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Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends and welcome to episode 771 of the Juicebox Podcast.

On today's show, I'll be speaking with Katie she is the mother of a child with type one diabetes who is more newly diagnosed. While you're listening, please remember that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan, or becoming bold with insulin. If you're a US resident who has type one, where is the caregiver of someone with type one, all I'm asking you to do is go to T one D exchange.org. Forward slash juice box and take the survey. I'm actually asking you to complete the survey. But that's nitpicking really take the survey AT T one D exchange.org. Forward slash juicebox. Do something good for yourself for people living with type one diabetes and for the podcast. If you're looking for the diabetes Pro Tip series, it begins at episode 210 In your podcast player, but if you want a whole list of them, you can find those episodes listed out on juicebox podcast.com diabetes pro tip.com. We're in the featured section of the private Facebook group Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes.

This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is brought to you by Omni pod five, the automated insulin delivery system that's tubeless and works with the Dexcom G six, the one you've been waiting for. It's available right now@omnipod.com forward slash juicebox. today's podcast is also brought to you by touched by type one, if you go to touch by type one.org right now and click on the Programs tab. You'll see the upcoming events. Right now in October. There's a family Halloween party coming up, in addition to the fall dance program. And then of course, pretty soon in November, dancing for diabetes showcase will be here. I'll be telling you more about that soon. But for now, fine touch by type one at touch by type one.org. We're on Facebook, and Instagram.

Katie 2:21
Hi, I'm Katie. I'm a mother of a child that has type one diabetes. were diagnosed in August. I kind of like to say now part time job of being somewhat of a parent, Chris. And I guess that's about it.

Scott Benner 2:37
Katie, it's so interesting. We were chatting before this about nothingness. And you never fought. I don't know if you know, futz because you're in, in North Dakota, but you never messed with the wire on the microphone. And then you started talking on the podcast and you're moving it or something like, are you? Is it touching your hair? Or were you touching it unknowingly? or talking with your hands or something like that?

Katie 2:58
I talk with my hands constantly.

Scott Benner 3:00
So don't touch that microphone again. Okay.

Katie 3:03
I will do my best. Only do it 1000 times.

Scott Benner 3:07
It makes this little sound like this on here that. Yes, just a little, it's this little rubbing in the background. And I don't want people to miss what you're saying. So. And maybe the other people are crazy, like me and hear tiny little noises in the background that completely takes them out of everything. But hopefully, hopefully everybody's not crazy like me. Alright, so let's see how many kids do you have? In total?

Katie 3:33
We have two kids, and it is my youngest daughter that has diabetes. Okay.

Scott Benner 3:39
How old is he or she?

Katie 3:42
She is eight years old.

Scott Benner 3:43
And how long she had diabetes now,

Katie 3:45
since August. We I have like the most non medically knowledgeable person you could ever meet. If it takes more than like, Advil or water. I'm out like I don't know what I don't how to solve your problem. Like waters not doing it. I don't know. It's terrible. Really. I'm like, I can't believe kids are interested to me, but they are and I mean, I have one that's 11 and she's still around so you know like we're doing something right but I really don't know anything medically. So

Scott Benner 4:17
maybe you just have good water. Katie.

Katie 4:20
We have water here. But yes.

Scott Benner 4:23
Oh, I didn't know this was gonna get turned around on me. But that's fine. No, no, maybe it's just like full of vitamins and nutrients and everything. And you just you just hydrate you're like, hey, you broke your leg hydrate?

Katie 4:34
Well, okay, I would be like, Okay, we gotta go to the doctor for that. But I think a lot of things like I got a headache and my kids like always roll their eyes. So I'm like, have you drink any water today? Like your body needs water and so I just that when she was diagnosed and like they're finally taking my advice. She's drinking so much water.

Scott Benner 4:54
I'm getting through to these kids.

Katie 4:56
Yes and no like, oh, probably she wasn't my advice to her. But he was just telling her to do it anyways. But

Scott Benner 5:02
soon I'm gonna move on from this hydration message and move up to something else. They they've got this one, you must have really thought you want for a couple of minutes, right?

Katie 5:11
Oh, yes. And like That daughter of ours has always really drink water. Well the other one were like, Do you drink any water during any time? It was a concern like, back in 2016. When I brought her in for an annual visit, we just said like, she does drink a lot of water. Do you just want to test her for diabetes at that point. And so they tested her back in 2016. And her blood glucose came back at 75. So I think once we had gotten that test back, we just didn't even think like diabetes wasn't an option anymore, which was really naive, I guess. But

Scott Benner 5:53
well, I mean, I can't I can't say that. That's naive. I mean, if you had the thought, by the way, why was the thought because the excessive thirst made somebody look for diabetes.

Katie 6:03
Well, my husband's grandma had type one diabetes, and she actually lost a leg to diabetes. And I never met her because she passed away young. And then her, his dad and his sister also had diabetes, too. But that was I think his sister was type one, but his dad was type two. So

Scott Benner 6:24
So you there's two people in your pretty close extended family who have had type one diabetes, so there was enough of knowledge that the excessive thirst read like diabetes to your husband has that right? To him? Yeah, yeah. And then But then you take the poor kid and and get a test when her blood sugar's 75. And then you don't think about it again.

Katie 6:44
Pretty much and like that test result came back and I didn't I really didn't know what anything meant. It just came back and greed, like, Okay, well, alright. Like, I had no idea what any of the values even meant.

Scott Benner 6:56
Right? Right. Okay. So, how much longer after? You know, you found out she didn't have diabetes? Did it take for you to find out? She did have diabetes?

Katie 7:05
Oh, well. It was July of last year. So July 2021, is when we got her brought her in to the doctor we were she was starting to wet the bed again at night. And she was signed up to go to a camp and stay overnight. And I'm like, whatever is going on. I obviously don't know how to solve it with water. And so we brought her in and she got tested then and I will always remember the day I got the call from the doctor was because she called me my daughter was out trying to learn how to water ski out on the reservoir here. And the doctor's like, she called me and I was just like ignored it because we're on a boat. It wasn't very easy. And then the second time she called me I'm like She's calling me twice in a row. I better answer this. And she's like, Katie, Emma has type one diabetes. I'm sorry to tell you this. Like her blood glucose is 712 right now is like, do you have eyes on her? And she passed out? Is she seizing? Like, do you know what she's doing? And I'm like she's trying to learn how the waterskiing right now. So from the urgency of my doctor, I got it that it was a big deal. But I had no idea until like, the more we learned about it like seven times 12 was very high. And quite crazy. So

Scott Benner 8:23
well. It must have been difficult to believe something Was that wrong if you were watching or being pulled behind a boat and skiing, right?

Katie 8:30
Yes, yeah. But yeah, because I think her biggest was wetting the bed at night was her biggest thing that we picked up on while she was eating a lot. But we just thought like, well, she's probably to the point where she's starting to grow. And it was absurdly high. It was like 100 degrees out. And we just thought she was drinking a lot of water because it was hot outside. So I always it's so easy to look back afterwards and see all these different things stack up and well, I thought I had different reasons for him. But they were all wrong. Yeah,

Scott Benner 9:01
no, listen, that's pretty common tale. So you drag her off the boat, you take her to a hospital or to a doctor, how does it go next?

Katie 9:08
Well, that was a something else I found really interesting. After listening to your podcasts, they just said you're showing up. And one of the larger cities in our state that's an hour and a half drive from us. And they're like you're showing up tomorrow at nine o'clock just make it happen no matter what I'm like, Well, this must be serious. So we've never had a hospitalization. We went to the endocrinologist and it wasn't even option of who you go to. In our state. We went have one pediatric endocrinologist in our whole entire state. So there wasn't really much of an option there but we show up and they did give us a heads up like you're gonna be here for a few hours I think was three or four hours and then we were sent home with our supplies and I hear about a lot of hospitalizations happening and I'm just really glad we just didn't have to hang out at a hospital the whole time. then that we were able to kind of like just sort of keep going on with life. Yeah.

Scott Benner 10:03
Well, it's interesting. That's kind of have something to do with the, the, the small amount of physicians that are available. I mean, to some degree like you can't stack people up to are there maybe it's just how they do it. Or maybe it was a function of what her blood sugar was. And so she wasn't in DKA. Is that right?

Katie 10:24
I don't believe so. And her you when she was 12.1 that they would we went to the doctor's office, and then the long lasting insulin they put us on, they had her on eight units. And so part of the though more I learned about it, I was like, I'm wondering if they were flushing ketones, and we didn't know it because it wasn't long, at eight units of Seba that we got pulled way back. And less than a month later, like a unit of Joseba was too much for 24 hours.

Scott Benner 10:54
So interesting. Like they were almost managing the drawl down with you at home, or most places, or most people you talk to that happens in a hospital setting. Yep, something else. Hey, there's a beeping going on behind you. Do you have any idea what it is?

Katie 11:07
It's my dishwasher? Because I stopped it.

Scott Benner 11:11
At Can you got to change your life?

Katie 11:15
Let me see you push your buttons. I'll be right back.

Scott Benner 11:18
I'll be right here.

Beep beep beep see what I can do for you people? Right. Now. You don't need to hear that beeping. I'm on top of this for you. Don't you worry, Katie. I'll never hear this part. It's not weird. She's coming back. This is it. I'm back. Hi. Thank you.

Katie 11:49
You're welcome. Sorry,

Scott Benner 11:50
no, don't be sorry. Alright, so with? I'm interested in this because you have How do I how do I ask my question? Did you feel like you had knowledge about type one? Not you but your husband? Or was it because it wasn't him? Who had type one growing up? Did he not know very much about it?

Katie 12:13
He did not know much about it. His dad is type two. When we are sitting in the doctor's office, said to the endocrinologist, I know it's bad because we're over seven. And he's like, how do you know what a 2007 is good. He's like, he writes, life and he helps with life insurance for people. And he's like, you can't get a policy unless somebody has agency under seven. It's his knowledge. We were actually our shareholders of Dexcom and insulet, before we even had a diabetic child, because that's the world he lives in. He recognize these as really up and coming companies and great products to get behind and stuff like that. So my husband had more knowledge at the start just because of his market research on these companies than I did that day in our appointment

Scott Benner 13:02
where that's interesting. You were the first person to say I knew about these products because of investing, not because of diabetes, you're literally the first person who's ever said that to me. That's

Katie 13:13
been on insulin. He's think he's listened to gotten whatever information he could, even though he wasn't interested from a diabetic standpoint, and he could see that it was like an outstanding company and how it was so different than other companies that were out there. And so it was it was it is a different perspective, when he was like, I know for sure we want Dexcom he's like, I've learned so much about it. I don't know why anybody with type one, would it have a Dexcom? And that's coming with us knowing nothing about diabetes. And that was his conclusion.

Scott Benner 13:45
Yeah, from a completely dispassionate third party perspective, too. That's really interesting. That's cool. Do you think I should be asking people to disclose if they own stock when they come on the podcast? That never occurred to me?

Katie 13:59
If you're one of the major company owners?

Scott Benner 14:02
Yeah, well, I mean, that seems obvious, right? Like people liquid the CEO comes on. They know he, I assume they know he has people have stock. Yeah,

Katie 14:11
it's they're not we're just little little or nothing. I mean, we're just small shareholders. But it is quite interesting.

Scott Benner 14:18
I understand that I am really fascinated by that, actually, that he had a firm understanding of a pump and a CGM. Because of that perspective was really something so Did Did that mean you tried to get those things very quickly? Or how did that all go?

Katie 14:33
The I'm positive. If we wanted to leave the office that day with that they would have sent us home for sure with a Dexcom and I think they would have started the paperwork for the pump right away. I wanted to start this is one thing I probably disagree with you on is I wanted to start with a bare basics, just for in a situation that you have to go back in technology that you're not struggling to know what to do and my lack of any sort of medical knowledge, I felt better at ease. Like if the wheels come off the wagon, and we have to go to the most basic things. I'm not trying to figure out what I'm doing. I will know what to do.

Scott Benner 15:13
You know, it is so interesting that you say that. I, this happens to me all the time on the show, but because literally yesterday afternoon, it hasn't even been 24 hours ago, it was so recently, I was speaking to a friend. So my friends, colleagues, sister, her kid heads type one diabetes just diagnosed a few days ago. And they asked if I would talk to her on the phone. And so I did. And she said, they told me, I can't have this right away, because I need to know how to use it. How did they put it? I need to know how to use it in case technology fails. That yeah, that that was the vibe of what she said. And my immediate response was, that's so but then my explanation was that when you have diabetes, and you're using insulin, and you're blind, you don't really know what's happening. So I've gotten to speak to enough people that what I recognize is that after a long time of using just a meter and MDI and not having a CGM all, not all, a lot of the things that those people think they know to be true, they find out was just their best guess once they have a CGM, and they can see what's really happening. Like they were filling in the blanks with their guesses, and we're frequently wrong about it. So my, my stance is always and by the way, it doesn't matter if you and I agree, you absolutely should live your life freely. But my stance is, see it happen. You can really understand it. And then if somebody were to come and take it from you, you know, which I also think is kind of a weird statement. I mean, here in the US, at the very least you don't I mean, it's like saying, I don't know, it's like saying pack a lunch, because we might get out there and not have anywhere to eat. If you're in New Jersey, you can get food every 30 seconds. You know, like I mean, so in the United States, I think you can get your hands on a Dexcom. If you have insurance, I don't believe there's going to be a Dexcom shortage at some point. So I don't think it's gonna go backwards or fail or fail for long. But if it were to if somebody just came and took it from you, you would at least have the experience of having lived with it. And then at least when you're guessing what's happening in between the blood sugar tests with your meter, your guesses would be more based in reality, and less just based on you just making something up, you know, because you've never seen it before. Does that make sense to you or no?

Katie 17:50
It? It does. But that day being less than 24 hours past diagnosis, I didn't even know that your blood sugar could change. Like I was so uninformed that I didn't even know like your blood sugar levels could change so quickly, with so many different variables. And it I think the other small thing we gained from that was like, my daughter saw what the opposite was, she is not the biggest fan of the Dexcom sensor and church insertions. I don't know if some of that's mental or physical or combination of both. I don't experience it. So I don't know. But she's able to come back and say, but I don't want to fingerprick all the time. So we were only on fingerprints for a week before we got the Dexcom. So it was very short term. And I think it even helped her realize, like, this isn't what I want. The one thing that we got from just being finger picking for a week was well, we're trying to figure out how to count carbs, like just even shifting like okay, insolence, you know, insulin and then our food and carbs. Like at least we're have the like, I think it was okay for us not to have those numbers for that one week just to try and get something else sorted out. And not all of it at once. And that is a case by case scenario, I'm sure. But then once we got the ducks calm. Like, I don't think anybody should give more than a week ever without a Dexcom is, you know, like, Oh, yeah.

Scott Benner 19:23
Well, you're certainly helpful. Your response. So mimics the person's I spoke to yesterday. It's fascinating. Because the way she put it to me is when they said that to her. She didn't have any context at all. And it made sense. Well, you want to know how to garden with a hoe in case your rototiller dies. And that she was like, Yeah, well, that makes sense. And I don't listen, I think what you just said a second ago, to me was the most valuable part of the whole conversation and the experience, which is how do you know what you are trying to avoid if you've never had that either? So even just her having the fingerprints For a couple of days made her say, hey, you know what, I don't love it when this thing inserts, but it's better than poking my fingers every couple of hours. So it did give her some perspective that she didn't have a week before.

Katie 20:12
Yeah, it was never our goal. Like we want to keep this. It's not simple. Like, and I think some people think finger picking is a simple way, it is not simple. I don't think it is. It's so much freeing to have the Dexcom that instant feedback, you're able to learn so quickly. It's amazing. But there was just such a big learning curve for us. Like, I think we had the Dexcom for two weeks. And we were like, well, she's not low. I mean, like it took us a while to realize what we needed to figure out. And that's where your podcast came into play. Like, this is why we need to know these numbers. This is how we can manipulate the numbers. And that was just a huge turning point for us. And

Scott Benner 20:54
I didn't know this was gonna be an episode where nice things were said about me, but I'm now super excited. Before Katie, I was just going through the motions, but now that you're gonna say something nice, I'm all jacked up. No, I'm just kidding. No, no, I appreciate you know, I'm not arguing with you. Right. Like, I'm not saying that it's a bad idea. I just, I think it's the way I, the way I think of it is I think that we set up these black or white things all the time, we always say it's this or that it's either or, you know what I mean? It's either you do it this way. You do it that way. And there's only two right answers. And, you know, I don't know, like, I just don't think that's the way the world works. You know, I think it's super reductive to say you have to do it without the technology in case like technology fails. To me, that doesn't make any sense. Because even if the technology fails, I will have at least had it to learn from I don't know, like, in the MK don't care. You don't I mean, people should.

Katie 21:52
I'm one of the few people. For me to give my daughter a shot. It was so hard. And I know it's not easy for a lot of people. But that was just like, I have to know that I can do it and not where I feel like it's more of an emergency situation. Like I didn't pick up my glucagon because I didn't want to have to use a syringe. And then they kind of got after me for not picking up glucagon. So then I did.

Scott Benner 22:18
I was excited yesterday when I spoke to the woman that newly diagnosed in the hospital last week, they sent her home with a G voc hypo pen, because I was getting ready to say to her, hey, you know, I actually I had, it's so funny when I have these private conversations I first it's almost like I'm disclosing my my stock, which I don't own any of but I'm just using it as an example. I'm like, Listen, I'm about to tell you about a CGM. They buy ads on my podcast. I'm like, That's not why I'm telling you about it. And then I brought up the glucagon because I think it's really handy the way it's set up. And I found myself going, You know what, they're actually advertisers, too. And I was like, almost found myself apologizing for suggesting it. And then she goes, No, they actually gave us that one. I was like, Oh, that's cool. So

Katie 23:00
I was I actually was that our three month appointment, I asked for the GMO pen. And he's like, You should have the glucagon. I'm like, Well, I don't and I want the G voc pen. And I don't want to miss like, I don't want to administer syringe like I don't think I think properly like medical things are not my strong suit. And I still don't have it. Oh,

Scott Benner 23:23
keep pushing. And by the way, good of you to like recognize that. You know, that might not be the strongest part of your personality or your skills. You know, I I still I don't know. I don't know if I say this very often. But back when I was finger sticking Arden so much. I wouldn't do it to myself because I was afraid that if I thought it hurt, I'd have a harder time doing it to her. I also like I wouldn't practice like inject saline and myself like I wouldn't. I just didn't want to know what it felt like because I knew myself. And I thought this if I if I relate this to something terrible, then it's going to be like a struggle for me to do it. I've done it all now since then. But back then when she was really little two years old, you know? 19 pounds. I couldn't bring myself to know the real truth actually.

Katie 24:16
No, and I guess everybody says they don't like needles, but like neither my kids I didn't have any epidurals nothing's good. Like, no way. Like that's how much I hate them. They're awful. Like, I just,

Scott Benner 24:28
we don't come out a needle person. Katie is Gotcha. So, in your notes that you sent me, you indicated that you guys didn't like flinch very much like you kind of kind of kept running forward with life. Was that? Was that like a purposeful thing or was it was it based in ignorance or how does it work?

Katie 24:50
I'd like to say both now that I look back. She was diagnosed on a Wednesday the following Wednesday, I left to go hiking in the mountains. for like, a 15 mile hike, and with something, I've been training for that for months, and my daughter was also set to be at a camp at the same time. And so we kind of relied upon the staff at the clinic and we call them like is Do you think it's okay? Like if only one person's here managing her? Or if we called the camp nurse, and she seems to have some experience, like, are we good to send her off to camp? And they're like, Well, if you think it's good to get back to life, just go for it. And so yeah, it was gone backpacking, a week after her diagnosis, my husband took her care until she went to camp and she had like somebody in the medical field taking care of her. And then on my way home, I stopped at that camp, and I actually volunteered in the kitchen, just to be there for something came up. Although I did absolutely nothing, obviously at that point, she's way better hands in the nurse's care than my care. But I was physically at the camp, helping in other ways, I was gonna

Scott Benner 26:05
say that, did you find comfort and leaving her with somebody who said, Oh, I've seen this before?

Katie 26:10
Oh, we didn't think twice about it. And selfishly, I would be in the kitchen from seven in the morning till seven at night, and I'd take a shower, and then I would sleep for 11 and a half hours, and then I'd wake up and just go to the kitchen again. And I, I said, I feel really guilty about how much continuous sleep I'm getting, even though we were only like one week into the diagnosis, like we already realized, like doing that to a finger prick is very disruptive to sleep. And it wasn't very beneficial at that point, because they didn't even tell you what to do. Like, oh, she's 300 she's not low, we're good. And we had no idea like, that's terrible.

Scott Benner 26:48
So the people that you were counting on thought 300 was okay,

Katie 26:52
know the clinic. So like, we came home, they said wake up at two o'clock finger picker, if she's low, treat the low, otherwise do nothing. And I'm like, why am I waking up? Looking back? I'm like, Oh, I'm gonna be up and she's 300 We should have been doing something.

Scott Benner 27:07
I would love to hear the person explain that the person that said that to you? Or who would say that to anyone? I'd love to hear the explanation for we don't do anything about a 300 blood sugar.

Katie 27:18
Okay, but I will I will step up in their defense for they did have us Pre-Bolus thing from the very start. Nice. They didn't call it a

Scott Benner 27:25
Pre-Bolus. Well, they call it Do they have a name port?

Katie 27:28
They just said try to give the insulin 10 to 15 minutes before she consumes food

Scott Benner 27:32
can't sell T shirts that says that? No. By the way, I do not sell a Pre-Bolus T shirt. Although I probably should. I mean, honestly, don't you think that's what everyone needs to I think there should be a magnet that sticks year for refrigerator that just says Pre-Bolus. Keep in your head, you know, let's play I'll tell you. It's so I'm always interested. Because it happened again, earlier this week, I record this podcast a lot. Where people feel very protective of their medical people. They'll say well in their defense, or they did say this or that I don't want anybody to think that. I was speaking to somebody the other day, who got like patently bad medical advice. Through through years, they recognized it was bad. And when I asked them to kind of talk about it, they could not bring themselves to say it all out. It's interesting. I don't know. I wish my wife spoke about me as nicely as some people talk about their doctors who let their blood sugar stay of 300. I don't I don't I I'm I'm super interested in the psychology behind that. I don't know that I'll ever understand it.

Katie 28:49
But so because we have to travel 90 miles to our endocrinologist, they had us call in twice a day at the first week. And we'd have to call in daily and it was like they would slowly give us more to think about as we would call in. But at the same time once I got back from hiking in Montana. I contacted somebody else in the community that I knew had a diabetic child. And she had just offhandedly said, like, oh, there's a podcast that like to listen to about diabetes. I'm like, I don't do my podcast. And then I was like a whole day and I was feeling really sleep deprived already. And then I felt like oh my gosh, somebody suggested something and I'm like, I just don't do that. Probably not a good choice so that I wasn't sleeping at 2am Because I'd wake up and check her blood sugar and I started I was overwhelmed. I started going through all these episodes and I'm like, Oh my gosh, like where there's just so many I don't think once I start something I have to do it all I can't. I can start a bad book. I still read the full stupid bad book like there is no like Half doing something in my life. So I like had to think about it for a week or like a day before I started listening to him because I'm like, how am I going to have the time to listen to these all and I started in the most logical spot of all I listened to the one about Everest, you know, super helpful for managing my own child.

Scott Benner 30:19
Where you had recently been on a mountain, so that made total sense.

Katie 30:22
Oh, baby, never in a risk of an avalanche. But no. So

Scott Benner 30:29
Katie, people with your affliction that have to finish things that that when they start them, you're my bread and butter, first of all, so thank you very much. And but I want to be clear for people are listening. You're not saying that my podcast is really bad. You just have to finish it because you started it already. Right?

Katie 30:45
Well, no, just kidding. No, it is fantastic. It was looking back, I really wish when I contacted this person, I wish they wanted to set I like to listen to this podcast, I wish they could have expressed like, this is where you're gonna find your most helpful information. This is where you can gain other people's experiences. This is where there's just so much up to date, and continuing to progress information available, and so worth the time investment that it does take. And I'm like, if people couldn't find time to binge watch something on Netflix, I took my time to listen to everything on your podcast. And that was kind of by listening to your podcasts. And I think I started with the defining diabetes. And then I started listening to the Pro Tip series. And I was still calling into the office, like, okay, she continually set the goals low, or she's constantly high. And I started making suggestions to the nurses. And I'd be like, before you tell me what you think should happen, this is what I would like to do. And it was nice that I could use them as a resource because I felt like there's a lot to learn right away at the beginning. And I appreciated that. They listened to what I said. And most of the time, they're like, why don't you give that a try? Once in a while. They said I think I would do this instead. But try what you wanted.

Scott Benner 32:07
First. Well, that's nice. It really Yeah. Also, it's telling, right? Because if you called me, and I don't know about anything, something I knew about intrinsically, and you called me up and you said, Scott, I think we should try this. You know, I would say no, I don't think we should because I know how to do it. And this way works. So it's weird. Not that not to be open minded. That's great. But it's odd that you can call a physician's office and say, Hey, here's our problem. Before you tell me the thing, you're gonna say, here's the thing, I'm gonna say you said your thing. And they went, Oh, yeah, that's fine. Do that. But it wasn't the

Katie 32:44
same using fancy words like, I want to Pre-Bolus this longer, like, I think because of your defining diabetes, like I had words to properly talk to them to

Scott Benner 32:55
I might be cynical, but I think that that. I think that's what I don't think let me say it this way. I don't think that sounding like, you know, what you're talking about should be enough to dissuade a professional from their opinion. And when it does, that causes me to call their opinion into question. This, you know, I'm saying, I could agree with that. Yeah. It would be like if you said to your kid, hey, put that down. Because that's dangerous. And your kid went, No, it's not you went, Okay.

Katie 33:29
I wouldn't allow that. Right, Katie, you're

Scott Benner 33:31
not doing that. That's this is my point. My point is, you know, I'll tell you what I told the woman I spoke to yesterday, I said in six months, you're going to know about more about this than you could ever imagine. And a year from now you're going to know more about it than the doctor that's helping you. And she's like, how is that possible? And I said, I don't know. But it's true. So just keep absorbing and figuring things out. I'm super glad that podcast helped you. Like even if it was just a bully a nurse into agreeing. Not not a bully Katie. I'm just I'm teasing.

Katie 34:04
No, but it was nice. Like, it was just like, I needed that process, though. Like just to have a couple of times of them saying Sure. Okay, do that. And then I'm like, I'm gonna stop wasting their time. And I'm just going to start changing things. And like, I didn't even know what to be afraid of insulin until I listened to your podcast, and like, oh, people are afraid to use this stuff. Like I just totally oblivious on so many levels, which I think is kind of a blessing in some ways, because I never hesitated to give the insulin. I don't know. I didn't have to do the needle. I didn't care. Like I have no problem giving her insulin.

Scott Benner 34:41
So this has only been about seven months for you. Right? Correct. Okay, has it leveled you up as a person?

Katie 34:50
What do you mean by leveled up?

Scott Benner 34:53
Jeez, Katie, do you know how sometimes I ask questions and I'm worried that it's going to offend people. This might be one of those times but I don't meet in an offensive way. So let me get through it okay

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Katie 37:39
Oh, I just think, I don't know. I just have a really positive disposition about everything. And I just don't let much bother me. I think it's so I don't know.

Scott Benner 37:50
Like when you're talking I think I should have married you and not Kelly. That's because you seem so plus it.

Katie 37:56
She seems very smart. Oh, she's pleasant to

Scott Benner 37:59
she's pleasant to other people not to me. Katie. Have you ever spoken about Kelly's gas station voice on the

Katie 38:04
podcast? No. Okay, or I don't think so. Kelly has a gas station

Scott Benner 38:09
voice. And it's this voice. She goes, Oh, hi. She gets very nice. And she goes up an octave. And she's super pleasant has a big smile on her face. And I joke with her I was like, I wish you would talk to me like I worked at a gas station because the I would appreciate that. So Kelly has a gas station voice. That's how we make fun of her about it here at the house. Not that she's like some terrible person in the shadows. I'm not trying to say that. I'm just saying. I don't know. Maybe it's just because you are you born in North Dakota?

Katie 38:40
No, in Minnesota, Minnesota.

Scott Benner 38:42
I don't know you have like a more Midwestern vibe about you? Do you know what I mean? Like you're not trying to kill everybody and take their money. Out here.

Katie 38:55
It's not positive, like just move on. I just I don't,

Scott Benner 38:59
I don't you should try living out here. It's a rat race that I know where that word came from. That's a viable description for living on the East Coast.

Katie 39:08
Then out on the east coast a whole lot. But we are planning on taking a family trip out there this summer. So maybe I'll have an inkling of what you're talking about. Once we get back. I don't know. I went to New York once.

Scott Benner 39:19
Would you see a show had a launch?

Katie 39:23
Skating and Rockefeller Center right you know, and like I realized I talk too much for people. They're like, Hey, isn't it nice though? And like people look at me like I grew up on my own or something like people don't talk to each other. Like, obviously I do not fit in here and

Scott Benner 39:43
I just realized that I don't see the phrase killer be killed as a bad phrase. Just had that like realization in my head. I was like, I just see that as like, you know, marching orders. Like let's get out there and when I want to live where you are like Not in the winter, people have told me how bad the winters are out there

Katie 40:03
it is on hold. I don't even have words to describe the winter. But, you know, three months out of the year is absolutely gorgeous here. So I

Scott Benner 40:13
mean, my goal is Katie, my goal is, if all of you would just please tell other people about the podcast, my goal is to live those three months in kind of that Wyoming, North Dakota ish. Like, I don't understand the country completely. But again, that place in that time when it's not cold, and it's not hot, that place seems perfect to me in that in that little section of time, then I'll run somewhere else in the summer, where it's not too humid. And then in the winter, I'll run back to one of those hot places that these are my goals. I don't think I'll ever accomplish them. But

Katie 40:44
I think you just need to buy a Winnebago.

Scott Benner 40:47
Okay, you don't know me at all.

Katie 40:51
When you can meet that goal. I mean, you can have whatever you want, but you can't have it all, you know?

Scott Benner 40:56
You sure? Can you because I think if I killed enough other people, I can get it. That's what I learned growing up here,

Katie 41:02
now just be doing stuff for you. And then you just have to take on more. So like you want to keep other people around,

Scott Benner 41:08
I hear you I really should bring other people around. The other day, somebody said to me, why do you not have an assistant and I was like, who's gonna pay that person? And then the person I talked to was laughing and said, I know people who don't need an assistant to have an assistant. I was like, I would rather work myself into the ground the way God intended. Thank you. So anyway,

Katie 41:29
what would you do it yourself? It does turn out the way you wanted to, you know, like, there's that aspect of just doing it yourself, too.

Scott Benner 41:36
Yeah, more time would be nice. But in general, you are right, the podcast comes out the way I want it to be like I've never once listened to one and thought who did that? You know, like, don't put that there. Or don't say that. Or the other night I was recording ads. And I was loopy, like, so I got back from my son was playing baseball in Florida. And we got back and I had this is probably boring for people. But I had killed myself the three weeks prior to leaving for this one week trip. So that you guys would not notice that I was gone while you're listening to the podcast. So I had to like work ahead of time, I had to double up recordings to like, like free. Actually, I have one on I think I have to tomorrow, because I had to move people off of this this time. But anyway, I got enough done. So that the entire time I was gone, the podcast would run fine. And I got to the point where I had some shows edited. But I didn't have the ads and the bumpers in them yet. So I basically came home Saturday, and had to pull myself together really quickly and make a podcast to put up on Monday. And I'm busy. I don't like working like that. So I was just trying to rest up from the trip. And I think it was like two nights ago, I was up at like 11 o'clock buttoning up an episode that you were gonna get like six hours later. And I got super like tired while I was doing it. And really kind of dopey. And I just left it all in. Because when I listened back to it, I was like, well, that's funny, people will like that. And if I gave that to an editor, there's no way an editor would have left in what I said, like at one point, I said, my tongue just stuck to my face. I don't even know what that means. So you know.

Katie 43:13
And it's nice that the ads are the same the whole time. Like, you can't just quote the ad because it's over and over and over. It's nice to hear something different, you know, okay,

Scott Benner 43:21
thank you. And I hope the advertisers are listening and appreciate my extra effort, because that is exactly what I do. I don't want them to be the same over and over again, because I'd like them to be entertaining and informative. And I'd like you to want to listen to them. So anyway, point is an editor would have just chopped all that out and sent me an email and been like, do that again. And to me, I was just like, Yeah, screw it. It's fine. So anyway, I'm thinking back on your note, what else did you want to talk about? I don't want to have to look, I had it in my head. And now I'm

Katie 43:55
like, once I thought about like, I know I sent you a note of appreciation. And what a difference that made in the management of Emma's management over diabetes and like her future health is going to be drastically better because of you and Jenny. I wrote one to Jenny too, but like, I told my husband yesterday that I was doing this podcast and like I don't even was like writing in complete sentences at that point. Like I'm so

Scott Benner 44:19
no, it's a little overrated. Yeah, word over runny, but I get the point. You know, if I read it, you'd be embarrassed.

Katie 44:28
Yeah, I don't want to hear me

Scott Benner 44:32
goes on and on.

Katie 44:35
I talk a lot so it doesn't surprise me that I write like that either. But I don't know. There's just it's such a different world. And you feel like when so many other people around you aren't affected by it. You feel half crazy, and it's just nice to listen to other people like these are real things that we see I'm not going nuts in that there is a community even though I am not necessarily in acting with these people like you just don't feel as alone in this crazy disease that we have now.

Scott Benner 45:06
Yeah. And you did say one thing in your note that I disagree with, you want to hear about it? Or Sure, let's talk, we can talk through it. You said something about, oh, here it goes. I want to quote you. And I would love to tell people to use the search feature on your Facebook private group. Instead of asking how to Bolus for insert carby fatty food here, search for that food, and then read posts that people have already taken the time to share. It's another way of gaining info that is quicker than waiting for people to respond. I want to hear your thought on it first, but then I'm gonna give you mine.

Katie 45:42
Okay, so I love your Facebook group. And I think you can just be not active at all and gain a lot of information from like, where to play sensors to how certain people feel different foods, what people like a starting point of how to start extending or not expand, or I remember researching pizza while we were still MDI and just like, Okay, let's try this much here. And that mature at least it's a starting point. And not just like, let's do it all upfront, that didn't work. Okay, now what you know, but I just felt like, maybe I was on the Facebook page too much that I felt like so much of it was kind of the same thing over and over again, I'm like, Okay, well, how many pizza posts do we need? Can you just see what other people said already?

Scott Benner 46:27
Hi, Katie. Now you want to get the other side of it? Sure. That is, if you that is the exact wrong thing to say, if you're trying to make a Facebook page that is valuable for people, because it's not. Even if it could act as an encyclopedia, like, you know, even if you could say, hey, everything you've ever asked is already in this Facebook group, you just have to search for it. If the Facebook group wasn't active, people wouldn't come to it. And if they didn't come to it, then they wouldn't be there to search for it. So you have the activity is the most important part of making a thriving online space. Like you need to, you need to want them to ask about pizza. Every time somebody thinks about it, you need them to say the same things over and over again. Because there there is a finite amount of things to say about diabetes. I mean, we haven't found the end of it yet. But there, there has to be an end to it somewhere, right? But if, if those things don't keep happening in front of you, you won't even know to wonder about them. So like you need you need it to. It's like a river, it has to keep running. Like you know, you can't you can't float down the river and then go I don't need this river to run anymore. I'm already down the river. Because there are other people who need to see all of those conversations, they need to watch them happen. They need to wonder about them. And if they stop happening, then nobody will pay attention to the group. They won't be in the group. And they'll never see the conversations. The conversations are the group without the conversations. It fails. Yeah, I agree with that. Yeah, but you're but I think what you're saying more is that it gets can it get overwhelming at some point?

Katie 48:14
And then that at that point, I could choose just not to look at it.

Scott Benner 48:17
Right? Well, you definitely could. Yes, you are an autonomous person, you can do whatever you want. Yeah.

Katie 48:23
I will say this about your Facebook group. Oh, our first few birthday party experiences were quite interesting. Let's see her. Her second birthday party she got invited to we had a Dexcom change right before it. And we she was limited in where she was comfortable on putting her devices and I'm like, I'll give her time to get used to different spots. And I had put her Dexcom on her leg and she's like, it hurts to move my leg. I'm in so much pain. And this is sometimes how we feel closer to insertion. And then as time goes by think she kind of forgets that it's on her body. But she was so adamant that it hurts so bad. I'm like, I really don't know, does this really hurt you and I really appreciated. I put a picture on the Facebook group of her pumping her CGM. And people gave me instant feedback like Oh, yep, occasionally it can really, really hurt and like I could see where that might happen in that spot. And so I knew to like we pulled that thing right away, put it on somewhere else and then she was able to go off to her birthday party. And so like I really do appreciate the immediate feedback of all those who do contribute their experiences because that's the one disadvantage of just being a manager of diabetes and not the one experiencing it of a kid. I just sometimes I'm like, how much of this is really what you're feeling? I don't know

Scott Benner 49:43
if that makes sense to things. I the very first Dexcom sensor I ever put on Arden I definitely didn't do it right and it hurt her and we made her wear it for a couple of hours. And I and the minute we took it off of her, I realized I'd put it into I forget what I didn't do. But I guess I didn't pinch up a little bit. And I don't know, it was it was back as long time ago. I haven't had that problem since then. But the point is, is that we were like, no each, we'll get used to it, you'll get used to it. And if she just, we were wrong, I still feel terrible about it. And like that has to have been like 10 years ago. And, but, but to your point about the page, you have no idea like none of you know how many, like threads I go into. And I go, Oh, I know what to say about this. Then I read down, I'm like, well, it's all covered. They don't need me. You like like, it's it's really wonderful like to go in and see so many people using the podcast, to grow their information. And then going back to Facebook and sharing it with somebody else is really cool. Like I more often than not, I just look and I think I don't need to be in here. Sometimes I'll just write great thread or like, something like that, and I'll get out again. But in the beginning, when I started the Facebook group, I had to be like in every thread, because it was exhausting. I have to be honest, to be like, no Think about it this way. Or have you thought of this, like that kind of stuff? Like I'm not real big on just telling people what to do. I sort of like to talk it out with them on Facebook, and ask leading questions to get them to that on their own. Because not only are you helping them to think through it, but everybody watching gets the thing through it at the same time. So I think it's an amazing tool. I cannot believe I'm sitting here telling you how much i i appreciate a Facebook group. Because I never thought that was going to be the case I swear to you when I started I was doing it because people were asking me, and I just thought off they want it. I'll do it. But it turned into an amazing thing. So I anyway, let's go back to your rambling message. This is fun. No. I feel like you don't say anything that I'm just gonna go back to your rambling message Hold on a second. You really drive 90 miles to get to a endocrinologist?

Katie 52:00
Yes, I do.

Scott Benner 52:03
Is that like a day trip?

Katie 52:03
No, well see, that's the different about our traffic here. I drive 45 miles to my work. It's a even smaller town that we live in. But it takes me like 43 minute 43 minute commute to drive 45 miles. Like, that's the easy, lovely pace of life we have here. So that endocrinologist is on the border of Minnesota and North Dakota, and they actually fly him and his crew to different parts of the state so that not people Oh, don't have to drive like seven hours to come and see him so they fly him into a more centrally located part of the state so that people just only have to drive like an hour and a half to three hours to see them and not like six or seven hours.

Scott Benner 52:48
That's nice. Is that a common thing out there? Maybe just

Katie 52:53
not. Not that I don't know what but I think like only having one pediatric endocrinologist. Like there's other people with diabetes education titles within the state. Like it's not that desolate, but like that specialty. I think that's really neat that they're able to do that. Because no, it's wonderful else. Yeah.

Scott Benner 53:14
It's like it's like a rural house call except he doesn't come right to your house. He comes to your area, then you come to him from there. Your him or her? Oh, that's really it's kind of brilliant. Actually. It's frequent flyer miles must be crazy. Well, it's North Dakota, how do I fly around North Dakota? How many airports could you possibly have?

Katie 53:33
Well, our little small community has it like, aren't you we have quite a few small little airports. Like we'll feed into like Denver into more major hubs. But I believe this is more of like a private in that medical system. Oh, I

Scott Benner 53:47
see. This could be like a helicopter or a private jet or something like that. Because I

Katie 53:51
started doing the math like, Okay, you guys start your appointments at eight o'clock in the morning, you have to go through security. And then you you know, like I was thinking it was more like in a commercial setting that like oh, no, like, you pretty much. Get to the airport, walk on the plane, like all the flight papers and everything are filed and stuff like that. And because kind of

Scott Benner 54:10
sounds fun to me, there might be something wrong with me. But the idea of like just going to an area and having a bunch of people come to you and just talk about diabetes with them for the day. I would do that. That sounds fun.

Katie 54:22
Actually. You can come visit we could set it up somewhere in the summer. You could see how nice it is then or if you wanted to like go through a few snow banks or something. I mean, you could come out in the winter

Scott Benner 54:33
think the problem is going to be that I'm not a doctor. I think that's where you're gonna get the lunch when you start going. Hey, can we helicopter a guy in to chat with people about diabetes? They're like a doctor there. No, no sick guy I met online. No, we can't do that. Katie.

Katie 54:48
It is really okay. So we are rule that I think it really speaks to the information that you're able to give out like my rule setting isn't limiting the other eligibility for me getting good care because of your podcasts like, we can manage my daughter. Excellent, because we just have to be able to access a podcast. And that is the most helpful source of information. I was really encouraged by our six month appointment when we went in, they take all of our devices and download the information and stuff like that. And one of the nurses took my pump from me, the other one brought it back. And she's like, you have the most beautiful graphs we have ever seen. And I think my graphs compared to everybody else in your little Facebook group look awful, compared to what a lot of people are able to do. And it just like it was really nice to hear encouragement from his staff that they liked what they saw. But it also made me sad that this is more of a common thing that they see coming through their office.

Scott Benner 55:51
Yeah, I'm afraid, Katie, that the people who listen to this show are generally speaking in the minority of people who are using insulin. And, you know, that's good.

Katie 56:02
So, when we got on Dexcom, we start having alerts go off on both my husband's phone. And it's been really interesting. He has more contact with the public than I do. And there'll be people to hear the beef. And they're like, What is that like? And he's like, Oh, it's my daughter's pancreas. And they're like, what? And through that we have found out one of his golf buddies, his wife is diabetic, and he had no idea. And he was just dumbfounded, like, you can see what her blood sugar is doing all the time. Eric's like, yeah, I can see that she's been steady at 90 Ever since naptime. He's like, what? And so it's been really interesting getting Dexcom setup for her and the alerts going to my husband's phone, the amount of people our age that we didn't even know we're diabetic. Yeah. That are like, Oh, we didn't know this was available or even possible. And so I know two people that have gotten Dexcom, since they've seen Eric, get alerts on his phone that are our age with diabetes, it's wonderful. But there's a part of me that I'm not diabetic, but I want to go tell him like you have to take the time to listen to this podcast, you need to do it all. But I don't feel like I'm in a position that I can just say that to these people that have dealt with diabetes for like 20 or 30 years, like who am I? To tell you what to do?

Scott Benner 57:25
Well, meaning love? Well, you're a well meaning lovely person, you can tell them there's a way to say it. That you know, I mean, you could listen, as a person who communicates for a living, here's what I would do. I wouldn't tell them to do it at all. I would tell them what it's done for your daughter. And then, and then let them wander about it.

Katie 57:45
And that's one of the people is my husband's area leader. And he's after getting back my daughter's a onesies. He'll occasionally check like, Hey, how's it doing? It's like, well, here's her eight onesies, like how is that even possible? And so like, I feel like, at least my husband's able to plant some of the seeds. And I really hope that that desire can be in him to be able to be like, I don't need the chug a bottle of Gatorade in the middle of the night. Because I went though, like,

Scott Benner 58:14
I appreciate how you feel. And I know it's making me sad to think about it, it makes me sad to think about it. So there's, you know, there's first there's access, right? You know, a lot of people can't afford these things, or their insurance doesn't cover it or what have you. So there's that there's that barrier there. There's just the barrier of ever having someone say it to you, or to even understand that it's possible. Because most people come into it. They have their experiences, their experiences repeat. And that leads them to believe that this is just what diabetes is. And then there's not even any reason for them to look into it. Because they think well, this is the animal I'm dealing with. I'm gonna now just close my eyes and hope that I am one of the lucky ones and I make it through. And if not, well, then, you know, I was bad luck for me, I got diabetes, and this is what it is. It's hard to reach people to let them know that that's not the case. I do think I joked a little while ago about not being a doctor. I think not being a doctor is maybe one of the most valuable things about me. Because I can just share our experiences and my ideas. And there, it's not medical advice. It's a podcast, you know, and then people can again, take from it what they will or maybe have a thought lit on fire in their head and they'll go chase it down on their own. But if you start asking for doctors to say what they know out loud, you're just going to hear what you all are hearing in a doctor's office in another forum. If a doctor started a podcast about diabetes, no one would listen to it. As a matter of fact, I believe there are a couple of diabetes like orgs that have podcasts that nobody listens to So, you know, it's not enough to just say it out loud, you have to say it in a way. That's, that's easy to take up by the person who's listening to it, they have to be willing to listen to it. First, they have to, they actually have to listen to it, they have to be entertained enough to listen. And then they have to hear something that strikes their fancy or makes them wonder, whatever. So they can dig into it on their own a little more.

Katie 1:00:25
And I think you have to be willing to get it wrong. Like, you have to be willing to try it and be wrong and be like that, wasn't it. Continue forward, even though it wasn't ideal, just like, Well, that wasn't it? What's next? Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:00:39
And to piggyback off of what we were talking about, about the Facebook group, me if you think of me as a content provider for a second, and what you said earlier about, oh, there's so many episodes, I don't know where to start. If there weren't so many episodes, people wouldn't listen, because people want content. So if I were to put up I probably shouldn't say this, because I know there are a lot of other diabetes podcasts listening to this, but you guys were putting up one episode a week, that's not going to work. It's not going to work one a month not going to work. I there's there's a I would not They seem like lovely people. But there's one they put up like 10 every six months, like 10 episodes every six months. And like that's not a podcast, that's your hobby.

Katie 1:01:20
Your ability to improve and learn is so limited by 10 to 10 times you're going to think about something you know, like, right,

Scott Benner 1:01:27
yeah. And you're not even going to cover I mean, listen, there's so much to talk about the problem, one of the here, here's some free advice for the diabetes space that they didn't ask for. You're gonna love it, you keep telling people the same banal bullshit over and over and over again, it's, it's your content sucks. For the most part, it's repetitive, it's banal, it often is not helpful. It's often shrouded in so many apologies that you can't even get to the idea. And by that, I mean, I once read this paragraph about about Pre-Bolus thing, it was preceded and preceded by language that made you think I should never do this. Be very careful, because if you don't do this, like like it was, it was apologizing for what it was about to say, then it said it, hey, you might want to Pre-Bolus for your meals. And then at the end, then afterwards, it again, apologize for saying it out loud. And I was like, anyone who read these three paragraphs would have been scared away from Pre-Bolus. But not not even like, made to think like, oh, maybe this is something I should look at. So there are so many things in diabetes that don't follow. Don't follow the rules, you know, and I mean, God, even you hear people talk about it. It's like, count your carbs, you know, apply your meal ratio to this, that's going to work that's so infrequently works. I mean, how could that be? The only thing you say to people? Like, why would you not come along? And I mean, I talked about things that I was worried when I started talking about them that people would be bored by, like, I really push glycemic index and load and understanding the impacts of different foods. People don't talk about that. And diabetes Bazel the least sexy thing in diabetes, right? I mean, if if they're sexy things and diabetes, you know, I'm talking about like the way people like consume their media. It's Dexcom on the pod. Those are like sexy diabetes devices, like we all like, know that that's true. Like people love them for some reason, right? Just the idea of them, or the vision of them. One of the one of the most popular blog posts I've ever put up was just a picture of a Dexcom G five before it came out. They just want to see it. You know? And the point is, is that is that talking about basil, not specifically very sexy. It's hard to keep people's opinions. Or excuse me, keep people's focus on something like that. When it doesn't sound exciting. Oh, my background insulins important the thing I shoot once a day, that setting in the pump that the doctor set up that I've never looked at before. How could any of that be important? It's the most important thing. And I defy you to go find 10 doctors who talk to you about it once after they set it up in your home, you know

Katie 1:04:27
that? I think just even listening to your podcast gives me permission to like make changes. And so even before it was about a month in we got the Omni pod. And before we even had it I've heard enough people that you interviewed or like yeah, we left and we just so that we know better and they made changes right away. And so I just kind of adopted that philosophy just because I heard it work for so many other people. Like it's so every episode is so important because you get something different from it, but It just is mind blowing, sometimes to me, like people's inability to decide to make a change, or to try something different. I just can't. Like, I can't imagine not doing that right. At our last appointment that we have with the endocrinologist, like when the first time we went, he's like, we'll continue education. It's something we'll keep giving you. It'll be every time you come, you'll get more. And I thought we'd have to sit for hours every time after we're done with the endocrinologist. And so this was our third time, fourth time there. And he's like, Okay, you're at once he's good, what's nothing else you can go? And I was like, so do I have future time with these diabetes educators? Or is like, what is like the process going forward? He's like, Well, if you have anything that comes up, then we'll address it, whatever comes up at that time, and

Scott Benner 1:05:51
it's over now, go home. And I'm like, good,

Katie 1:05:54
because I'd rather not sit in this room. And I don't know, like, I'd rather learn on my own terms and stuff like that. But I was just like, you know, like, I don't know what they could tell me right now, that would be more helpful than what I've gained from listening for all these hours.

Scott Benner 1:06:09
I was messaging with a lovely woman last night, and I obviously won't, I won't identify them. But adult pregnant type one knows what they're doing, had gotten up to the point where I think the Basal was like close to 40 units a day, right through a pump. And they were using so much insulin, that the doctor said, why don't we abandon the pump and go back to MDI, so you can make these larger injections while while we're you're going through all this, and put the person back on MDI. And if I asked you to guess what they started her basil at, go ahead and guess she was using 40 in the pump. Where did they start a baseline?

Katie 1:06:55
Probably 30 or 20 or 10. It was tagged.

Scott Benner 1:07:00
So so it was 10. And now she's experiencing these spikes at meals, and then getting weird loads that she doesn't understand the loads are clearly from overcompensation with mealtime insulin because she's now using way too much mealtime, insulin and correction insulin because all the Basal is gone. So I just like, you know, she's like, can you please look at this with me? And I, I'll tell you, I have 50 messages right now I haven't answered. But she said she was pregnant. I was like, okay, like, like, I'll take a minute here, right. So I stopped, I read what she said, I looked at her graph. I helped her. The first thing I said was, I'm not a doctor, you know that right? And she's like, Yeah, I'm like, so this is not advice. Like, I'm just going to talk this through with you and see what makes sense. So we chatted about it for a little while back and forth, I don't know, 1015 times. And I And she's like, you're a genius. I'm like, am I I don't think I am you went from 40 units a Basal to 10. I know, this isn't like, but it was interesting. She never really thought about the Basal as a collective. She thought about it as her hourly.

Katie 1:08:03
Oh, he was going from pump to

Scott Benner 1:08:06
Yeah. And so I just was like, take 40 divided by 24. That's about what you were getting an hour. I mean, now you're getting a fracture, I mean, literally 25% of it, you know. So anyway, that's a person who knew what they were doing, and just got bad information from a doctor. And then they were like, I don't understand what's going on. But that happens to everybody is my point. You know, like it's a stark, it's a stark story here because 40 to 10. But same thing, if your little kids getting point, four, and they should be getting point eight that's 50% less than they need. And that stuff happens constantly. That's always happening to people.

Katie 1:08:51
The other thing I find kind of interesting is like I have seen people post like their endocrinologist doesn't want them on a pump because their insulin needs aren't high enough. And I was really thankful that ours that a pump was a good solution because Archer SIBO a one unit of true SIBO was too much for the whole day. For the whole day like I was because of your podcast. I like re engineered our meal plan. Like what high fat foods, protein, the high fat protein meals are we going to eat and tell her pancreas function changes again. And it was glorious, because I didn't have the battle lows at night. We couldn't go less than a unit. So then we just ate all this terrible food that was delicious for us. But I do like here's the way I'm going to solve this problem is by planning these meals and I think we had 10 days of that and then her packers function changed and then a unit was enough again that she wasn't going well without eating fatty foods. But I'd like to thank you for the information on this podcast. I'll just change my meal. Like this is easy enough like here's my other solution I have for this.

Scott Benner 1:09:57
Katie I don't think you gave yourself enough credit at the beginning of all this So, I think you're doing really well. It sounds like where she where she at? What's your agency right now?

Katie 1:10:05
Um, let's see, I wrote this down. We started at 12.1 at diagnosis. Then at our three month, I think we were at 5.4. And then at her most recent one in February, we were at 5.10. Honeymoon happening. So Oh, yeah, it just, it's bonkers. We went on spring break vacation. And she was a solid point four per hour, or, I don't know, 10 days, we had a good run. And then two days before we left for vacation, what was appropriate to keep her steady throughout the day at night was point oh, five?

Scott Benner 1:10:49
No, that's

Katie 1:10:52
great. All right, let's get on a plane and try that for the first time.

Scott Benner 1:10:55
So more importantly, than this one, see, how's your stability? Are you able to keep away the high spikes and the low lows?

Katie 1:11:01
Oh, I was just, yeah, I think like that was it is then I am just fine with like, Oh, this isn't working, we're doing something different. And I don't wait for patterns. I just constantly change stuff and see, according to clarity in the last 90 days, we've had 1% of very high, and we've had less than 1% of very low.

Scott Benner 1:11:25
Wow, good for you. Congratulations, you're off to a great start.

Katie 1:11:30
Well, and I like I hate I hate the honeymoon. I hate that. I don't feel like I could beat them with a smart person and say like, Okay, this is their Basal rate, this is what you do for carbs, you know, just kind of get in the ballpark will be good. I feel like the shift in things is so crazy that even I sometimes I'm like, I'm doing this, I'm gonna give this even though it's like, one time it was six times more than what was appropriate two days ago. And it kept her steady and is what she needed. And I'm like, I can't expect that as somebody else that hasn't lived with us for six months, you know, like, so, I hate the honeymoon. And I'm like, I'm sure there's some upsides of it, but I can't see until we're past it. And then we like, Gee, I didn't realize that was such a big benefit of the honeymoon.

Scott Benner 1:12:15
I'm sure there will be. I'm sure. I'm sure this is gonna happen to you over and over and over again for the rest of your life. Hey, did you consider testing your other child like your trial net? Or do you not think that about what you do what you decide to do?

Katie 1:12:32
We haven't decided yet. Um, my oldest child has more anxiety tendencies. And so I don't know if we we'd have to decide if we find out and she does have markers that would we keep that to ourselves? Is that something? I don't know? I'm not against it. I just haven't taken action on that front yet.

Scott Benner 1:12:51
Does the anxiety come from the fact that when you walk outside bears and bald eagles and bison are trying to kill you or anything like that?

Katie 1:12:58
Okay, there is a bald eagle in our neighborhood. I know you're right on that oh head. My husband was biking some trails and a nearby like wooded area. And he did see like about mine last spring. So there are those, but like, we live in town, but yet we have like we call them city deer. There's like 30 deer that will hang out in our yard. And like you can like try get them off your yard because they're eating your plants and stuff. And they just look at you like they don't care that people around or they'll just

Scott Benner 1:13:30
we have that like yeah, I have a migrate migration path right through my backyard New Jersey where deer just wander through and then eat on my bushes and keep going.

Katie 1:13:40
And we've had wild turkeys so like, we do have that but they're not really.

Scott Benner 1:13:45
I do want to point out though I've never seen a bald eagle eagle or a mountain lion outside. So I think my vibe is right here. You live in a hellscape and you can be killed at any minute by wild animals. Is that correct?

Katie 1:13:57
It's not that common.

Scott Benner 1:13:59
Do you know anyone who's ever been mauled by an eagle? No. run over by a bison or bison still alive? Am I making something up?

Katie 1:14:08
They are super aggressive. Yes. Yeah. They are still like,

Scott Benner 1:14:13
Okay, well. I don't know. How'd you end up? They

Katie 1:14:16
don't they don't like wrong for you, Leo. They're all caged or they don't. It's probably the better word.

Scott Benner 1:14:22
Oh, they live on like, preserves and things like that.

Katie 1:14:25
Yeah, that's like one of the features of our town is you can go see the herd and feed them and

Scott Benner 1:14:32
they won't run your car over.

Katie 1:14:34
Well, you don't drive with them like they know I understand you're on the outside of the fence. Yeah, we're not Yellowstone right? They like stop traffic and get the wait for them to leisurely walk past and stuff like

Scott Benner 1:14:45
that. Leave the park and I thought I love that show.

Katie 1:14:49
Okay, I agree. The show was great, too.

Scott Benner 1:14:52
You made us the park and I was like, I really love that show. I wonder when it's coming back. That was I watched 1883 So I enjoyed that very much. I love westerns.

Katie 1:15:03
We haven't watched 1883 yet, maybe.

Scott Benner 1:15:06
Let's see, I really enjoyed it. I'm just saying there's my there's Scott's pic of the day, which is not not a segment where I don't do anything like that. All right, well, is there anything we haven't talked about that we should have?

Katie 1:15:17
Oh, I could talk all day long. But I don't know. It's just

Scott Benner 1:15:22
me on a slow day, do you have one more thing you want to talk about?

Katie 1:15:27
Well, I just, I don't know, I just feel like I, I feel really fortunate that were diagnosed when we were that we never managed our diabetes differently. So I never know when to think differently about any of it. But I just like to encourage those newly diagnosed people like it is gonna suck, it's going to be hard. And it just straight up takes time before you can start to get things sorted out. And sometimes you swing and you miss greatly. Like we got diagnosed about two or three weeks before school started. So then we had to do a transition into the school setting. And there's no nurse at the school that my kids go to. And so at first when I heard you texting about diabetes, I'm like, that sounds so time consuming. And that sounds awful. And then I was like, nope, Scott's right. Texting is definitely the way to go. And it has gained us so much freedom for her to go and do stuff with friends. But texting with an eight year old who had never had technology before, has its own set of challenges, like punctuation.

Scott Benner 1:16:32
can't follow what they're saying.

Katie 1:16:34
Oh my gosh, like one time she was just going little running around at recess, and I was like, You need to eat some fruit snacks, like eat three of them. Now, it she types back now and I'm like, Oh, I'm so proud of her. She must have had fruit snacks in her pocket or in her little sack or her little phone thing. I'm like, way to go. She I love my daughter.

Scott Benner 1:16:58
But she meant the question mark. Right. She thought about now that she was like now like, Should I do it now? Or she question mark? Yeah. Let me let me tell you something about how Arden breaks my balls through a texting, okay, I and she's just doing it for fun. If I have a typo, or if you know the the phone changes a word or something like that. It could be a completely cogent sentence with one word out that anyone with half an IQ point could read and fill in the blank on it. And she'll respond. What? But she's just messing with me. I know she is. So then I then I read retype it. And I fixed the word and she just Oh, yeah, I just did that. There's no, you know what I mean? Like, I know she's messing with me, Katie, I know she is.

Katie 1:17:46
I think so then we've picked up on. I know she's at school, and she can't respond within 20 seconds every time. Like, if you see it, just send me back a que. And then I'll get on with my life and stop wondering if you're doing something about our problem. So then, if she doesn't respond, like, sometimes I give it five minutes, I'll start doing like her name, I'll send an E and then an M, and then an M, and then an A, and then she'll start to respond. So her thing she does back to me is she'll be like, hey, somebody brought cupcakes for school lunch to share, can I have one? And literally like, it'll just come through my screen. And I know I'm a slow reader, but I'm still reading the first text and then she's doing em. Oh, I'm in three separate texts, because I'm not responding to her past would not however this works.

Scott Benner 1:18:38
I would be lying if I said that's never happened to me. So she's just like, Oh, finally I can I can screw back with this guy. I will say this earlier, when you said you didn't think texting was a good idea. And then you realize that was y'all should just listen to me. I'm usually right about this stuff. I I'm half teasing. And I'm half want you to know that I don't just jump on the podcast willy nilly and start saying stuff. You know what I mean? Like, I'm not, you know, I didn't I didn't think texting diabetes, then get in front of this microphone and say it the first time we were doing it for a year before I ever shared with anybody that I thought it was a valuable idea. Like I try very hard to make sure the things I say here are, you know, or at least tested through our family. You know, but having said that, I get the you know, I've heard people say I don't want a young kid to have a phone, or you know, it feels I think that I think it's possible that if you hear me talk about a number of things one time, you would think, god that sounds like so much effort. But I think you said something earlier that I agree with completely. And the idea is that just sort of like a little bit of effort now saves a lot of time later because it's specifically with listening to the show to begin with. I hear that from people sometimes. They say, oh, there's so many episodes I I don't know where to start. I'm like, I don't care. Just start somewhere here. Mount Everest. Yeah, obviously. Yeah. Oh, an interview I did seven years ago with a mother of a woman who was on Mount Everest during an avalanche. And she had diabetes, the person I was talking to didn't even have diabetes. I know, obviously, the clear starting point. Yeah, the absolute place to start for sure. You got that? 100%. Right. K. But you know, we've done put a lot of effort into making lists. I don't know if you're in Facebook, in the Facebook group right now, Isabel is helping me she's terrific. She put like the series together on lists and stuff that people can share and keep she's, she would say to me, like, why have you never thought to do this. And I was like, I mean, I have, but I don't have time. You know, like, I have to keep making the podcast. So I a lot of the things that make sense to do, like I don't do a great job with social media wouldn't be that hard to do literally don't have enough time to do it. You know, I'm going to record this show. I'm going to probably record eight hours of content this week, spread out over five episodes, and I'm going to edit five hours, spread out over four episodes and put it back up for you and keep going. I just don't have time. You know. So that's been wonderful having lists, but But back to the original point. It's this idea of, I don't have time to learn about it, I'm too busy doing it. And that makes sense sometimes. But when it comes to diabetes, it doesn't make sense. If you can't afford not to find out the right way to do it. Because you'll spend your whole life torturing yourself, you know, having like half knowledge or not quite understanding, it's better to just carve out some time now at least get some of this stuff like straight in your head. And then you can start making more purposeful decisions moving forward. And I think that's how eventually you get to the point where it is 1130 in the morning, I haven't looked at Arden's blood sugar yet today. Like I've literally not I've been up since seven o'clock, I have not looked at our blood sugar today. And I don't I can right now, but hold on a second.

Katie 1:22:06
I'm definitely looking forward to Lupe or that Omnipod five. That'll be amazing.

Scott Benner 1:22:13
Right now, and Arjun is also doing a lot more on her own right now. And so all of that is just, you know, it's part of the growth process. You know, her blood sugar has been pretty good all day. If she had left the school, and let's see what happened here, she headed off to school. I have to get up a graph where I can see back far enough. So overnight. She's like, 105, overnight. No, not overnight. On a second overnight, she was, let's say, 99. It's six o'clock, 99, seven o'clock. Anyone can see where she woke up, because she got a little feet on the floor went from 94 to 125. In about an hour, she's back down, under 100 starts to drift around nine o'clock. 120 or so the algorithms working hard to stop her. And she just Bolus for food. So she Bolus for food at like 135. So we'll see what happens. You know what I mean? Like it's just, I don't know, like it eventually. My point is, is that you'll you'll know so much about what's happening, that it won't, it won't encumbered your entire existence. But it's, it's always going to if you don't know what you're doing, I guess.

Katie 1:23:33
Yeah, I agree with that. Yeah. So just kind of wait, I think the other thing from listening to all the episodes that I gained, like, before I listened to them, I was like I'm gonna give my child the skills and the ability and that she'll be able to do this on her own. Before I learned or listen to things was what I thought was best for her. But after listening to you manage Arden, and also to people who had diabetes, I realized what a gift it is for me not to expect that of her and that, obviously, she's going to deal with this the rest of her life. And so I will know that she's kind of getting up, I'm going to Pre-Bolus for breakfast so that she can just get up and eat it. Like she knows that we Pre-Bolus should Pre-Bolus was her lunch. But why do I need her to experience that Pre-Bolus For breakfast like so I've taken on, if I'm around her, I will help her do stuff, which is the beautiful part about Omni pod. I don't have to go right next to her because there's a tube connected to her, you know, I am able to help manage her and lift this burden from her as long as she's in my household because that is something that either she has to find a significant other that's willing to help her or something that she will just have to bear that total burden all the time. And I think like I get tired of it. And I'm not even doing it all the time either. My husband is wonderful at helping me and I'm like why I would I expect this of my kid now, to do it all when, between my husband and I were just like, it's still plenty to do. And so I'm really glad that that listening to all these podcasts has shifted my way of thinking about that. And that was the last endocrinologist appointment. He was like, does she know what is going on? Do you have her do it all and I'm like, I don't want her to do it all I do have her. She makes pump settings. And you know, like, she enter stuff in her pump, every everything that happens at school she's taken care of, but I said, I don't see any reason for me not to just give her that help. While she's at her house. And she hears my husband and I. I mean, we're only six months into it. So there's sometimes we're like, I don't know, what should we do is suffer, how much should we do up front? So like, she still hears us talk about it. And she still understands like, doughnuts, she's like, Okay, let's start that Pre-Bolus Before we head to the store for doughnuts, and then she realizes like, Oh, we're eating chicken and brown rice, we better start that now that we're eating like she, I think is gaining this because it is something that we talked about in our family. But I think that would be something I would also really missed out on by not listening to all these podcasts is like, what? Why not take this burden away from her until she is older and do as much as you possibly can.

Scott Benner 1:26:15
Katie, would you do something for me? If you still like me in two years, and I'm still making a podcast? Would you come back on please? Oh, I love it. Okay, and I'm sorry to set it out so far in the future. But

Katie 1:26:27
how's that any different than this appointment?

Scott Benner 1:26:30
Well know that that is the truth right now, if you booked today, your booking in December. So that's April, May, June, July, August, right? Hold on April, March, April, May, June, July, August, September, October, November. Yeah, you're nine months to get an appointment right now. And then to record and then you don't go up for? I guess you're making a good point. It takes about 15 months to get on the podcast, if you

Katie 1:26:53
will two years from now, like are we just gonna be optimistic?

Scott Benner 1:26:56
Well, if I was you. Next summer, I'd make an appointment. But But the reason I'm saying that is, you're you've bought in to how I do this. And you're right in the beginning. And I would love to hear back from you in a couple of years, and see how it went. Like seriously, like, whether you come back on and be like, Scott, I stopped doing what you said a long time ago, or this is how we adapted it, or Oh, my God, it's still working. This is the greatest thing ever, whatever the answer is, I'd like to know what it is. I don't even care what it is. I just want to know, I want to feel your trajectory a little bit.

Katie 1:27:32
Well, good, because I mean, we are fresh, and I hear people have managed us a long time. And I know like burnout is totally possible. Like, it's even nice to know, all the options that possibly could happen. Like, there's a strong likelihood that at some point is just not going to care because she's a teenager, and I just know that, you know, I don't know, just the value, like I really want to encourage everybody. You're defining diabetes, your Pro Tip series. Amazing, great. But I think people underestimate the value to all the other episodes that are there too, because there's something from every single one of them, especially not being a diabetic person that I think I can have more empathy, I can have a better idea understanding like, why wouldn't you want to understand your child or somebody you love that's going through this better? You don't

Scott Benner 1:28:21
want to miss the conversations, honestly, I mean, the point to dot management stuff, I think is listen, I'm, I'm biased. But I think the pointed management stuff in this podcast is some of the best information available for people using insulin. But I think the conversations are where the deeper understanding comes from. Like, so. I'm glad it struck you that way. I'm very happy that you like it. All right, Katie, this is it. You gotta go. I'm having too much fun talking to you. It's over now. Okay. By the way, who knows, two years from now you might be like, so what happened? Scott was my husband. I couldn't take him anymore. I tied a fish to his back and sent him outside and a bald eagle carried him away. And that's it. That's how we handled it.

Katie 1:29:10
I'm the more outdoorsy person.

Scott Benner 1:29:13
Well, that's Well, he'll have less of a chance then again, attack. Like

Katie 1:29:18
I think it's I don't know, have you ever gone ice fishing before?

Scott Benner 1:29:23
Although you mean I didn't mean to laugh right into the microphone. No, God no. I I might cut off one of my toes before doing that. You're you're combining a bunch of stuff. I don't like the cold ice water that I could fall into and then drop. Being outside in the cold. I'm not good with that either. People drinking beer also not good for me. Exam. I don't have to drink beer to ice fish but they'll all be drunk and then who am I going to talk to That's my biggest problem with drinking is that people lose the ability to have like deep conversations. I'm very boring. I love talking about things. Like at length. I don't I don't I like hearing what people think. And, you know, I mean, it's already tough. Katie, I don't know if you know this or not. But when you put boys together in a group, basically, the conversation gets boiled down to cars, boobs and sports. So that I would say, why don't you just hang out with more women? Well, because you guys don't talk about boobs enough.

Katie 1:30:30
Then stop complaining about the people you hang out with.

Scott Benner 1:30:33
I mean, not in the problem. You don't talk about it in a fun way, I guess is what I guess is what I'm saying. But no, no, I mean, it. You know, I don't know. Ice fishing. That's what we were talking about. Oh, god. No, I don't. Yeah, go ahead. Make your point though. I'm sorry.

Katie 1:30:48
I was gonna say like, it'd be more likely that like he'd fall like, a friend invited me to go spear phishing. Have you heard about this? Okay, you got on the ice and you make a gigantic hole. And then you throw a spear at the fish instead of using like a fishing line and learn. Oh, my God. Like, there's a way bigger chance that I'll like die from slipping into. Like,

Scott Benner 1:31:11
I feel like you're telling me very cool. I feel like you're telling me a story from 3000 BC right now.

Katie 1:31:17
I mean, like you bring in a heater it gets wire, but like it's, I mean, we have experiences here. But I mean, I think you're like I incident seems way more likely than a bear attack.

Scott Benner 1:31:29
I say you say that right till the bear gacha. And then what are you gonna do? Because there's nowhere to run. You're on ice. Your little fetal slip?

Katie 1:31:37
Yeah, well, yeah, it is crazy.

Scott Benner 1:31:39
I honestly wish I had more experience in places like where you live? I think it would be. It would be lovely to know more about stuff like that. And, and to be able to see it my, my favorite, absolute favorite vacation I was ever on was at Yosemite. And we stayed there for like a week and lived in a cabin and just went out in the park every day. It remains my favorite vacation. So I might be foolish, a little bit. You know what I mean?

Katie 1:32:07
But I feel like the nice thing about you could come in experience winter for a week, and then you can leave. And then you can say like, Well, that was neat. And then you don't have to live in it for like six months. You know,

Scott Benner 1:32:20
hey, I'm gonna tell you one last little story before I let you go. Okay, and there's going to be a lot of bleeping here at the end. I took the garbage out recently, Sunday nights when my garbage goes down to the end of the street. I'm gonna say it's about a 90 foot walk from my house. Okay. It was in the 40s, the temperature the 40s. And this is me walking down the driveway. And I don't mean to offend anybody who's listening. I have the cat in my hand and I'm walking and here's what I said. I'm so cold. I swear to god. I'm so cold. I don't want to be cold. I hate being cold. I'm a baby. I don't want to be cold.

Katie 1:33:03
So right now we're like if it is 40 like we open up our windows, it's time for fresh air like oh my point

Scott Benner 1:33:09
I'm Katie, I'm not cut out for it is what I'm saying. I did. Good.

Katie 1:33:13
This winter, we had like a warmer day where it rained. Which do you think warmer weather is good, but no and winter, you want it cold? Because it rained. And then it froze like 20 below afterwards. And I literally like our neighborhood isn't like a main neighborhood. So I could have put on like ice skates and skated, like from one house to the next on the road. That's how like, awful it can be. Again,

Scott Benner 1:33:39
you might as well be the Flintstones to me. Okay, so that's enough. I we're done with us now. All right, thank you so much for being on the show.

Katie 1:33:47
Oh, you're welcome. Thank you for having me. And thank you for every single episode that you put up in all the back time. I don't think people realize how much time goes into the after. After the recordings and stuff like that I appreciate that time you've dedicated towards this is just amazing.

Scott Benner 1:34:05
Well, thank you I want to be clear, I do get paid for the ads. But I it is a lot of work. I I work harder at this than I've ever had anything else in my life. So I think at this point now I'm up to about 65 hours a week on the podcast. And and I really do love it actually. So I'm not complaining at all I just want to be clear, I am being compensated. So nobody needs to feel bad. Now if you stopped clicking on the links for the sponsors, and they go away, you're not getting this podcast anymore, or I gotta figure out another way to pay for it one way or the other. But

Katie 1:34:38
I'm saying like just even go and invest in these companies, you know? Well, that doesn't help me as much Katie but I hear Okay, nevermind. Don't invest in these wonderful companies. Just click on the ads.

Scott Benner 1:34:48
Click on the ads. If here's how I always put it to people being serious. If you need it. I'd appreciate it if you use my link. I don't want you to go in and buying an insulin pump because you feel like you want to support the podcast I mean that Be kind of half insane. If you get there and you'll like it on the pod, use my link, if you want to Dexcom use my link, you know, I mean, you're getting the hypopyon use my link, it's a huge help it's advertising, it's super simple. If people use the links, and the advertisers see this podcast as a valuable way to reach their customers, then next year, they'll buy ads again, and I will record every day as much as I can, and bring you as much as I possibly can. And it gives me the autonomy to do things that you wouldn't see as a big deal. But like, even like the defining thyroid series, as an example, that's not everybody listening to this podcast doesn't have a thyroid problem. But it's really important information. But I take a hit on downloads by putting up information that not everybody needs. That's not something I could do if the podcast wasn't supported so well. So I can kind of like Like, right now I'm, I'm thinking about defining celiac next, which again, will not cover everybody, but I still think is incredibly valuable. Thinking about how to get people on to talk about like supplements and supplementation that might be valuable, like vitamin D, and things like that, that will help people. That's not something everybody's gonna jive with. But if you guys keep clicking on the links, then I get to keep kind of expanding, like the encyclopedic nature of the podcast. And I think that's really important. Honestly, I think we need to get away from the same five I mean, to go back an hour ago, the same five stories you see pop up on diabetes blogs, and really dig into some stuff, you know, and this is how you This is how you get the autonomy to do that. So I really appreciate it. Thank you very much. It was nice you to to be so kind about the show. I really appreciate it.

Katie 1:36:46
Man a problem

Scott Benner 1:36:54
first of all, let's thank Katie for coming on the show and having this great conversation. Thank you, Katie. And then we're gonna thank touched by type one and remind you to go to touch by type one.org. And of course, I'm the pod makers have the Omni pod five and the Omni pod dash. I appreciate you buying the advertising. The five guests today. Omni pod.com forward slash juicebox to find out about the Omni pod automated insulin delivery system that they call Omni pod five. And to learn more about the Omnipod dash thanks so much for listening. I'll be back very soon with another episode of The Juicebox Podcast.