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Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends and welcome to episode 1154 of the Juicebox Podcast.

On today's show I'm going to be speaking with Sterling. She's 27 years old was diagnosed with type one diabetes at 23. She's a figure and commercial model. Her father was an Olympian. And at one point, Sterling was on her way to being a professional golfer. I want to let you all know up front that this conversation will involve physical and sexual abuse, so please be ready. While you're listening. Please remember that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan or becoming bold with insulin. When you place your first order for ag one with my link, you'll get five free travel packs and a free year supply of vitamin D. Drink ag one.com/juice box. If you'd like to help with type one diabetes research and are a US resident you're in luck because the T one D exchange is looking for you. The T one D exchange is looking for people living with type one diabetes or their caregivers to fill out a quick survey T one D exchange.org/juicebox. You can help type one diabetes research right from your sofa and it'll just take 10 minutes T one d exchange.org/juicebox this episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by touched by type one touched by type one.org and find them on Facebook and Instagram touched by type one is an organization dedicated to helping people living with type one diabetes. And they have so many different programs that are doing just that check them out at touched by type one.org. Today's episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by Omni pod and the Omni pod five. Learn more and get started today at Omni pod.com/juice box. This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by the ever sent CGM and implantable six month sensor is what you get with ever since. But you get so much more exceptional and consistent accuracy over six months, and distinct on body vibe alerts when you're high or low on body vibe alerts. You don't even know what that means. Do you ever since cgm.com/juicebox, go find out.

Sterling 2:34
My name is Sterling Hawkins and I am 27 years old. I was diagnosed at 23 in 2019 in January with type one diabetes. And I am I mean a summary. I'm a figure model my commercial model. I'm an art director and I manifest and that's just kind of how I get everything in life. So yeah.

Scott Benner 2:59
Excellent. Who named you? Was it for a superhero movie? Or like your name is terrific. I always think it when I say it.

Sterling 3:06
Yeah. My father, my dad named me and he named me based off the football player.

Scott Benner 3:13
Sterling Sharpe,

Sterling 3:15
yes. Because he really wanted boys. And he wanted to be a sports dad. And then he got two girls and he was like, Okay, we're still I'm still gonna be a sports dad. And I'm gonna name you that and then he did my sister Alon, which is he watched the Mulan movie and he's like, I like move on. But I'm gonna change it to an E instead. So

Scott Benner 3:41
that's what happened. Did he make you play sports?

Sterling 3:43
Oh, yes. I mean, we played tennis basketball. He was really into Serena and Venus Williams and he really thought as like to two black women and two black children. We could get better opportunity doing no sports that also didn't really have too many black people in it. So we did golf. And that's kind of what it dwindled down to was golf and we were we're headed serious. I was headed towards professional until I got diagnosed with diabetes. I got full ride scholarship to school for it. Wow. My my handicap was a plus one.

Scott Benner 4:21
Oh my god. I don't know what that means. But it sounds very impressive.

Sterling 4:26
It's impressive, but it definitely a long way from being anywhere in the top 10. But I was that that was kind of the the goal. My whole life. That's kind of how He raised us. He's an Olympian, too. He was in the Olympics in 1984 in the LA Olympics.

Scott Benner 4:44
Yeah, hurdles. No kidding.

Sterling 4:46
Yeah. So he got he got six plays because he actually hurt his knee. Going over one of the hurdles I don't know if it was that time but it he thought that they set it up incorrectly. So he hurt his knee during the Olympics.

Scott Benner 5:03
Oh, wow. Yeah. But by the way, because of the internet, this is fascinating. Sterling Hawkings was named the 2017 PacWest. Golfer of the

Sterling 5:15
year, I have a few news articles on me somewhere.

Scott Benner 5:19
That that's really interesting. Oh my gosh. And so, you and your talk while you're really talking? Yeah,

Sterling 5:25
yeah, I'm six one, but I'm mostly wearing heels most of the time. So I am six, five, which does not deter the five, six men, the five, six men. It doesn't stop them, they still come, they still come more so than the six foot men, the six foot men have a serious insecurity issue versus the five, six men throwing

Scott Benner 5:43
I'm going to tell you something that I'm gonna end up having to bleep out portions. But I just put up an episode with a blind woman. Yeah. Gets dick pics on dating. No. Yes. Oh. And they know, by the way, wow. Fascinating. Fascinating. Yeah.

Sterling 6:03
So it's like, it's like, she doesn't see it. But she knows because I'm writing that I sent it. And that's what's the exciting part?

Scott Benner 6:14
Yeah, I guess the assumption is, well, she's gonna have to show it to somebody to help like, anyway, I think that's a fascinating look into some men's like psyches. Yeah, I really do. And the same thing. So guys that are six, seven inches shorter than you come up to you with all the all the confidence in the world. And

Sterling 6:34
all the confidence without any type of respect.

Scott Benner 6:38
I was like, how does that happen? Um, because

Sterling 6:40
I've been I was in that. So I stopped going into the dating world after I only started going into the dating world. As surprising as this is as being a model. I only started this year, I was with my ex for about three and a half, four years. And he was the first one who even had the courage to ask me anything. And I just said, Yes, straight on the spot. I was like, Sure. And we lived together like six months after we dated. And we stayed through COVID together. And you know, he's a really great guy. But things just didn't quite work out the way that I had wanted. And I was like, Okay, well, I've never dated. So let's try that. And then I'm like, let's not do that. Again.

Scott Benner 7:22
I don't think you can give up after one tries throwing, oh,

Sterling 7:25
it was 250 Man I've talked to so try, but I, you know, I use my dad's diligence of doing 200% into something and I really did that. And I said, you know, I'm gonna take a break now.

Scott Benner 7:39
There is there is really something to it. My wife is I mean, five, nine. And that's not compared to you not tall. But compared to most women I meet the course of the day, she's tall. And she told me that she's like, boys like shied away from her constantly. All the guys, all the guys, this is not good for me. But all the guys she was looking for generally speaking, like we're scared to talk to her.

Sterling 8:02
Yeah, they're just they're intimidated when they know that I I'm really independent art and my dad grew up super independent. So I don't really take like, BS from anyone. And, you know, it's hard to get through to me. So it's like, it's not worth it. You know, so you know, being a model, and then having a sense of self to having a mortality stand and ground and being also very serious, like the intention to marry. whether, you know, through dating, it's like that seriousness, intention, is what I'm looking for. In some people, most people are not looking for that. And I've been through the age ranges I've been from I've dated people who are like, I've talked to people who are 23. And I've talked to people who are 36, which is, you know, on both spectrums of my age, and I just haven't quite like, figured out what area of group is best for me because they're all similar. Do you

Scott Benner 8:59
do you think people look at you like a trophy? Because you're, you're different because you're taller? Like, is that like, that is an example like you think, Oh, wow, I'll see if I can't get a tall girl. Or like, Do you know what I mean? Like, do you think that happens? Do you have any feelings for what happens? Yeah.

Sterling 9:15
Yeah, I mean, I think that definitely happens. I think, like, it's the idea that I'm not because even people and even men who are looking for relationships, they don't see me as a relationship. They see me as someone who is a trophy in that way. It was interesting when I first started, you know, going and talking to these dates. I only I actually only went on seven dates in the first month. Like I actually went out after that I didn't go out because one, you know, men were too intimidated to go out with me. They call it castering. Nowadays, when they say oh yeah, I'll take you out. Oh, yeah, let's do this. We can ride in my car and I'm like, okay, when and they're like, sometime

Scott Benner 9:59
at some For you kidding. Well, you're you're also you're unique looking. And you're pretty, but you're like, you don't mean like there's like, I don't know this Yeah. Into my psyche. Yeah. But you're unique and pretty at the same time. Yeah. Like, like, I don't like I don't look you in the face and think, oh my gosh, like, you've got to, like Sunday. Yeah. That that that kind of feeling. Yeah. Makes sense to you. Yeah.

Sterling 10:22
Yeah, exactly. I'm sure I'm sure isn't day has been through a similar run. So I should probably hold on to Tom Holland so fast. Like, this is like, I'm ready to get married.

Scott Benner 10:33
This boy is talking to me.

Sterling 10:37
Like that, it's not hard to get to me. It's just being confident and also getting to know me, I think a lot of these guys like, I do mostly show my art direction. Like, on my dating apps, or like, in person or anything, I mostly show my art. They go towards my modeling instead. And then they're like, how did you get into modeling? And I'm like, Well, do you want to actually hear the whole story about, you know, how I was raped as a child and molested through my whole life. And like, I couldn't wear clothes. And I thought I looked like a boy. And you know, like, going through this whole iteration. And then at the end of all of that, you know, and being like, I am naked in front of people because I wanted to take power in my body and myself. And I thought, you know, I'm uncomfortable about this, so I should do it. And at the end of it, they're like, Wow, you're just really pretty.

Scott Benner 11:24
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Sterling 13:49
Wow. And that's that's the end of the conversation there. I'm like, great. Thank you. It sounds like more than once. Thank you. Thank you for letting me know.

Scott Benner 13:57
Well, Sterling, I I'm going to ask you a question that I guess because you brought it up and you took me by surprise. You know, before we started talking, you're like, you know, how do you want this conversation? I said, Just tell your story. And you said it could get dark and I was like that's fine. I didn't know it was gonna get that dark. You don't worry. It's just not my I didn't start a diabetes podcast thinking I'd have conversations like this, but I certainly have had a number of them. So what do you mean, what happened? Like what happened when you were a child? Yeah,

Sterling 14:27
so I am so open to talking about this. And like before I even start is the reason why is because I wanted to be calm. And my goal is to be able to motivate people in the world. And to be able to do that you got to be vulnerable. And so I've been really learning about this healing journey and just talking about it more so that I can resonate with people. Because a lot of people look at me and they're like, Oh, you're so thin. You're so x, y z you know, and they don't know if they don't know how diabetes until they see my pump now that I have or they don't know my story until I told them that I was actually 50 pounds heavier, you know. And so, with that, that's kind of my intention when I tell people so I'm open to any questions or anything. But what happened was younger. My sister I think was about three, I was about five. And it was actually our we lived in a neighborhood. That was a cul de sac. And we had a babysitter who was one of my childhood friends who's unfortunately addicted to cocaine, and like all of that now, because his whole entire life was awful. But we grew up with her and she, she babysat us. And eventually, she, you know, I don't know how descriptive but just, she would basically physically abused me or my sister, if we didn't do what she said she would line us up outside the room, and like, I would go into the room. And then whatever, I had to do whatever she told me to do, and then she'd be like, go get your sister. And if I didn't listen, she would, you know, punish me. She would send my sister on me. So my sister was too young, like, I was too young to understand, but my sister was even younger. So she would prompt my sister to chase me on the room and like, hit me with toy trains. Like, gosh, so I would be running for my life crying, and I'd be telling her to please save me as a child, and she would just be laughing, and she thought it was hilarious.

Scott Benner 16:21
How much older was she than you?

Sterling 16:23
She was probably 16. Okay. So much, much older. Yeah. So she,

Scott Benner 16:30
she'd abused you physically have the two of you abused each other physically? And then she asked you to perform sexual acts on her. That's right. Yes. Well, yeah. So how long did that go on for?

Sterling 16:43
I don't remember. I mean, unfortunately, with a lot of my childhood stuff, I only remember, blips up until 20, up until I was 20. Because my brain just kind of turned everything off. So I don't know how long it went for or went on for. I mean, we stayed at that house for quite some time, I didn't fully tell my family until I was 23. Because I just didn't want like, obviously, the victim's point of view is not telling the family because you don't want them to worry, because you're already tired. So that's kind of how I was when I was growing up. I was very closeted, like I was very nonverbal. And a part of me like so I did get diagnosed with the possibility of ASD and ADHD, which also doesn't help my dating life. But, but I got diagnosed with those two, and I'm just not sure if the correlation is is with the trauma because it was so young, but there's nothing to compare to what what what I was like before that. Sure. And so I just was very quiet growing up, I have a lot of sensory issues. And yeah, it was just a very different person growing up. I was I felt like I looked like a guy like I felt super ugly. I felt I was 50 pounds heavier. And I couldn't figure out ever How to lose that weight. When

Scott Benner 18:05
you were 50 pounds heavier than you are now. How tall are you?

Sterling 18:08
I was probably like 511. I mean, I've been six foot like I'm 11 Six foot? Yeah, in high school, I guess.

Scott Benner 18:16
Would you call it like extra weight? Was it like strength? No, it was like

Sterling 18:21
bigger weight. Like I have all the stretch marks and you know, the tiger marks we call them from losing all of that weight. After I turned I think after I turned 19 I started I lost like 20 pounds, which was crazy for me to see. And then after that I kind of lost a few more. And then you know now I'm like around 170. So I used to be there and to 15 to 20. And I'm like at 170. So,

Scott Benner 18:50
how how old were you? You said you were in your late 20s When you are in your 20s Excuse me when you told your family about what happened with the babysitter but did you ever tell anyone else did you and your sister ever speak about it?

Sterling 19:04
No. My sister actually unfortunately for for her. She didn't remember it. But she did get Bell's palsy. She had Bell's palsy when she was very little. And I think it was the stress of that. But her she didn't know and after that she I think fully blocked it out to the point where we've talked a little bit about this or I've talked to my mom about this but she would just kind of play down or even the mullah molestation from other people like I've been felt up by homeless men. Even that growing up she'd be like, I don't see the problem.

Scott Benner 19:37
When you were younger that happened to you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Throughout my

Sterling 19:42
throughout my life up until I like regained. My sense of self was been around like 2223 Like when I got diagnosed with diabetes that changed my life. So like all the way up until 20 People would like, like in high school, they would come up and grab my breasts. You know, it wasn't like I was wearing anything revealing I would never I would wear like long jeans and like, obviously very closed off. But they would come up and grab me. I was very innocent and like with the, the homeless man situation. For some reason, it's kind of interesting. But for some reason, I was a very loving person, even though I didn't like to be touched. And so I was like, I always gave out candies and gifts to random strangers. And people. I don't know why I do this, but I still do this to this day. And I did that for him. This one guy, and he was like, I can't have candy. I'm diabetic. And he's like, but can I have a hug from you? And like, he wouldn't let me go. And he just felt me all the way up. And this was back when I was 13. Or 14, this was actually Christmas Eve, which didn't make it any better. But you know, I had a hard time telling that story. Because it's something that I decided to let him do to me. And I didn't realize, you know, like, don't touch strangers.

Scott Benner 20:57
I have two questions. Was it difficult to know that you had this experience? And your sister couldn't remember it? It wasn't

Sterling 21:04
difficult, because I didn't know, back then I didn't know what was different. So I mean, it wasn't a shared experience in the way of this is different from my normal life. I don't know how to explain that. It's just like, I don't remember anything before that. So I thought that was normal normal for a very long time, because I didn't understand what it meant to not be normal. You know,

Scott Benner 21:30
that. My My other question is, did your parents I don't know, I never asked if you grew up with two parents? Or how you how you grew up? It didn't No one notice. Like, or were they just in a situation where they had to use this babysitter, and they didn't have any other options? Like did no one notice you were unhappy? Or that you didn't you already mean the kind site?

Sterling 21:50
Yeah, so that's the other side of, you know, the issues that arose. And we don't really talk about this much. But I don't mind talking about podcasts, because I do want to have conversations about this is like my family life growing up was was not great at all. And unfortunately, my mom was getting off depression medication. And so she for 12 years, since I was like, nine was erratic, you know, all the way up until we were like 19. And it was just it, there was no, there was no reason for them to observe me, or ask me because the way that I was raised was very in, like, my dad wanted me to like, and my, you know, my sister to live vicarious. Like, he wanted to live vicariously through us. And so a sports you know, we never went, I didn't get to go to birthday parties growing up, I didn't really hang out with people growing up. You know, with my mom's side, it was a it was a battle of who, who loved her and who loved us. And you know, it was, it was a battle every single day to me kind of being the scapegoat. I have been called every single name under the sun, by my family on a daily basis. So they

Scott Benner 23:07
were either ignoring you or trying to turn you into something that they thought was gonna make money. Yeah,

Sterling 23:12
it was more like, you know, my dad's thinking of intention was like, Oh, she's gonna get a scholarship. And she just has this view of me of us being somewhere. I don't know if it was to make money or not. He doesn't really talk much about that. Or I didn't really notice. But

Scott Benner 23:30
my my kid played college sports, and I thought of it as making money. Yeah, I thought I thought of it as saving money. That's

Sterling 23:39
right. That's that's kind of how my dad thought, you know, it was saving money. Even though golf is very expensive.

Scott Benner 23:47
Yeah, I know. It's funny, like, we're gonna save money if this works out. If it doesn't work out, then we'll just keep carrying around your very expensive golf clubs and all the green fees and everything. That's, that's right.

Sterling 23:58
Yeah, yeah, he has a very different point of view, like my family right now, as a disclaimer, like, we're better now. Great. Um, you know, it's, it's a better situation, because I'm not necessarily living there. But

Scott Benner 24:11
it's much easier to get along with that, but you don't say.

Sterling 24:17
That's right. That's right.

Scott Benner 24:18
Do you have any other autoimmune issues? So

Sterling 24:21
I have hormonal issues. I don't know of any other autoimmune. The hormones like I have to take birth control, I had to actually got an IUD. Because right before I fully became diagnosed, which is like, you know, after my honeymoon is what I'm considering that which was three years later. Yeah. My body just like started with my periods, like halfway through for like, two weeks at a time, like my body would just drag so I felt like a stroke patient.

Scott Benner 24:52
Yeah. Where you had, like very heavy periods, or were they longer or

Sterling 24:59
Yeah, They're very heavy, they were very heavy, but it got to the point where like they would be late. And like my body and my feet would just like numb up. And so I had to go on something or, you know, I couldn't go work out I had anemia on top of that, so that's kind of the only auto immune that I have, like are the hormonal thing. I don't have any others that I know of like, I'm not even lactose. That was something that I joked around with with my sister when I first got diagnosed is like I'm not lactose you are. At least I have that on me. You know?

Scott Benner 25:38
And I'm winning.

Sterling 25:42
Yeah, exactly. I got that one on you. But that's the like, I don't think I have celiac. I've never experienced any type of things like that. Yeah, so I think that's like the only one that I know of that is that is at least prevalent right now.

Scott Benner 26:00
Check this out. ADHD has been related to autoimmune diseases, with epidemiological studies reporting positive within individual associations with several specific autoimmune disorders such as celiac ulcerative colitis, psoriasis. I can I can ever say this, this one Ankylosing Spondylitis type one diabetes. So I will tell you that a lot of people I talked to seem to have ADHD in their family when they when they have like, other autoimmune stuff.

Sterling 26:29
Yes, yes. And I only found out I had ADHD and probably ASD back in November of this last year. Okay, now that I'm so glad that I, you know, a lot of people told me to not seek out this information. They were like, just be quirky. And I for me personally to anybody, like I always say learn as much as you can about yourself because then you can at least utilize tools that can help you get through life and help you recognize why you do some things you know, my dad is definitely undiagnosed ADHD didn't know this growing up because you know, living with someone who has ADHD How can you know any different from the family you live with? You know, he he tends to, to move or his his emotions go up and down a lot, because I don't he doesn't understand. I think why he is the way he is. I'm really glad that I got diagnosed because it helps me see like, what, you know why I act certain ways why I'm so forgetful sometimes. Why can be a little erratic here and there hyper fixated, like, especially on people or crushes, and understanding that too. But yeah, that's really fascinating.

Scott Benner 27:42
So my last question around that stuff that I'm going to talk about how you figured out you had diabetes, but are there other people in your family lines that have type one?

Sterling 27:51
No, no, but not a single person? Okay. Oh,

Scott Benner 27:55
all right. Well, then, how did you figure out you had type one?

Sterling 27:58
So I figured I had type one, because I was I mean, I always tell people, I was like, I was going blind. Oh, you're going blurry. I

Scott Benner 28:06
that will make you Yeah, after right?

Sterling 28:09
That's, that's right. That's right. I was I was going to the bathroom a lot. I unfortunately, like, you know, I've also had a very terrible friendship life growing up as well. And it was, my friend actually kicked me out of her house a week before school was about to start. And it was super rainy season. And I, we found a place finally, and I was so happy. And I was like really happy. I was losing weight. Because I was like, Oh my gosh, I'm losing weight. I don't know how maybe it's because of depression. That will do it. And I was like, I'm losing weight and all of this. And I started going to the bathroom more like I couldn't keep it on my food. And I was driving. And I was actually like, blurry eyed driving, which really scared me. Luckily, my sister was there, I believe, and she had to drive us home. But finally that night, it was kind of sucky because the cars were not working. Both her cars like had broken down for some reason, and it was pouring down rain and I had to get to the ER and I was like, what is happening? And we had to kind of push the cars to get them to go to get one of the cars to go and we finally go to the ER and of course, you know, everyone that was there was like your blood sugars are high, but we can't help you because we're closing soon. So are like the it's just the er It's the what do you not the emergency room the place you go to before

Scott Benner 29:33
that? Of like, like urgent care or something like that?

Sterling 29:37
Urgent Care? Yes. Urgent Care. So we went to urgent care and the people that were there were like your blood sugars are high. I think it was like 315 which is is not terrible.

Scott Benner 29:50
That's funny. Now you're like,

Sterling 29:51
you're like I've heard other people.

Scott Benner 29:55
Well, it's sort of you probably weren't in decay yet. Or did they say you were I

Sterling 29:59
was Ain't no I wasn't in DK. I mean, I don't think so I really started in Fallout or anything. No one's but the thing is, is when I went to er, all the people that were kind of treating me were like, you're way too skinny to be diabetic, like that was all the nurses. Yeah. So no one was actually giving me any information. They're just like, you're way too skinny to be diabetic. And even before then I like had an inkling, I didn't really know about diabetes, but I just looked at my mom, I'm really good intuitively. And I just looked at her. I said, I think I have diabetes. And she's like, What makes you think that? And I said, I don't know. Well, I don't know. I didn't look it up. But I'm like, I think I have diabetes. I don't know what that means. And then they told me I had diabetes. I'm always

Scott Benner 30:44
interested when people like make that leap. Because there's some information in your head from the past. You just don't know what it is. And you start putting things together. You don't even know why so many people play that it's a it's very interesting. So how long were you in the hospital for

Sterling 30:59
two days, I was in the hospital. And we were just kind of sitting like I was sitting there. I always say, if you can help not go into the hospital, don't go. If you can figure it out yourself, just don't go because you don't get any rest in the hospital. Like they have waking me up at all different hours. And like when you're diagnosed with diabetes, you have no idea what that means. Because especially as an adult, most people are not going to explain it to you. Yeah, and I'm sure you've heard that a lot from everyone. And it's just like, You need to eat this food and right now. And if you don't eat this food, you're gonna pass out and you're like, what does that even mean? You're like, we just gave you insulin. I'm like, but what does that mean? They're like, doesn't matter. You need to eat this food. Yeah, nobody's

Scott Benner 31:41
really. Nobody's explaining anything to you. Did you have family around you at that point? Or were you on your own at the hospital?

Sterling 31:47
So I have my mother with me, you know, with my family situation growing up, like, unfortunately, for the first four years of my diabetes, no one in my family, like, decided to learn about it. So I was all on my own. And it was really, really hard. I did have my ex as was basically my caretaker. He knows much more. My dad pretends to ignore it. He loves ignoring it. And he's never been to a single like hospital visit. My mom goes once in a while with me to do these things. But I'm mostly like, on my own with most of this stuff.

Scott Benner 32:26
What would you say your level of understanding was in the first year? Oh,

Sterling 32:31
you know, like, compared to what I've known since I've met you guys and met the people who directed me to you and your podcast? Probably like 10%. Wow. Because I went on keto, like six months after I became Insomniac because no one explained to me how to use insulin. Even no one told me that Oh, no one told me to Pre-Bolus to how many what's my ratios to sensitivity? I don't I didn't know what any of that was man. And

Scott Benner 32:59
so were you not sleeping because you were fighting with blood sugars because you were scared to sleep.

Sterling 33:05
I was really scared to sleep. So I had a low. So I took and I've heard this story once before with the person who went running and obviously a lot of adults are Ladas. But it's like I took insulin because I wasn't fearful at that point of insulin because I was like, Oh, it brings me down to a certain level. And I didn't know I was honeymooning for three and three years, you know. And I took some insulin and decided to walk up a hill in San Francisco. And all of a sudden, all the dogs in the park ran up to me, and were jumping on me. And I was like, What are you guys doing? Like what's happening? And then it hit me. I was doing my best to tell them what are some of the owners? I was like, Do you have food? Or do you have a house near here? Like I have nothing because I didn't know to hold anything around me. They didn't told me tell me that they didn't teach me any of that stuff. And like all these people thought I was crazy. And they're like, why are you guys why are you talking to me? And they weren't helping me. And then one lady was like, there's a food store down the street. I can't believe I made it to the food store. I was at 40 at that point

Scott Benner 34:05
and shopping. Did you have a basket? Or were you? Did you

Sterling 34:08
know I was sitting in a park on the top of the San Francisco Hill?

Scott Benner 34:12
She grabbed some food just yet why you really did last for a while. How long do you think that all took? Or do you not have a feeling for it? What do you mean? What would you say from when you started walking and found people to when you actually could eat? How long do you think it was?

Sterling 34:26
It was probably like it took me 15 minutes to walk up the hill. I sat down for about 10 And then all the dogs are jumping on me about that point. You know like they were they could figure it out before I did.

Scott Benner 34:42
They were diabetes service dogs in training apparently.

Sterling 34:44
That's That's right. That's right. They're all really confused. And I was like, I love you all. And that's why I'm at the dog park but I don't want you to jump on

Scott Benner 34:52
me also. None of those people at the dog park have ever seen a movie when a dog looks worried you have to be worried that wasn't something like a I don't know. Well, nobody understood. I mean, you didn't understand you had it you didn't understand. So it's hard to.

Sterling 35:06
Yeah, I mean, you know, like, I think it was that in San Francisco, there's a lot of mentally ill people, and you can look normal and be mentally ill. And it's a lot of schizophrenia. And so the way I was acting, I basically tell people now when my blood sugars are low, I'm a drunk person without the benefits. Yeah, so I usually tell people that now, but that's basically how I was acting, because all I knew to think was in my primal brain was like, I need food. Like, I need food. And so I just kept telling people, like, I need food. And I couldn't coherently explain that. And they didn't get it. And the only lady who kind of got it just pointed me in the direction of a store. And she's like, there's a store down there. So I had to walk to the store. I don't know how I did that on like a 40. Blood sugar.

Scott Benner 35:52
Yeah. You know, Sterling, I started writing a blog in like 2007. And about diabetes. And one of the things that got me to do that was a news story about a man who got off a commuter train, and passed out. And he No one knows exactly how long he was lying there. But then the morning commuters came in, and they were going past them, like he's lying, like facedown in like a stone driveway. And people are mocking him for being drunk. And it took one person who had a family member with type one to recognize the low blood sugar incident and probably save the guy's life. And I started writing a blog thinking, well, maybe I'll educate people. And one day if my daughter falls over, someone might have like, it's a weird thought. But like, someone might have read the blog and known or something like that. It was like literally one of the reasons that I started writing a blog. But that's exactly what happened to you. You look disjointed, because you're low and people can't tell the difference. And people are busy. And like you said, other people around there might give off a mentally ill vibe to begin with. So they're probably not looking to get too involved. And there you go. And just by luck, you've made it to that food. That's pretty pretty.

Sterling 37:05
I did I really don't know how. But that scared me. And I and no one still explained to me diabetes, and like, even my endo was telling me hormones don't affect your diabetes, and she was a woman.

Scott Benner 37:20
Well, she was wrong about that. Oh, yeah, she

Sterling 37:22
was I was like, This is not right. I know my body. Like, I feel like something is weird. Something's definitely off during different times in my month.

Scott Benner 37:29
Yeah, you're using more or less insulin, and you're not even you're not even doing anything purposefully. So so what I mean, obviously, all these experiences lead you out to try to find your own answer. So how do you find them for yourself? So

Sterling 37:42
I became an insomniac, and I couldn't sleep through the night and I was eating pizza, and I was eating all of this stuff. And then I have my opinion on this, and it has changed or accidentally, but I found the only people I found was the Bernstein diet people. And so I went full keto. For four years, I'm still keto. But that's that's kind of how I survived was like well to take, I need to take less insulin. So the way to take less insulin is to eat less carbs. And that's the only way I knew how to even manage my diabetes on the day to day. Yeah, and I didn't even realized my diabetes wasn't even in full swing or effect until I had reached out to you guys and had been a part of the like, been listening to the podcast. And I was like, wow, I didn't even know I wasn't even like fully diabetic until that year, until last year. And that was really hard for me to kind of have to take in. Because I thought I was like already dealing with things on hardmode. And then I was like, wow, I just got like re diagnosed mentally. And it really sent me into a spiral and depression. I think that was like throughout all the things that kind of happened through my whole life. For some reason, I always had like a glimmer of hope, even though I couldn't see there was no light and a darkness world that I lived in since from five to like 21 but for some reason diabetes got me and like, that was the first time I thought about suicide. Really. And yeah, and it just like I was like, I can't believe I can't, like do this because I didn't understand much about it. And I felt like I couldn't even go walking. I felt like I couldn't do anything, because I didn't understand it. And then I my whole world had changed. And then I started listening like, I think I didn't go outside of my home for like two weeks. I like didn't take any figure modeling jobs. I didn't take any any type of commercial jobs like and I just sat there and I was just listening for hours to your podcast with you and Jenny, because I just I realized I didn't understand anything and and it was really overwhelming, honestly, to take in all that information, but I just decided to take as much as I could because, you know my dad had raised us to ask questions why? And so I was like, I gotta ask questions why? I know well, because I realized that my doctors weren't telling me or providing me with the information I needed. Yeah,

Scott Benner 40:05
I mean, good for you because you got desperate. And you started to panic a little bit. I mean, if you're starting to think about hurting yourself, then you're you're you're running out of ideas in your head about what to do. And diving into something like that, like you said, couldn't have been easy. And you did it. So that's really like, like weight of, like, take control for yourself. That's amazing. Also, you named the episode a couple of minutes ago, named the episode you named your episode a couple of minutes ago. Oh, what is my episode name? Well, it's got to be an after dark because of the story you told about growing up. But it's going to be it's gonna be called Hard Mode. I love it. Yeah. Well, because I love that whole life seems to be in hard mode. I'm hoping we're getting you to like, easy at some point. Let's see, as we keep talking,

Sterling 40:46
I know. Yeah, I know. Yeah. I mean, definitely we can I mean, we can go into my art and stuff, because that's what saved me.

Scott Benner 40:53
Yeah, no, I want to hear about it. I really do. But so you, you kind of absorbed the the management episodes of the podcast, and you got an idea of what you were doing. I also want to point out that you just told a story that exactly mimics my expectation of why people would die with type one who have adopted a very low carb lifestyle, why they're so protective of it, and, and why they almost proselytize about it. Like, like that whole story, you just told like, I'm not gonna go back over it again. But being desperate, not knowing what you're doing, having scary health issues. And then recognizing if I really take in almost no carbs, I will use a very little bit of insulin, and it will minimize those other issues. Like if you don't know how to use insulin, that is the only answer you can get to. Like, as that's your story. And so I've always maintained that I think that's how it happens. Because listen, I don't honestly, I hope people understand by now I've been doing this podcast for a long time, I don't really care how people eat, I don't care how you live it all to be perfectly honest. But the thing that I'm always interested in is when somebody who's newer diagnosed is in that position you are in, they're like, I don't know what to do. And my blood sugars are spiking, and they're getting low. And then a person who has found keto or very low carb or something like that, they come in, like, you have to do it like this. Like, they talk about it. Like it is life itself. And they're so protective of the idea. And, and that's why because it saved their life. They were Yeah, right. And that's why it becomes such an important thing. And and it feels like you really need to tell other people about it. But then you but you got more information at but you stayed low carb, so you like the lifestyle, but you're better at using your insulin now.

Sterling 42:45
So I so actually, before I even found your guys's podcast, I was reaching out to the Bernstein's groups and not saying a nice things, just saying factual things. No one helps me, no one came to my rescue. Sorry. And it was really tough to kind of bear that too. Because I was like, I thought you guys wanted to help people keep low blood sugars and all this stuff. I mean, there's a lot of propaganda where if your blood sugars aren't perfectly at 80 all the time, they look down on you. And that was really tough for me for a long time. Because that was all I knew was that group and me I didn't really know any other diabetics, someone finally like a light shine. She was a nurse and she was like, check out you know, you should check out these groups. I am staying the reason why I've stayed keto. I don't really want to be keto. But I've had so much PTSD with all of this stuff, that it's just a fear based thing at this point. I do want to be a little more freer with my carbs and like what I want to eat like I want to eat pork. Who says and I do want to eat pizza again. It's just understanding what I didn't understand it's going to take maybe a few years or two kind of free to gamble is like, yeah, because right now I'm actually on so I got on looping because my PDM stopped working. So I'm looping now.

Scott Benner 44:06
That's the that's the most interesting pathway to that you're like, Oh, my PDM doesn't work. I'll just start looping. Yeah,

Sterling 44:13
actually in my neighborhood, or in my, in my city in San Jose, there is a woman who works at tide pool. She I had talked to her last year to several times and then my PDM wasn't working at 12 o'clock at night. And my pump was about to go out. And I was already stressed out about being on a pump. It was like three days into being on a POM four days in. And I was like Well, great. This is the perfect scenario. And then she contacted me and they were telling me that they couldn't even send my PDM until July 5 Because it was July 4 Oh the holiday and I was like I had to wait two days Okay, and not guaranteed. So you mean I just contacted I was like can you put me on loop because I just the PDM just like broke.

Scott Benner 44:58
Can you do me a favor? Can you tell me her First name, I'll bleep it out because I feel like I know her and that she's been on the podcast. It's but she doesn't know you guys. Okay, then that's not the person I was thinking of. Okay. All right,

Sterling 45:09
I was one I really want her to like, listen to you guys, because she doesn't actually know you guys. She relies solely on on looping. She does the Bolus with her daughter. But it's really interesting because her daughter is on the opposite spectrum. She her daughter's eating 300 carbs a day. Yeah,

Scott Benner 45:24
I know. That's, listen,

Sterling 45:26
it's nice to see,

Scott Benner 45:27
your story is like you're first of all, you're very good at telling your story. And it's terrific. And I am having. So somebody's gonna send me an email. It says that this is creepy. But I really want to tell you how I feel like it's, I know this is crazy. But I you know, I'm getting ready to talk to you. I've like your Instagrams up in front of me and like stuff like that. And you are, I don't know. You don't look the way you feel about yourself. And you don't look like you're struggling. And it's so disjointed to hear your story then look at your picture because it doesn't feel like you're talking about the person I'm looking at. I was one I was wondering if that ever felt that way to you?

Sterling 46:13
Yeah, my dad raised us so you know, most people would never guess and every time I tell them like I do probably have ASD and ADHD they would never guess it because we kind of growing up we were ingrained into being poised. Yes. To dress how you look, you know, dress how you want to be approached, you're always being interviewed. I don't care if it's a janitor, I don't care if it's someone just cleaning the street and I don't care if it's a homeless man, you're always being interviewed Sterling. So you need to act that way. So that's, that's how I am so like, it's not noticeable.

Scott Benner 46:45
But even in your speaking like, not just visually, but like you talking to like nothing. All the words don't seem to match your you don't I mean, like your your your your life is a dumpster fire. But you don't you don't come off that way while you're talking. And you don't come off that way. When I'm looking at you. I'm trying to figure out why that is. And so that's the answer you were raised to, to present yourself in a certain way. That's correct.

Sterling 47:11
And also on top of that, I've always had a vision to change the world when I got diagnosed with diabetes that solidified it and made me less fearful. So I started writing poetry. I started going up and doing stand up like an open mics and became a little famous in that world. That's when I started doing modeling, sort of going to art directing and commanding people no one would ever expect. I'm actually an introvert. They always look at me, they're like, You're not an introvert. I'm like, Yes, I am. I just learned how to talk. And so that's kind of like, the direction. And so when people read and if you ever look at my art page, I have a ton of poems, and they're extremely depressing. I don't think I write anything, even when I'm in love. I write sad. And it's always either that or contemplative, because it's me processing my emotions. And people were surprised when that first started happening. When I first start expressing myself, they were like, Please don't hurt yourself. And like, at this point, I was like, No, I'm not even, you know, I'm not thinking about that. I'm just thinking about how can I express my emotions, because I never got to when I was younger? And how can other people, you know, step in their own light and be able to do that for themselves. I've gotten several emails and several DMS and all this, like, thank you so much for writing that it was really dark, but I really appreciate your art and you're helping me start to write again, or you're helping me reevaluate my life or I didn't know you were going through this. And sometimes like people don't know, I'm what I'm going through. And, and that's really important to me to like, be able to hold people when I'm talking to them.

Scott Benner 48:45
Now, I'm, I'm enjoying talking to you a lot. And it's just very impressive. You're young, and you've been through a lot. It seems like most of it you went through by yourself at one point or another. And I don't know you just your the way you're coming off is it's almost confusing, because I'm not sure why you're doing okay. But at the same time, it's very impressive. So you you think that expressing yourself through different artistic endeavors was very valuable for you emotionally? Yeah,

Sterling 49:18
it saved me. It saved me. Like when I got diagnosed, and I was sitting there in the hospitals, I quit golf, because I thought to myself, I'm like, I can't sit in a hospital bed, not ever having cried out of joy for something. Like when I was winning and golf, and people would interview me, I'd be like, yeah, it's whatever. It's whatever. And I was like sitting there and I was thinking I'm like, my life can't just be whatever. It's you know, it can't be whatever

Scott Benner 49:43
you go and success is expected. You can't be happy about it. Because that was that was the goal.

Sterling 49:48
Yes, yes. And and I love golf, too. But when I got into art, I really found myself and you know, initially when people first I started doing art or people would call me cringy to, like, you're not gonna make it to that's silly. You know, all of these fears people like to put on, but I never really listened. Because the thing is when you grow from a dark, dark space, there's nothing worse than where you were before. So everything that happens to me now every emotion or every heartbreak or whatever situation, yes, it's hard, but it's not the hardest thing I've been through diabetes isn't the worst thing I've been through. Yeah, you know, so So I take that really seriously. And like, you know, when people were like, Oh, well, art can be a second choice. And like, no arts are first choice. And yes, I'm slowly finally starting to get into manifesting into like, getting more finances from it and other things like that. But it's a journey. I mean, when you're building a house, it's not going to take a day. Yeah, you know, you know, it's

Scott Benner 50:51
funny, because you use younger words than I would use, which makes sense. Makes sense, because you're younger than me. But I was just telling my son recently, I'm like, you can just do something and make it happen. And that probably sounds like hocus pocus to people. But I made this podcast out of sheer nothingness, and a lot of effort and a lot of time, and I hit a lot of speed bumps where I didn't know what I was doing. Or people told me it wasn't going to work the way I wanted to do it. Like all of that stuff. And I just kept focused and kept working on it. And and that's right, yeah, you do it. And then it is. And I don't know, like, I don't know a better way to say that, like, you can conjure something up out of nothing. And, and make it real. So you

Sterling 51:39
can literally do anything you wish you want to do in this world. I tell people this every day, I'm like, you can do whatever, there was a woman I think I don't remember what state she was in. But an older woman, she was like 70, she would actually get paid a ton of money to pee in jars so that people could pass their drug test.

Scott Benner 51:56
Early, that is not where I thought you were going with that. But is that what she wanted to do?

Sterling 52:03
No, but I'm just saying you can do anything that's the world has provided and you know, you can make whatever type of income you want. Some people don't want to, and that's okay. And some people don't want to get there, they just want to be doing the thing. So it's when people limit themselves because of what society has told you, you have to realize you're not the majority, you are the minority, you're you yourself. And you know, just just your being like, you're just you. And so you really have to understand, like you're very different from that next person. And that next person's life. When if you understand that you're able to do whatever you choose to do.

Scott Benner 52:40
You mean, you need some sort of support around you, right? Like, you can't just decide I'm gonna get up this morning and work very hard on something that doesn't make money because I still have to stay alive and eat and everything. Like I had support. My wife was supporting me while I was building the podcast, obviously. But

Sterling 52:56
yeah, of course. And the thing is, you know, I think support comes in more forms than a person. And more forms. Like for instance, like, for instance, my parents, my parents bought our Victorian home through a government funding, where they gave them a whole entire historical loan to build their house. And they didn't have any money, they my mom bought another home for $1, because it was in the newspaper, and they were gonna move it and they just wanted someone to live there in San Jose, this was back when San Jose was still being kind of, like downtown was still being kind of built on. And so I think it's more, it's less about like, thinking about, Oh, I need the support from this specific place at this exact moment. It's more about like, I'm very spiritual person, trusting the universe, and it is going to as long as you're doing what you need to do, whether that is doing your full time part time job to get by, but trusting that there's gonna be money coming from some other place, because money is material, just like anything in this world. And you know, a lot of wealthy people I'm sure, we'll talk about this is like, they already know they're gonna get money. So they're high risk takers, because they know that they're gonna get money, and therefore their brain isn't blocked by that financial, you know, stability need,

Scott Benner 54:16
I'm comforted by the idea that money comes in it goes, That's right, that it's transient through your life, and that, that the goal is not to make a giant pile of it. And exactly right. So, you know, because at the end, I mean, a lot of really wealthy people die and they're still dead. So

Sterling 54:34
that's right. That's right. The only thing you can't get back is time, right? Yeah.

Scott Benner 54:38
So I like to think as long as it's coming in, and it's going out it's I don't get mad when it goes out. I get upset. Like sometimes I get nervous, but like, you know, comes in I'm like, okay, great. We have some sort of a flow here, and, and put your mind on other things and you have to stay. I'll tell you that when the better the podcast does, there is always Is this, there's this kind of carrot on a stick that tries to lead me towards just relax and like, put it on autopilot. Like, like, like, just let it do what it does like you, you love making the recordings, make the recordings, you don't have to work so hard or you don't have to do and I and I always stop myself because if I if I go in that direction, I get bored very easily to begin with. And then I just find myself wandering around like I'm like, oh, like I should be working harder or thinking of a way to make the podcast better find a way to reach more people like I mean, your story's insane. Like, I mean, honestly, we're not talking about today, because it's not going in that direction. But you're in a significant mental health and physical health crisis that you're brought out of, in some part from a podcast, which is ridiculous, you don't immediately get it's actually silly. But if it works, then isn't it incumbent upon me to find other ways for it to help people. And so like I'm doing that, today, when I get off with you? I am. I've just paid for a service that will transcribe, I'm starting with the bulk beginning series, it'll transcribe the series, and then it attaches an AI bot to each transcript. And it's, it's amazingly accurate.

Sterling 56:16
So you can tell what is it doing? Is it doing like captions for you? Well, it

Scott Benner 56:20
does all that which is fine, because we can make content with it that will help people read who would prefer to read but more importantly, you can ask the bot any question about the episode and it very accurately answers it for you.

Sterling 56:32
I like that, right? I love future things. I'm here for everything.

Scott Benner 56:37
I I'm such a I'm so on board with this right upfront. Like I feel like there's a way where we could eventually have all the information from the podcast, behind the scenes transcribed and where you could just ask a little bot like, you know, in this episode, how could I learn to do this? Or what does it talk about Pre-Bolus singer or whatever, and then it could take you right to that information.

Sterling 57:00
I love god I'm so on board for for that. And I think that's going to be really helpful. I know there's a lot of people in the art world or, you know, that have issues with AI situ and stuff. But for me, I'm like, it's just another tool. Just use it as another tool. If if really someone or an AI is you're feeling like it's going to affect you and your future, then you're not really putting as much energy into yourself and understanding that you're valuable. Like really genuinely do that. Because like with that AI it's gonna help people find I know I'm on your I'm on your guys's Facebook's quite often. And everyone's always asking what episode

Scott Benner 57:41
was the? Yeah, no. And I

Sterling 57:45
always ask him like, yeah, what episode is that?

Scott Benner 57:47
I'm up the butt of the company who made the stuff? I was like, can you make the bots embeddable into social media? Like, you know, could there be a Facebook post that said, hey, ask this bot, anything you want about this episode? And it'll launch I'm I'm very, very hopeful that it's going to work. And by the way, if it doesn't work, I'll pivot. Like, I won't try. Yeah, I won't go down with the ship. If it doesn't work. I'll be like, alright, I tried that. That didn't work out the way I expected. And let's try something else now. But at least I'm not bored and sitting around and just staring. Just letting this thing run. Like I want to keep propelling it

Sterling 58:25
forward. Yeah. And that's a perfect word for anybody. You know, who, who has a sense of like, business ship or making something new is the pivot word. I love that word. Yeah. Oh, yes. It's not working. Just pivot. Why stay there? I tell reason to be there.

Scott Benner 58:43
Ya know, I tell people all the time, like, one of the reasons that the podcast is, is popular is because when I see something not working, I can just, I can redirect myself. And I don't have to go ask six people in a meeting and they all don't have to agree and you don't end up in a situation where one of them their job was the thing you're trying to get away from. So they're like, no, no, no, we should stay with this. Like, you know, like, you lose all of those problems when you're streamlined. And anyway, how are you managing your before the looping? Did you ever do pins or needles or anything like that?

Sterling 59:18
I was MDI, I had my Nova log, but I never used it because I use regular insulin. So I was using syringes. And that was after two years, so I didn't actually have to use any type of I have to use Lantis. I use like two units of Lantis for the first year. I didn't use any type of insulin for food or the first year

Scott Benner 59:41
I had you on regular and Lantus. Yeah. Oh, wow. For two years.

Sterling 59:45
No, I was on regular Atlantis. Yeah. For like, yeah, for I guess the two years after that first year. That first year was kind of, it's kind of it's kind of easy levels.

Scott Benner 59:56
You did. You had a very slow onset. Super

Sterling 1:00:00
slow onset. Yeah. And I think being keto really did slow it down quite a bit. wasn't necessarily a positive or negative. It just made me a little more confused. I was like, Why do I need to take insulin now for food? That doesn't make sense? Yeah. But I took Yeah, I took regular and took Lantis. And then I also started taking Novolog for corrections because that for our fat rise, the regular insulin doesn't actually catch. So I was taking three different types of insulin and it was not fun, right?

Scott Benner 1:00:30
But now you're just Nova log in your pump. That's

Sterling 1:00:33
right. I'm just Nova log in my pump. I've been on my pump for about a month now. Wow. I love it. I suggest people

Scott Benner 1:00:41
scrolling. We were telling the Fourth of July story that was three weeks ago. Yeah. Oh, wow. Okay.

Sterling 1:00:50
I had to pivot. I was like, okay, looping wasn't gonna go on loop. I was gonna figure out what the pump was. I like figuring things out. I like seeing what's going on. And if I could figure it out myself, and then go on to assisted thing. But the universe said, No, I don't think so. This is going too slow for me. So

Scott Benner 1:01:09
we're gonna do this instead? Well, that's fast. Yeah, using the G six.

Sterling 1:01:13
I've been using a G six right now. I was contemplating going on to g7. But I'm like, I don't know, people. People were like, yes. And then people are like no about it. And people are like, it's whatever. So I'm not really sure throwing

Scott Benner 1:01:27
the information. Just remember, people don't come to the internet to share how well things are going. You know, I

Sterling 1:01:33
said that all the time. That's what happened. That's why I started that's why I haven't gotten a pump until like, last two months ago, because or like a month and a half ago, because I was just reading people's dumb stories, which I shouldn't.

Scott Benner 1:01:48
What you're doing is you're recommended. People are having trouble, they get lost. They don't know what else to do. They go and kind of word vomit on the internet. And then you think oh, that's how it is artists been using g7 since it came out. It's fantastic. So okay, yeah, sure. Then I'm

Sterling 1:02:02
gonna I just wanted something simpler, too. And I don't really want to tour away even though I'm keto, like if I decide to go off of it. I just don't like the mystery. Yeah, I mean, I don't like the mystery. Obviously. g7

Scott Benner 1:02:13
works fine with looping. So it's pretty wicked. Yeah, I just did the Arden did excuse me, the whole, like, put on her new g7. But didn't turn it on, let it soak in for a couple of hours before she put it on. Like that was happening during like the window. Because there's like a buffer at the end of the old sensor. There's a lot of cool stuff about the g7. So it's worth looking into. And listen, I'm not going to tell you. Like, I don't know how it's gonna work for you. You don't I mean, like, I don't know how any of this is gonna work for anybody. But our experience has been good. So yeah,

Sterling 1:02:47
and I really appreciate hearing your stories. I'm sure everyone says that. But honestly, like, you guys take chances anyway. And I like that. And you just like, you know, pivot if something goes wrong, there's a way to get out of there, you know, out of it. And obviously g7 is not like that crazy, but it's just the mindset. That was around things that

Scott Benner 1:03:08
was interesting for me, I want to adopt. I'm sorry, that was interesting for me to hear you say because I don't think of myself as a risk taker. But I guess in this space, I, I

Sterling 1:03:19
feel like you're a calculated risk taker. I feel like you kind of see your options. And they're like, Yeah, I'll be fine. Oh, yeah. Or this is the out, you know, which I am not, I'm very impulsive. But I am not at all calculated risk. I'd be like, Oh, I have to wait like six months before I decide.

Scott Benner 1:03:39
I do not do I don't do things without thinking them through extensively, but not compulsively. I just, I make sure that I have a i My wife tells me that my brain works backwards from now. So any question you asked me, my first thought is no. And then I talked myself out of the answer with with like data, and then if I can get to a point where I'm comfortable, then I'll move forward. My kids do that too. It makes our air makes Kelly crazy. Because Because she you know if you said let's go on vacation, I go no, we can't do that. Then Then like five minutes later, I'd be like, well, we probably could and then the I could get the time off and can we afford it? And then like and I work so I work backwards from no is what she says she would prefer five work forward from Yes. But I think that's how we end up with boxes that I don't know what they're for. And then I can't find them five days later. And it seems like we're buying stuff we don't need. That's That's me.

Sterling 1:04:33
I'm very I'm like I'm an INFP I don't know if you know the personality traits, but I'm like very whimsical. So I'm always let me tell you my dream. And we can go from there.

Scott Benner 1:04:43
I have all those thoughts. I just thought myself right at the end. I'm like, No, not yet. Not until I figured out how this is gonna work. I've had that feeling for years. Like since I was a kid. Like I wanted to do something big, but I didn't want to waste my time is how I thought of it. There's that if that makes sense. And I watched my son make a decision like that coming out of college too. And I was like, Oh, wow, he did the same thing. He was very willing to put a ton of effort into something but the minute he couldn't see the path to the end of it, he was like, I'm not doing this anymore. And, and he made any pivoted and made a good decision. So anyway, so yeah, what have we not talked about that we should have?

Sterling 1:05:21
I mean, I can quickly go over my art. I don't know if you saw my page, but I can

Scott Benner 1:05:28
quickly go over sterling. Hold on a second. I don't you get I like you. We're fine. We're doing good. Okay, okay. You fill time very nicely. I don't have to I know I'm not pressured to speak here. So alright, so where am I going to find this that so

Sterling 1:05:42
Sondra dot people is my artists page for on Instagram. I have it here on Instagram. Okay, that's right. So

Scott Benner 1:05:50
the this is, is this You photographing yourself? Or what am I seeing here? So

Sterling 1:05:56
when I first got started, I was actually I was having. So when I first got started, I'm actually going backwards. I used to have so I have a team, I have a makeup artist, I have a hairstylist, I have an assistant. And I had me when I first got started, I was just taking photos of me it was COVID, too. And that was kind of the reason why and I was having random photographers take photos of me. And then all of a sudden, these photographers I was spending around $500. On a shoot, I use a lot of flowers. I have a lot of florists that I work with. And I put around like 20 hours a time into each production. And so photographers when I first started doing my art stuff, they were kind of saying, yeah, so all of this art is my art. It's all mine. And you should be grateful that I'm taking photos of you. And then I was like, Okay, let's not do that. And then I went into and you can see a little below, there's like other people, these are all my photos. So these are the ones I actually point and click the camera, I come up with the art direction all of that I take it's about 30 minutes per photo to edit. So I use Photoshop and Lightroom. Presently now I'm going back to just being myself in it and maybe collecting like three other models and just really working on a really short, small team. And luckily now I do have photographer now who's a part of my team who's like, no Sterling, this is your art. I'm pointing clicking the camera today, I'm only here for two hours. And you've been going through all of this iteration for the last two weeks. And so I kind of like got into going more into like, what I look like in my world and in my point of view,

Scott Benner 1:07:42
so you kind of act and you're acting as an art director, sometimes you're using the camera, other times you're bringing in a person to operate the camera and to take a picture of your vision. Is that about right? Yeah,

Sterling 1:07:53
that's right. Yeah. So I come up with all this. Like I come up with a set designs, I come up with all the like I have over you don't I don't think you use Pinterest. But anybody who listens to this, I've have like 11,000 pins, which is a lot. Sounds

Scott Benner 1:08:08
like you've been busy. We're not busy.

Sterling 1:08:13
I've have like over like 100 different types of art directing boards to like 200 Maybe are directing boards. A lot of them have not even been used yet. But it's like my specialty. I learned how to sew even. I'm making this gigantic kimono right now. Because I'm pivoting to being more like just more artsy, I guess, like you're talking about how to make money and all that stuff. And I was kind of going down that right? Like, how do I make money, I started doing prints. I was performing poetry. And I was like, Yes, I can make money here and there with that, but it wasn't making me happy. And so right now I'm just focused on like, just creating, which is funny because like a lot of brands, even the brand I work for the laundry company gives me a ton of free stuff now, because I'm just being free about it more so. No one's deterred by my poetry so far. I'm surprised. Well, it's

Scott Benner 1:09:02
wonderful. Like you're you're really obviously very talented in a number of different ways. i You just said you were sewing Arden is has taken over our our, like our house. She's home from college right now and she's in a fashion design major at school. And she's like, I'm gonna make a dress this week. I'm like, okay, so she's like, I'm gonna need fabric and blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, Okay, so I'm like, out of the store with her. We're buying fabric together. And she's like, I'm gonna, this is the dress I'm gonna make but here's what I'm gonna do with the design. And she's like, I'm gonna put this swoop through it. And it's gonna feel like a Coke can. And I'm like, what she goes, Don't worry. It's not explaining it right. So then she sits down and sketches it all out. And I was like, Oh, wow, that's wonderful. And I was like, Yeah, I was like, what is that around the collar? And she goes, I think I'm gonna put like, soda can tabs there. I was like, okay, and meanwhile, aren't just even drink soda. They don't even know where it came from. She just saw something about that and said I'm gonna change this and make it kind of modern but make it pretty at the same time. I was like, oh, okay, I was like, Alright, go ahead, do it. And yeah,

Sterling 1:10:08
we'll definitely start noticing when she gets into it. Um, the amount of fabrics that we buy is a lot. Ya know, I know she's something that's a patience game, because it's like, why do you need this? And you're like, No, no, I just need this. Like, I just need this this thing. That's

Scott Benner 1:10:23
exactly what she's like. She's like, I'm just gonna get a couple of yards this because I like it. I think there'll be a place for it later.

Sterling 1:10:28
Yes, yeah. And it will not stop. I promise.

Scott Benner 1:10:31
I'll tell you the one thing that I don't this is not a job. But to watch art and go to a thrift store and put outfits together is fascinating. Like she just drifts through that place. Like it's like, like she's meant to do it, and grabs these things that no person would think, like, no reasonable person would go, these two things will end up in an outfit together. And she puts stuff together. And when she's done, you go, Oh, my God. That's, that's crazy. She's she's one of those people, she tells me that when she's at school, and somebody stops her every day, to tell them, I love your outfit. I love what you did with this. I love it. She's just like, I don't know, aesthetically, she's got like a great eye. So we're just trying to support that, like and with, without, you know, without saying it needs to lead to something. And that's one of the things that I've been, I'll tell you as a parent, I'm proud of that. We at least got ourselves into a position where we didn't have to say to our kids, alright, you're 18. Like, go do a thing. And it better make money. Because this is it. You know what I mean? Like, pick one thing be 100%. We're like, you know, we told our son when he went to college, we're like, just do whatever it is you're most naturally inclined towards. And then you can figure out how to make a living with it later. And with Arden when Arden said her two inclinations led her in one of two directions. She said, I think I could either be a very good lawyer, or I want to design clothing. But when she started talking about clothing design, in high school, she was not an artistic person, I would not have thought of it that way. She didn't spend much time drawing or sketching or anything like that. So in her first semester in school, she just sat at a desk and taught herself to draw. Like it was really, I wasn't very impressed by I don't I've told her but I don't know that she knows how impressive it is like she sat down and gave herself a skill she did not have previously. It was really something. So anyway, I love that you're doing all this terrific.

Sterling 1:12:36
Yeah, well, is she getting some manifesting power, if you want to hear I am right now real quickly, and how crazy my life has been. So basically, last year, I was really hurting financially. And I was figuring things out. I found figure modeling, which figure modeling is for most people don't know, I'm nude or portrait in front of artists, and they're studying anatomy, or they're doing oil paintings or whatnot. So I got into this, and people were like, that's like, that's the weirdest thing to get into. And what ended up happening was, is that I became, I just was like, you know, it's whatever. And I became like, I was like, I'm just going to be the best at it. Every time I go into something, I'm like, I'm going to be the best at it. You know? And all of a sudden, I just kept getting word of mouth. They're like, how do you keep getting these jobs? And I'm like, people just DM me. At this point. People just DM me. And they're like, I need you here. Can you come here this day? And I'm like, Yeah, I can be there. I can be here. And so I've been doing that for a year. And everyone was like, How long have you been doing this? And it was like about six months in like six months. And we're like, we're you're literally the best model we've ever had. Oh, cool. I'm like, Thank you. Thank you for

Scott Benner 1:13:47
you. And it's supporting, supporting your other stuff that you're doing. That's right. Yeah. So

Sterling 1:13:52
and I was like, thank you. And so that was about a year and a half ago now. And so finger modeling does take a toll on the body, you have to sit there in silence. And you'd have to put yourself in positions for a long time. Like I hurt my foot. This was kind of I'm kind of dwindling out of that because I actually am working for a laundry company. I want I walked in. So what happened was is like I was doing my finger modeling, but I wanted to get started doing art direct, and I'm like, I want to do art directing. I want to make art. And so I started following a lot of lingerie brands. And I went into I was like, Oh, this lingerie brand is in San Francisco. And so I went into the store and I was like talking to the lady and I was like I'm an art director. Like I'll do stuff for free for you. She's like, No, no, no, no, I don't want you to do anything for free for me, but I also don't need to art direct. I just want a model for me. And so I got into this whirlwind with this woman who, who is who was like one of the top 20 executives at Levi's Well, she she decided to quit she had a dream of building a luxury company and for her retirement. And so I like got into this world with this with this lady and I started doing commercial modeling for her. And then she's just like Sterling, I just love you so much like, we're gonna still do the modeling. But I want you to work for me. And basically, I'm getting $800 for 1515 hours of work each week. And its salary base. So if I can't do a day or anything, I still get paid. And she's letting me use her apartment, she gives me bags of clothes. And she's like, very into my poetry very into my art and wants to support me. So anybody who's like going towards anything, if anything is possible.

Scott Benner 1:15:42
And it comes in the craziest form, I was gonna say, you never know where it's going to work out.

Sterling 1:15:46
You never know where exactly, and it's really helping me because so taking away from figure modeling, now I can start focusing on sewing and making clothing and doing more production stuff and having more money to like, be able to support myself more independently, and you know, have all the benefits of things and still having a ton of time leftover to do what I want to Yeah, wow.

Scott Benner 1:16:10
It's great. Yeah,

Sterling 1:16:11
so that's where I'm at right now. I'm on an upward spiral. I'm on an upward bend from all the stuff before, but it's just about believing in yourself and really trusting that as you continue to work, just continue to work each day and like, you're gonna get somewhere. So with, even with art, and like, it's so cool to see that she's just drawing things on her own. She's like, I'm gonna do this. And you're like, I don't get that. But okay. It turns out to be interesting. My dad does kind of similar now. He's like, I don't see where you're coming from? Why do you need to use my bathroom? Again? I'm like, no, no, like, see, just just believe. And he's like, I really don't, but okay. And then he sees it. He's like, Oh, my gosh, these are all the ideas I can give to you and everything. And so just pursuing forward is amazing. And you providing art in that space to move forward? And I hope other people do. You just have to really trust its theory, because it's like, oh, my gosh, I really want to control whether it's our lives or somebody else's. But it's like, sometimes you just gotta trust the vibe. And as long as they're, they're moving forward in some form and direction, like, it's gonna work out in whatever way they choose to. Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:17:15
it's very, it's very important not to have a preconceived notion of what things are supposed to be. That's right. It's kind of how I feel about it.

Sterling 1:17:22
That's right. And it's so much more fun that way to

Scott Benner 1:17:25
Sterling. Well, I've, I've made a small adjustment to my note about the title. Now I'm thinking after dark, Hard Mode made it because I like hard. I think maybe you came up hard. And I think it's turning you into who you are. So very, very impressive. And I really enjoyed the conversation. I appreciate you doing this with me.

Sterling 1:17:52
Thank you so much for talking with me. I really enjoy talking as much as an introvert I am.

Scott Benner 1:17:57
Listen, you were terrific. I have you never done this before.

Sterling 1:18:01
No, but I did go to school for multimedia technologies. So I had to do quite a few like interviews for school or else I'd fail.

Scott Benner 1:18:08
You're absolutely terrific at this. Tell people one more time your Instagram handle. So

Sterling 1:18:13
my Instagram is sonder dot people. It's so n d e r dot p o p l e and my name is Sterling Hawkins. And thank you for talking with me. Oh, thank

Scott Benner 1:18:27
you so much. I really appreciate you sharing all this with me. Can you hold on one sec? Yeah,

Sterling 1:18:30
yes again.

Scott Benner 1:18:36
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