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Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends, and welcome to Episode 551 of the Juicebox Podcast. Do you guys like this opening? Or should I go to something else? Friends Hello, hello people. Yo, what's up? It's got now

on today's show, Melanie is here. Melanie has a husband with Type One Diabetes and a child with Type One Diabetes. And we are going to talk all about it. Please remember while you're listening that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your healthcare plan or becoming bold with insulin. There's a little bit of music left here. So I want to remind you that there's a private Facebook page for the podcast. It's called Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes. It's private so that you can go in there and chat with people about life with Type One Diabetes without prying eyes. There are over 15,000 members right now. And it is an incredibly active page. So if you're just looking for camaraderie, or answers, there's plenty of people in there who might be able to help and they're just like you, they're listeners of the podcast Juicebox Podcast, type one diabetes. There's also a public page called bold with insulin, and I'm on Instagram at Juicebox Podcast.

Today, the podcast is sponsored by Omni pod makers of the Omni pod dash and the Omni pod promise, which I will tell you about a little later. But let's just say this, you may be eligible for a free 30 day trial of the on the pod dash find out it on the pod.com forward slash juice box. The show is also brought to you today by the Dexcom g six continuous glucose monitor. And that you'll learn more about and get started with@dexcom.com forward slash juicebox I don't know which one of my URLs is the favorite to say, but I do like the way dexcom.com Oh, my voice just grabbed there. We'll do it again. dexcom.com forward slash I the way it bounces back and forth. dexcom.com forward slash I think it's the calm, calm thing. And I'm overly simplistic. So, but I mean, there's nothing wrong with omnipod.com forward slash juicebox. I'm just saying Dexcom calm Anyway, here we go. Melanie.

Melanie 2:42
I'm Melanie. I live in Utah, but I was born and raised in Virginia. I have a husband and a son that are type one.

Scott Benner 2:52
Right? You didn't say your last name, which you don't need to but I'm just gonna say that whenever I see your name pop up on my schedule. It feels like you were named by like Stanley or a Marvel writers.

Melanie 3:04
Well, I mean, I married into the name so my maiden name is Jones which is really easy and plain but yes I am when I started dating my husband and he said his last name was Mellon teen I was like, Oh, this is not going to be great. This guy

Scott Benner 3:19
you could easily be spider man's girlfriend with a name like that. That's all I'm saying. I'll take it that way. Do you like that? Boy? That's the spider man now.

Melanie 3:27
Um, no, I like Joey Maguire like the original one.

Scott Benner 3:33
Oh, Tobey Maguire.

Melanie 3:34
Tobey Maguire all the way.

Scott Benner 3:35
Don't worry. Yeah. Could you shy right? Anybody under 20 just now. She's so wrong.

Melanie 3:42
I know. Oh, and all of my children. I'm so wrong about that, too. But yeah,

Scott Benner 3:47
I stood in a line with art and a couple of years ago for hours, so she could meet the kid who's Spider Man right now.

Melanie 3:56
Which I wish I could say his name, but I can't remember top

Scott Benner 4:00
my head. It's slipping for me off the top of my head. But I'm gonna just tell you that the countless 1000s of girls that were there for that it was in a giant auditorium. And the line just snaked around forever. And it was like you were next. You went in got next to him through your best pose on he was like, thank you and you were like, shoved right out the back of the thing. It was fascinating. And she was still like, overwhelmed with all the things she thought she said and didn't say and I was like, the whole thing took eight seconds. Like what are you talking? Anyway, at one point during this conversation, his name will pop into my head.

Melanie 4:42
Yeah, or maybe mine. My kids are gonna be super disappointed in me,

Scott Benner 4:45
but you can think of it off the bat. I can picture him. I know he's British. That's where I that's where I'm stuck. It'll come to me. Anyway. Um, so you don't have type one. Is it just the three person families that you Your child, your husband, are there more kids?

Melanie 5:03
There's a bunch more. Okay. So,

Scott Benner 5:06
did you come to me through the secret underground railroad? that I have in Utah?

Melanie 5:12
Yeah, I must have.

Scott Benner 5:15
The show is so incredibly popular in Utah and I, I don't understand. But uh, okay, so who was? Well, I guess let's start here. How long did you get married?

Melanie 5:31
I've been married 27 years.

Scott Benner 5:34
27 years. And when was your husband diagnosed?

Melanie 5:40

2019. So just barely. Like, we're, he was diagnosed when he was 48.

Scott Benner 5:47
She got remarried like 25 years before he was diagnosed. Yeah.

Melanie 5:50
Which I'm not sure you've interviewed a wife yet? Who? Yeah, was married so long. And then had their husband?

Scott Benner 6:00
Yeah, yeah. That's, it's really interesting. Because I assume that after 25 years, you feel like you're on the back nine already. Like you just sort of feel like you're gonna, your kids are gonna get a little older and you'll retire. Yeah,

Melanie 6:14
yeah. I mean, we had a lot of teenagers at the time. I mean, we we still have a lot of team and they just keep coming. So I have seven children a lot. So um, yeah, so we had a lot. We were in like, while we still are the hard part, I would say, of raising kids and being married. And then, um, yeah, he had all of the classic diabetes symptoms, but nowhere ran in any way. I mean, it runs in my family huge. I have an uncle who has it. And I had a cousin who has had it, and then it's on my dad's side, too. So but never, that was never really on our radar. And then the typical story, he was diagnosed with Type two, wrongly, four or five years ago, and then change his diet started exercising lost weight. And then when he went back to the doctor, they were like, you're done with diabetes. Like, you're good, you're healthy. And then he went just to a random appointment, like, Why can I think of the name of like a GP, your general? Right? Yeah, just check out my oldest son wanted to go. And so he was like, well, let's make an appointment, we'll go together. And he went, and he would, he had was concerned enough about the fact that he'd been pre diabetic before. And type two or whatever, that he went in fasting and said, I want to glucose number. And they ran it. And it called him and said, So did you eat a box of doughnuts on the way here? And he said, No, I just, I actually came in fasting because I wanted an accurate number. This can't be right. Let's, why don't you come in again, and make sure you're fasting. And when they when he went out? Again? I think he was over 500. And they called him and said, how sick are you? Like, are you so sick right now? Do you need to go to the ER, right? And he was like, What are you talking about? I feel great. I feel like I do every day.

Scott Benner 8:39
So it seems like First of all, I have to say I would not be a good doctor, because I found myself thinking I would have just asked if his pancreas was tired because you have seven kids. But seriously, I but just in general, I'd be like, oh, maybe you're just tired. But if he came in type two, four or five years ago, did he have weight to lose?

Melanie 9:01
So I would say then he did maybe a little have a little bit of any wasn't super fit, he wasn't really exercising a lot and he hits so he had just changed jobs and his stress level was off the charts at that time too. So there were lots of things going on with him when that happened. And so this was a different doctor that he saw the second time that maybe the first doctor would have put it together but there was never even a follow up and it was probably at least three years between those two like when he'd seen a doctor last and then saw this doctor

Scott Benner 9:41
when you say he changed jobs. Did you mean he? I'm sorry. I feel like his job is having sex with you and then watching you have a baby. But no, I'm so

Melanie 9:52
trying to think how old our youngest was then. But yeah, no, he Yeah. changed his his job.

Scott Benner 10:00
There's a lot going on in his life. And this happens. He diets down a little bit and then the doctor is like, Hey, you your blood sugar was high. I said to you, you should lose weight. You lost weight. This is over now, but he was probably just honeymooning on and off. I went.

Melanie 10:15
Oh, yeah, for sure. And he, I mean, he went mostly keto, which wasn't called that then. But what whatever.

Scott Benner 10:22
They call that low carb back then. Yeah, right. Just

Melanie 10:24
meat. Right. Atkins probably was more

Scott Benner 10:29
low carb for people who don't like broccoli is how I always thought.

Melanie 10:33
Right? Yeah. So he, I mean, I probably because he changed his diet, and he was honeymooning, it all just kind of

Scott Benner 10:42
blurred together. Yeah. And he felt Okay.

Melanie 10:46
Yes, he took my foreman for probably six months. He has an iron stomach, he can eat anything. So where Metformin normally makes people really sick and not feel? Well, he was fine on it. And I'm sure that helped to I guess, I mean, I don't know there's differing opinions on that right on other Metformin will actually help anyone with type one?

Scott Benner 11:11
Well, why not? What I do know is that Metformin is used off label for weight loss by some doctor. Oh, so there's that, I guess, value there if he was looking to lose weight. Okay, so So after that happens after he's kind of given a clean bill of health from his type two diabetes, how long does it take for him to realize he's not okay.

Melanie 11:32
I, he really didn't see a doctor again for probably three years. And to be 100% honest, he didn't go because he didn't feel good. He went because my son wanted to go. And he was like, Well, I can get him and if I go,

Scott Benner 11:45
Yeah, he was just so

Melanie 11:47
he just went, yeah, yeah. And so yeah, and that's funny, because I would say that I said to him before he went, you're going to be diabetic again. And he thought I was crazy. And I said, you're drinking a ton. And not alcohol, but always drinking liquid. Like he would sit at a dinner and drink an entire two liter bottle.

Scott Benner 12:12
Because he was so and he didn't notice that as odd.

Melanie 12:15
No, he just thinks that social for him. And he he he is a big drinker in general. Like he drinks a lot of liquid in a day. Gotcha. More than most, but you saw it. Yeah, it was, it was an extreme that I thought, and I'm now looking back, I can see all of the type one symptoms. But I didn't know then that that's why he was acting the way that he was acting. So if that makes sense. It

Scott Benner 12:48
does. But I want to know how he was acting.

Melanie 12:51
Okay, so well. Yeah. I mean, I think it's important. It's an important story, actually. And we do need to talk about how the doctor almost killed him when they were when he was diagnosed. But it was hard. marriage was hard, right that like for probably, really, for two years. But I could I can even pin it back to when he was diagnosed with Type two. And then kind of back and forth. And, and we had older kids and teenagers that were doing things that were stressful and hard. So marriage was hard, then anyway, but um, some of those classic symptoms of just not being able to remember in your brain being foggy, and you just not not really being all the way there. I mean, they really do say, when your blood sugar's high, or when your blood sugar's low, that it's like you're drunk, like your brain doesn't work the same way. Is it the same way? Right. It's it's,

Scott Benner 13:57
we are altered. Well, I mean, have you ever heard me say, Have you ever heard me say that I think that one of the one of the very important reasons that you should work on keeping your blood sugar in a stable lower range is because you get to then be who you're supposed to be, you know, if you don't recognize that, hey, that's why I shared with people how out of whack I was when my iron was really low. Because I was difficult to be around. Like I just I was very short tempered. And things that just don't make a person upset would make me upset is the tiniest thing. And I was just like 100 miles an hour in one direction. Like it was the most important thing in the world. And we had to get it fixed then you know, or whatever it was, or I just was, it was unbalanced. And you could come off like an asshole. Like you really could like for somebody just from the outside. They could just look at you and go, Oh, interesting. Melanie's husband's sort of turned into a jerk. And then that's, you know, and you don't recognize it because it's happening to you. It happens to you in the beginning slowly enough that you don't see it. It's not like breaking a bone. You can't just go, Wow, My arm hurts now something must be wrong. It just happens so slowly, you know.

Melanie 15:06
But yeah, and I would say, I mean, I think he had his jerk moments like, but I would say more it was that he was foggy all the time. So he couldn't remember that there was an appointment, or he couldn't remember what he was supposed to do that day to help me with the kids or he couldn't. And, and I would have to remind him over and over and over again about things and he would get so mad at me like when he would keep asking, and I would keep answering. I'm like, Why do I have to tell him so many times? And he just thought it was normal, like, well, I'm working, I work full time. And I we have all these kids. And I just can't remember. But I was like, we've been married a long time. And you, you could remember before now, I felt like I could count on you before now. And right now I feel like I can't count on you. Which, when you have that many kids and are going through all that. You need to feel that way. Yeah, right.

Scott Benner 16:02
I don't believe this is germane to the story. But just because like it keeps coming up in my head. What are the age ranges of your children? Like what's your youngest and oldest right now?

Melanie 16:09
So right now my youngest is nine, and my oldest will be 22 in June. So he's 21.

Scott Benner 16:15
That's not even that big of a gap.

Melanie 16:18
Yeah, they're all two years apart, except I have a set of twins that are number two and three. And then the last two are four years apart. So

Scott Benner 16:28
so the nine talents then there's 913, some twins, the middle, the older ones. I gotcha. All right. I think I didn't count two of them when I was just doing that. But there's that's cool. And you're okay, make your uterus didn't fall out or anything like that. Everything's fine on your

Melanie 16:42
own. Everything is fine. on my end, I'm very healthy.

Scott Benner 16:45
I also want people to listening to know that I didn't say on your end as upon, it just came out.

Sorry. Okay. So he's like that, blah, blah, blah. You notice it, but you notice that his behavior?

Melanie 17:03
Yeah, I didn't. I didn't. I definitely didn't connect it. Right.

Scott Benner 17:06
There's no reason you would, right. Yeah. But yeah, but now you're saying hindsight, knowing more about type one diabetes, it's all completely obvious.

Melanie 17:15
Yeah. Well, and how how much he changed after diagnosis, and then getting his blood sugar in a reasonable range?

Scott Benner 17:25
Yeah, not foggy anymore. able to keep up?

Melanie 17:28
Yeah, just Yeah, like more reasonable, like more like my partner like he was before.

Scott Benner 17:34
So now if he doesn't do something that you expect him to do, you can just yell at him?

Melanie 17:38
Well, I do often question his blood sugar.

Scott Benner 17:43
You find yourself in the same position as a parent does. Where I know I have said to Arden in the past, we're going to test your blood sugar. And if it's not lower, high, you're in trouble.

Melanie 17:54
A little bit. There's a little bit of that. Yeah. Like, are you acting like this? Because your blood sugar's sunny or just not really mad? Are you really Yeah.

Scott Benner 18:03
Well, it's interesting, too. Because after I can tell you from my own personal experiences that after this, something like this happens to you, and then it's found out and understood. The next time you actually are legitimately upset or tired, then people look at you like, Oh, is this the thing again? Or, you know, or is he just tired? Or, like, there's sometimes like, I'll like, raise my voice. I'm like, I want everyone to know, I'm fine. This is just anger. It brings everything into question for a while. So he's diagnosed for for certain 2019

Melanie 18:39
is July of 2019. Yes, but well, so he was diagnosed in type two, but they looked at it and said, You don't look like a type two, because this time, he lost weight. Okay, so he did the typical like, he so he lost probably 15 pounds before he went in, but he had started working out so he attributed it to this. Great, yeah, yeah, lifting weights that he was doing. And I was like, that was really fast. Wait.

Scott Benner 19:13
No one gets into shape in seven days.

Melanie 19:16
Men do have an easier time, I will say but I was like, that is really fast,

Scott Benner 19:20
right? Even too fast for that. Okay. So 2019 he goes back to the doctor with a problem. They hit him with the type two again.

Melanie 19:29
Yeah, but they looked at him and said, we really probably don't think you're type two. Let's do the test to see if you're type one.

Scott Benner 19:36
So they say it just like it's a knee jerk reaction, but at least they followed through with the antibody testing.

Melanie 19:42
Yeah, they did. And he, he went to an endocrinologist but in the meantime, they prescribed Lantus for him a long acting, okay. And they send him well, so they prescribed it. But she said to him, I usually have a sample pack. needle here, but I don't have one today. So basically, it's like a pen and you put a needle on the end and you grab your stomach. And I mean, really, honestly, that was the most he was taught how to give himself a shot. Wow. Was this random? And, and then she prescribed 40 units of long acting insulin for him to give to himself at night before he went to bed.

Scott Benner 20:26
Let's hold on a second. Yeah,

Melanie 20:28
uh huh.

Scott Benner 20:31
Does he weigh like 250 pounds?

Melanie 20:34
Um, no, no, I'm pretty sure he didn't even wait 200 pounds at a time. And so I think he, he ordered a meter. I mean, it was all very like scattered supposed to do this. But we didn't really, I mean, the most I really knew about diabetes was my uncle had it, that no one ever gets it when they're that old. So he kept saying, I think I must be type one. They're testing me for it. And I kept rolling my eyes and saying, You're not type one. No one gets diagnosed with type one this late in life. Like that doesn't make sense. And I mean, now I can look back and go Yeah, with that number. Of course you were and with. But anyway, oh,

Scott Benner 21:15
yeah. No, I mean, unless you have my job. Like I've, I believe I've interviewed someone at every age range, probably up to like, 64. Yeah, they've been diagnosed with type one. So crazy. Now, it just, you know, it's not what, it's not thought of the same anymore. But it really does. marketing works, I guess, you know, calling it juvenile diabetes for so long. Has it etched into the minds of a number of generations like it's going to take, it's going to take more generations for people to grow up with like, Oh, I remember that, like my mom was diagnosed at 48. And then no one will think of it that way anymore. But it'll take a lot of time. So yeah. So he went home and gave himself 40 years before he went to bed. Well, so he

Melanie 21:57
was kind of slow about the whole thing, because I think his test results haven't come back yet to say for sure he was type one. And so he kind of thought I can just change my diet. And it will fix it. Yeah. But he was testing his blood sugar. And it wasn't fixing it. And so he went and picked up the prescription brought it home. And it probably been a week, maybe since she prescribed it. And of course, he's taking Metformin and all the things that they prescribe for type twos and and he's standing in the bathroom about ready to give himself the shot. And I'm like, Kate, I don't understand insulin at all. What What if I mean, and you just have these vague understandings, right. So I'm like, I think you can pass out and have a seizure, like, what if I, what if something happens? And he was like, we can just give me juice? And I'm like, we don't have juice we don't? And how do I know when and how much and, and I have a sister who's a nurse, and my best friend is a surgical PA. And I said to him, we can call one or the other of those women and ask them. One, whether 40 units seems right, because the pen only holds 200 or something. And I was like that is a lot of that pin up giving yourself at one time.

Scott Benner 23:23
It's an interesting feeling like yeah, like what this penalty last five days like that. Yeah. Is that how that works,

Melanie 23:29
and you've never taken insulin ever in your life. And that's the amount that you're supposed to take, like, all those things just seemed.

Scott Benner 23:38
So I want to pick this apart for a second. So just for context, is your husband the kind of guy that would jump off a zip line, go bungee jumping or try heroin for fun? Is he any?

Melanie 23:48
Probably got the heroin, but he Yes. He's been bungee jumping. He's done all yeah.

Scott Benner 23:53
So there's no mechanism in his brain to go, don't do this. Somebody said it. So it'll work like, you know, when you like when you get to the rain forest and the zip lines going through. I'm a person who looks at that and goes, Well, I'm not getting on that. Because I don't know anything about the people who put this up or what if I fall here and like, I don't do that. I go, No, no, thank you or I watch 1000 people do it first and then I go, Okay, now I'll try it. So he had that vibe. You were you were women listening or just like saying men would just be dead without us. And it's a you were smart enough. They got to pick through the details of it. But I think what's most important is that I don't believe this is an incredibly uncommon story.

Melanie 24:36
No, I don't, I don't think it is, either.

Scott Benner 24:39
I don't and now knowing as much as you know about type one diabetes, it is a fascinating statement that someone was like, here's this thing, vaguely This is how it works. Let me just randomly pick a number out of the air go give this out to yourself before you go to bed. So something happens while you're sleeping you could just drift off and

Melanie 24:58
well I definitely would have woken up to My husband, I don't think there's any way I wouldn't have 40 units he takes 13.

Scott Benner 25:04
I was gonna say that was my question, how much does he actually need? Cuz

Melanie 25:08
I was 13. Now. So when he started, he really probably needed about nine.

Scott Benner 25:13
Yeah, who even knows? Right? Like it just, you would think that there would have been some sort of, I can't believe that anybody use the mathematical equation to come up with 40 for him at that weight? Like, I honestly think, and this is random. And please, I'm not a doctor. And this is not a mathematical equation. But I would think if you were going to say 40. Like, if if it occurred to me to tell an adult to use 40 units of Lantus the first time, I would have to think that their blood sugar's were in the No, no, eight hundreds, and they weighed in excess of 250 pounds maybe. And that's just like random thinking about it, like I would think, is a guy around 180 200. I think maybe we maybe will land around 1.5 units an hour, like if he's on a pump. So I, then I'd be around 24 to 30. And I'd still probably end up saying, why don't we try 15 to start, like in this specific scenario, you know, it doesn't.

Melanie 26:13
But that's an endo. Right. So this is just a general practitioner, who probably knows very little about any of it. Right? Really?

Scott Benner 26:23
Look what I have.

Melanie 26:25
Right? I mean, I'm in nursing school, and I will tell you, they just taught us how to mix NPH and regular insulin. When I was like, No one does this anymore. This isn't even a thing. But so they just teach you. Not enough, right? So she didn't know enough. I don't know if she googled, like someone who has an average blood sugar of 500. How much long acting insulin would the I have no idea.

Scott Benner 26:53
And that's funny. He was even say, he was really elevated, his blood sugar was super high. The 40 might not have got him the first day. But once his blood sugar came down, the next day, it was gonna be a huge mistake. Like, you know what I mean? Like maybe the basil would have. I mean, obviously, if you use way too much basil, and some will drop your blood sugar. So maybe it would have but I don't know, and you don't even have a meter Really? Like there's no context for any of it.

Melanie 27:18
No, it was. Yeah. So. Um, so we, I think we called my sister who's a nurse. And she was like, yeah, that seems like a lot. I mean, she works in an emergency department. So she doesn't know what time but she was like, that does seem like a lot. And so I think we decided to do 10. Okay. We're like, let's just do a fourth of it. So we did 10. And I want to say that it that it worked. Okay, I think he's built up to 13. And I think there's been times that he's been under 10. Yeah, I would imagine that. But he's MDI, still, and he actually only takes long acting. He doesn't still owe lists for males. Um, yeah.

Scott Benner 28:07
Does he not need to? Or does he not do it? Because your face is telling me? He shouldn't. He doesn't. But you got you got seven kids, and you need to get them all through college. So you're just gonna like, what is it? You're saying? Well,

Melanie 28:18
okay, so, I mean, we could you're married. Yeah. So you can't really tell them what what you think they Well, you can kind of tell them what they you think maybe they should do. But they get to do whatever they want to do. And his blood sugar's good. Don't get me wrong. It's good. He mostly eats meat.

Scott Benner 28:41
So he's decided to do it this way.

Melanie 28:43
Well, I yes. I think he read some things that said that you can slow it down if you if you don't tax it.

Scott Benner 28:52
The pancreas he's trying to hold on to his honeymoon a little bit. Yeah.

Melanie 28:56
Which I think mostly is working. It's but it is going like we're watching it slowly go. And he's watched he has a Libra. So he, he is aware of his blood sugar. But Libras Do you have to scan. They don't just it's not constant feed. So, but he does scan all the time, like all day, he knows where he's at. Overnight is different. But um, which is it's stressful for me as a wife, because I have a son who I'm who has a Dexcom so I get his alarms.

Scott Benner 29:32
I think it's interesting that if I had your husband on this show to tell this exact same story, he'd be like, yeah, yeah, they thought I had type two and then I went on a diet and then it was type one. And now I use him the I would probably be the whole story, right? Like it takes an ounce Actually,

Melanie 29:47
he really likes to drag those stories. Oh, he would

Scott Benner 29:51
a chat. Oh, yeah. Well, yeah. But he might have told the story. Nobody cared about you. So like, for sure. There would have been a lot of details for you. Like I don't understand why it's important that it was at 1230 It was cloudy outside. But no, I think it takes. I mean, honestly, like, you know, I I'm not going to denigrate. I'm obviously a male who's a caregiver. And I'm pretty good at it. But most guys are just like, it didn't kill me. It's good. Like, you know what I mean? Like that. That's the the level of concern. We I'm watching my son deal with something he's never dealt with before. And he explained the details to him, and then asked him an hour later, and he's like, I don't know, I wasn't listening. I was like, great. Yeah, it is really, it is really kind of super interesting. So he's managing MDI with a Libra? How? I have a lot of questions, how, hmm. How long after his diagnosis? Does your child and which one of your kids is it? Let's do like this. Let's call the 22. year old number one, and then nine year old number seven. Which number kid has diabetes? Six? Wow, look at how quickly you did that. So the 14 year old, right?

Melanie 31:00
He is. He'll be 13 1313.

Scott Benner 31:03
All right. And he got it not long after your husband.

Melanie 31:09
So three months? That is not long after your husband? No.

Scott Benner 31:13
Was there like any moment where you're like, is this contagious?

Melanie 31:17
Well, that's actually a funny story, because then three other kids in our neighborhood were diagnosed within a year. So there was a lot of like,

Scott Benner 31:25
what people thought, Oh, you know, it's funny when you sent that in your note, my thought was like, from a reasonable macro perspective, that there are a handful of people who live in your area who have the markers for type one diabetes, who were likely to get it at some point in their life, and then maybe some sort of a virus or something went through the town, and then it, it kicked it in for these people.

Melanie 31:48
Yeah, that's my take, too. But I think some of the moms, of course, tried to really dig in and see if they could find a cause somewhere would you do? Because this is grief? Right? Yeah. And so and that's the first thing is figure out the why try and find the why. And I think I'm sure I did that, too, at the beginning. But at some point, you're just like, it doesn't actually matter. Yeah, why you got to do

Scott Benner 32:15
this. It's not 5g. And even if I could figure it out, it doesn't matter. And I can't move. That's the other thing. I think, too. Like, I can't just move. Like, imagine if there was something that was happening around your house, that once everyone knew, and all the houses went up for sale, like you don't I mean, like, what would you really do? Like you are kind of stuck a little bit where you live, like, once you're an established family, it would be hard. I mean, if I if you told me I had to bug out of here, and I had to sell my house because I don't have the money to go buying another house without this house being sold. I don't know. It could probably take me years to leave here. Like if I you know what I mean? So not that you would just and I do agree with the idea of you have to come up with? You don't have to, but it hits you so strongly that you want to know why it happened. Oh, for sure. And I don't know why, like, what do you do with that information? Once you learn? You know? Is it just to make yourself feel like you didn't do it? Like, it's not your fault? Yeah. Like I wonder about that sometimes, though. Because I felt like that a little bit. There was a long time, where I actually found myself wondering, were you always washing your hands before you were cooking for Arden? Like, like, and I do. And I'm sure there have been times that I haven't. But that's how ridiculous that thing happened to me. Like, I need to figure out what happened. I'm sure I did this to her. You know what, like, how do I do? Because she was really little. So you know, yeah, it

Melanie 33:41
is a little helpful that my husband was diagnosed before my son because I for sure would have blamed me. And that because it's I have so much of it on my side of the family. So I'm like, Well, I mean, I guess it could still be for me for him, but I couldn't have given it to my husband. So right.

Scott Benner 33:57
Just like there's enough doubt in here to make me feel better about this. Right? I watch it happen to my wife, because there's so much different autoimmune stuff on my wife's side of the family and that she feels badly, like somehow, it's her fault, which is ridiculous to you know, can't prevent it. Yeah. And even at that.

I'm just gonna come out and say it that was a weird place for an ad break. I just couldn't find the right spot. And I was like, I just got to pick a place. I pride myself usually on doing a better job. Alright, I'll just do a great job on the ads then and make up for it. Ready? Omni pod.com forward slash juice box. You go there and you find out if you're eligible for a free 30 day trial of the on the pod dash. This is a free use of an insulin pump for 30 days. What am I saying here? Am I saying something crazy? Maybe, but it's real. Go find out if you're eligible. Are you thinking to yourself? Oh, I would Scott, but I heard on the pods got some other stuff coming and I want to wait for that. Well, I hear it. I understand how you may feel. But understand this Omni pod has the Omni pod promise. Oh, what is that you want to know? Well, here's what it says super simple. The Omni pod promise, says this. If you're waiting for that next big thing you don't have to because with the Omni pod promise, you can upgrade to Omni pods latest technologies for no additional cost as soon as they're available to you and covered by insurance terms and conditions apply. But you can find out all the details at Omni pod.com forward slash juice box. So if you're a person who's sitting there thinking I'm gonna wait a little longer, I want to see what the next thing is. You don't have to do that. The pod.com forward slash juice box. Just go now. You're all covered. Speaking of covered Australia, y'all just got covered with our new pod as well. On the pod.com Ford slash juicebox. A you to get started. That's for Australians. You guys got your own link. pretty special. Speaking of special, look at me, I'm just boom, boom, boom, you can't stop me. I'm selling baby Dexcom gs six continuous glucose monitor. Why do you want it? Well, should be obvious by now. But in case it isn't, let me go over it with you. rate and direction. That's right. How fast and in what direction? rate and direction? Is my blood sugar rising? Is it falling? Is it rising two points per minute, one point per minute. More Dexcom will tell you that. That's valuable information to have. It also gives you the number of your blood sugar actually artists blood sugar right now is 160. She was out driving. She's a licensed driver now. And she started getting a little low. Right? Her blood sugar started to drift down. So she got an alarm. And she ate some fruit snacks. Then her friend stopped to get a little fro yo. She didn't do a great job of bolusing because she didn't think to cover the fruit snacks. So she got a little rise right now. So as soon as we saw that rise going up, I texted her and I said Hey, what's going on? She said I just had frozen yogurt. And I was like, Okay, did you Bolus for the fruit snacks for your low blood sugar? And she went my didn't? I said, Okay, we'll do that now. Put that insulin in, stop the rise in level off, and now it's coming back. Do you think you could have figured that out without the Dexcom? g six? No, I don't think I could have nobody could have. I mean, what do I do? I just got to tell the future. I can't. But Dexcom can show you what's happening. dexcom.com forward slash juicebox. You'll want to know how I've kept my daughter's a one C in the fives for like seven years. While she's eating Frodo shouldn't be much of a surprise to you. It's on the pod. It's Dexcom. It's accurate meters. It's the stuff you hear about on the podcast, links in the show notes, links at Juicebox Podcast comm Please support the sponsors.

I sometimes look at my kids and I think Am I ever going to like pull them aside and tell them hey, you know, if you have kids, there's going to be a higher likelihood that they have an autoimmune disease, right? Like Am I let me get my put that in their head? Or not? And like it seems wrong to say it to them? And it seems like bad parenting not to say it to them. I don't know if that makes sense or not.

Melanie 38:49
Kids are pretty smart. I mean, I would assume that connect it at some point. But we kind of had to connect that because I did try on that with all the rest of my kids. Because at that point I'm like, okay, there are seven of you. If we're doing statistics wise, at least one more of you will have

Scott Benner 39:06
it right. I gotta start selling furniture and saving money. If it's all seven over you're gonna get what did you find out in town that

Melanie 39:14
none of them have the markers? No,

Scott Benner 39:17
just just lucky 14 are lucky. lucky number sex excuse me,

Melanie 39:21
his name is Marcus. Well, you can call Marcus or number six.

Scott Benner 39:24
I was I was gonna call this episode lucky number six, but we'll say.

Melanie 39:29
So I want to I have to pick a teeny bone with you about that. So when you first made the show, you would say you would threaten or say like, that's gonna be the name. And then it was never the name. Never. But lately, I'd say like 50% of the time. It's the name.

Scott Benner 39:45
Yeah. So what ends up happening is while I'm recording, it strikes me like, oh, that might be a good title for the episode. And then when I go back and edit, I find something that I like better or, and this is true. And I've said this already. If the title is Have a great title comes up too early in the episode. I don't use it. Because I'm so afraid like it 15 minutes in, you'll be like, Oh, that's why they named it this. I don't need to listen to the rest of it.

Melanie 40:12
I've never wanted to stop listening. I will tell you.

Scott Benner 40:15
Thank you. I have a very weird thing. theories about how to make the podcast popular. So

Melanie 40:21
have you made it yet? Because I would say it's probably really popular. Yeah.

Scott Benner 40:26
So yeah, it is. But I'm, so if you can kind of separate these things, I met a person who is incredibly interested in helping people with type one diabetes, like genuinely and sincerely. I'm also competitive. And with myself, and with the classic interpretation of success, so I'm trying to do better for myself, I'm trying to be better than the masses. And I won't do I won't chase those things if it hurts helping people with diabetes. So I'm trying to find a way to help people with type one diabetes, and have a massive podcast in the global sense. And always feel like I'm doing better. So the this? Yeah. So. So this month, this month, there was 150 times more downloads than there was the first month of the podcast. But then I see that number, and it immediately feels like well, why can't I just get to this number then? Like, like white, so that you just that's how it works for me. And, and I and I treat this podcast very seriously. Like, to me, it's a business, and it's a public trust at the same time, like in my mind, so

Melanie 41:45
you're doing a lot of good and for sure. Thank you an awesome thing.

Scott Benner 41:48
I appreciate it. Sure. It is. Yeah, I'll be happy when everyone who has a cell phone in America at UK, Australia, New Zealand and a couple of other places in Europe, all are listening to the podcast, whether they have diabetes or not like I want people to be like, I don't have type one. But I love that

Melanie 42:07
case, funny. Yeah, I don't really get out. I have a brother who runs a podcast and I'm always like, you should really I know, there's no one like, you're not interested in diabetes, but you should listen, because Scott's really good at this.

Scott Benner 42:20
I appreciate that. I like talking to people. And I like Moreover, I think that I think that everyone has a great story. You just have to be willing to not judge them and listen for it. And not pre judge them. Like it's fun to joke that you have seven kids. I mean, because I mean, how are you not going to if you're a person who meets a person with seven children and doesn't look at them and go, Holy Christ, are you okay? Like I don't I don't know what you're thinking. But it but it can't be the it can't be the focus of the whole thing you can't decide. You know, again, the reason the titles of the show are so kind of wonky is because not one of these episodes is about anything specific. Except the pro tips and the defining diabetes, they're specifically about them. And still, sometimes they're, we drift away a little bit to have to have a real conversation, not just feel like somebody is reading through bullet points that anyone can learn on the internet, if they wanted to, you know, so there's something about how you deliver I think, but that's a lot of high minded talk about podcasting that nobody cared about. Okay, so. Okay, Marcus, I was gonna say number six, but I see what you're doing is diagnosed. And now you're in charge instead of your husband's in charge. super interesting. Why did how did how did that go differently?

Melanie 43:48
Actually, is really interesting. So he he classic symptoms, lost a bunch of weight, peeing all the time, super sick. He plays football. So I'll be honest, I have a lot of kids, I don't weigh them and pay attention to their weight, really like would be enough to notice you've lost a significant you know, I bet he had weigh ins for football. And then, six weeks later, he weighed himself in my bathroom and he's like, ah, I've lost 15 pounds. And I'm like, No, you're 12 or actually was 11 at the time and and he's like, no, my my I for sure did because I had weigh ins. So I really did weigh that much. And he had been sick and lethargic. But still playing football still going to practice every day. So it's one of those where you're like, hey, you're tired, but you're doing this and he we're we're big eaters and big carb eaters. He had a huge plate of pancakes before a football game one day and he went to the football game. And he threw up the entire football game, you can play really well you play and then you come out and he throw up a bunch. And then I can do it. And I wasn't at the game. My husband was there. And he was like, Marcus is really not doing well. He's doesn't, he's sick. And so thought he had the flu, he came home, slept. The rest of the day, we got up the next day, he kind of felt like eating, which, when your kids have the flu, and then they feel like eating, you put carbs in them, like bread, juice. So he had bread and juice. And I think my mother in law, sent home the apple juice container with us. And it was like, half a gallon apple juice container summit. And I think he drank the entire thing and got so sick, that I finally just looked at my husband like, I'm just I'm taking him to the ER, I don't know, maybe. And he's had bowel issues in his life. And we've kind of tried to figure out allergy problems. For a minute, we thought he was lactose intolerant, we took them off dairy for a while. And he he was kind of a random throw a rapper anyway, like he would just randomly throw up. And so I, I was like that maybe, I don't know, maybe as a bad stretch. And I called my friends who have medical people and they're like, I appendicitis maybe I don't know. So I took him in. The weight loss was concerning to the nurse practitioner, I think that was talking to us.

Scott Benner 46:32
God, I was gonna say to you, when you said 15 pounds, it's clear you have more experienced raising children than I do. Because I would have went in a private room locked the door and thought Marcus has cancer. Like, like, seriously, that's how it would have hit me right away, I would have been like, like kids that age don't lose 15 pounds, we're in trouble. But you you stayed pretty steady through it for a little bit like looking for reasonable because, you know, yes, people get cancer as children, but it's fairly unlikely. So but my brain would have jumped right to it. So

Melanie 47:01
I will say the day before, when my husband brought him home and he slept the rest of the day, he slept in my bed and I was kind of with him in and out and I i will say I'm spiritual. I'm a spiritual person. And I'm assuming you've assumed by now that I'm a Mormon,

Scott Benner 47:17
I have to be you have all markers. If there was a trial net for being a Mormon, I already found your test. I know, I'm good. Don't worry. And that's what I meant in the beginning. The podcast is incredibly popular in the Mormon church, and I

Melanie 47:30
will tell you my theory about that. That's at the end. Okay, so, um, I had a pretty strong impression, feeling, whatever you want to call it, that he was very, very sick. And for me, I did actually go to cancer. So that's interesting that you brought that up, because that kind of brought that memory back for me. But um, yeah, so when I took him, I had already made a doctor's appointment for him earlier in the week, but it wasn't until the next Monday. So this was Sunday. And I was like, I can't wait until Monday. I just, I we need to go right now. And so I took in weight loss, but they ordered like an ultrasound and all these things to look at his bowel. And I am told, actually, the nurse practitioner told us that the minute the doctor on call, walked in and saw lost weight. He said, he has diabetes. And she was like, no. And she had asked me if there was diabetes in the family. And I said yes, Dad was just barely diagnosed. And so but I'm not sure I said type one. I probably just said he was just diagnosed to which everyone's gonna go, Oh, well, his dad was diagnosed type two then which doesn't matter for the kid. Right? Or whatever. But so yeah, so they dipped his urine. And he was 866. So, yeah,

Scott Benner 49:01
okay. Um, but then you. You put it as you leave the hospital on MDI, how does he leave the hospital?

Melanie 49:09
Um, he did leave the hospital, MDI, we were, we were in an ambulance. Within about 10 minutes from the hospital, we were in up to a primary, primary children's to Children's Hospital. But my one Funny thing is my husband, I called him and I'm like, he has type one diabetes. And he was like, Okay, I'm on my way. And he came, and he showed up. And they're wheeling him out to wheel him into the ambulance. And he's like, Where are they? Where are you going? And I'm like, we're going to the primary to the Children's Hospital. And he said, Well, now that we know he has type one, we know what to do.

Scott Benner 49:43
Yeah, let's just give him 40 units Atlanta.

Melanie 49:48
Like, you know, they don't do that. You spend a couple days in the hospital and they educate you. And that is really where we got all the education for diabetes and

Scott Benner 50:00
Yeah, maybe not like for your husband? Was he sitting there thinking, oh, wow, there's a lot to this I didn't understand I should be concerned with or

Melanie 50:08
Yes, yeah. And really had not been given any sort of real good. He knew high was bad. So he was mostly trying to keep his blood sugar between I think 60 and 80. So even after he was diagnosed, he was low all the time didn't feel good. But he's like, well, they say that, at first, you don't feel good. But he didn't even really understand the ranges, like the healthy ranges, I think, at that point. Wow. And was living super low, which was also not good for

Scott Benner 50:47
me either. Yeah. No, that's interesting, though, the way he thought about it was, he probably was like, I'm dizzy under 60. And a person who doesn't have type one diabetes, blood sugar sits around 80 fasting. So that was his goal was thing right there. That's, I'll tell you, I'm pretty good at this. And I don't think I could keep somebody's blood sugar between 60 and 80. without causing a lot of lows. Like that's, you know, I think he had a lot of luck. Yeah, that's, uh, that's something else I, but if he's thinking at his top line than 120, must have seemed like, crazy to him. I would imagine. Yeah,

Melanie 51:23
I think it was fairly easy for him to stay pretty stable low. At that point. I think he was still honeymooning, really strong. And just on the long acting, and probably taking maybe a little too much long acting because there are times when he eats to feed the insulin. We talk about it. Yeah. On occasion. Yeah,

Scott Benner 51:42
don't feed the insulin. That's not a good plan, either. So your son gets his education, which starts, which really just begins to educate your husband and you because you know, what's going on? Why is someone calling me a spam risk? Get out of here. Let the phone if the phone knows it's a spam risk. Why does it send me the call?

Melanie 52:06
I've never tried it on to and my dad would really like to know that. Yes. They complain about

Scott Benner 52:10
me just block it. If it's a spammer. Why does it make it to me? So so the education is coming? Everyone's really being educated? Yeah. How long does it take for you to put a pump on your son?

Melanie 52:23
So we had a CGM. 30 days, okay, Nikki, wait, 30. And we, I think it was 30 days. I think it was on his arm by 31. And then I started fighting for a pump. Maybe at three months. I was already listening to your podcast. So I knew I wanted one. And I knew what they did and what I wanted to do. And so I started fighting, then they're very particular, like, they have their standard. It's six months. And I said, that's fine. It can be six months, but I'm putting a pump on my kid at six months. I'm not starting the stuff at six months. So I think I took the class at four got approved, you know, anyway, so the pump was delivered to our house. The day my son turned 12. So he was October. He was diagnosed in October, and March 10. I think it showed up at my house. Wow. So but then, of course, so this is like COVID. Right? Like COVID starting within a week, maybe? So then, oh, well, we can't train you because you can't come into the office and whatever. And I don't know maybe the pump magically made it onto his arm without training. Maybe it didn't. really sure. I don't know if when we were doing the training. We already had been using the pump for a few little while. And you know, I don't

Scott Benner 53:55
know. I don't know how I got pregnant. Yeah. I'm not sure what happened. We would do a movie I swear.

Melanie 54:03
A lot of YouTube videos on how to set up pumps and how to figure all that out. We haven't Omnipod Yeah, so that's what we do. We actually loop

Scott Benner 54:10
so yeah, okay. Well, I'll tell you the, it's interesting to see people's different people's perspectives on this, like, you'll see someone who's got some information and they're like, we can figure this out. And you'll see other people who don't have any information or like, Oh, my God, don't do anything that the doctor didn't tell you to do. It's so it's so like, it's very, very, I don't want to just reuse the word interesting, but I'm fascinated by watching people's different reactions to ideas like that. Like, you know, you went to you got the pump, it's here in the house. It's a thing that delivers insulin. Just like the needles are a thing that delivers insulin like there's really no

Melanie 54:49
one it was like the most perfect time of any time to start a pump on a kid. You were still day. Yeah, I'm managing everything. And, you know, we just kept saying like what could honestly what could go wrong? Right? And I couldn't find anything that could.

Scott Benner 55:06
Well, you're stuck over there, that's for sure. We have you been a nurse your whole time?

Melanie 55:11
Or no, no. So I'm in nursing school right now. Yeah. So it's

Scott Benner 55:15
not like you were a nurse and decided to shift the diabetes like you decided to be a nurse. Is it from this from the kids and the husband and everything, so

Melanie 55:23
I only have four left at home, which I'm sure for you probably feels like a lot. But for me, I'm like,

Scott Benner 55:32
forced, that's a bad man. But,

Melanie 55:34
um, I think I've always wanted to be a nurse. I wanted to be a labor and delivery nurse. And then this, and I was like, No, I want to be a nurse. I what I want to be is is certified diabetes educator, which now has a new name. Yeah, but I can't remember what it is really long. And you have to either be an RN or a what? geneious.

Scott Benner 56:00
Jenny's a lot of things. Jenny's had a mess. Yeah. Yeah. It's funny, I say it a lot. But I read it every time I say it. Just like every time I introduce Jenny, in an episode, I pull this thing up. And I'm like, Oh, that's what she is. Yeah, well, that's how far into that are you?

Melanie 56:20
I'm in my ninth week. Wow, you just started? Yes, I'm in my first semester, I'm doing an accelerated program. So it's 20 months for my Rn, and then another year for my bachelor's, and then to be a CV. I want to say it's 10,000 hours working with diabetics, before you can even test for the

Scott Benner 56:43
certification, see 10,000 hours in a clinic or in an endo setting or something like that, which is where I want

Melanie 56:49
to be anyway. And I, my understanding is I'll be doing the same thing, I just won't have the certification. Yeah. And then I'll get it hopefully,

Scott Benner 56:57
I got a note recently from another listener, who said that they're switching their focus, they are a nurse, and they're becoming a CD. And she said it was because of the show. So one day, a couple of years from now, there will be an episode called I made a CD in case you wonder, because I'm very excited that that someone did that, based on listening to the podcast, I think that's really cool. So you said you were listening to the show up front, which is how you knew to get the Dexcom in the army pod? When? How do you find it?

Melanie 57:25
I actually was trying to remember and figure out how I found it. I think it must have been online. And I mean, I was googling books, write books to read or whatever. And I think some and now I am a podcast listener though. So I probably searched it and found it that way.

Scott Benner 57:46
Yeah. Interesting that you don't even remember because it was probably such a throwaway thought Do you know make podcasts I found that I that I haven't listened to like, I'm like, Oh, I want to listen that and I never did. I would if you said to me right now, how did you find that podcast? I would have no idea.

Melanie 58:01
But I don't think anyone told me about it. I've told a ton of people about it. Who will say my found out about it from Melanie, but I don't think but I didn't really know anyone to talk to if I had been the second or the third, or the fourth, or the fifth person in my neighborhood. I might have found out from them. We know right? I was the first so. So I got to be the one that shares it. But

Scott Benner 58:25
how closely does the podcast mimic what you heard in the hospital for your son? Or does it not

Melanie 58:32
know it? Of course it doesn't. I mean, it doesn't, I'm actually writing a read, I have to write a research paper for my, for nursing school, and I'm writing about the fear of hypoglycemia that they that they instill in all of us, to the point that we do not shoot for healthy blood sugars, period. And, and what a problem that is, because

Scott Benner 58:58
yeah, I hear you. Now how much of that of what you figured out makes it to your husband? Or doesn't it? like are they two separate people with diabetes? And they don't intersect? Or is one kind of in, you know, like changing the other or not like what's the dynamic like,

Melanie 59:21
I mean, obviously, I managed my son's like, he's involved, but I manage it. So everything that I learned here, I, I use with him. And I sprinkle things in here or there or there'll be a really good episode that I think would relate to him better. all the episodes are really good. Just one that might that he might really resonate with. And I'll say, hey, you should listen to this one. I mean, he's listened to the loop ones because he helped me set up the loop and he understand. I mean, he's helped he, he helps with the care as well, but I I probably am really the Primary diabetes caregiver for my son, which is I think a little bit interesting, because he has it, but um, actually, you've interviewed a couple other moms. It works the same way.

Scott Benner 1:00:13
Yeah. What what are? What's your husband's versus your son's a onesies? Are they close to each other?

Melanie 1:00:20
So I don't know. I'm my son's is like 5.6. Um, and I would I think the last time my husband went, it was in the sixes, but he hasn't seen anyone since before. COVID.

Scott Benner 1:00:33
Ah, so I thought you were gonna be like, I go, hey, guess what we got his agency back is 5.6. And he goes, Uh huh. And walks away from me and doesn't share?

Melanie 1:00:42
No, no, his his his is usually good.

Scott Benner 1:00:45
Yeah, I was gonna say because this is not a race. But if it was, that would mean you're winning. Just so you know? Well, you're in a really interesting situation. Cuz you said something earlier about, like, you know, your marriage, you know, you can't tell people what to do. Like the worst, the best you can do is I don't know how other people do it. I wait for a moment, that seems like this is the moment that would least lead to some sort of a disagreement. And then I drop in what I think and run away. And, and hope that a couple of days later, it resonated and stuck with somebody. And I'll tell you, I've been married a long time, not as long as you but pretty close. Actually, I think I'm 25 years. This summer, maybe? I guess I should find that out. But, uh, but a pretty long time. And I just think one of the things I've learned is you don't get to tell other people how to think. And even when they're kids, it only works till they're maybe 12 or 13. And then they just pretend to listen to you for the last six or seven years. And then they're like, they take your money for college, and then they run away. That's it. Right? Yeah.

Melanie 1:01:49
Yeah. You're talking about, about raising adult children a little bit? In that episode I was listening to recently and I thought, yep, that's about what it is that they're they're not their brains are not fully developed. But they, they think they are Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:02:07
they don't know it. It's like asking an unstable person. Are you unstable? They're gonna go, No, of course not. I've got this. Listen, the internet is full of people who think they're making sense. You can see it happen right in front of you. And that's for it goes for anybody really, you just growing up is super interesting, because I try to tell my kids right now, in this moment, you are as smart and as strong as you've ever been in your entire life. And it is completely impossible for you to believe that there's more for you to learn. And next year, you will look back on this person who you are now and go, Oh, that guy was an idiot. You know, but you're an idiot now, too. You just need to live another year to find out. So

Melanie 1:02:51
so that's a really good perspective. Yeah, yeah, good way to look at it. It's just and there's

Scott Benner 1:02:55
no way to tell anybody that and honestly, I don't know if you'd want someone to know that because they can strip away all their self confidence. You don't want somebody standing around going, I'm dumb. And I don't know what's going on. And in a year, I'll prove that because then that's like, you don't mean that then that you're? I don't know. Do you ever meet somebody who's like, I don't know, like, pretty, but doesn't think they are? Or, you know, you know, or somebody who's been told that they need to lose weight, but they don't they spend their whole life thinking I have to do this thing. I have to do this thing before. You know what, it's the end of your life. And you just missed everything, you know. So it brings up problems, but at the same time, it's a it's the way things work. So you've got your son for a little while longer to put him in a, you know, in a frame of mind. And then then you're just trying to keep the tiger from getting out of the cage before he leaves the house? I would think right?

Melanie 1:03:44
Yeah. Yeah, managing a 13 year old 1213. Year is. It is hard, though. Like, I got a little perspective when he was first diagnosed, of what it's like before they just before they're before their numbers are just crazy. And puberty and all that. It's It is unbelievable how unpredictable it is every day. Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:04:10
And it's diabetes. And to be honest, if it you know, because you have 1000 kids, if it wasn't diabetes, everything's unpredictable and difficult to call. And I stood at a baseball field eight months ago, where he was trying to figure out this little thing about his swing. And I was saying one thing, and he was certain it wasn't that and you might have thought we were fighting over global dominance. Like do you mean like it was just, it was it was the most intense conversation I've ever had in my life with the person over when his foot was landing. Like that literally is what we were talking about, like is your foot coming down later than you think it is? They've had equal conversations with the UN about human rights. And you're and you're standing there and there is that person inside of you is like I have more like pretty perspective. And so you can kind of like step back from it a little bit, but you're like, there's no way to infer this to them. And COVID really taught me that too. Because here's the thing about this year COVID is terrible. And it appears to be killing specific people who got it. And I'm a big proponent of the idea that we need to vaccinate, population and move forward and everything. And I think it's 1,000,000% scary and real and all that stuff. None of that changes the fact that two years from now, you're going to be gone, like remember COVID you know what I mean? And, and kids don't have that perspective. So they're stuck in this time, or someone told them stay inside, you're gonna kill your grandmother, stay inside, or you're gonna get sick? Do you want to grow a unicorn horn three years from now? Because that could happen? We don't know. And, and the ones who take it seriously are, it's overwhelming, that gets seriously overwhelming because they, when you're younger, you lack that piece in your brain that goes, alright, I'll do these things. And this will be over at some point. Like, I'm watching. I'm watching people younger people think this is the rest of life. Like, I'm gonna live in my bedroom for the rest of time. And I'm like, that's not what's happening. You know?

Melanie 1:06:10
Yeah. For sure. perspective, yes, I will say my kids have been in school and out of school and in school and at school. So in Utah, we went back in the fall. And we don't go on Fridays. And there's a, there's a percentage of kids, if the certain percentage is reached, then they send all the kids home for two weeks. And they do online school for two weeks. And then they go back, right. So that's how it started anyway, in the fall, now they actually test to stay is what they call it, where they test them. They test the whole school, all the faculty, everyone in one day, and anyone who's positive goes home. And then they can reset the number to zero because they know that there are zero people that have COVID in the school that day, and then they start collecting numbers again, of kids who have it and then the number goes up. But I can't remember, oh, this is why I was saying it. So I think my older kids are mostly pretty adjusted. They're not super afraid of COVID. We know a lot of people who have had it, and one my daughter had it. But my nine year old anytime he hears that someone has it, it's this. Like, Oh, no, it's a he's terrified. And we have to sit down and say, okay, it's not terrifying. People, you know, people that have had it. Everyone you know, is doing okay, we are we are lucky that we don't. I don't know anyone personally, who's died from COVID. But I do think perspective wise, especially these little like elementary kids who go to school and masks all day. Yeah, they're going to have some PTSD a little from that this.

Scott Benner 1:08:03
Yeah, it's a shame. Because, I mean, first of all, it's obvious that everyone's life is equally important. It just obvious that's obvious, right? But we stopped saying, you know, overwhelmingly, here are the groups that it's impacting, because I guess that felt? I don't know, it's, it seemed to feel wrong. Like I remember the first time so I heard someone say out loud, oh, it's okay. Because it's only affecting these groups. I was like, Oh, that's not right. Like, don't say that. And it's in so in, I think, in a way to protect anyone from having those thoughts. Because I also see how that could go wrong. You know what I mean? Like, I can also see how like a whole group of 20 3040 year olds would be like, hey, guess what, it's not for not gonna hurt me. So, and then it hurts everybody, like I get the whole global versus personal perspectives. But yeah, I just think that in an unavoidable scenario, which this obviously is, some people just didn't have the tools to get through it. And it's not just kids, there's some adults who don't have the, the tools to get through it. Like, I mean, I told my son the other day, I'm like, here's one thing I know, for certain, this is going to end. And could you get COVID? Still, you could but you know, the same way I think about everything else, like I get die in a car accident, but I still drive my car, and I'm sure that there's a place I could live where the air would be cleaner. And there's, I mean, there's some risk that comes with being alive and you just mitigate the best you can and you go live your life, you know, and if you are the 29 year old guy who gets COVID and, and you know, and it kills you. That's really terrible. But it's just as bad as if you were to me it's not much worse than sitting in the house the whole life being scared. So I mean, I don't know what kind of life that is either. You got to take a chance sometimes. And and I think we're getting that I think the vaccine is going to build up. It's funny. This will go out Long after it happens, but my personal thought is, it's March now. They're going to ship a ton of vaccine in the next 30 days, it's going to get delivered pretty quickly. I thinking spring is when you see things kind of begin to open back up again. And I hope so yeah, that seems to be the vibe of me. But we'll see mom

Melanie 1:10:21
has the vaccine. So I she, my mom as well. And my dad's doing the Johnson and Johnson trial. So he's had the one but he doesn't know if it was real or not. But I she is finally like, maybe we could get together as a family now. So

Scott Benner 1:10:35
yeah, well, JJ is just got emergency approval the other day. That's great. Yeah. So your dad needs to call it that site and say, Hey, do I have it or not? Do I have it? By the way? If I don't, I helped you out. Where's mine? Yeah, for sure. I'm not sure if that's how it works, but it should, if it doesn't. Alright, so um, couple last things, and I won't keep you too much longer. Your son's doing well, you're managing Well, you listen to podcasts, you're probably aggressive and you know, changing your settings and stuff like that. But I still want to know, like, what, what are the tools that led to me, your son's got a great eight, one say? So what are the tools that led to that? What do you think's The most important thing about managing insulin?

Melanie 1:11:19
Well, understanding how it works. And that's what what you say, right? Not being afraid of hypose. And, and we go back and forth here, because his settings change so often, just two weeks ago, he went really high when I after pizza up in the three hundreds was really hardly ever happens. And I mean, we fought and fought and fought to get that down and couldn't and so the next day, it was still way higher than it normally is. And so I I made a override called double down and literally put in 200% insulin, so he's getting 100% more basil all the time than he would need. And I'm thinking there's no way that but let's just I don't know. And so I did it. And he needed that much insulin for four days. 100% what he had needed before

Scott Benner 1:12:12
that, and then he didn't change too lately. So there's different

Melanie 1:12:16
Yeah, well, we so we changed the pod at the beginning of it, because I thought, well, maybe it's just that and but yeah, even through it was very strange. And that and he never got sick, like maybe I'm like, maybe you're sick, maybe. And then it went down. And then maybe two days ago, he started writing really high again, and we did it again. And he has needed that much insulin for the last two days.

Scott Benner 1:12:44
Wow. Again, actually, I've recently been using that, that looping trick to to like crush a high I've started to notice like sticky blood sugar and like the 161 80 range. If you do an override and just double it for not long either. Like I felt like a half an hour can can cut like, like a quick 60 points out of it. That's a lot of different ways to manipulate insulin to get it to do what you want. Yeah, it's so

Melanie 1:13:12
you're are you using? Am I allowed to ask you about this? Yeah. Okay. Are you you're using Auto Bolus? Is that right? Yeah, you use it. 100% of the time. You switch back and forth?

Scott Benner 1:13:24
No, it's always on. And I guess technically, we're not using a loop anymore. We're using that other version of it. Which is APS. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Okay. So that's the I think there's two I don't know, I literally just like Kenny, tell me what to do. Right. Yeah, that's like which so

Melanie 1:13:41
I we Auto Bolus, but usually, if his numbers are really good when he's going to bed, I'll swap it over to auto Basal for the night. Okay, while he's sleeping. And it tends to keep him just a little more steady Auto Bolus, because it's a little more aggressive. He'll kind of pop up and down a little, the range will be a little bit bigger.

Scott Benner 1:14:04
Yeah, I don't know if that's settings or not Arden's like super stable overnight. So, like last night, there was a guy that we use, we had Pete I made homemade pizza. So I made pizza. And earlier in the day, she had something else with a lot of carbs in it. And then she had a compression low. So we're sitting around at the end of the night, I've got her blood sugar at 90 after pizza and I was like I went and then like it's starting to go down and ice and she's like, well, I'm getting low. She goes Don't worry. I'd be happy to get an ice cream cone and she starts walking through the house. I'm like, I think this is a compression I don't really think you're low and she goes too late. Okay, so I got a little behind the ice cream cone because there was no Pre-Bolus which caught us up into like that 165 range and I had to push it back down. It took me a couple of hours to to overcome not Pre-Bolus in the ice cream.

Melanie 1:15:00
Okay, so that was one of my friends that I mentor talk to whatever about it. She's like, hey, I need an accurate picture here. So when you say a couple hours to fight that, because you miss the Pre-Bolus, what do her numbers look like in that range?

Scott Benner 1:15:15
Yeah, so I'm gonna think i think is about three hours in total. And it went from 90. I stayed ahead of it for a little while, then the food overwhelmed not having a Pre-Bolus she was up in the 175 range. That came back to 165. I looked at it for a second realize this isn't going to work. did an override and then brought it back down again? Like that's what happened in that like three hour three

Melanie 1:15:44
or four? And it took a three, four hour period. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's kind of how it worked over here. But I always wonder, like, is it faster for him? Or, you know, I, you just wonder, no.

Scott Benner 1:15:59
Go ahead. I was just gonna say like, I did it the way I did it, because it was bedtime. If it was in the middle of the day, I might have opened the loop and, like, crushed her and then caught it again. But the time of day had something to do with why I did what I did. Because I wanted to go to sleep.

Melanie 1:16:14
Yeah, yeah, I don't often loop often. Um, but I have started to think recently, like, you, you need to use that tool a little bit

Scott Benner 1:16:22
more. Yeah. During the day, I would have done it like that, because I was trying to go to sleep, like what I wanted to be sure of was that her blood sugar was going to go down, and that I was gonna go to sleep. Those are the two things that I was working on. And I can pull it up and look to see. Oh, no, you're sitting here. Come on. Yeah, so she came down. The Fall took it took a little longer than I thought to be perfectly honest. So the process that I went through took three or four hours, it still took another hour or so for it to come down the old all the way. And then overnight, she was you know, 106 ish. And then this morning, decided she wanted hot cocoa, which is like, crushes her. And she likes it to be extra chocolate Li so it's a packet and a half of hot cocoa in like this much water. And then she's like, it gets too hot. So then she dumps milk into it. So it's milk, a packet of half of hot cocoa. And she's running around like in between classes, like I need this now. So there's not nearly enough Pre-Bolus so we the cocoa took her to 150. But we used enough in the Bolus, so it didn't have to be redirected to took care of it on its own. She's 83 now, but that's all happened over about the last two hours. So that's awesome. Yeah, I think she might have chased a couple of potato chips with that cocoa to probably some very weird eater.

Melanie 1:17:47
I fought a cinnamon roll last night for a few hours. Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:17:51
Like you're an old 1980s Arnold Schwarzenegger movie trying to kill a dragon or something. I fought a cinnamon roll. See that title for your episode?

Melanie 1:18:03
Okay, here's my other question. One more, okay, cuz it's, it's an Omnipod question. So we have found and I've read a bunch of stuff that if when I give really a lot of insulin at once, then I get occlusions. So, like, we limit to three, but I want it to be more than that. What do you limit it? Yeah, like at a time.

Scott Benner 1:18:29
I mean, Arden's Bolus for the hot cocoa was 12. I think.

Melanie 1:18:33
And you put it all, at once. illusion problems.

Scott Benner 1:18:38
Yeah, yeah, we don't see a lot of I mean, you have to be careful because there's a lot of anecdotal information floating around in the world. Yeah, you know, like this happened to me. So this must be what happened. I try so hard to just say like, you know, somebody puts a pencil in their pocket robs a bank. Some people see that and say pencils, cause bank robbery, like it just is how people like mines work. They're like, it's so the place you see it more frequently than not is people who go from MDI to a pump. Don't use nearly enough Basal insulin during the switch, mostly probably because the doctor dialed it back on them, their blood sugar goes up. And the first thing they think is the pump doesn't work. Not that we didn't use an offense on fat, it gets fat. It's just how people's minds work. So I'm not saying that it can't happen that some people don't keep their Bolus as lower. But I've seen people say that and then I've seen people not said So the interesting thing about being around one space in the internet for so many years, what you learn to realize is that there are no there's no ebbs and flows. It's just it happens to somebody somebody says it out loud. That question gets taken seriously online, and then all of a sudden, there's 100 people who believe that that's some sort of a role. Like do you ever see people who get online and say, Hey, is anyone else's Dexcom server down? Oh, all the time. I'm like, that's not that's not what this is. Like. You just you know, something happened on your end. But it's amazing that the thought is like, Well, my I don't have a signal the rest of the world must not have one either.

Melanie 1:20:06
Yeah, well, it did happen that one time, one time. And it just happened to be, I think, like two weeks after we started the Dexcom. And so we were completely confused and loss and did the whole delete off your phone and then had it go be gone for longer?

Scott Benner 1:20:21
The point is, is that prior to that one thing happening, no one in the history of Dexcom ever asked that question out loud online. And now it's constant, the minute they lose their signal for a second, they're like the server's down and like it happened Dexcom has gotten has been a company for a decade now. It happened one time, and they're like, this is the rule. This is what happens. I'm like, ah, they just happen to be online that day and had been brutally impacted by it. So now it's one of the things they think of first. You told me you have a theory on why I might be

Melanie 1:20:53
why there's so many Mormons, Mormons that listen. Um, well, my theory is, and it's probably not right, but so do you have the next door app? Do you have that we ever heard of that? No idea what that is. So people have an app. It's called next door and it like connects you with the people that live in your neighborhood. And they'll write things like, what's that really loud noise or my truck got broken into last night, everybody watched your car, or whatever like that. It connects people with the neighborhood, it gives them a forum to spread, spread information, okay. So, as a Mormon, we have small congregations, not like, I mean, I grew up in Virginia, almost all my friends were Catholic, I would go to Mass with them. And they didn't know the other people at Mass, right? It was just people that come to mass at the same time, we go with a specific group of people to church every Sunday. It's different with COVID. But so we have like a built in community and anywhere you live in the world. So in Virginia, I had one in Utah, there's a gajillion of them. And they're really a small area where where I lived in Virginia was a bigger area, to have enough Mormons in that area to make up what we call a ward or a congregation. So we have access to disseminating information. Because we, we have close knit groups of people, and then those groups then have a bigger subgroup that all meet together, twice a year or whatever. So in that way we just have so I knew immediately when these four women in my neighborhood had diagnosis, because I know them intimately because they are in my congregation. Gotcha. Then they know people in other congregations who also have it and then disseminate that information. So we do we have a little bit. We have a community, a built in community a little bit more than maybe other people. Okay, that's my theory. All right.

Scott Benner 1:23:08
I'm good with that. I just like I don't know if the first time I was like, that's cool. The third time I was like, Huh, the 10th time I thought, What is happening? I there's a there's a moment when it is and I said recently, I'm sure that there's been as many, you know, Baptists on the show, as you know, Mormons, except there's no way to like when a Baptist tells you that how many kids they have, you can't go Hey, what did you say seven? And like, so there's no like, there's no lead into the idea. It's, you know, so now I've just become like comically, or comedically focused on the idea that, I wonder when this all ends, what the number will be that I get to eventually

Melanie 1:23:50
when I tried to Google like, Are there more diabetics in Utah, all those things for you to figure it out better, and

Scott Benner 1:23:57
it's just communication. Some person said recently, too, that I was talking to that the community is just generally focused on helping other people too. So she said to me, your podcast clearly does that. So it kind of follows the vibe, and which is hilarious, not hilarious, but it's interesting because I'm not religious, or even particularly spiritual. But it's interesting how being nice to people and caring about them. Must be so uncommon that appeals very, like spiritual I don't know, I get to me, it just seems obvious like to help other people. I that that seems very obvious to me. I did something on Friday night, that took up my Friday evening, and I helped a small group of maybe 120 people online, and I felt like invigorated by it. Like it felt good to me. You know, I don't know. So everybody, if you want to feel better, like do something nice for somebody else. Don't ask anything in return. don't give a crap. If they're The same political leaning as you or anything like that, like, just go do something nice for somebody. There are some times people come into like the private Facebook group, and I'll see them. Yeah, he can kind of see their life on Facebook in a split second. And I think, oh my god of this person, like, like, we couldn't possibly be any more different. You know what I mean? And then they get in there and wrapped around diabetes, it doesn't matter. It just doesn't matter. So. Alright, well, thank you. Sure. I appreciate that. Did we miss anything that you want to talk about? That I didn't bring up? I don't think so. Right. Okay. Cool. Yeah. All right. I want to wish you luck with your nursing program. It's very cool that it's accelerated. I'm assuming I just imagining like, hungry people all over your house because you're busy now.

Melanie 1:25:47
Well, I mean, I like I said, I only have four left and two are in high school, and then one in middle school and one in elementary. They

Scott Benner 1:25:54
can feed themselves, mostly they can feed themselves. My son told me very famously in my house, when I wrote a book about being a stay at home dad that ironically, I had never been a worse father than I was the year I was writing a book about being he said, you just ignored us and I was like, it's hard to write a book is wasn't easy. Making a podcast is much easier. Anyway, thank you very much. Can you hold on one second for me? Yeah, thanks. Yeah, just gonna hit.

First, of course, a huge thank you to double M's sub Melanie. Thanks for coming on the show. I'd also like to thank on the pod makers of the Omni pod dash and the Omni pod promise and remind you that you may be eligible for a free 30 day trial the on the pod dash right now head over to Omni pod.com forward slash juice box. I also would like to thank the Dexcom g six continuous glucose monitor for all the things that it does for my daughter, and for sponsoring this episode of the Juicebox Podcast dexcom.com forward slash juice box support the sponsors support the show, support your health.

Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back soon with another episode of the Juicebox Podcast.