprised how many people pay them and then don't ask for sex. And then they just want to talk or hang out or stuff like that. Anyway, that's what came to mind when you were talking about that. But I mean, probably a pastor would probably be a quicker, easier way and cheaper. I mean, unless they hit you up for 20%. And I don't know.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 30:35
Well, no, I think well, your second example of, you know, role playing. I think that yeah, that's also a reflection of your ability to kind of go through that that cognitive behavioral structure like you, you thought about how you would feel you thought about what you would do. And then once you go through the cycle, it changed how you felt. And so you that stress and fear was kind of relieved. So you were able, that is very unique and special, that you were able to kind of walk yourself through that.

Scott Benner 31:04
I remember, I remember the time I was with my brother in law. And it was like a family thing. I don't know what we were talking about. And I said something about, you know, if the house catches on fire, I know which window I'm going to jump out of. And he goes, what, and I said, you don't know what you're gonna do in a dire situation, if there's a fire and he goes, No, I said, what about this situation? And I started really, like rattling off like big ideas. And I was like, What if you lost your job? What are you going to do? What if this happens? What if that happens? He was I don't know. And I was like, Dude, I thought through all of that, like, you're not pre planning for things that are probably going to happen. I mean, the house fire ones, not a probably, but like the other stuff was right. Right. You know, and I felt, I felt crazy in the moment, because he looked at me like, What are you talking about? I was like, I don't know, man, like I've role played through all this. I know. I'm not leaving it up to chance, if something like this goes on, I said, you don't know what you would do if your car went into a lake? He's like, what? And I'm like, I do.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 32:10
Well, and that that could be at your a planner, that could be a little bit of, you know, anxiety driven motivation to figure out what to do. When if when I don't know

Scott Benner 32:21
if it's anxiety, Erica, I have a plan of what I'm going to do if I find a genie in a bottle. Okay, well, that's because I'm 100% sure I'll miss it. Listen, I've said this on the podcast before I knew if I didn't have a plan, I'd end up with a billion dollars and a giant penis. And so I

Unknown Speaker 32:40
was like, I need a plan if this happens. So it's obvious right? First first. First one is, I don't die before I finished making my wishes. Because I know I'll drop dead before I get them all out. Right. So Oh, my God. Then the second one, of course is unlimited wishes. Or the second one is no matter what my third wish comes true. And then the third wishes unlimited wishes then I started taking care of people's health and welfare after that. Like is that not obvious?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 33:10
I know I love that guy. That is your that is your mindset. You were for sure a planner and you and you take care of people. That's also Yeah.

Scott Benner 33:18
Well, that's great. Yeah. Do you not like when is that not what everybody thinks when they think if I win the lottery, I'll help other like, I'll set other buddy up. That's the only thing I think of I don't even know what I would do with all that money.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 33:30
Well, that's I don't know if everyone I have not asked that question to enough people to know but I imagine that's might not be on the top five. Maybe they have your your Outlook

Scott Benner 33:41
to put everybody's make sure everybody's okay. And health always comes first in my head. Like I always think like, I'll get them a private doctor. So they can go through all their concerns. Like that is one of the first things I think. But seriously, I'm not joking. I'm not trying to be funny. I know if I didn't have this thought through. I'd have three of the stupidest things in the world if I found a genie

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 34:00
bottle. I love it. I love it. So

Scott Benner 34:03
go ahead I'm sorry. So I

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 34:04
wanted to I wanted to go back to your the third point of you know, paying, you know, paying a prostitute. I think that goes you know, there are human human nature as you don't. There are there yes, there are. There are introverts or extroverts. But I think at our core, we don't want to be alone all the time. Yeah. And so that reflects to me just that deep human need to be seen, heard, validated, loved, hopefully, you know, and not feel that that emptiness

Scott Benner 34:40
so those burdens drive you farther and farther away from those connections. If you don't strive to keep them is that right?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 34:49
Yes, I mean, I think it ultimately can I would, I would look at you know, if you if you feel like no one needs to hear these burdens. I'm not worthy or mine aren't big enough. for bad enough, that's a really common, you know, lie that maybe you tell yourself with like, well, it's not I don't have it that bad. But then I would look at how, how are how is that mindset impacting your relationships with friends family, like we just talked about? Is it? Are people are you feeling isolated from them? Are you not having those connections conversations, if you're just holding everything inside? Yeah, because of all the reasons the fear the not knowing how mine is mine aren't, my problems aren't bad enough or big enough. It can impact your connections,

Scott Benner 35:37
there's a sentence that gets spoken a lot. That I think it's meant to be insulting a little bit, but I see it in both directions. So it's the worst thing that's ever happened to you is the worst thing that's ever happened to you. And so on. The kind of bad side of that is, the idea is that if you have lived a pretty good life, the tiniest thing you can be out complaining about. And most people might look back you and be like, Oh my god, like, that's the worst thing that's ever happened to you. But still, the rest of that point is, that's still the worst thing that's ever happened to you. And it strikes you just as bad as the worst thing that's ever happened to me, even if my thing includes fire and brimstone and a car hanging off a cliff and yours is that, you know, you couldn't pay your rent on time. Like, you know what I mean? Like, and so there's no way to like, I think that when you're talking about burdens and offloading them, so you can be healthy and be happy and live. judging your burdens is not valuable. Like it doesn't matter what they are. They're, they're the worst. They're the worst thing that's happening to you right now. And that can be overwhelming.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 36:42
Yes, judging your burdens. And judging somebody else's, you know, I think we do. As humans, we kind of categorize burdens or problems or hardships. And yes, there are some that are really extreme. But as you said, it doesn't really matter. Because if it's you lived this carefree easy life, and then something hard happens, you have never experienced something hard. So of course, it's going to be traumatizing and painful. And so, but that person might not share it because you have that mindset of like, oh, but at least I'm not, you know, on the streets, or living with the chronic illness or your whatever, that you're comparing it too. But that doesn't really matter, because it is painful and challenging.

Scott Benner 37:27
How, why then, if, if that is the wrong way to deal with that? It isn't. It's hard to argue with though that when you see somebody who is clearly worse off than you, it does make you feel better. I mean, that's just true, right? Like you.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 37:45
I think it is true. And we can internalize that and say we know I'm so grateful for what I have. You can you can live in that space of gratitude of contentment. But that doesn't mean that takes away from the pain or struggles that you have. Right? You can't it's not like you can't it's not like one or the other. But you can hold both.

Scott Benner 38:08
You can't let that gratitude trick you into staying in that room. When you shouldn't be there like yeah, yes. Yes, that person has literally no legs, but it doesn't make the thing you're struggling with. Reasonable to stay struggling with it. You still should try to get away from it.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 38:29
Yes and find seek help support all the things? Yeah, I think that's we we often live in this either or mindset. Yeah. And okay, well, I just gotta be grad. I just gotta be grateful. I gotta be grateful. I got to be content. But don't. But yeah, but also allow yourself the space to feel like Gosh, this is really I'm really struggling. I feel really sad, angry, frustrated about this other thing too.

Scott Benner 38:56
How do you Excuse me? Sorry, how do you let's put ourselves in a we're in a relationship. And I have diabetes, and my spouse doesn't or my kid does. And neither of us do or something. I want to go to the other person, the other person in my life and say this is how I feel. But they might not be ready to say how they feel out loud. Is there a primer? Is there a way I can get them to that space so that it doesn't get met with either they shut off? Or they push back? Because they don't want to say it out loud? I mean that that seems like an important consideration here.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 39:34
Absolutely. So you're in your in your relationship and your partner and maybe you're struggling with something and you want to have that reciprocal exchange with your partner. And so you come and share your your stuff. And I think if you're finding again over like patterns, I think you want to maybe first set up is it an appropriate time to have this conversation? Have You plan to say, hey, can we talk, I'm really struggling with this, can we talk on Wednesday night after the kids go down. Because oftentimes, if this isn't something that you do on a daily basis with your partner, they might not be prepared to receive that. So having a set time, being clear with what your goals are, if you're finding over many, many times that your partner is either cut off or defensive or unable to receive what you're sharing, or wants to kind of one up you then I would maybe encourage them to go, you know, it to see their seek communication, couples therapy, because then that that's going to interfere with the intimacy, ultimately, between you and your partner. Yeah,

Scott Benner 40:44
in general, therapy really at its core is, is a is a third party who just doesn't care about the details, right? And can listen, and then kind of get you moving in the right direction. People. You don't give people answers. That's not your job. Right. Your job is to show them what's happening and let them absorb it. And, and I guess, eventually become okay with it. Is that right?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 41:12
Yes, I think too. We I would want to hear you know, what, what is your goal in therapy, because oftentimes people are really clear with what they need or want is processing their trauma, is it I want to learn how to meet people, I want to fix this problem in my relationship. So once we're clear on where are we trying to go, then it's about reflecting what do I see understanding the patterns poking around, sometimes if I feel like there are some hidden traumas or things that might be interfering with your current relationships and how you're communicating and getting move helping the client move along to, to get to their goal, but not by saying, I think you should do this, I think you should do that. You're really bad with this, you know, this area that's not

Scott Benner 42:01
being afraid to go to therapy is odd. Because really, if you are, then you're, you're just afraid to be to hear your own thoughts eventually, because that's really all that's going to come I think people have a mis understanding that you're going to get in there, and you're going to explain to them what happened. And you know, it just doesn't seem to me that that's the way it works. And I wanted to make sure people understood that. Right?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 42:23
Yeah, I think there might be a fear of, you know, what does? What does there be mean? Is it is it sometimes being honest with yourself, and that can be really scary, and really hard.

Scott Benner 42:33
I also think it's probably this is just me, from my anecdotal, you know, experiences, but what you think is wrong, whatever wrong means, quote, unquote, you're often not right about that. Like, very, very infrequently Do you understand at your core what's happening, and just can't get away from it. And I go back to that example of, you know, the person sharing the story and how people came from all different directions. No one saw themselves as an aggressor in it. Like, if you if I, if I stop, and I say, hey, you know, you're being a little harsh. They're like, No, I'm not. This is just This is obviously what's going on. I'm like, Well, this is your this is your reaction to what you just saw. It's not obviously what's going on, you don't know any of these people.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 43:18
Right are, are where they're sitting, what share what room, what not, how was their day, you know, all of those things

Scott Benner 43:26
at all. And, but here's a little bonus, because eventually we'll talk about interactions online. But as the moderator of a very big Facebook page, I also think that there's sometimes certain times of night where people are a little drunk, drunk and online. And

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 43:42
oh, yes. And maybe they're a little just more apt or free to share. Yeah, there's, there's the filters or not,

Scott Benner 43:52
there's no filter at all. They're either sharing openly or they're picking. It's very, very much of interest. Okay, so I'm sorry. So I figured out why I'm carrying the burden. I figure out that how to get it off of me. And I go through all this process, I figure out who I can talk to. What's the what's my expectation for when I feel better? Like is it is it right away? Is it once I give it I hate to say this because I feel I feel very granola you saying this, but when you give something a voice, oftentimes it dissipates. And the I've just found that to be true. But I feel like I'm a Yoga Instructor in Southern California when I say that. Erica tells me she used to do yoga instruction.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 44:40
Back when I was a yoga instructor,

Scott Benner 44:44
but But you don't I mean, like I do. I do. Honestly, I found that to be true. Just saying something out loud is very valuable. But anyway, what's the like? What's the process? And is it possible that I'm so far into it? I can't do it on my own. We're, and then I need to find somebody else.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 45:04
Okay, so what's sort of the goal? When do you start to feel good. And if you're in so far, deep, I think a good starting place is to journal. If you are, you know, I'd like the talking out loud in your in the car. Because again, it's like the voices in our mind can be the volume can be turned on so high that you can't function. And so by letting it out, I mean, it's, you know, classic, go journal, go get it out of your mind and onto the page that does help you are unloading it onto the paper or out into the world. By having someone else there present, not only hopefully, will you receive that validation that decrease feelings of isolation. But then if you're needing to, if you're needing help with some of those burdens, hopefully you can get to a place of, you know, stress management, problem solving, having some tools to utilize when you're starting to feel triggered, or overwhelmed or stressed or sad. Helping you find other resources to support yourself, be it independently with community. And maybe if it is past or current, you know, active trauma, helping you find ways to navigate through that. Changing your thinking or processing, the pain that you're feeling. Sometimes it's dealing with the psychosomatic symptoms, it really just depends on you know, what, what is the presenting issue, but ultimately, yes, you want to be able to function, but that the burdens are will continue, but then you'll have the skill set to manage it.

Scott Benner 46:44
Can I offload these burdens in nonverbal ways? Exercise, boxing, running, like, like that kind of stuff? Can I go to an axe throwing place and let it out that way? I mean, is there value to that?

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 46:59
I guess I'm so glad you brought that up. Thank you. Yes, I think exercise is a great way to for stress management. If I think the caveat to that is if you're finding that you're that's the only thing you're using, and you're still seeing these other issues arise like that irritability, that sadness, that maybe it's not quite enough, but it's helping you just let

Scott Benner 47:20
a little steam off every time you do it instead of just expressing it all.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 47:24
Exactly, exactly. But I think that's a good first step. If you're kind of if you're in the space of I can't afford it. I don't have time. I don't want to trying these, you know, the journaling, the talking out loud, the exercise are all really great first steps for sure.

Scott Benner 47:40
Yeah. I just to hear people talk about that, when they're in a good exercise routine, that their mental health feels better. And you never I mean, because some things are just, I mean, life's never going to be easy. Like it's never going to be without resistance, right? Like so there's always even if you're not struggling with big things, you're still struggling with small things that you that you don't recognize in the moment, likely.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 48:05
Yes, yes. And the exercise obviously has so many great, you know, current, and then post side effects with all the endorphins and all that

Scott Benner 48:15
release. So just some sort of a release. My last question, before I before I say something that I hope it's funny that I let you go is we talk we talk, you know, a lot from the perspective of a parent child who has type one and all that stuff that comes on. But this stuff is all just as relevant for an adult who's diagnosed. You know, I mean, and but that, but But it's different. Because your burden as a caregiver, and your burden as the person are just, I mean, I've just spoken to so many people, like it's just, it's a completely different reaction. People are, generally speaking, better at taking care of other people than they are taking care of themselves. And so I don't know. I guess though, if you're the parent, and there's a burden on you, then this really is about taking care of yourself. So both people fall into that conundrum of either I'm not going to take care of myself, or I'm going to put my effort into taking care of my kid. And so everybody ends up ignoring themselves, I guess. I don't know.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 49:33
Yes, no, sorry. No, that I think that I think so. Yeah. Being diagnosed as an adult being a caregiver and your child is diagnosed. I think the adult there's a lot of layers to being diagnosed as adults. The I think the caregiver piece. I have found that people do throw their entire mind life thoughts, you know, they look like if Sleep, that they are just trying to protect their child. And I understand that wanting to give your child a healthy life. But I think having that awareness of is it, overtaking your life to the point that you will have no friendships, your your your relationship is suffering, your you cannot function, you're crying, you're irritable, then maybe that burden has become so overwhelming that you have forgotten about yourself. And that happens as caregivers, because you are so loving and obviously empathic and compassionate towards your child. And so having that wherewithal to say, You know what I need to I need to pause and find ways to take care of myself, it's really important that I know we've talked a bit about that before. Yeah,

Scott Benner 50:50
I think that you can make the mistake of seeing your child's health or your own health as the win. And then you can ignore all the other things that God, you know, that got pushed to the side, to get to that win. And you, I think, I think in general, as time passes, we're all slowly dying, right? But and we also all slowly give something away to take the next step everyone so on, sometimes you have to, like sometimes you say, I'm not going to be around as much because I'm going to succeed at this job, or I don't care about the job. So we're going to make less money, but I'm going to be around more everybody gives something away to get to where they want to go. But I think just from my personal experience, if you think you're going to have diabetes, or raise somebody with diabetes, and just a Grade A one C and low variability is your mark, you know, your, your, your Mendoza line for you're doing a great job. And you think that just because you're doing a great job of that, that the other things aren't suffering, you're probably not right about that. Like there are probably other things suffering.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 51:53
Yes, and you and you probably know that. But I also want to just speak, you know, a moment of encouragement that it's never too late to, to change that. Of course, it's just because you're all in you can you can make steps no matter you know, what age and stage you're in, to take to take care of yourself and find those small or big ways to do so.

Scott Benner 52:13
Yeah, I know. I'll share to that if every anybody thinks that just because my daughter is a once has been so stable for so long, that I don't have these problems. I worry all the time. That I don't know if we haven't, and she seems okay. But I worry about the things that I forgot to address. And, you know, and I'm always wondering if it's going to like, come for her when she's in her late 20s or, you know, after college or like, is there going to be a point where she goes this synth off, it's too much. Like I'm trying to, I'm trying to walk that line. And I know you're a little low on time, but like I tried last night last night, she did a CGM change. And then I thought the CGM wasn't quite a while I wasn't sure how accurate it was in the first couple hours, and she starts eating and bolusing off of it. And then gets a little higher. And I said, I need you to test here. Like I don't want we shouldn't be given insulin at this number is not right, like let's test. And I know she was doing homework because I spoke to her earlier in the day. And she ignored me. And I I I did the thing in my head where I was like, Okay, this is gonna end up being a teaching moment, she is gonna get low later. And sure enough, it took till five o'clock in the morning. But she started have a low blood sugar. And I knew was coming. So I was awake or not awake. But I was listening for my alarm in my sleep, which is a thing, probably only people with diabetes understand. But I, I popped up, got her on, got it straight, kept moving. And at another time in the future, when she's not doing her homework, I'm gonna bring this up. And I'm gonna say, Look, if you just want to test your blood sugar for 30 seconds, we would have avoided all this. And I'm going to try to use it as a teaching moment. And I also tried to use it as a time where I didn't. I didn't let I didn't let diabetes turn into the reason why she couldn't do her homework. And because she was sitting down and I don't know, like there's a balance in there somewhere. But you have to you have to stay conscious of it and keep and keep going back and forth with it. You can't just slide one way or the other. But anyway, let me say this. I appreciate you doing this very much with me. I think you and I are finding a really nice rhythm.

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 54:31
And I hope Yeah, me too.

Scott Benner 54:33
It's lovely. I appreciate you being here. And I hope everyone heard earlier when I talked about letting stress off as steam. And then I said express it so that I could have a double entendre because you could express yourself and express this theme. I was so proud of myself. Oh,

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 54:50
I'm so sorry. I missed that and did not give you due credit.

Scott Benner 54:55
No, no, no, I was I got it done. Good. I don't though and I was just when it was over, I was like, Ah, I felt so good about it. Listen, I don't I'm not good at a lot of stuff, being able to hold a conversation. And at the same time, think about the words you're going to use to like make a pawn. I was pretty proud. I

Erika Forsyth, MFT, LMFT 55:19
know that it's good. You felt you shelved it, you held it. You used it. And that was so many skills. No,

Scott Benner 55:25
please. That's ridiculous. If it wasn't for iPhones and cheap microphones, the skill would be completely useless. So thank you so much. I'll talk to you again soon. A huge thank you to one of today's sponsors, G voc glucagon, find out more about Chivo Capo pen at G Vogue glucagon.com forward slash juicebox. You spell that g VOKEGLUC. Ag o n.com. Forward slash juice box. I'm also going to thank athletic greens for their sponsorship and remind you to get some ag one at athletic greens.com forward slash juice box don't forget free vitamin D five free travel packs with your first order athletic greens.com forward slash juice box

thank you so much for listening. I hope you are enjoying yourself while you're listening to the show. If you are, share it with somebody else, tell them how to download it or where to get it on Apple Music or Spotify or wherever you're listening. I really appreciate that. That's how the show goes through word of mouth. And of course if you're looking for community, find that private Juicebox Podcast page on Facebook Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes, you'll know you have the right place if it asks you just a couple of questions because we need to make sure you're a real person and not a bot or something you know Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes. Lastly, there's a ton of episodes with Erica if you're looking for them. Once you get into that Facebook group in the feature tab there's a list or that list is also available at the top of juicebox podcast.com In the menu system. Erica is terrific. And I've been talking to her for a while so there's a nice little catalog of episodes with her